Girl not offering to pay

[Nemo]

Men hunt.. part of hunting is paying for the dates..

Hear ye, hear ye!!!!!

 

Men should take a moment to think about why women's haircuts are 10 times what men pay. There are so many cheap guys on this thread, that I am disgusted! I hope you learn from this thread, and start opening your moth-laden wallets.

[Lauriebell82]

The lady has probably invested her time and money in putting on make-up so she looks pretty for you, selecting an outfit and shoes so she'll look sexy for you, doing her hair so she'll look sexy for you, and wearing perfume so she'll smell sexy for you. Are those not attempts to impress? Are her efforts not romance?

 

I agree. I honestly don't understand why guys see paying for a meal as sexist and unfair. I'm sorry but I don't see that you have paid for all that much for this girl so far..2 dates. I could see if it is like 5 or 6 dates you have footed the bill and she hasn't offered, but she probably feels the way most women do..the guy who is asking should pay for the first 3 or 4 dates.

 

And this thing about you not "asking her out." Why the heck not? Sounds like an excuse to not have to foot the bill...

[oppath]

I agree Nemo..

 

 

Be a guy..show some balls and pay for dinner.. WTF?.. it has always been this way.. I prefer it this way and it will always be this way..

 

Men hunt.. part of hunting is paying for the dates..

 

Absolutely, but at some point the women needs to open her wallet too, mostly to demonstrate she values the time with the man and is invested in getting to know him. If you go on 20 dates before being exclusive, I find it absurd to suggest the guy should cover every expense on those 20 dates, because he is supposed to court her. That's flat out disrespectful to the guy and is completely unrealistic in the OP's case as he is a student.

 

However, he's really only had two dates with her, so he is raising this issue a few dates too soon. When a girl is really into you, typically she will counteroffer in some way that is not necessarily financial. There are many ways to offset costs. For example, if you are cooking dinner at your place for her, ask her to bring avocados to make quacomole or a bottle of wine. Just say "I want to cook xyz for you; could you bring a bottle of wine?" That's not an unreasonable request and if the woman thinks "he should provide everything" well, I wouldn't want to date a woman who couldn't buy a $6 bottle of cab.

 

I think what the OP wants more than the $$ value is a sign that she is invested in him and really wants to get to know him, because otherwise, he can't afford the investment. And I'd agree. He is in no position to be blowing money on a woman if she's not giving him signals she really likes him. It is not the $$ value. It's the effort, and he sounds like he'd be more content if she'd act really appreciative of him treating her and he is not certain if she likes him.

 

So what he is really asking, is "if I'm not sure how much this girl likes me, what can I do as a student to not spend so much money on her? because I don't have much, and it upsets me." I'd suggest rotating venues, cooking from your home, and doing things like a cup of coffee and a walk. Don't buy her dinner. Take her to other places. Be creative. Plenty of women, especially students, will recognize your financial situation and they will not care.

[Lauriebell82]

Absolutely, but at some point the women needs to open her wallet too, mostly to demonstrate she values the time with the man and is invested in getting to know him. If you go on 20 dates before being exclusive, I find it absurd to suggest the guy should cover every expense on those 20 dates, because he is supposed to court her. That's flat out disrespectful to the guy and is completely unrealistic in the OP's case as he is a student.

 

However, he's really only had two dates with her, so he is raising this issue a few dates too soon. When a girl is really into you, typically she will counteroffer in some way that is not necessarily financial. There are many ways to offset costs. For example, if you are cooking dinner at your place for her, ask her to bring avocados to make quacomole or a bottle of wine. Just say "I want to cook xyz for you; could you bring a bottle of wine?" That's not an unreasonable request and if the woman thinks "he should provide everything" well, I wouldn't want to date a woman who couldn't buy a $6 bottle of cab.

 

I think what the OP wants more than the $$ value is a sign that she is invested in him and really wants to get to know him, because otherwise, he can't afford the investment. And I'd agree. He is in no position to be blowing money on a woman if she's not giving him signals she really likes him. It is not the $$ value. It's the effort, and he sounds like he'd be more content if she'd act really appreciative of him treating her and he is not certain if she likes him.

 

So what he is really asking, is "if I'm not sure how much this girl likes me, what can I do as a student to not spend so much money on her? because I don't have much, and it upsets me." I'd suggest rotating venues, cooking from your home, and doing things like a cup of coffee and a walk. Don't buy her dinner. Take her to other places. Be creative. Plenty of women, especially students, will recognize your financial situation and they will not care.

 

Great post, Oppath. I agree completely. I think if you are upfront with her that you don't have a ton of spending money, she will be understanding about it. IMO I don't think students should be offering to treat their dates to dinner all the time..it's a waste of money. You can however, do other things like cook dinner at home like Oppath suggested. Listen to him, OP, he knows what he is talking about.

[Art_Critic]

but at some point the women needs to open her wallet too, mostly to demonstrate she values the time with the man and is invested in getting to know him.

 

So you need to have your back slapped that you are doing a good job by her paying for the dates ?..

How about her agreeing to go on another date ?.. that in itself is her acknowledging that she values you and wants to spend time with you..

 

Sure there are women out there that take men for a ride looking for freebies.. but those are not the norm.

The normal woman is looking for fun and a date.. not just free food..

[Nemo]

The lady has probably invested her time and money in putting on make-up so she looks pretty for you, selecting an outfit and shoes so she'll look sexy for you, doing her hair so she'll look sexy for you, and wearing perfume so she'll smell sexy for you. Are those not attempts to impress? Are her efforts not romance?

Exactly. And with all the expenses that society expects women to pick up, the least the man can do is pay up for the dates. He is easily getting off extremely lightly.

 

If the guy baulks at paying, then it's a sure sign that he's cheap. Time to move on to a man that's more comfortable with the provider role, or you will be sorely disappointed.

[norajane]

I'm a full-time student working part-time (as is she) so quite frankly I can't afford to be fitting the bill for both of us on everything. If I had been the one asking her on the dates then that might be a possible reason, but this is more like one of us says "hey we should do something on Saturday..." then we come up with a plan. What bothers me more than actually losing financially is that she hasn't even made the suggestion that she chip in. I'm used to girls offering to pay their share, refusing to let me pay for them....and some girls have even paid for me! (despite my objections). What's a guy to do?

 

If she's a student, too, then she probably doesn't have much money either and will understand.

 

If your problem is the actual money, next time you talk about what you'll do and the subject of dinner or whatever comes up, tell her you'd really love to take her to dinner, but you're a starving student and you don't have much money to take her to a nice place. Then, it's up to her to say, "Oh, don't worry, I'll pay for us tonight." or "No problem, let's stay in and split a pizza." If she doesn't say something like that, then she's probably not the girl for you.

 

If your problem is that she's not offering to pay some or half or all of the bill, then give it another date or two and see if she offers. Two dates isn't really enough time to see if her expectations are that you will always pay for everything.

[oppath]

Great post, Oppath. I agree completely. I think if you are upfront with her that you don't have a ton of spending money, she will be understanding about it. IMO I don't think students should be offering to treat their dates to dinner all the time..it's a waste of money. You can however, do other things like cook dinner at home like Oppath suggested. Listen to him, OP, he knows what he is talking about.

 

Right, and a girl whose tastes are dressing up nice, putting on makeup and heals, on one of the first few dates, probably is not the type of woman a student should date to begin with. There are plenty of ways as a student to date and I'd avoid fancy dinners. A woman whose expectation is to go to romantic dinners, if that is what she wants, she shouldn't date a student. But most female students do not have that expectation. Most are fine grabbing a mocha and a box of sidewalk chalk and drawing pirate ships on the sidewalk outside the student union. Hell, most female students want you to invite them to keggers and get them drunk. Make dinner an infrequent activity.

 

However, again, wait 2-3 more dates and re-evaluate. Or...if you really feel like she isn't displaying enthusiam, drop her. I love it when a woman emails or texts me after our first date thanking me for a date. A lot of women do not do that even if they have high interest. I'm compatible with the type who does do that. So if a woman isn't conveying her interest in you, and you are uncertain, maybe that means she isn't the one for you, and you should move on.

[ismellsogood]

Oppath is the fair guy of this thread, yes.

 

Relationships are give and take. Make sure she's gonna give to you, but right now she's testing you, trust me.

 

I have to agree with that girl that made the post about the time this woman took to prepare for the date...the makeup, the hair, the clothes...she probably has been buying new clothes to wear for you...

 

I can guarantee that the money she spends on making herself look good for you costs more than 1 dinner. Please take taht into account. For instance, I pay over $100 to get my very long hair cut and highlighted. I take about 1 hour or more to get ready for a date. Women's clothes are more expensive than a man's.

 

I do like everyone else's ideas about contributing things...like bringing a bottle of wine, buying drinks, thinking of cheap/free dates...

 

Make sure she's contributing, but court her a little bit first. Show her you're a stand-up guy.

[Nemo]

Hell, most female students want you to invite them to keggers and get them drunk.

I think this says it all.

[norajane]

I take about 1 hour or more to get ready for a date.

 

And during that hour, I'm usually thinking about the guy I'm going on the date with...

[oppath]

So you need to have your back slapped that you are doing a good job by her paying for the dates ?..

How about her agreeing to go on another date ?.. that in itself is her acknowledging that she values you and wants to spend time with you..

 

Sure there are women out there that take men for a ride looking for freebies.. but those are not the norm.

The normal woman is looking for fun and a date.. not just free food..

 

No, her agreeing to another date in of itself is not acknowledgment enough for me. Her emailing me later that night saying "I had fun" is. After a few dates, I expect a woman to go beyond agreeing to another date a week later to convey interest in me. I expect her to tell me she has a lot of fun, to email me commenting on the superbowl, and a bunch of things that indicates that she truly enjoys spending time with me beyond accepting a date. I want her to demonstrate that she really wants to get to know me and is enjoying her time. Just accepting a date is not enough. After 4-5 dates, I expect more. If I've been dating a woman a month, which may only be 5 dates since I am busy, I do expect her to have called me of her own initiative during that time. Why? Because if someone is genuinely interested, they will do those things.

 

For the OP, I don't think he has dated her enough for those signals to appear, but I think his problem with the money has less to do with the money than the fact that he doesn't know how interested she is. He is jumping the gun on that and should give it a couple more dates but then, if she's not giving him a sign that she is investing, I'd reconsider dating her. It is not about the money, it is about feeling like the relationship is progressing. It's a little too soon for him to make those decisions and he should wait a couple more dates. But after 6-7 dates, a woman should give more indication that she likes the dude than just agreeing to another date. Opening her wallet too is one way of expressing that. Another is saying "I really want to see xyz movie this weekend. We should go." Another is texting him "I had so much fun tonight." His problem is he wants that slap on the back, but it is too soon, and he needs to wait a couple more dates, but if she isn't giving it then, I think he should stop dating her.

[Nemo]

And during that hour, I'm usually thinking about the guy I'm going on the date with...

If I do that, then I need to change my panties. But, whatever works for you.

[ismellsogood]

Hell, most female students want you to invite them to keggers and get them drunk. Make dinner an infrequent activity.

 

Hahaha, yeah I was with you up until this post. I'm about to graduate college and at no point was that the most I've expected out of a potential boyfriend. The same goes for my girlfriends.

 

Getting drunk at keggers is fun SOMETIMES, and perhaps you can meet a girl at a party, but it's not a date. Don't try to pass that off as a date.

 

And do take your girl out to dinner, or at least order dinner in/make her dinner, and rent a movie.

[oppath]

I think this says it all.

 

When I started dating and was inviting girls to coffee, to dinner, to the contemporary art museum where they had a bar and a dj for a new exhibit, I was mostly met with "people don't actually date anymore. You're just supposed to take me to a party or invite me over to play beer pong." The first few girls I dated thought it was weird that I'd want to grab a coffee, or lunch. They literally told me "people just hook up or get into relationships. I don't want to grab dinner. I want to get drunk and party." That is what many 21 year old women want to do. So if you are a student that age, most people don't date in the traditional, post college sense. Many women that age find a traditional dating atmosphere to be weird.

 

There is a middle ground that is appropriate for students.

[underpants]

I don't think about it too much.

 

One of the best dates I went on was one where we both were having so much fun that ......he ran out of money. I picked up the next activities because we both did not want it to be over. We dated for a year and a half.

 

I have had guys go overboard with paying for stuff, and it does make me feel a little uncomfortable.

 

I've gone dutch on a first date.

 

It is all about the person for me. Not what they have in their wallet. I go into those things to make a friend.

 

I think if you ask then be prepared to pay. I feel most comfortable with a back and forth kind of thing. So both know that you are there for the company...not the food/event.

 

...maybe my approach is wrong.

[norajane]

If I do that, then I need to change my panties. But, whatever works for you.

 

And those panties are expensive, too!

[ismellsogood]

 

There is a middle ground that is appropriate for students.

 

Agreed. Being only 23 years old, in college, and dating/wanting to date guys my age, I don't expect much from them, and I consider somewhere like Outback Steakhouse to be insanely fancy (I'm a stereotypical poor college student). I consider somewhere like Applebees to be a normal date...I expect something like buying a pizza or cooking and renting a movie the most regular things to do. If her expectations are more than this then she really shouldn't be dating a college student. However...never try to pass fast food off as a date. NEVER!

 

If you are paying her your full attention and you are keeping her interested and amused (and yes, if she is doing the same), and you are either ALONE, or with other COUPLES, then you are on a date, and this does not have to cost money.

 

However, in the beginning, just pay a few times before alternating. Seriously...try to impress her!

[oppath]

Agreed. Being only 23 years old, in college, and dating/wanting to date guys my age, I don't expect much from them, and I consider somewhere like Outback Steakhouse to be insanely fancy (I'm a stereotypical poor college student). I consider somewhere like Applebees to be a normal date...I expect something like buying a pizza or cooking and renting a movie the most regular things to do. If her expectations are more than this then she really shouldn't be dating a college student. However...never try to pass fast food off as a date. NEVER!

 

If you are paying her your full attention and you are keeping her interested and amused (and yes, if she is doing the same), and you are either ALONE, or with other COUPLES, then you are on a date, and this does not have to cost money.

 

However, in the beginning, just pay a few times before alternating. Seriously...try to impress her!

 

Agree with all of that. If a college kid is taking women to fine dining or romantic restaurants, he's an idiot, as most girls that age do not want to go there. But grabbing some hummus and baklava at the greek cafe/coffee shop across from campus is a middle ground where you may only pay $15 for dinner for two that most college women would be fine with.

[pisces fish]

If I am asked to a baseball game, he is paying the tickets and gas. Sorry, he asked me, he wanted to go with me, I am doing him a favor by accepting.

If I get up to pee, how am I supposed to know instinctively that he wants a beer? First of all, I don't know if you drink at all or even drink beer, that is very possible at this early stage. Secondly, I don't know if you're a Bud Light kinda guy or a Hef drinkin' man. So I buy the Hef and bring it to you and you say that you don't drink Hef but thanks? WTF?

I MIGHT ask on the way to pee if you want anything, but if I have to pee, your drinking pleasure is not the first thing on my mind, sorry hon.

Also, why do you expect the woman to make the first move by texting after a date? My best dates have been when the guy has called ME to thank ME for going on the date with him. Remember, you're still trying to impress her on the first date. Dude, texting is the same as calling and the guy is going to make first contact with me.

[SeraBella]

And those panties are expensive, too!

 

SERIOUSLY! We need pretty panties, and a bra. Bra's are far from cheap. And we have to have multiple because we anticipate you seeing them more than once!

 

And Nemo gets the hair thing! I spend at least $100 on a trip to the salon.

 

And makeup, have you ever seen how much it costs to look "natural" and "glowing"??

 

Plus, we NEVER have anything to wear, so we have to buy new clothes.

 

We also carry purses and handbags...you don't.

 

THINK ABOUT THE DIFFERENCES IN WHAT WE ARE REQUIRED TO DO HERE!

 

You're lucky you're a man and just need to pay for the meal!

[blue16]

If I am asked to a baseball game, he is paying the tickets and gas. Sorry, he asked me, he wanted to go with me, I am doing him a favor by accepting.

 

Remember, you're still trying to impress her on the first date.

 

Why does this strike me with the tone that the guy should just be grateful the girl is gracing him with his presence? A girl accepting a date is doing no 'favour' to me at all, it's mutual enjoyment. I'm sure that will come across as conceited to some but the whole "the guy should be lucky just to be with her!" is a false pretense IMO.

 

The problem is more about the fact that no offer was made, then not actually having the money to pay. I had actually planned on paying for dinner anyway and if she offered I would've refused. But it wouldn't have hurt for her to at least suggest pitching in, that's all I ask. I'm just worried that this is going to become a pattern because then I won't be able to spend much on dinner/drinks anymore. I wasn't going to any fancy restaurants or anything, but a decent meal + alcohol for 2 can add up. I'm trying to save for a trip overseas in addition to buring a car within the new year.

 

She also did casually mention that she doesn't have a lot of money, as she says she won't be able to buy too many drinks this weekend when we go clubbing with her friends. I think the solution might just be to cut out any extras from dinner altogether. It's obvious to me now that she doesn't have a lot of money, so since she most likely won't be pitching in for the meals, I'm gonna have to cut costs at dinner. No alcohol for starters would make things a lot more affordable.

 

The good news is that there hasn't been any shortage of interest from her. She compliments me often, sends me texts regularly and I'm fairly certain she's at least interested in seeing where it goes.

Edited February 4, 2008 by blue16

[oppath]

If I am asked to a baseball game, he is paying the tickets and gas. Sorry, he asked me, he wanted to go with me, I am doing him a favor by accepting.

If I get up to pee, how am I supposed to know instinctively that he wants a beer? First of all, I don't know if you drink at all or even drink beer, that is very possible at this early stage. Secondly, I don't know if you're a Bud Light kinda guy or a Hef drinkin' man. So I buy the Hef and bring it to you and you say that you don't drink Hef but thanks? WTF?

I MIGHT ask on the way to pee if you want anything, but if I have to pee, your drinking pleasure is not the first thing on my mind, sorry hon.

Also, why do you expect the woman to make the first move by texting after a date? My best dates have been when the guy has called ME to thank ME for going on the date with him. Remember, you're still trying to impress her on the first date. Dude, texting is the same as calling and the guy is going to make first contact with me.

 

Hahaha. I'm not talking about date 1, I'm talking about date 6. I agree the guy should pay for the first few dates but as someone without a lot of money, it's important to me that a woman recognize that. Plenty of women do. I have no problem, especially since I often date other students who are in the same boat. And if you are a student, don't take her to fancy dinners. There are plenty of cheap dates that are fun, romantic, and creative. I agree if you can't afford small things, maybe you shouldn't date, but dating doesn't have to be nice dinners all the time. I agree the guy should pay for the first few dates, and I think the OP needs to wait a couple more dates before getting upset over this.

 

If you are a woman that thinks the guy should pay for everything from date 1-20 until you agree to be exclusive, that's fine, but really, you shouldn't date a student to begin with. He likely won't be able to afford your current lifestyle. Though that's dumb, because in a year he might have a high income and be right for you in those other ways. But it endears the woman to me if after a few dates, she treats me too. Why? It shows that she understands I don't have much money but she wants to get to know me and date me anyway. Someone who will treat me too is much more likely to be compatible with me, not because I'm cheap, but because it means they recognize I am a student and they recognize I am worth an investment. It's not a coincidence that the women I've felt the most compatibility with have done those things without me thinking of this issue at all.

 

And no, you aren't doing me a favor accepting a date from me. It's a mutual pleasure. If I take you to a ballgame on our 4th date it's reasonable to ask "I'm going to the bathroom, but would you like a beer or something?" It's not about being cheap. A woman who is interested in me and who is compatible with me would ask that question. How do I know this? Because they do ask, all the time. Women ask. And my most passionate connections, they have asked. The ones who don't ask things like that have usually been the ones who text other dudes while out with me and I have to tell them "it's kind of rude to be texting other people while on a date with me." When it's with the right person, that person does treat me on occasion after the first 4 dates or so. It's not that I keep an eye out waiting for it to happen, it's just that I really does happen when I've felt high chemistry with someone. It's not a test or a rule I have, it's that the right person for me would do things like that. And if you are unwilling to do that, you probably should not date a student.

 

But this is about the original poster, and I think he needs to wait a few dates before making this an issue. There are plenty of cheap dates. If after 6-7 dates she hasn't initiated contact of her own volition, and she hasn't offered to pay for anything, I'd say they aren't compatible, not because he is cheap, but because if she were the right person and the chemistry was really high, she would be doing those things. But he does need to give it a couple more dates.

[Lauriebell82]

The problem is more about the fact that no offer was made, then not actually having the money to pay. I had actually planned on paying for dinner anyway and if she offered I would've refused. But it wouldn't have hurt for her to at least suggest pitching in, that's all I ask. I'm just worried that this is going to become a pattern because then I won't be able to spend much on dinner/drinks anymore. I wasn't going to any fancy restaurants or anything, but a decent meal + alcohol for 2 can add up. I'm trying to save for a trip overseas in addition to buring a car within the new year.

 

She also did casually mention that she doesn't have a lot of money, as she says she won't be able to buy too many drinks this weekend when we go clubbing with her friends. I think the solution might just be to cut out any extras from dinner altogether. It's obvious to me now that she doesn't have a lot of money, so since she most likely won't be pitching in for the meals, I'm gonna have to cut costs at dinner. No alcohol for starters would make things a lot more affordable.

 

Ok, well there. She told you she doesn't have a lot of money. That's why she didn't offer to pitch in. On a first date I actually wouldn't offer to chip in either. If the guy asked me to go on a date I wouldnt offer unless we did a lot of multiple things and he was spending a lot of money. If it was just dinner at a place like Applebees, then no I wouldn't offer on a 1st or 2nd date. Coupled with the fact that I have very little spending money, I wouldn't try to offer to pay if I knew I couldn't. Yeah I do think the solution is to do cheaper things..that's what my boyfriend and I do. I usually chip in for the cheaper things like renting a movie, and he pays for dinners and things because he has more money then I do. I also try to do nice things for him like buy him a bottle of gatorade when he comes to visit me at college or buy him little things here and there. So I try to contribute as much as I can to the relationship with limited means to do so.

 

If she didn't offer it's probably because she is more traditional and/or doesn't have the money to offer. If you can't deal with that, then you need to stop seeing her. But I suggest going on a few more dates and see what happens.

[Els]

I'm just worried that this is going to become a pattern because then I won't be able to spend much on dinner/drinks anymore. I wasn't going to any fancy restaurants or anything, but a decent meal + alcohol for 2 can add up. I'm trying to save for a trip overseas in addition to buring a car within the new year.

 

She also did casually mention that she doesn't have a lot of money, as she says she won't be able to buy too many drinks this weekend when we go clubbing with her friends. I think the solution might just be to cut out any extras from dinner altogether. It's obvious to me now that she doesn't have a lot of money, so since she most likely won't be pitching in for the meals, I'm gonna have to cut costs at dinner. No alcohol for starters would make things a lot more affordable.

 

Errr yes of course, you should plan and limit your costs at dinner to what you can afford in the first place. Not plan based on your expectation that she should pitch in...

 

Your decision to make your dates simpler is perfectly fine... as is her not paying on the first few dates. I think you only really have a problem when she doesn't pay for the first few dates BUT complains about you being too cheap.