Dating Pattern....

[carhill]

I admire people who are always themselves and if she is not attracting men because of this then that’s their loss and not hers, I personally admire feisty, straight talking and honest women who have a strong head on their shoulders.

 

I agree.

 

This issue appears to be a problem for the OP, hence my suggestion to find something to break her cycle of self-doubt, not "change" herself.

 

I honestly think, if she does this, her aura will change and she will attract those men to her whom she desires.

 

OP, I wasn't suggesting changing the relationship you have with your male friends, merely to go enjoy some quality time with them and seek their feedback. They know you well.

[Angels&Airwaves]

if anything I think she should stop pursuing so much and have a little fun, be a little flirtatious and then mix it up, there’s nothing a man likes better than a bit of stiff competition, especially if he knows he can win. She needs to stop being so into the men who she is chasing, but I don’t think she should tone down her personality, because that could cause problems further down the line. There’s nothing I’d hate more than to enter a relationship with someone then finding out what they are truly like, because I might not like what I see, then I’ll just finish it and leave.

[xpaperxcutx]

what state are you in.

 

Is that even relevant?

[carhill]

I think there's something about felons and state lines...

[OpenBook]

There's a lot of indicators in body language, too. For example, do you find yourself leaning forward when you talk to him? or scooch your chair around so you're facing him/sitting closer to him? Try leaning back instead, and relax, don't try to maneuver yourself around him, let him do all that work!! Take the attitude of "I'm cool with whatever happens, I'm just here to have a good time." WTH, no harm in trying it!

[Jilly Bean]

I try to project myself off as being more confident than I normally am. So maybe I should tone down the happy and be a bit gloomy... lol

 

Uh, no. lol. Being gloomy isn't attractive. I don't think being too happy is your problem, hon. lol. By tone it down, I mean, let the boy be the boy a little more. Work on building up his man-ness, appear impressed with his accomplishments, compliment his muscles, his intelligence, etc.

 

On the overly confident thing - that can easily be intimidating to guys. If they think you are TOO together, then they might fear how you would react finding out their flaws...

 

Be coy, a little self-deprecating at times, fun, funny, interested and interesting, but just don't feel like you have to drive the bus, you know? Let the guy take the lead, even if it's something you are not crazy about doing or want to go to.

 

When guys used to offer to take me to dinner, they would suggest a place, and if I hated it, I would tell him so and then proffer an alternative. The guy always complied, but I am sure I was being perceived as being pushy, hard to please, and high maintenance and I am sure (in retrospect) it was emasculating. Now I'll go where a guy suggests and not try to plan something else...

[Ebeleptik38]

We'll if your truly being yourself then I don't think your doing anything wrong. I mean sure change it up if you feel like it. But you are a woman after all, so maybe you should take full advantage of your amazing female powers and lure them into your web of seduction, then spit em out like all the other cute, sweet, but nonetheless predatory women out there. lol Dating sucks, usually when your not looking for it, something good just falls into your lap.

[xpaperxcutx]

I agree.

 

This issue appears to be a problem for the OP, hence my suggestion to find something to break her cycle of self-doubt, not "change" herself.

 

I honestly think, if she does this, her aura will change and she will attract those men to her whom she desires.

 

OP, I wasn't suggesting changing the relationship you have with your male friends, merely to go enjoy some quality time with them and seek their feedback. They know you well.

 

I try. But I like spontaneity and meeting people I don't know. But I do get where you're coming from.

 

As for my guy friends, I do hang out with them and I did seek advice from a friend one time. I asked him from a male perspective whether I was attractive and dating material, and he said that I was but has a problem with seeing me as dating material because he was in love with a close friend of ours. awkward.

 

if anything I think she should stop pursuing so much and have a little fun, be a little flirtatious and then mix it up, there’s nothing a man likes better than a bit of stiff competition, especially if he knows he can win. She needs to stop being so into the men who she is chasing, but I don’t think she should tone down her personality, because that could cause problems further down the line. .There’s nothing I’d hate more than to enter a relationship with someone then finding out what they are truly like, because I might not like what I see, then I’ll just finish it and leave.

e

 

I don't go into pursue mode until after the date, where it seems that I have to initiate contact because they've became stiff with their approach. And normally I do flirt, when I know the guy's flirting with me. I also play it nonchalantly and no straightforward attacks, just lots of subtle approaches, like the occasional hand touching and hugs. Besides, the

guys were usually the one who are more straightforward. They start with the wanting to give me hugs, or massages, and wanting to kiss and whatnot.

 

And the last part really strikes me, because it applied to my ex. He was so shy in the beginning, but after I stated dating him, he was so forward with his needs and wants, it was sickening.

 

I think there's something about felons and state lines...

 

There's a lot of indicators in body language, too. For example, do you find yourself leaning forward when you talk to him? or scooch your chair around so you're facing him/sitting closer to him? Try leaning back instead, and relax, don't try to maneuver yourself around him, let him do all that work!! Take the attitude of "I'm cool with whatever happens, I'm just here to have a good time." WTH, no harm in trying it!

 

Speaking of body languages, yes, I'm very relaxed. It's more obvious in my facial expressions, when they see me blushing and I have a tendency to look away from them when I sense they're staring at me.

[xpaperxcutx]

Uh, no. lol. Being gloomy isn't attractive. I don't think being too happy is your problem, hon. lol. By tone it down, I mean, let the boy be the boy a little more. Work on building up his man-ness, appear impressed with his accomplishments, compliment his muscles, his intelligence, etc.

 

On the overly confident thing - that can easily be intimidating to guys. If they think you are TOO together, then they might fear how you would react finding out their flaws...

 

Be coy, a little self-deprecating at times, fun, funny, interested and interesting, but just don't feel like you have to drive the bus, you know? Let the guy take the lead, even if it's something you are not crazy about doing or want to go to.

 

When guys used to offer to take me to dinner, they would suggest a place, and if I hated it, I would tell him so and then proffer an alternative. The guy always complied, but I am sure I was being perceived as being pushy, hard to please, and high maintenance and I am sure (in retrospect) it was emasculating. Now I'll go where a guy suggests and not try to plan something else...

 

Yes I know. I do make compliments like "Wow, I can't believe you're studying TaeKwon Do", or " Omg I love your hair, I wish mines were naturally curly like yours". And I was straightforwardly sincere with my answers, no hesitations indicating that I had to come up with a shady answer, or compliment. And mostly it's the guy that makes the plans. Like with my last date, we both agreed on sushi, because it was a common delicacy we both loved, and when we finished dinner, when he asked what we should do, I was more than willing to listen to his suggestions, and give an answer that I was okay with anything. ( Maybe that might have came off a little too compliant). But I do let the guys take the lead.

 

We'll if your truly being yourself then I don't think your doing anything wrong. I mean sure change it up if you feel like it. But you are a woman after all, so maybe you should take full advantage of your amazing female powers and lure them into your web of seduction, then spit em out like all the other cute, sweet, but nonetheless predatory women out there. lol Dating sucks, usually when your not looking for it, something good just falls into your lap.

 

Lol.

I guess I try. Like I said, I try not to be overly sexual, but I do love to dress up in skirts and heels to emanate a bit of a femme fatale.

And yes, dating does suck. Maybe next time I should go out on a date that I'm not extremely excited about, and see what happens from there.

[carhill]

As for my guy friends, I do hang out with them and I did seek advice from a friend one time. I asked him from a male perspective whether I was attractive and dating material

 

Wow, what a loaded question. Even dumb @ss me can figure that one out..... yes?

 

I was thinking more feedback on your style of interaction. Friends know your mannerisms and quirks and all those little things you're likely not even aware of. I think it's the totality of your presence which is causing the issue, not any one thing.

 

For example, I might tell a female friend that she fidgets a bit too much or twirls her hair or laughs too much or, or...etc.

For me, there's something about a woman who projects serenity with herself and confidently holds my gaze and challenges me on subjects of all sorts, but in a ladylike way. It has nothing to do with her appearance. Most of this comes through her eyes, expressions and the tone of her voice. A bad sign is if the man is talking to your chest Blushing is OK because it means you are in the moment, not working from a script. You react. That's sexy.

 

Anyway, the important thing is to define the kind of man you want to attract and what this potential is to be to you. A fun date. A quick fling. A companion. A soulmate. You decide.

[xpaperxcutx]

Wow, what a loaded question. Even dumb @ss me can figure that one out..... yes?

 

I was thinking more feedback on your style of interaction. Friends know your mannerisms and quirks and all those little things you're likely not even aware of. I think it's the totality of your presence which is causing the issue, not any one thing.

 

For example, I might tell a female friend that she fidgets a bit too much or twirls her hair or laughs too much or, or...etc.

For me, there's something about a woman who projects serenity with herself and confidently holds my gaze and challenges me on subjects of all sorts, but in a ladylike way. It has nothing to do with her appearance. Most of this comes through her eyes, expressions and the tone of her voice. A bad sign is if the man is talking to your chest Blushing is OK because it means you are in the moment, not working from a script. You react. That's sexy.

 

Anyway, the important thing is to define the kind of man you want to attract and what this potential is to be to you. A fun date. A quick fling. A companion. A soulmate. You decide.

Oh carhill you crack me up.

But I think the responses from my friends will in no way completely fill in the blanks of how I'm perceived from a stranger. Around my friends I'm really goofy, very open minded, and not afraid to voice my opinions. They know I'm very OPINIONATED on certain subjects.

 

I think I do a fairly good job of attracking guys. I tend to turn a few heads or two. But my impression of that is that many men tend to see me as more of a fling than anything else. I guess that's the general desire of a normal man: to f*** every girl they meet.

[Kamille]

I try to project myself off as being more confident than I normally am. So maybe I should tone down the happy and be a bit gloomy... lol

 

So are you saying that you're not being yourself? I wonder why you feel the need to appear more confident then you normally are? It sounds to me from what the way you describe your interactions with your friends and the way you present yourself here that you are confident without being overly so. So I wonder why you would try to project more confidence when dating.

 

It seems to me there's something there that might be indicative that you might be trying too hard. Think about all the people you've come across whom you were able to tell were trying to act more confident then they were. It's noticeable right?

 

I wonder, do you sometimes feel like dates are like interview situations, where you can either suceed or fail? When I started dating again, someone on here pointed out that this was probably the worst way to go about a date. Sure there is pressure to get to know someone and impress, but deep down you are looking to find a really great friend, possibly your best friend ever. So, advice teller said, act as if the person you are with is already that great friend of yours: he means you well, wants you to succeed, wants you to be happy, wants to have a good time with you. I don't know if it makes sense to you, but every once in awhile when I was feeling flustered during a date, I would think about this and it would relax me for some reason.

[Max Overclock]

I guess that's the general desire of a normal man: to f*** every girl they meet.

 

Sheesh ... I just realized how uncompromising ... and abnormal? I must be.

[xpaperxcutx]

So are you saying that you're not being yourself? I wonder why you feel the need to appear more confident then you normally are? It sounds to me from what the way you describe your interactions with your friends and the way you present yourself here that you are confident without being overly so. So I wonder why you would try to project more confidence when dating.

 

It seems to me there's something there that might be indicative that you might be trying too hard. Think about all the people you've come across whom you were able to tell were trying to act more confident then they were. It's noticeable right?

 

I wonder, do you sometimes feel like dates are like interview situations, where you can either suceed or fail? When I started dating again, someone on here pointed out that this was probably the worst way to go about a date. Sure there is pressure to get to know someone and impress, but deep down you are looking to find a really great friend, possibly your best friend ever. So, advice teller said, act as if the person you are with is already that great friend of yours: he means you well, wants you to succeed, wants you to be happy, wants to have a good time with you. I don't know if it makes sense to you, but every once in awhile when I was feeling flustered during a date, I would think about this and it would relax me for some reason.

 

No I meant normally I'm not a very talkative person to strangers, and I'm very quiet at times unless I know someone and is comfortable with them. So on these dates I try not to exude any shyness on my part. By being confident, I meant I'm usually more elated or felicitious than need be. I don't know how to describe it, just more forthcoming with myself.

 

Umm yes, I sometimes do find that I have a bit more restraint with my opinions, I won't voice them loudly but I will make it known when I don't agree with certain things. I really don't know how to see them as a great friend because I don't date my friends.

[Kamille]

No I meant normally I'm not a very talkative person to strangers, and I'm very quiet at times unless I know someone and is comfortable with them. So on these dates I try not to exude any shyness on my part. By being confident, I meant I'm usually more elated or felicitious than need be. I don't know how to describe it, just more forthcoming with myself.

 

Umm yes, I sometimes do find that I have a bit more restraint with my opinions, I won't voice them loudly but I will make it known when I don't agree with certain things. I really don't know how to see them as a great friend because I don't date my friends.

 

Why not be shy if you feel shy? Use it. It probably makes you intriguing. Get them to do the work to get to know you.

 

The pretend they're you friend: I guess it's more about seeing your dates as people who mean you well in trying to get to know you and not as people who are trying to evaluate you. What I mean by it is that thinking of my dates as people who wished me well, the same as friends would, helped me enter dates with a positive, relaxed, easy-going attitude. And whether or not you date friends is besides the point. If things work out with your date, then he will become your closest friend in the world - at least that's what happened to me in all three of my LTRs.

 

It might not help you out. In fact it didn't really click for me at first either, but then I was on a date, feeling restrained, and the 'pretend this guy is one of your best friends' line popped into my head and I eventually started feeling more relaxed. Then again, I have a pretty great imagination .

[carhill]

I think I do a fairly good job of attracking guys. I tend to turn a few heads or two. But my impression of that is that many men tend to see me as more of a fling than anything else. I guess that's the general desire of a normal man: to f*** every girl they meet.

 

I'll bet you do. My wife has a friend I bet is a lot like you. She's like 5'10", 120lbs, blond, mid-40's, intimidating as heck, smart as a whip and she attracts losers like a carcass attracts flies. Heck she used to piss me off when she'd come around and try to re-arrange my house Anyway, underneath all that, she's a really good and loving person and a very loyal friend but these guys only see the exterior and judge her by it. It doesn't help that she flirts like there's no tomorrow. I've seen her in action and no male (probably not even Mr. gentleman me) would stand a chance. Not that she'd ever listen to me, but I'd tell her that her aura is all wrong and that's why she's attracting the losers and players. Tone down the "girls" and wild hair and club makeup and flirty behavior and attract a different caliber of male.

 

Anyway...there ya go.....back to the tractor

[xpaperxcutx]

I'll bet you do. My wife has a friend I bet is a lot like you. She's like 5'10", 120lbs, blond, mid-40's, intimidating as heck, smart as a whip and she attracts losers like a carcass attracts flies. Heck she used to piss me off when she'd come around and try to re-arrange my house Anyway, underneath all that, she's a really good and loving person and a very loyal friend but these guys only see the exterior and judge her by it. It doesn't help that she flirts like there's no tomorrow. I've seen her in action and no male (probably not even Mr. gentleman me) would stand a chance. Not that she'd ever listen to me, but I'd tell her that her aura is all wrong and that's why she's attracting the losers and players. Tone down the "girls" and wild hair and club makeup and flirty behavior and attract a different caliber of male.

 

Anyway...there ya go.....back to the tractor

 

Thanks

She does remind me of me, I tend to piss off my friends' boyfriends as well, they feel a bit intimidated by my attitude.

[xaneurysmx]

Well, how many people are you dating? I can count on my fingers how many guys I have been interested in enough to date. They are few and far between (which is why I have the problem of falling fast when I find one, but that's in my post ). If you're dating often and many men, the chances are it's not going to work out most of the time, which is fine as long as you're having fun and do not take it personally, but it sounds like you do, and you have to ask yourself why then? I mean, are you even really interested in these men? Maybe try hanging out with groups of friends and friends of theirs until you meet somebody you actually have a connection with. Then you can be yourself on the date, not worry about dating rules or how strong you come off, and be pretty sure that a follow-up date is to come because the chemistry was already there.

[D-Lish]

Patterns are hard to break- and once you start questioning yourself and what you're doing wrong- you become overly self conscious and can make things worse.

 

I've never really figured out how to date "right"... lol.

I've lost a couple by acting too dis-interested, trying to play it overly cool.

 

I do know that men don't often react positively to neediness, and they can tell if you're trying too hard.

 

I am great at dating until I develop real feelings for someone... then I can lose perspective and so something mean or stupid to push them away.... pattern. I think we all have them.

 

I won't call or reach out to someone after a first date- I always wait for them to contact me after. I agree that there is that element of the chase that most men enjoy.

 

You probably have to ask yourself if you're just attracting and dating the wrong kind of guys. Sometimes it might just have to do with a lack of chemistry.

 

I try to approach dating with a "relax and have fun" attitude.

I do suggest that if you have a date with someone and feel the chemistry with them, that you don't jump the gun and call them first. Wait for them to contact you. I know many people will disagree- but I can tell you that anytime I have gone out with someone and felt a spark- they've called.

[Angels&Airwaves]

 

I don't go into pursue mode until after the date, where it seems that I have to initiate contact because they've became stiff with their approach. And normally I do flirt, when I know the guy's flirting with me. I also play it nonchalantly and no straightforward attacks, just lots of subtle approaches, like the occasional hand touching and hugs. Besides, the

guys were usually the one who are more straightforward. They start with the wanting to give me hugs, or massages, and wanting to kiss and whatnot.

 

And the last part really strikes me, because it applied to my ex. He was so shy in the beginning, but after I stated dating him, he was so forward with his needs and wants, it was sickening.

 

Is that after the first date? My point is (and I don’t mean to come across as an advocate of playing games) that you should perhaps pursue less than what you do, especially if it’s early on in the dating stage. Some men like to find their feet, get comfortable and then gradually work towards a relationship. Your eagerness and pursuing could make some men feel awkward and uncomfortable and that’s what leads them to going off you.

 

And from what you have you said, it seems like a mixture of them not being terribly interested and you’re pursuing far too much. I guess you have to go through a few men before finding a decent one, maybe that’s what you have to do.

 

Take your experience from your ex and apply it to yourself, I don’t think you should change anything except maybe hold off on the pursuing and eagerness in the initial stages, but I certainly wouldn’t try and restrict and enclose parts of your personality, that won’t help matters. Personally, if I liked you and you liked me, I wouldn’t have any problem with you pursuing me, but that would have to happen after I had become comfortable around you etc.

[xpaperxcutx]

Is that after the first date? My point is (and I don’t mean to come across as an advocate of playing games) that you should perhaps pursue less than what you do, especially if it’s early on in the dating stage. Some men like to find their feet, get comfortable and then gradually work towards a relationship. Your eagerness and pursuing could make some men feel awkward and uncomfortable and that’s what leads them to going off you.

 

And from what you have you said, it seems like a mixture of them not being terribly interested and you’re pursuing far too much. I guess you have to go through a few men before finding a decent one, maybe that’s what you have to do.

 

Take your experience from your ex and apply it to yourself, I don’t think you should change anything except maybe hold off on the pursuing and eagerness in the initial stages, but I certainly wouldn’t try and restrict and enclose parts of your personality, that won’t help matters. Personally, if I liked you and you liked me, I wouldn’t have any problem with you pursuing me, but that would have to happen after I had become comfortable around you etc.

 

I went thru some old posts on LS and I came across one relating to why a guy usually takes a girl out, because he's attracted to her or just for the sake of a good time?

Does this apply? I mean my firm belief is that when a guy you don't know takes you out on a date, it's because he's attracted and wants to pursue something. So then why ask me out in the first place if you don't even have the decency to call me afterwards?

 

Like I wrote before, I hardly ever pursue until I'm certain that the guy's pursuing me. And so I should stop reciprocating their advances then?

[Angels&Airwaves]

I went thru some old posts on LS and I came across one relating to why a guy usually takes a girl out, because he's attracted to her or just for the sake of a good time?

Does this apply? I mean my firm belief is that when a guy you don't know takes you out on a date, it's because he's attracted and wants to pursue something. So then why ask me out in the first place if you don't even have the decency to call me afterwards?

 

Like I wrote before, I hardly ever pursue until I'm certain that the guy's pursuing me. And so I should stop reciprocating their advances then?

 

If I take a girl out who I like (a rarity as I’ve explained before) I’ll go out with them because I’m generally interested in them and want to get to know them better to really seal my interest and attraction, for example. I guess there are some men who like to go out and have some fun; I’m sure women to do this, too. It depends on the person and what they want, after all not all of us want the same thing.

 

It depends if those advances are genuine or not, I mean I doubt I would make strong advances on someone until a series of dates, where I know I like her and she likes me, then again I’m similar to that of tortoise, I’ve only developed a small brand of confidence and high self-esteem, so naturally I go at a slower pace. I guess you could reciprocate their advances if that’s what you feel is right.

 

All I was suggesting is to perhaps not be so strong initially; the discussion is getting more profound by the minute

[xpaperxcutx]

If I take a girl out who I like (a rarity as I’ve explained before) I’ll go out with them because I’m generally interested in them and want to get to know them better to really seal my interest and attraction, for example. I guess there are some men who like to go out and have some fun; I’m sure women to do this, too. It depends on the person and what they want, after all not all of us want the same thing.

 

It depends if those advances are genuine or not, I mean I doubt I would make strong advances on someone until a series of dates, where I know I like her and she likes me, then again I’m similar to that of tortoise, I’ve only developed a small brand of confidence and high self-esteem, so naturally I go at a slower pace. I guess you could reciprocate their advances if that’s what you feel is right.

 

All I was suggesting is to perhaps not be so strong initially; the discussion is getting more profound by the minute

 

Well almost all my dates seem to signal that they're interested. I mean their advances do seem genuine, the occasional touch of the hands and whatnot. I mean I have nothing against a hug or any light touching, in fact I see that as a sign that they're really INTERESTED. I mean I was raised in a very traditional family where open expression of interest is not really accepted, yet I have no problem with holding hands or hugging.

 

And really, A&A, do your dates ever get frustrated that you're approaching them at a tortoise's pace?

 

No offense but I do believe in your approach to dating, yet, you have to make it known you're interested without shouting it out that you like the person

[Angels&Airwaves]

That’s very strange, xPxCx, very strange, I’m afraid I can’t help any further, I guess you’ll just have to weed out the man you’re looking for from a bad bunch.

 

I haven’t had too many dates as you will have probably guessed, but the two or three girls I have been on dates with haven’t been impressed with me entirely.

 

The first girl I went on a date with wanted some physically intimacy with me in a cinema, which I did not comply with, the reasons for me doing so is not because I wasn’t attracted to her, but because I didn’t know and was rather uncomfortable within her presence.

 

The second girl was a bit more successful, we went on several dates and really hit it off on the first few, but as the latter dates came and went she became disinterested because I was too shy and lacked any confidence to move from level one to level two, eventually she lost interest and pursued someone else, who I believe are still together.

 

The third girl was disastrous, I was attracted to her, but she was so bland and lifeless that I had to resort to cutting the date in order to regain my sanity, mysteriously I actually went on another date with her to see if my opinion would change, but ended up acting rather distant and disinterested and she eventually vented her frustration and left and I haven't spoken to her since.

 

So as you can see, I’m not the best person to go on a date with especially if you’re looking for any physical intimacy on the dates, or looking for subtle or blatant signs, I probably send out all kinds of mixed signals, I don't mean too, it just happened that way, I'm improving though.

[carhill]

When you meet the right woman (that's the important caveat), none of those issues will matter. It'll just happen. When it happens to you, and I hope it does, you'll look back and wonder what all your angst was about

 

The important thing is exposure, not just "dating". Engage and converse with as many women as possible, even casually.