Author D-Lish Posted March 4, 2008 Author Posted March 4, 2008 Yeah, I banged my head against the wall over that guy's posts. I sure didn't mind having a casual relationship with him- but not at the expense of my sexual health. I knew from day one he was going to be "fun-fun" guy... and didn't ever have crazy expectations. With some guys you just know they aren't going to be your soul mate- but it's okay to have fun and date them. I should post my response e-mail I sent back to the guy.
Author D-Lish Posted March 4, 2008 Author Posted March 4, 2008 (edited) This is what I wrote in response- I hope it goes through... Lol. I sorta figured all that out by date #2.... and it's okay with me! I have a bizarre penchant for choosing men that aren't available, so that sure says something about me and my self fulfilling prophecy syndrome. lol. But you know that as we talked about it. I came to the conclusion over the weekend that I have to get my head screwed on straight.... get the business and life stuff in order before worrying about settling down into a serious relationship... and as much as we have fun... it would always worry me about my sexual health. Yeah, I still want to hang out and be your friend. That's cool with me. I like hanging with you too! ;-) xo Dee Edited March 4, 2008 by a LoveShack.org Moderator Removed Extraneous BB Code
RecordProducer Posted March 4, 2008 Posted March 4, 2008 (edited) I knew from day one he was going to be "fun-fun" guy... Whenever I would see the sentence "I am a fun loving guy," accompanies by photos from parties, I would close their profiles immediately. Not because I don't love fun (who doesn't?), but because this autodescription suggests that they are only good for fun and prioritize having fun in their lives. After all, you can have fun reading a book or joking around with your long-term partner, but for some reason, the expression "fun loving" refers to superficial fun like partying, drinking, flirting with many people, doing drugs, and the like. I think your response was good and honest. In any case, he doesn't seem interested unless you want sex with him. And his statement that he would be your friend EVEN WITHOUT SEX suggests that sex was the only thing on his mind. Especially since he disappeared when you said "no sex." Edited March 4, 2008 by RecordProducer
audrey_1 Posted March 4, 2008 Posted March 4, 2008 I had so much fun reading all these posts! I am getting up the courage to break off a relationship that addressed some of these same issues. But we're casual AND long distance, and I don't want to be sleeping with him if he's sleeping with other people, though I don't believe he is. We're in our early thirties, and he's had four or five relationships that were all a year or less. He's always focused on his career or there's always something more important We only email and text, and lately, if we talk or see each other at all, I initiate it. He told me from the beginning he wanted to "explore" our feelings. We hadn't seen each other in about 15 years, and he said he had a crush on me when we were kids (like from elementary school) all the way up until we went to different high schools. Blah Blah Blah. I need some sleep.
Author D-Lish Posted March 4, 2008 Author Posted March 4, 2008 Yeah, I think it's about prioritizing what is important to you! I didn't want to be in a Harem. lol. Trust me- even using condoms doesn't protect you from everything out there. That is why I didn't want to keep dating him. Hey- I liked him, I had fun with him. After a couple dates I didn't have any illusions that he was going to be my boyfriend. AT that point i knew I had a decision to make.
electric_sheep Posted March 4, 2008 Posted March 4, 2008 I guess I wonder if he is addicted to infatuation.... and that once that begings to dwindle, he may move on to the next adventure. I'd just ask him straight up, and carefully measure his response. I know some people are like this, though they would actually say they are addicted to "love", not "infatuation". Semantics aside, the beginning phases of a relationship do have a certain intensity, romantic and otherwise, that it's hard to match over the long term. It's certainly hard to blame someone for being addicted to falling in love... but, I feel sorry for the casualties they leave behind. Sometimes I wonder if I'm not a bit like this, if I do an honest assessment of myself. Practicality and hormones catch up with us all though, eventually. Most of us, anyway. And I think our expectations change, and even our very idea of what love is. After reading over this thread some more, my response probably isn't relevant anymore. Whoops!
Kamille Posted March 4, 2008 Posted March 4, 2008 (edited) Ok. I am operating here on the basis that Daniel is a commitment-phobe who is actually writing to try and better understand his situation. I understand that his words might have been inconsiderate to D-Lish but please allow me to discuss some of the issues that he raised in regards to commitmentphobia. I think men feel better being single. Women need to feel secure in their relationships so they like it to be formal. So I think it is womens job to shift R on next step. But it is of course not a dogma. Can I ask you what went wrong in your R? I mean you were exclusive, they even brought it up so I suggest you dumped them? I have told 3 men that I loved them in all my life, and therefore consider that I have been involved in 3 LTRs. The first one, when I was in my early 20s, was a self-admitted commitment-phobe. I left him because I could no longer handle the drama that came with being in a relationship with him. I felt like I was doing all the relationship work and it was exhausting in the end. He was scared shatless, much like you, that I would try and get pregnant just to trap him into mariage. I thought that showed just how much he didn't know me and had no respect for my life's goals. But guess what happened to him? He met his war correspondant, a woman who would not take no for an answer and also not let him get away with any of his commitment-phobia ****. After a year of being with her he showed up in my town (where he was visiting his brother) because he was trying to leave the relationship, but didn't feel he had the strenght to do it in person so he instead he ran away. Guess what she did? She moved to that city to be with him. Three months later, she was pregnant. Now they have a kid and even though he still struggles with his issues trusting women, he wouldn't have it any other way. So basically his was a self-fulfilling prophecy. But I think he was so hung up in his commitment issues that he was unable to function in any other kind of relationship. Also, it meant the only women he truly trusted were women who would make having a relationship the main goal of their lives. That definitely wasn't my goal and it explains a lot of our misunderstandings. My second bf and I broke up when I moved from Europe to Canada to pursue my studies. We never made it as a LDR. This latest breakup, still in the LS press, is the result of my own fears in regards to my bf's drinking. So yes, you could say I ended all three Rs. Again the exclusivity talk seems to me so unromatic and too pragmatic. It is the same. Why would you watch if cant touch anyway Cause then you can fantasize? Of course Im commitment phobe. I survived a few dragging-in-the-bed/R moments, thats why Im certainly not hoping to experince it again. Dont ever say Traps and Love in one sentence when dealing with commitment-phobe Oh so you're trying to pull a deer in the headlights on me? As if something as inocuous as a sentence from a complete stranger off the web could send shivers down your spine. another note: Im not very good example of a male specie. Im considered LTR option only when I pretend to be a wounded animal and even then the hell of insecurities, suspicions and jealousy begins shortly. I'll have to find some female war correspondent. the way I see it, you have one of four options: 1) find someone who is as independant as you are in an R (rarely works for commitment phobes. This is what they think they want, but really most need continued proof of devotion. They can't handle someone else's independance. They perceive it as undermining theirs and need to always be the distant one in the R). 2) become your own self-fulfilling prophecy, find a woman who would go incredible distance to be with you (such as oopsing a pregnancy). 3) face your fears and challenge them (usually hard for commitment phobes because it is much easier to just stay single then work on yourself). 4) remain single Edited March 4, 2008 by Kamille
NuTuDating Posted March 5, 2008 Posted March 5, 2008 As a successful guy who also owns about 20 or so guitars, I have to say that it's all irrelevant if you don't know WHY he has broken up with the past girlfriends! For example, I'm 31 and have had one relationship that lasted more than a year. I was married and divorced. Looking back, that relationship SHOULD have been about a 8 month relationship. Sometimes, there are not quality members of the opposite sex worth dating in your area (at least that you can find), so they do not merit a l/t relationship. The last girl I dated I thought might have been the one. Then, she basically admitted to me, laying in bed one night, that sex... how did she put that... wasn't important after marriage. Almost her exact words. We broke up the next day because she really felt that way and it took me 3 months to hear this from her. Find out WHY he broke up with them, if you can. Sometimes there's a reason for someone just not finding the one. He may be telling the truth!
fray718 Posted March 5, 2008 Posted March 5, 2008 Whenever I would see the sentence "I am a fun loving guy," accompanies by photos from parties, I would close their profiles immediately. Not because I don't love fun (who doesn't?), but because this autodescription suggests that they are only good for fun and prioritize having fun in their lives. After all, you can have fun reading a book or joking around with your long-term partner, but for some reason, the expression "fun loving" refers to superficial fun like partying, drinking, flirting with many people, doing drugs, and the like. I think your response was good and honest. In any case, he doesn't seem interested unless you want sex with him. And his statement that he would be your friend EVEN WITHOUT SEX suggests that sex was the only thing on his mind. Especially since he disappeared when you said "no sex." Oh I completely agree with this! When I first started online dating I always kid myself and just said 'oh he doesnt seem like the serious type but that will do for now, i just want to have fun.' So I did end up dating alot of guys but none of them worked out! It was finally when I decided enough was enough and I want something more meaningful did I start to become more selective....way more selective. It was frustrating at first because I'd go weeks without any prospects but the first one I found good enough to date I got into a serious relationship with just after 3 weeks of dating (what happened after 2 months of dating is a different story but thats for another thread haha). So yea, I mean it's hard but just be patient and hang in there D! Be selective and you will eventually find someone who wants to be serious with you.
RecordProducer Posted March 5, 2008 Posted March 5, 2008 Sometimes, there are not quality members of the opposite sex worth dating in your area (at least that you can find), so they do not merit a l/t relationship. If there are no quality candidates for dating, that means you're NOT dating at all. We don't have a problem with guys who have been completely single (alone) for years, because they couldn't find anyone worthwhile (if the guys are OK). It's precisely the guys who date people for months just for sex and fun that we're trying to avoid. Women like D-Lish and I don't even want sex with a guy who doesn't seem like a prospective candidate for a LTR. We broke up the next day The only girl who seemed OK had one fault too and you broke up the next day! This is scary. You'll always find something bad and that will be a reason to break up. This demonstartes lack of tolerance and ability to compromise. If you are looking for perfection, you'll grow old alone. My husband ditches women at the first - what he perceives as - mistake they make. He doesn't communicate, he doesn't forgive, he doesn't want to invest any effort - on top of that, he is full of faults and promotes the attitudes "Take it or leave" and "My way or the highway." This is a typical commitment phobe. The underlying reasons for this phobia are irrelevant. We are trying to stay away from these guys. Those less cautious will get hooked and end up broken-hearted.
DanielMadr Posted March 6, 2008 Posted March 6, 2008 Ok. I am operating here on the basis that Daniel is a commitment-phobe who is actually writing to try and better understand his situation. I understand that his words might have been inconsiderate to D-Lish but please allow me to discuss some of the issues that he raised in regards to commitmentphobia. I have told 3 men that I loved them in all my life, and therefore consider that I have been involved in 3 LTRs. The first one, when I was in my early 20s, was a self-admitted commitment-phobe. I left him because I could no longer handle the drama that came with being in a relationship with him. I felt like I was doing all the relationship work and it was exhausting in the end. He was scared shatless, much like you, that I would try and get pregnant just to trap him into mariage. I thought that showed just how much he didn't know me and had no respect for my life's goals. But guess what happened to him? He met his war correspondant, a woman who would not take no for an answer and also not let him get away with any of his commitment-phobia ****. After a year of being with her he showed up in my town (where he was visiting his brother) because he was trying to leave the relationship, but didn't feel he had the strenght to do it in person so he instead he ran away. Guess what she did? She moved to that city to be with him. Three months later, she was pregnant. Now they have a kid and even though he still struggles with his issues trusting women, he wouldn't have it any other way. So basically his was a self-fulfilling prophecy. But I think he was so hung up in his commitment issues that he was unable to function in any other kind of relationship. Also, it meant the only women he truly trusted were women who would make having a relationship the main goal of their lives. That definitely wasn't my goal and it explains a lot of our misunderstandings. My second bf and I broke up when I moved from Europe to Canada to pursue my studies. We never made it as a LDR. This latest breakup, still in the LS press, is the result of my own fears in regards to my bf's drinking. So yes, you could say I ended all three Rs. Again the exclusivity talk seems to me so unromatic and too pragmatic. Cause then you can fantasize? Oh so you're trying to pull a deer in the headlights on me? As if something as inocuous as a sentence from a complete stranger off the web could send shivers down your spine. the way I see it, you have one of four options: 1) find someone who is as independant as you are in an R (rarely works for commitment phobes. This is what they think they want, but really most need continued proof of devotion. They can't handle someone else's independance. They perceive it as undermining theirs and need to always be the distant one in the R). 2) become your own self-fulfilling prophecy, find a woman who would go incredible distance to be with you (such as oopsing a pregnancy). 3) face your fears and challenge them (usually hard for commitment phobes because it is much easier to just stay single then work on yourself). 4) remain single O.K. Some defence of mine here: Dont take my post so seriously (I highlited the most humorous parts) What I meant is I am comm-phobe only to girls I dont see future with from the start - I dont like them that much. I hate to receive "you-broke-my-heart" letters from girls I cant do anything for. It is my weakness and I will work on that. Give them a taste and then disappear. At least they had what they wanted for a while. Is it right to do? I doubt it. Actually I consider myself more family man than bachelour. Due to circumstances my life goes different way. 1) Not an option. Im more conservative than that. Meaning Im faithful. And I dont need to be distant. 2) And Im not hyperactive. Meaning I might be a little lazy....so when I have proper mate I can stick with that. 3) Actually I have to work on opposite. To be able to enjoy one night stands. 4) I am perfectly fine to be on my own. That is what I am. I get along with other poeple very good but I dont mind being alone for long periods of time. But I want to have kids. And Id like to have some LTR scout badges too. So staying single is not a option. I experinced quite an outrage from women when they assumed Im the not-commited one and I dont crave women girlfriend. And I got a hint of a little outrage from you too. Is it the women-ego thing?
Kamille Posted March 6, 2008 Posted March 6, 2008 I experinced quite an outrage from women when they assumed Im the not-commited one and I dont crave women girlfriend. And I got a hint of a little outrage from you too. Is it the women-ego thing? No, no outrage here. My ex-boyfriend, the one who was a commitment-phobe, had a bunch of preconceived ideas about women, what we wanted and how we operated which made dating him very difficult since I didn't fit the bill. He however could not hear me out because he believed more in his own conception of "women" as a general category then anything I could do or say. This isn't the space... I think I'll go start a thread on commitment-phobia and if you want, we can continue discussing it there. But I just wonder if anything happened in your past? My ex's mom left him, his dad and his two brothers when he was 6 years old. She didn't have the financial means for custody at first (as she chose to go back to school) and then felt like it would be unfair to destroy the stability the boys had come to know with their dad. Then, when bf and I were together, we found out that his dad was getting divorced a second time because his wife cheated on him. I mean, I think I stuck it out a bit because he had good reasons to afraid or relationship.
Author D-Lish Posted March 6, 2008 Author Posted March 6, 2008 Kamie... why do you engage this guy? He's here looking for a fight. I don't think he has CP, I think he is a woman hating mysoginist. I for one wouldn't keep argueing with someone who hurls personal attacks at other posters because he isn't stable or educated enough to engage in a progressive discussion. When he can't form an answer- he attacks someone personally. Why bother with someone like that. I had to leave my own post because I was sick of getting lambasted by someone who decided to start throwing insults instead of debating. If the mods read this- please delete my this thread I started. It's run it's course and not worth seeking further response.
sweetbutcheeky Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 I don't think so. I am 30 and have only been in one long term, so take away that one (which was 7 years) I would be in the same boat as he is. And how trying to find someone to sweep me off my feel too after being single for too long now, not finding anyone remotely close. (almost 4 years single - how sad)
Author D-Lish Posted March 7, 2008 Author Posted March 7, 2008 I don't think so. I am 30 and have only been in one long term, so take away that one (which was 7 years) I would be in the same boat as he is. And how trying to find someone to sweep me off my feel too after being single for too long now, not finding anyone remotely close. (almost 4 years single - how sad) Being with someone for 7 years means you have the capability of getting attached.... My guy had only had one 8 month relationship at 32- other than that nothing over a month or two. But he also said once he starts feeling an attachment emotionally that he usually walks away.
Walk Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 (edited) hmm... I read Daniel Madr posts in your thread and I didn't see where he was attacking you. And I didn't see it as offensive either. I never pushed a gf talk on him- I discussed a SEXUAL HEALTH ISSUE. That issue was/is : "I don't want to put my sexual health at risk if you or I are going to be sleeping with other people". Plain and simple as that... After looking after myself and getting tested- I didn't want to put myself at risk for an STD. That's responsible- not crazy or misguided. My concern was my sexual health- Addressing sexual health is important in today's society- You say the "talk" was only about your sexual health. You've stressed that in your reply to Daniel. But even when this guy emailed you that he was fine hanging out with you withOUT sex you still want nothing to do with him. Which leads me to believe that what you really wanted was a commitment from him to be exclusive with you. I don't know if that's what you really wanted or not, but that's how I have interpretted your actions. And it may be how this guy is interrepting them too. You wanted him to tell you he was not going to touch another girl while dating you. And when he wouldn't say that, then you stopped dating him. That's fine... that was your call. But it is an exclusive talk (sex exclusively with you), and comes with an undercurrent of unspoken meanings. You told him in your reply to him: I came to the conclusion over the weekend that I have to get my head screwed on straight.... get the business and life stuff in order before worrying about settling down into a serious relationship... and as much as we have fun... it would always worry me about my sexual health. What I'm tryin to say is, he did agree that he wouldn't put your health at risk by having sex with you and others. He agreed that he wouldn't have sex with you but was willing to continue seeing you. I think he was responding directly to what you SAID was the ONLY issue you had... your sexual health. But you weren't really asking for safety with sex. You were asking him to commit. Otherwise you would have accept the offer to continue seeing each other without the sex. Your actions say you didn't want that, and the issue of sex was just a platform for your real desire... exclusive bf/gf relationship. I think you're clouding the issue with the talk of sex. If it was completely about safe sex, then you wouldn't have a problem continuing to see him but not having sex with him. You wanted a real commitment from this guy, and when he couldn't give that to you you dropped the relationship. Which is fine. Just acknowledge it (to yourself), and focus your attention on finding someone who more closely aligns with what you really want in life. Edited March 7, 2008 by Walk
DanielMadr Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 Kamie... why do you engage this guy? He's here looking for a fight. I don't think he has CP, I think he is a woman hating mysoginist. I for one wouldn't keep argueing with someone who hurls personal attacks at other posters because he isn't stable or educated enough to engage in a progressive discussion. When he can't form an answer- he attacks someone personally. Why bother with someone like that. I had to leave my own post because I was sick of getting lambasted by someone who decided to start throwing insults instead of debating. If the mods read this- please delete my this thread I started. It's run it's course and not worth seeking further response. WOW. That was sleazy attack. And Im not sure I deserve that, certainly not from you.
sb129 Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 In defense of Daniel, I think he made some valid points, and don't think he was "attacking" you D-lish he just called it the way HE sees it. Its different to the way you see, it but this is a public forum and that happens. I can see where you are BOTH coming from. Only you know the truth D-Lish.
Author D-Lish Posted March 7, 2008 Author Posted March 7, 2008 Can we put this post to rest please- geez.... we broke up like 3 weeks ago and it didn't phase me in the least bit. I didn't ask the dude for a relationship committment- I was there, I experienced this - okay? I didn't want this guy to be my boyfriend. I'm banging my head up against a wall here because no one is understanding what I have been trying to say. One last time. It's not cool with me to have casual sex with someone who is having casual sex with a lot of others. That was my decision and I am happy with it. We've chatted on msn a bit lately and I told about this crazy post and how it's been blown out of proportion to which he laughed. We were both upfront with one another. He is a cool guy. We were having fun and having sex, that's it- we're still friends. I posted this originally ages ago. It was and still is only a question of my sexual health. Even if you're having casual sex with someone and using a condom- you can catch things. I had just been tested and cleared.... and I had no issue having casual sex with him without being bf/gf.... But I don't sleep with more than one person at a time- even when it's a casual thing. I don't know how I can be more clear. People are responding with these long winded posts telling me how I was pushing for a committment, when even my guy agrees I was the most laid back girl he'd ever dated and didn't see my health concern as a pressure situation. People aren't keeping in mind that I was the one who experienced this- and I know how cool we were with one another about not having sex anymore. He's cool with it and never felt I was pushing for a committment. Geez, we joked about him being a comittment phobe. I can't be more clear that it was never a pressure situation. I keep telling everyone that I didn't see him as bf material after a few dates. Anyway- I am not going to keep beating a dead horse. People can go ahead and argue about how wrong I am. Have fun.
DanielMadr Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 (edited) Can we put this post to rest please- geez.... we broke up like 3 weeks ago and it didn't phase me in the least bit. I didn't ask the dude for a relationship committment- I was there, I experienced this - okay? I didn't want this guy to be my boyfriend. I'm banging my head up against a wall here because no one is understanding what I have been trying to say. One last time. It's not cool with me to have casual sex with someone who is having casual sex with a lot of others. That was my decision and I am happy with it. We've chatted on msn a bit lately and I told about this crazy post and how it's been blown out of proportion to which he laughed. We were both upfront with one another. He is a cool guy. We were having fun and having sex, that's it- we're still friends. I posted this originally ages ago. It was and still is only a question of my sexual health. Even if you're having casual sex with someone and using a condom- you can catch things. I had just been tested and cleared.... and I had no issue having casual sex with him without being bf/gf.... But I don't sleep with more than one person at a time- even when it's a casual thing. I don't know how I can be more clear. People are responding with these long winded posts telling me how I was pushing for a committment, when even my guy agrees I was the most laid back girl he'd ever dated and didn't see my health concern as a pressure situation. People aren't keeping in mind that I was the one who experienced this- and I know how cool we were with one another about not having sex anymore. He's cool with it and never felt I was pushing for a committment. Geez, we joked about him being a comittment phobe. I can't be more clear that it was never a pressure situation. I keep telling everyone that I didn't see him as bf material after a few dates. Anyway- I am not going to keep beating a dead horse. People can go ahead and argue about how wrong I am. Have fun. Majority of posters here concluded you were right to walk away, me included anyway. Normal hypothetical general debate about commitment phobia sparkled up, because your case was closed, thats all. Jeeez, Dont be so deffensive and touchy. Calm down bit*h (thats what misogynists say I think). If you had written : ....I know how cool we were with one another about not having sex anymore. He's cool with it and never felt I was pushing for a committment. Geez, we joked about him being a comittment phobe. I can't be more clear that it was never a pressure situation. I keep telling everyone that I didn't see him as bf material after a few dates......I had no issue having casual sex with him without being bf/gf.... But I don't sleep with more than one person at a time- even when it's a casual thing..... Nobody would say anything. We thought you are sorry that you lost him or that he lost you. Edited March 7, 2008 by DanielMadr
Walk Posted March 7, 2008 Posted March 7, 2008 (edited) Can we put this post to rest please- geez.... we broke up like 3 weeks ago and it didn't phase me in the least bit. Oh my god. Like this was soo yesterday people. You know people aren't going to stop. Its a public forum, and we're addicted. Doesn't matter as long as you know your situation and are happy with the outcome. Edited March 7, 2008 by Walk
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