Author hopeful08 Posted February 28, 2008 Author Posted February 28, 2008 Funny, everything I heard about his "horribly bad abusive wife" came from sources other than MM . And of course now that he's left her and everyone's accepted that reconciliation really isn't on the agenda at all this time, the stories are REALLY coming out ! Not just abusive to him, colleagues, workmen, shop assistants and random others, but to family and friends themselves. anyone who knows anything about domestic abuse - from a clinical or legal perspective - would not find that surprising. Abuse robs the abused of their sense of agency and their sense of self, and leaves them at the mercy of opinions and actions of the abuser. The abused internalise the oppression and come to think themselves deserving of it, of not deserving happiness and as unable to survive without the abuser. It's a recognised mental health diagnosis and a successful basis for argument in court (where the abused kills the long term abuser). Google "battered person syndrome" if you need more info. And i also want to thank you, I looked at some of your posts and found this .. im going to assume that your MM was in a verbally abusive relationship. So is mine. which is why it is taking so long, I also knew a coworker of her's that supported this. He rarely talks about it unless asked.
OWoman Posted February 28, 2008 Posted February 28, 2008 im going to assume that your MM was in a verbally abusive relationship. So is mine. which is why it is taking so long. Hopeful - EVERYTHING about your story makes sense to me now. From my experience, I can't recommend enough that your MM get counselling. Family counselling if he wants to negotiate a civil exit and mediated dissolution for the family - but my MM's W didn't agree to this and your MM's W may also not - but certainly IC. Without IC my MM would probably also have stuck it out 6 years or 20 years or 50 years, because the abuse not only erodes their esteem and what they think they deserve, it also undermines their agency and they become completely paralysed, unable to act, worrying about the effect on others and looking for permission elsewhere instead of inside themselves. He is probably looking to you for permission, or even instructions, to act one way or another, and it's very tempting to take that responsibility from him and to make those decisions on his behalf. Abused partners see that as a sign of love - you love him enough to step in and sort things out for him, and make all of that go away - but that is just perpetunating the abuse by showing him youhave no faith in HIS ability to decide or act, and it perpetuates a situation of him being "weak" in the relationship, the same as he is with his W. He needs to be able to make the break and feel he's done it himself. And his W needs to see him do that - she needs to see him squirm out from under her thumb and recognise that he no longer belongs there, that she cannot expect him to fit there again - and that can free her from her role as abuser too, if she takes the opportunity. Hopeful this must be very difficult for you. You must have great bald patches from all the hair you have torn out. And at some point you may need to think seriously if it is worth it to you to carry on hoping, if his trappedness doesn't seem to be resolving itself one way or the other. He could leave - mine did - but he needs to feel OK about doing so, and for that I really think you should encourage counselling. When he starts to realise - really realise - that he too has rights and worth, as a person and not just a H or father, he can start to accept that he has a choice, can make that choice and act on it - and then leaving becomes truly possible. Once he's out of it, he'll be able to look back and see it for what it was - abuse and not love. And then everything will start to happen very quickly. You'll have a new man on your hands! But this teetering on the edge stage is very trying - it's so tempting to give a little nudge so that he topples over if he won't jump, but you have to let him take that step. Good luck hopeful. There is hope. If you're willing and able.
Mino Posted February 28, 2008 Posted February 28, 2008 Hi Hopeful, read my thread, I have been with mm going on 4. We had many deadlines, all failed on the Day he was supposed to move. He has made the move twice. Last month was the last one. He ended up back home again. I too wanted to sell my house, get a new home together to make a fresh start. Long story short he ended up with a breakdown, because of missing the kids. I called his wife for the first time. Funny he has been back home several weeks, and they still have not discussed the "incident" swept it under the rug completely. Amazes me, they are not really talking , except small talk, no fighting, no nothing, really wierd. I am making plans to leave area completly, searching for a job far far away, he does not know this. I am tired, my advice to you is to consentrate on yourself.. Do not sell home, not even if he moves out . Wait at least till divorce papers are signed and the ink is dried, 1-2 years. He may be a flip flopper like mind. i know what he wants in his heart, but he just is to weak . He keeps trying. But that is not working for me anymore. And I know I am the opposite of his wife, I cannot keep my mouth shut , not even for a day:o unlike his wife who rather look the other way and pretend. I drive him crazy and myself with all the questions, Now my only question is are you moving out and when, narrowed it down to two. And My new response is good, when you have accomplished this , with seperation papers call me. till then leave me alone, and in the meantime ai am looking to dssappear. I figure by the time he gets his but in gear, I will be long. Good Luck sweetie
bentnotbroken Posted February 28, 2008 Posted February 28, 2008 BNB, my point was that these sorts of general observations (heavily loaded with opinion) is not really assisting the OP. Just an observation Sure it is. When you say things out loud and others say them out loud, they seem to have more impact on what we stand to loose and what we stand to gain. She has already lost six years waiting. Could she have lost out on the man God chose for her, maybe. Could she have lost out on blessings only for her, maybe. Can she ever get those years back,never. Just an observation.
Author hopeful08 Posted February 28, 2008 Author Posted February 28, 2008 How do you know what questions to ask, and how often? I don't want to drive him crazy, I guess I keep forgetting that my divorce took two years, (but we were separated) Does anyone know of a situation, that there was talk of divorce, but due to financial reasons they lived under the same roof until it was a "done deal". I'm having another "conversation" with him tomorrow morning, And that is going to be one of my question's. After she found out about us she said she wanted a divorce and to sell the house, but in my original post I stated why that hasn't happened yet. I guess I had hoped that he would move out first, but that is purely for selfish reasons, and I guess my desire to see some action.
Je Ne Regrette Rien Posted February 28, 2008 Posted February 28, 2008 Of course you want some action, and you deserve some action to back up his words. It must be extremely difficult for him if his W is alienating him from his daughter because of their marriage. However, that doesn't really help you does it. OWoman touched on a very valid point about a non-confrontational person in a verbally/mentally abusive marriage which I definitely think is food for thought: You can't sort out his problems. Your talk that you want to have with him is looking for reassurance from him - but how can you really ever gain reassurance from him until any actions have been demonstrated? Because when you have your talk, I'm sure you will feel reassured for a few days until doubts spring up again and then you're back to square one - because he is not providing you with actions, and in a way his actions appear to differ from him words. You've waited for a long time for him. As I said earlier, it already builds a rocky foundation that he was "found out" instead of leaving of his own accord. But by the by, he was and he has decided to make a life with you. I think its more important that you give yourself a timeline. Take some control back in this. If your situation is not how you would like it by, say, December, are you willing to wait longer? Sometimes giving yourself a deadline, that isnt shared with anyone, just gives you that little bit of control that you sound like you really need. It sounds like you're waiting in the wings for the merry-go-round of their marriage to go round once again - but why do that to yourself? If MM can show some reassurance in action (i.e. getting a place, going to counselling, anything positive for your futre together) fair enough. If he can't - take your life back from him.
Author hopeful08 Posted February 28, 2008 Author Posted February 28, 2008 By the way, that is exactly how it is...... We have a conversation.... I feel reassured for a few day's..... and then the doubts start all over again. I sometimes wonder if all the "communication" is worth the effort, but what I am really looking for from him, is what he is thinking, and being a man, and of the 50 something generation, and his nationality (a lot more private, he's British) He will tell me.....he's worried about money, his daughter, all valid concerns , but I'm really looking for a little more depth. We have talked about some specifics, like we will have to keep ourselves private for sometime, where he is going to live, (house apt) But to be honest, his wife is who I am really worried about, she is difficult, won't speak to him, for weeks on end... and when she does talk to him, it is in anger. ( it's been nine months since she found out) She and her character are my primary concerns. I feel very strongly that if she was not so volatile this would have been on it's way by now. Fear immobilizes people.
ICallsEmAsISeesEm Posted February 28, 2008 Posted February 28, 2008 So, his wife's 'character' and whether she talks to him or not is all told to you by a guy whose done nothing but lie and deceive his own wife and family for the last 6 years? I wouldn't believe a word out of this guy's mouth if a gun were put to my head. So you're going to get your prize because his wife decided she didn't want to be married anymore when she found who she was really married to, is that it? You're a lucky girl.
Author hopeful08 Posted February 28, 2008 Author Posted February 28, 2008 If you had read my earlier post's should would have seen, that I am good friends with someone that is a aware of that "character" first hand.... pls don't draw your own conclusions from one post... and to be honest. NO One knows the whole situation unless they are in it.
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