OK Time to share. Kinda long.

[addicted2love]

Lakeside...

 

I completely understand your feelings and situation. Your story pulls at my heartstrings because it is so similar to mine. However I've posted here before and been flamed by many (you included) So I hesitate to offer you kind words and encouragement.

 

I really wish you would answer the questions posted by those who have asked why you've been so harsh against "cheaters" when you yourself are a willing participant in the act of cheating.

 

I have much to say to you regarding your situation...all of which are kind, so I hope you can answer those questions so that I can share those kind thoughts with you.

 

A2L

[White Flower]

Hi LSD,

 

I wonder, is it possible that you have understood your W's cheating and came to the conclusion that certain people are right for each other and others wrong for each other? That you weren't right for her so she moved on?

 

I was one to judge cheaters before. My own father cheated and for a while I was very angry with him. But now that I have gone through my own path I have learned to see people who cheat not neccessarily as cheaters. And I have totally understood and gotten over my father's 'cheating'. Of course, there are many kinds of cheaters and I don't condone the serial cheaters.

 

But most 'cheaters' are just people trying to figure out who is right for them after having learned a very long and painful lesson that their partner is not 'the one'.

 

Is it that you finally understand, barring the possibility that your ex wife was a serial cheater(?), that your ex was just looking for her best partner in life? And now you are seeking your best partner?

 

I hope you really love the location you're moving to because if it doesn't work out with her, you might be stuck. Also, I think it is an awesomely romantic gesture and it would definitely work for me. Maybe it will work for her. Be careful though; it might scare her, on the other hand.

[LakesideDream]

Hi LSD,

 

I wonder, is it possible that you have understood your W's cheating and came to the conclusion that certain people are right for each other and others wrong for each other? That you weren't right for her so she moved on?

 

I was one to judge cheaters before. My own father cheated and for a while I was very angry with him. But now that I have gone through my own path I have learned to see people who cheat not neccessarily as cheaters. And I have totally understood and gotten over my father's 'cheating'. Of course, there are many kinds of cheaters and I don't condone the serial cheaters.

 

But most 'cheaters' are just people trying to figure out who is right for them after having learned a very long and painful lesson that their partner is not 'the one'.

 

Is it that you finally understand, barring the possibility that your ex wife was a serial cheater(?), that your ex was just looking for her best partner in life? And now you are seeking your best partner?

 

I hope you really love the location you're moving to because if it doesn't work out with her, you might be stuck. Also, I think it is an awesomely romantic gesture and it would definitely work for me. Maybe it will work for her. Be careful though; it might scare her, on the other hand.

 

 

WhiteFlower, my ex WAS a serial cheater (over the years it's been discussed here) She had a "main squeeze" Who she saw for 23 of our 25 years of marriage, sometimes taking years off at a time, she also had other "dalliances" with co-workers, and one time with a contractor working on the building she worked at. Sadly, while I became suspicious a couple of times, my response was to work harder on the marriage, taking responsibility myself. I didn't find out the facts, or the details until the divorce, wherein she had to rip me with it all.

 

The last few years I worked my ass off on the marriage. Mini Getaways, Bubble Baths, followed by 1/2 hour massages (actually went to Jr. College for a course on massage therapy) Candlelight Groumet dinners I leared to prepare... sappy stuff (that I miss like heck). By then it was a complete sham.

 

I'm not a "passive" or normally thought of as "sensitive" guy. Former Marine officer, Business owner most of my career, Outdoorsman (not a hunter, deer can't shoot back) generally a pretty imposing person (formally, I'm pretty beat up at 57).

 

The ex had serious personal psyche problems. 5 counsilors all came up with the same diagnosis, she needed IC before beginning MC. She fired them all. I knew about the "stuff" when I married her. I had no idea of the problems it would caused (no sexual or other abuse, both parents died when she was a pre teen).

 

I'm in the place I want to move now, typing on my laptop, connected to the hotel WiFi. I intend to find a house this week. I like this place, it's different, and will be a neat adventure regardless of what happens. I'm sure she will be as "scared" as I am when she eventually discovers I've relocated here. But that's part of the point. Nothing was going to happen without a dramatic change.

[LakesideDream]

Lakeside...

 

I completely understand your feelings and situation. Your story pulls at my heartstrings because it is so similar to mine. However I've posted here before and been flamed by many (you included) So I hesitate to offer you kind words and encouragement.

 

I really wish you would answer the questions posted by those who have asked why you've been so harsh against "cheaters" when you yourself are a willing participant in the act of cheating.

 

I have much to say to you regarding your situation...all of which are kind, so I hope you can answer those questions so that I can share those kind thoughts with you.

 

A2L

 

 

A2L, I've given a great deal of thought to your question, knowing it or one like it was coming. You inspired me to answer.

 

I was "harsh" because I am still very "bitter". I feel I was Royally screwed over. After the divorce after it all came out (to dig even deeper) I reconnected with the gal I'm writing about here. (BTW we were each others "firsts") I had never cheated in my marriage, neither had she. We both jumped in from minute one, white hot and blazing. My self esteem was rebuilt, my "love bank" was full. The same was true for her, so she said many times, and I believed her. When the "time to decide" came, she got cold feet, and I cut it off instantly as all the pain of the divorce and the pain and fear of losing her came rushing in like a blazing volcano. I was completely shattered. Much worse than the Divorce by itself.

 

It wasn't as bad as all that, certainly not a forever thing. No threats of NC or animus of any kind. She was stronger then than I was, but she didn't do anything to cause pain. We stayed in touch, and still are. I'm pretty "butch" when we talk, emails vary from "updates" to intimate. Ditto with phone contact. Occassionally she looses composure and gets very emotionally intimate on the phone. She really is a "tough broad" and hearing her break, makes me ache. Luckily it hasn't happened often.

 

Thinking we would never be close again, made me more bitter and for that I apologise. I'm sure my stern attitude was a way to cope with the hole in my chest, a hole I never thought would be filled, and frankly may never be filled.

 

Finally (now) circumstances, and the dull ache in my heart have led me to the decision to relocate, and give it my Last Best Shot. Introspection makes one much more understanding and tolerant. I know that I will never be as quick to judge as I have previously.

 

Hope that answers your query, if not ask more.

[White Flower]

Wow, LSD, it sounds like you really tried hard in your M. I'm sorry she came with so many problems. Based on her history and personality traits it looks like it was doomed from the beginning so you get an A for effort.

 

Do you feel your situation is completely different than that of your wife's since she was serial? I guess what most of us want to understand is how do you explain (if not to us, then yourself) your pain with your wife's cheating and how you now reconcile that with your current A with a MW.

 

I ask without judgement. My H had an EA (PA not proven) and now I'm currently involved in an A.

 

Every single A is different and cannot be put into the same category. That would be like saying all Blacks look the same or all Whites are prejudiced. There is no blanket label for thosed involved in As.

 

My H's A hurt me like crazy. Yet, it also brought to light the idea that perhaps someone else really does suit him better. She could have served him effortlessly while it took every ounce of energy for me to do so. Yet, I insisted he cut her out of our lives. I now regret that.

 

Later, I found someone who suits me perfectly and he happens to be a MM. I'm soon to be divorced, but I am not banking on MM divorcing. The point is, I have experienced pretty much the full spectrum of the issue and understand it a great deal more than I used to. I no longer judge people and feel set free by that. Can you relate to this in any way?

[White Flower]

Finally (now) circumstances, and the dull ache in my heart have led me to the decision to relocate, and give it my Last Best Shot. Introspection makes one much more understanding and tolerant. I know that I will never be as quick to judge as I have previously.

 

Hope that answers your query, if not ask more.

LSD,

 

This pretty much answers my question, so feel free not to answer mine;).

[LakesideDream]

Wow, LSD, it sounds like you really tried hard in your M. I'm sorry she came with so many problems. Based on her history and personality traits it looks like it was doomed from the beginning so you get an A for effort.

 

Do you feel your situation is completely different than that of your wife's since she was serial? I guess what most of us want to understand is how do you explain (if not to us, then yourself) your pain with your wife's cheating and how you now reconcile that with your current A with a MW.

 

I ask without judgement. My H had an EA (PA not proven) and now I'm currently involved in an A.

 

Every single A is different and cannot be put into the same category. That would be like saying all Blacks look the same or all Whites are prejudiced. There is no blanket label for thosed involved in As.

 

My H's A hurt me like crazy. Yet, it also brought to light the idea that perhaps someone else really does suit him better. She could have served him effortlessly while it took every ounce of energy for me to do so. Yet, I insisted he cut her out of our lives. I now regret that.

 

Later, I found someone who suits me perfectly and he happens to be a MM. I'm soon to be divorced, but I am not banking on MM divorcing. The point is, I have experienced pretty much the full spectrum of the issue and understand it a great deal more than I used to. I no longer judge people and feel set free by that. Can you relate to this in any way?

 

 

 

WhiteFlower, I saw the irony in my affair with a MW immediately. My ex's long term A was with a man married with children the whole time. They had a "4 year plan" that lasted less than a year because she became impatient. It took another year for "his" divorce to come about. He left two juvinile children and one adult child behind. Grace of God ours were both adults.

 

When the A was going full blast I wasn't thinking about my MW's husband. I was so very needy, feeling things I had absolutely never felt before, full of enthusiasm and testosterone, and vigor (at 50) that I could have walked through walls.

 

In moments of quiet contemplation I would feel sorry for him. To "her" credit, she didn't "dog" him to me. She just wasn't "happy" and that doesen't seem to have changed over the years. The word I would use to describe her attitude is "resigned". If I had to guess I would say from talking to her that she hasn't been "in love" for much more than a decade.

 

I don't feel sorry for him anymore. I actually am ashamed that I would gladly take his wife for my own. That shame isn't as powerful as my desire. Desire to have a chance of eternal happiness and love.

 

By my standards that's not a good attitude. I do struggle with it.

[BetrayedMM]

Wow. I must be dense. It only now occurred to me why you chose "Lakesidedream" as your handle.

[Mustang Sally]

Don't feel too bad, Betrayed. I didn't get it until now, either.

 

Hmm. For some reason, I just thought of Lakeside was a BS. I didn't know he participated in an A also. Must have missed some posts somewhere along the line.....

 

Anyway, I think I can empathize with your MW, Lakeside - after reading what you describe about her feelings towards her marriage.

 

Hope you find what you are looking for. Sincerely.

[White Flower]

I don't feel sorry for him anymore. I actually am ashamed that I would gladly take his wife for my own. That shame isn't as powerful as my desire. Desire to have a chance of eternal happiness and love.

 

By my standards that's not a good attitude. I do struggle with it.

I had a long discussion with a neighbor last night. Life is so interesting and full of surprises. I told her of my A, then she told me of hers. She is in her 60s and is still meeting MM in a hotel. I never had a clue in all the years we've been neighbors.

 

But, she had a feeling about me, lol. Older, more experienced...you get the picture.

 

But she brought up what you just did that your shame isn't as powerful as your desire. You throw in the fact that perhaps her H isn't working hard enough on his M with all the other ingredients for you, it just might be the right thing rather than an 'attitude' problem.

 

Of course, every single story is different and that is for you to decide. But, I find it very interesting when a MP who was cheated on later cheats and somehow finds redemption in it. It happened to me and I've learned a lot so wouldn't change much of what happened.

 

My neighbor's H cheated on her and left for the OW. Apparently he never strayed on his second W. It was a one-time thing. Even though my neighbor had been hurt by an A, she later became an accomplice in a few affairs. The circle of life I guess.

Edited February 10, 2008 by White Flower

[LakesideDream]

WhiteFlower,

 

Ultimately life is a balancing act. I didn't try to get "revenge" on my ex. I remember my feels over 7 years ago as if they were yesterday. I just wanted something good to happen to me. I didn't want to know she was happy when I was so overwhelmingly sad. And it happened for me, for awhile.

 

It's not about those same feelings for me any more. For me it's wanting to feel what I did during those happy months. I want the one I know I can love unconditionally, the one I can be silly and sappy with. The intoxication, the euphoria, the feeling that each moment is the best in my life, even when I know that actually isn't true.

 

Hell, I'm here a couple of miles away and it's hard not to do something silly, call her, or show up at her work. I don't because I know it will make her unhappy before I have to. Logic tells me she won't be happy at first. Having me live a few miles away is bound to cause a mess of trouble. My hope is that when faced with the permenancy of the situation, I'll have my chance to win her.

 

I haven't been happy living apart, not knowing. At this point I know I never will be. I realized.. decided that I had to take the chance.

[silktricks]

hmmmmm - now I see why you've been so down on BS who have shown so deeply the hurt they've felt because of their spouse's emotional affairs. It seems that you've been involved in one for quite some time. Your MW's husband is in for a world of hurt. I hope that amongst the three of you at least two work their way to some happiness.

[White Flower]

WhiteFlower,

 

Ultimately life is a balancing act.

It most certainly is!

 

 

I haven't been happy living apart, not knowing. At this point I know I never will be. I realized.. decided that I had to take the chance.

This is what most OPs feel. We throw our cares to the wind in order to find a true connection and real happiness. It's scary yet exhilarating at the same time. The only downfall is the possibility of hurting the 3rd party.

 

It makes you dislike the institution of marriage and the idea that one is held to a promise that is made in his/her early twenties or thirties.

[LakesideDream]

hmmmmm - now I see why you've been so down on BS who have shown so deeply the hurt they've felt because of their spouse's emotional affairs. It seems that you've been involved in one for quite some time. Your MW's husband is in for a world of hurt. I hope that amongst the three of you at least two work their way to some happiness.

 

 

Silk, If keeping in touch, just a few times a year is being involved in an EA, you are probably correct. I wish I thought it was an EA, It never felt close enough to be called an affair of any kind to me for years now.

 

My "emotional life" has pretty much been on hold for 4 years. I've learned a lot about myself in the last few weeks since I made the decision to drop my life and start a new one. That's a pretty silly thing to do at 57 years old. Things that I was sure about a month ago are convoluted and mysterious today. I haven't "chased" a woman in 35 years, and that's exactly what I'm about to do. The world is upside down right now, and may never be right side up again.

 

On the other hand, Life could be bliss in a few months, maybe a year. I have no expectations about the future at all.

[GreenEyedLady]

This is what most OPs feel. We throw our cares to the wind in order to find a true connection and real happiness. It's scary yet exhilarating at the same time.

 

You know I think this correlates with OP's also...Maybe that is part of what attracts MP...

[silktricks]

Silk, If keeping in touch, just a few times a year is being involved in an EA, you are probably correct. I wish I thought it was an EA, It never felt close enough to be called an affair of any kind to me for years now.

 

My "emotional life" has pretty much been on hold for 4 years. I've learned a lot about myself in the last few weeks since I made the decision to drop my life and start a new one. That's a pretty silly thing to do at 57 years old. Things that I was sure about a month ago are convoluted and mysterious today. I haven't "chased" a woman in 35 years, and that's exactly what I'm about to do. The world is upside down right now, and may never be right side up again.

 

On the other hand, Life could be bliss in a few months, maybe a year. I have no expectations about the future at all.

Don't get me wrong. There's nothing wrong IMO with leaving all behind for an unknown future, hoping and praying for the best. I wish you the best always. BUt yeah, keeping in touch a few times a year with love in your heart IS an EA. Please be careful in your judgements of others is all I'm sayin'

 

Best wishes for a happy future.

[LakesideDream]

Don't get me wrong. There's nothing wrong IMO with leaving all behind for an unknown future, hoping and praying for the best. I wish you the best always. BUt yeah, keeping in touch a few times a year with love in your heart IS an EA. Please be careful in your judgements of others is all I'm sayin'

 

Best wishes for a happy future.

 

In the words of an old Marine, Roger That! The happenings of the last few weeks have really opened my eyes to a lot of things. Intolerance or lack of tolerance high on that list. And after reading your post above, I know that you are correct about that as well. When I sent gifts on holidays, flowers to her work, occasionally phoned her my heart was singing. Sometimes It took me weeks to build the nerve to call. She never asked me not to, or discouraged me in any way.

 

As an aside, I've always wondered what she did with the gifts, jewelry etc. Some of it pretty gaudy stuff. She's told me that her H didn't notice, or that she passed it off as "costume jewelry". That sure wouldn't have worked on me when I was a husband!

 

You gals out there... how would you have pulled that off?

[GreenEyedLady]

You gals out there... how would you have pulled that off?

 

I've never had to pull that off, but I'd probably just say I got it for myself...Or as a gift from work...I won't elaborate, TMI...

 

LD, you have to do what you need to do to see this through...I admire your willingness to see this through...

[LakesideDream]

I've never had to pull that off, but I'd probably just say I got it for myself...Or as a gift from work...I won't elaborate, TMI...

 

LD, you have to do what you need to do to see this through...I admire your willingness to see this through...

 

 

GEL, Thanks for the kindness. I have the courage, and can summon the nerve and I think that it helps that I've waited a very long time.

 

I'll tell you (and all) something that I realized today. If this "quest" of mine fails, even blows up completely which there is a great chance of it doing it will be devestating to me emotionally. That is not something I want to see happen. That being said, the status quo has been painful as well. The choice I made takes that into account. I have always felt it better to live hard and leave a smoke trail, than to die the death of a thousand cuts.

[StillSame]

One curious thing, neither of my adult childrened mentioned this... hmmm. I'll have to ask them about that.

 

Did you find out why they didn't tell you?

 

Is your ex still married to this OM now?

[LakesideDream]

Did you find out why they didn't tell you?

 

Is your ex still married to this OM now?

 

As far as I know, I haven't been in contact for a year. A year ago I heard from my adult daughter that the "OM" fell from a ladder on his dome and in addition to a couple of broken bones suffered a pretty serious stroke.

 

He's about 50 so that could be pretty serious. I have to admit it didn't concern me in the slightest.

[GreenEyedLady]

GEL, Thanks for the kindness. I have the courage, and can summon the nerve and I think that it helps that I've waited a very long time.

 

I'll tell you (and all) something that I realized today. If this "quest" of mine fails, even blows up completely which there is a great chance of it doing it will be devestating to me emotionally. That is not something I want to see happen. That being said, the status quo has been painful as well. The choice I made takes that into account. I have always felt it better to live hard and leave a smoke trail, than to die the death of a thousand cuts.

 

You know that there are no guarantees from life by experience...

 

And my personal philosophy is that I would rather regret something I did rather than regret something I didn't do...

 

I always say that love is a risk and a risk worth taking...The worst case scenario is that you are where you are now...

 

But the best case scenario is that you get what you need and want...

 

So what's to lose? And what's to gain?

 

That's my advice...Just try and play the cards you are dealt with right...You know her, let that guide you...

 

GEL

[marlena]

which there is a great chance of it doing it will be devestating to me emotionally.

 

This, Lakeside, is something that scares me. Emotional devastation gets harder to overcome as we grow older. It also takes a bigger toll on our health. I am wondering of this is as good an idea as I thought it was in the beginning. You are taking a major risk mainly because you do not know if she reciprocates the feeling you have for her. Perhaps it would be wiser to go along with this with her full consent. I hate to say this but if she didn't leave her huband back then what makes you think she will do it now? Or even want to continue being in an affair with you, emotional or otherwise? The fact that her husband has had a stroke complicates things as well. She may not want to leave him in his time of need.

 

I am only saying all this because of your admission that you would feel devastated if things didn't work out as you hope they will. And I wouldn't want this to happen to you at 57. This is a time in life when peace of mind and good health is of utmost importance. Jusr concerned is all.

Edited February 10, 2008 by marlena

[White Flower]

As an aside, I've always wondered what she did with the gifts, jewelry etc. Some of it pretty gaudy stuff. She's told me that her H didn't notice, or that she passed it off as "costume jewelry". That sure wouldn't have worked on me when I was a husband!

 

You gals out there... how would you have pulled that off?

 

I told my H it was costume jewelry I had picked up. The very fact that he asked proved me wrong about his ignorance although he sure never seemed to notice much about me before. Until I became indifferent, that is.

[White Flower]

You know I think this correlates with OP's also...Maybe that is part of what attracts MP...

I am sure it does; both of the OPs in my EMA are MPs!