Child Support.

[IWALH]

I've been thinking a lot recently.

 

I have never received ANY kind of child support from xMM. It is VERY hard to raise a child by myself. I am currently a full-time student and looking for a part-time job on the weekends. I have no income... a ton of debt... I am unbelievably broke.

 

Long story short: Should I pursue child support? It's going to open up a whole new can of worms... but I don't think I have any other choice now..

 

What do you guys think?

[Lyssa]

This must be tough for you, IWALH.

 

[[[hugs]]]

 

If you don't mind my asking you, why didn't you ask for it in the beginning? Does he know about his child?

[IWALH]

This must be tough for you, IWALH.

 

[[[hugs]]]

 

If you don't mind my asking you, why didn't you ask for it in the beginning? Does he know about his child?

 

 

It's tough sometimes...

 

I didn't ask for it before because he said the ONLY reason he would want partial custody/visitation is if I pursed child support. Considering the fact he is a drug addict, alcoholic, married man who has neglected all three of his children in the past, I did not want him to attempt to father my daughter. So I have not pursued child support.

 

However, now that I am taking a Family Law class, know my rights, and am in a significant amount of debt trying to raise OUR child on my own, I have come to realize that he does need to be paying.

 

But there are all sorts of issues. He has been in trouble with the law for tax fraud before (not to mention multiple DUI's!). He works for his father-in-law and I was informed last year that he gets paid "under the table" so the amount on his income tax return is incorrect, so I probably wouldn't even get much.

 

Ugh... this is just stressful... I don't know what to do.

[IWALH]

This must be tough for you, IWALH.

 

[[[hugs]]]

 

If you don't mind my asking you, why didn't you ask for it in the beginning? Does he know about his child?

 

And yes, he does know about his child.

 

But he has made it very clear (verbally and non-verbally) that he does not care about her nor does he think of her as his daughter. Which is why I'd like to keep him out of the picture as much as possible. There is no telling how he would act towards her...

Edited February 15, 2008 by IWALH

[ICallsEmAsISeesEm]

Boy, does this guy sound a complete LOSER. I don't think you have to worry about him wanting to take your kid on the weekends - that might interfere with his laying on the couch and doing nothing while his wife does all the work and raises their 3 kids (that he shouldn't have had because he's too big a LOSER to support them in the right manner).

 

Quite frankly, who gives a rat's ass WHAT he thinks about your kid - whether he thinks of her as his or not? What a piece of sh*t this creep is. And I highly doubt his wife would push to have your kid for the weekends when she already has 3 to look after with ZERO help from this f*ckwad. I think that would be the LAST thing she'd want.

 

Loser boy needs to be responsible - if he's old enough to unzip his pants and cheat on his wife, he's old enough to be responsible for the consequences that occur.

[Lyssa]

Considering the fact he is a drug addict, alcoholic, married man who has neglected all three of his children in the past, I did not want him to attempt to father my daughter. So I have not pursued child support.

 

But there are all sorts of issues. He has been in trouble with the law for tax fraud before (not to mention multiple DUI's!). He works for his father-in-law and I was informed last year that he gets paid "under the table" so the amount on his income tax return is incorrect, so I probably wouldn't even get much.

 

I'm worried about the above that I quoted.

 

Drug addict, alcoholic etc on top of that - getting paid "under the table"... how is he going to support you?

 

Won't you be earning more after you're done schooling? He should be responsible but I just don't see him as being a potential child supporter.

[BetrayedMM]

Good point... If he's working 'under the table', he just doesn't have the money to begin with. There is no paycheck to withhold arrears from to begin with, so he would have to voluntarily send in the checks. Do you think he actually will? Also, are you sure you need him in your child's life, and that you want a lifetime of interaction with him?

 

If it's important to you that he acknowledge his responsibility, yeah, I can understand. Child support will force him to, even if he fights it there's DNA and the courts to wrestle, and he can't escape that one! Personally, it irks me that guys like this can just go and have kids willy nilly with no responsibility whatsoever. I guess he's pretty much a kid himself, otherwise he'd step up to the plate.

But, is that what you want? You did mention a can of worms.

[Lyssa]

But he has made it very clear (verbally and non-verbally) that he does not care about her nor does he think of her as his daughter. Which is why I'd like to keep him out of the picture as much as possible. There is no telling how he would act towards her...

 

Which is another reason why you shouldn't bring him into the picture. That's my opinion, anyway.

 

Good point... If he's working 'under the table', he just doesn't have the money to begin with. There is no paycheck to withhold arrears from to begin with, so he would have to voluntarily send in the checks. Do you think he actually will? Also, are you sure you need him in your child's life, and that you want a lifetime of interaction with him?

 

If it's important to you that he acknowledge his responsibility, yeah, I can understand. Child support will force him to, even if he fights it there's DNA and the courts to wrestle, and he can't escape that one! Personally, it irks me that guys like this can just go and have kids willy nilly with no responsibility whatsoever. I guess he's pretty much a kid himself, otherwise he'd step up to the plate.

But, is that what you want? You did mention a can of worms.

 

The bolded part - yes, I can understand that too.

 

IWALH, this is something you have to think about - long and hard. Will it be a good idea to have a drug addict/alcoholic father around your daughter?? It's not healthy and what if they want her over a few days? He has the right, doesn't he?

[OWoman]

IWALH, this is something you have to think about - long and hard. Will it be a good idea to have a drug addict/alcoholic father around your daughter?? It's not healthy and what if they want her over a few days? He has the right, doesn't he?

 

I don't know US law (assuming you're in the US) but in my country every parent has the obligation to pay child support, irrespective of access and custody. That is determined separately, by a separate court, with the child's best interests in mind. If this guy is as bad as is described, no court will grant him access unless under the very tightest court-approved supervision.

 

I'd say go for child support. Even if you don't get very much, it's better than the nothing you're getting now. It's your daughter's right. Why should she suffer because her father is a loser?

[Lyssa]

I don't know US law (assuming you're in the US) but in my country every parent has the obligation to pay child support, irrespective of access and custody. That is determined separately, by a separate court, with the child's best interests in mind. If this guy is as bad as is described, no court will grant him access unless under the very tightest court-approved supervision.

 

I'd say go for child support. Even if you don't get very much, it's better than the nothing you're getting now. It's your daughter's right. Why should she suffer because her father is a loser?

 

I'm not in the US, that is why I asked. I presumed OP is from the US and I don't really know much about the US law.

 

As for where I am from, especially my religion - it is a must that the H supports the child. It is in part of agreement with the Syariah law.

[nittygritty]

A lot depends on the laws of your state but there are ways to keep your child protected if you can get them written into a court ordered agreement.

 

Putting stipulations like UA's, hair sample drug testing, supervised visitation (that your ex pays for until a relationship is established) and non-specific wording of visitation, offer some protection. The courts may require even more hoops for him to jump through before he could have any unsupervised visitation.

 

Its not likely that he will ever attempt to actually exercise any visitation and it is a fairly common tactic of deadbeats to threaten to exercise "unsafe" visitation, simply because they're trying to prevent having to pay child support. It is your child's legal right to be financially supported by both parents.

 

BUT...You know best as to what your ex is truly capable of doing and if you have any doubts as to the amount the court system can offer protection for your child or any concerns about emotional harm being done to your child, than don't put your child at risk for a minimal amount of child support.

 

It sounds like you'll need paternity established first. Research your state laws thoroughly before you begin the process.

[Chrome Barracuda]

I've been thinking a lot recently.

 

I have never received ANY kind of child support from xMM. It is VERY hard to raise a child by myself. I am currently a full-time student and looking for a part-time job on the weekends. I have no income... a ton of debt... I am unbelievably broke.

 

Long story short: Should I pursue child support? It's going to open up a whole new can of worms... but I don't think I have any other choice now..

 

What do you guys think?

 

Of course, why havent you pursued the Xmm for child support!??

 

What the hell were you waiting for? let me guess he is still married and has kids?

 

If that's the case you might need to get in line because the wife might have first dibs. lol.

[silktricks]

My immediate gut reaction was, "well, of course, you should pursue child support." However, as I read on, I can see that you may be saddled with many problems if you pursue it.

 

Also, getting the order and getting the money are two different things. You may find that you spend more money in court pursuing the money than you ever get actual money. When you come down to it, you need to decide if the possible money is worth the probable headache.

 

My kids' Dad sent VERY little money through the years. I didn't use it as child support, but instead put it aside for them and gave it to them (with interest) when they were grown. It still wasn't much, but it was the only thing (other than genes) that they ever did get from him.

[Art_Critic]

First off.. I wanted to say that you need to file for child support.

You are doing your child a disservice by not doing so.

 

That being said...

 

If he has to pay child support then you may have to grant him visitation.. Something to think about.

[Meranna]

Try going to your local public services offices, mine was in the same place that offer food stamps, etc. Talk to them, they can set up child support for you and if it is anything like mine was, nothing was ever brought up about visitation. My ex is a decent father so we have a very open visitation schedule and he's never fought me for visitation so your situation may be different. I THINK he would have to pursue that separately through the court system, I may be wrong here. Even if he can't pay now it will build up and he will have to pay it eventually.

 

It also wouldn't hurt to look into other areas of help you can get while you are there. Even food assistance can make a huge difference. You are going to school, working and trying to make a better life for you and your child, that help is there for people like you!! Do whatever you can for your child, she deserves it.

[IWALH]

Boy, does this guy sound a complete LOSER. I don't think you have to worry about him wanting to take your kid on the weekends - that might interfere with his laying on the couch and doing nothing while his wife does all the work and raises their 3 kids (that he shouldn't have had because he's too big a LOSER to support them in the right manner).

 

Quite frankly, who gives a rat's ass WHAT he thinks about your kid - whether he thinks of her as his or not? What a piece of sh*t this creep is. And I highly doubt his wife would push to have your kid for the weekends when she already has 3 to look after with ZERO help from this f*ckwad. I think that would be the LAST thing she'd want.

 

Loser boy needs to be responsible - if he's old enough to unzip his pants and cheat on his wife, he's old enough to be responsible for the consequences that occur.

 

Well, they actually have two children to look after. The third child is 22 years old (one year younger than me) and is from his first marriage. In addition, he lives in another state (though he was staying with them for a time period last year). The other two children, from his second and current marriage, are (almost) 10 and 4. And, yeah, it is my understanding that his wife does do the bulk of the child-rearing.

 

I do, however, think that she would push him for visitation, if not partial custody. I think this because last year when he and I were talking, I mentioned to him that I was getting a lot of pressure to pursue child support from him and I was really thinking about doing it. He replied to this by saying "If you go after me for child support then W will DEFINITELY make me go after you for visitation/custody." And when they were all out here she was taking so many pictures of my daughter and really wanted to be around her and include her. I know she wants her to be a part of their family. He doesn't, she does.

[IWALH]

I'm worried about the above that I quoted.

 

Drug addict, alcoholic etc on top of that - getting paid "under the table"... how is he going to support you?

 

Won't you be earning more after you're done schooling? He should be responsible but I just don't see him as being a potential child supporter.

 

Well, I have been speaking to several people and what the people at CSE told me was that they look at his taxes for the last 3 years. Two years ago he was getting paid mostly under the table because he was a DJ and was lying about his tips (I saw this with my own eyes on several occasions). Now he has been working for his father-in-law since, who helps them out in addition to his paychecks. So he DOES get paychecks... but the big problem is his WIFE is the one who prepares the paychecks (she works for the same company). They also get extra help from his father-in-law, which is why I said he gets paid "under the table." But he DOES get a paycheck. But I believe it states that it is less than he actually makes.

[IWALH]

It sounds like you'll need paternity established first. Research your state laws thoroughly before you begin the process.

 

Yep, I would. I have two ways I can go. I can go through CSE, who would do all the work for me but it would only be for child support; or I can file against him myself and file for custody, visitation, and child support all at the same time. Or I could just hire a lawyer and let him do everything. I think, at this point, I am not going to hire a lawyer... but if he hires a lawyer, then I will. One thing I have learned from my law class was that I am entitled to the same quality of representation as him. Meaning that if he gets a decent lawyer, I would be entitled to one to and he would have to end up paying for it.

 

As for paternity, yes, what they would do is first go through the DNA testing (which they said would take a total of 6-8 weeks), then they would proceed with everything else.

[IWALH]

If he has to pay child support then you may have to grant him visitation.. Something to think about.

 

 

That is my exact predicament, and has been since she was born. It's the only thing stopping me from pursuing child support from him....

[Meranna]

Some help is better than no help. If you are counting up your change to get a gallon of milk to last you until your next paycheck you may want to look into it. I know you didn't say you are that bad off but i know it's hard raising a kid on a limited income. An extra 10 or 15 bucks a week is huge at times.

 

As for his W, she sounds a bit odd to me but maybe she realizes that your daughter is her kids' half sister and wants her involved with them. A child can never have too many people around who love them. I fully understand your worry when it comes to your XMM, if they do push visitation I would definitely make him jump through as many hoops as you can. I can't help but feel that's just a threat from him so he can get out of paying child support either.

 

Good luck

[IWALH]

Try going to your local public services offices, mine was in the same place that offer food stamps, etc. Talk to them, they can set up child support for you and if it is anything like mine was, nothing was ever brought up about visitation. My ex is a decent father so we have a very open visitation schedule and he's never fought me for visitation so your situation may be different. I THINK he would have to pursue that separately through the court system, I may be wrong here. Even if he can't pay now it will build up and he will have to pay it eventually.

 

It also wouldn't hurt to look into other areas of help you can get while you are there. Even food assistance can make a huge difference. You are going to school, working and trying to make a better life for you and your child, that help is there for people like you!! Do whatever you can for your child, she deserves it.

 

That is what has started this whole thing, actually. I applied for Food Stamps and Medicaid (for my daughter, I have insurance through my mother's work, but my daughter does not now that she is over 18 months old) and they asked for information about him. At first, I didn't provide it. Then they told me I have to cooperate with CSE in order for them to approve me for Food Stamps. Then I thought "Well, if I am going to have to give his information and he is going to have to end up paying so I can get food stamps, he is going to probably try and go after me for visitation/custody, so I might as well just go after him for child support!"

 

Now I am just kind of stuck. My application is on hold and... blah, I don't know. I have another appointment with CSE on Tuesday and she told me she wants all of his information at that appointment or they will have to close my case. I told her I would try to find it.... but I am so lost. I have a couple of attorneys lined up that I was supposed to contact (referred by friends), and I am thinking I am probably going to need to do that asap.

 

He would have to pursue custody/visitation separately, but I know he would do it because his wife would push him to... not because he wants to.

 

I am trying to get all the help I can! My college tuition is paid for through the Pell Grant, so that is wonderful. And I am sure I am probably eligible for extra scholarships since my grades are so great... so I will try to find some to apply for.

 

My life isn't extremely hard financially right now, because I am living with my mother. But I do have to buy all of my own groceries, plus things for my daughter, cell phone bill, debt, etc. and I could really use the extra money that I SHOULD have been getting all along. Since the birth of my daughter I have been digging myself into a hole of debt by trying to provide for her what two parents should be providing. The only thing he ever got for our daughter was a Target gift card soon after she was born.... and only because his WIFE went and got it herself. Like I have said many times before, he just doesn't care about her at all.

[IWALH]

Put a micro casette recorder in your pocket and have a conversation with him about support. When he starts spouting off about "I'm gonna demand visitation if you make me pay" he'll sound like the jackass of a "father" that he is, and hopefully the court will disallow the visitation, or at the very least make him go through parenting classes and such before allowing it, which he'll probably avoid like the plague.

 

Actually, I already have a conversation that we had online when I was pregnant saved on my computer where he basically stated that he doesn't want anything to do with the baby unless he has to pay. And he has proved that this is correct by not attempting to have anything to do with her since she was born. His wife and I were the only ones that tried to get him involved. I have never deleted the conversation just in case.

 

I can't do the cassette thing because I don't talk to him anymore... been almost 8 months now... and I refuse to ever talk to him again without a lawyer, judge, or mediator present.

[Art_Critic]

His wife and I were the only ones that tried to get him involved. I have never deleted the conversation just in case.

 

I'm surprised that she stands there knowing that one of his kids is out there that he doesn't take care of...

That shocks me... WTF is wrong with her ?... she is no better than him..

 

Go get your child support.. don't take their reasoning why he shouldn't have to pay..

 

Go get it and live with the visitation.. at least you will have the help you need money wise..

Something else to consider.. because you have not established paternity then your child doesn't get the chance to get his Social Security if he dies..

If you have him as the father then his SS will pay for your child till he/she is 18.

 

 

Go start the process... you and your child will be better off in the future...

[nittygritty]

Yep, I would. I have two ways I can go. I can go through CSE, who would do all the work for me but it would only be for child support; or I can file against him myself and file for custody, visitation, and child support all at the same time. Or I could just hire a lawyer and let him do everything. I think, at this point, I am not going to hire a lawyer... but if he hires a lawyer, then I will. One thing I have learned from my law class was that I am entitled to the same quality of representation as him. Meaning that if he gets a decent lawyer, I would be entitled to one to and he would have to end up paying for it.

 

As for paternity, yes, what they would do is first go through the DNA testing (which they said would take a total of 6-8 weeks), then they would proceed with everything else.

 

I think going through CSE would be your best bet to start off with. If he's a total sleaze its possible that he'll get an attorney that will file for joint custody with no child support awarded. Worse case scenerio would be if he fought for full custody. Then you will need to hire a good attorney.

 

More than likely he would never win joint custody but its a risk to consider.

 

Your chances will be better having started off with using CSE. The judge will see that. The state will want to pay out the least amount of financial obligation towards you which makes them more eager to go after him for child support enforcement.

[nittygritty]

I also totally agree with Art Critic.

 

Your child will be protected and if he gets visitation and is intoxicated or something, if ever he were to come pick up your child then you withhold visitation until you can get it in front of a judge.