Trimmer Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 The reason why you are saying that he isnt right for doing what he's doing is because he isnt over it. Something is still fresh in his mind. As it was in yours. Right now he's acting on blind emotion. He'll start to simmer down, and someday the affair and cheating will be nore more than an afterthought. But right now he wants revenge. Let him make his own choices. I for one will not stop him. I know that I cannot stop him, I just know that his short-term decisions will affect the long-term development of his kids, that's why I'm so passionate here. And I completely want him to make his own choices, but I hope, for him and his kids, that he will consider different options, and actually CHOOSE a course of action, as opposed to being driven down the warpath by his rage and his attorney. But I will tell him this. That in the long run you got to let go of the pain. When your finally over it and your content with your anger and your actions, BMM, just let go. Forgive. It'll all work out for the best. Amen to that.
Trimmer Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 Gents - This has been a great discussion, and I respect your opinions... I'm going to bow out for the evening in the interest of getting some sleep (and having that fully actualized post-split life-as-an-individual that I bragged about ) I hope that this will all give Betrayed some good stuff to consider.
Author BetrayedMM Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 Listen, you guys who are worried about my kids, for starters they are 14, 16, and 18 years old, they have been here to help pick up the pieces the last time she did this, and that abuse and child endangerment I mentioned is no joke. You guys just don't have any idea what she does to them, what they have been forced to live through. My whole time here I have focused on infidelity in my posts, as this is not a child/spousal abuse forum, and I only have so much time to type things out. Also, they are unfortunately well versed on this subject, and this is not going to be a surprise to them. Especially since I'm not the only one she confessed to. Once again she made a major decision affecting all of us without discussing it with me; she told them also before I could stop her. How dare she be the one to decide when to burden them with this! Yes, I most certainly have them in mind. As far as how the divorce is going to go, look, even my lawyer told me that the outcome may not be all we seek. When it comes to these matters, the precedents have severely biased the legal system in the woman's favor. That is ice cold rock hard fact. Therefore, to ensure that the kids and I come out of this OK financially, I must be every bit as ruthless as my lawyer wants, present an overwhelming preponderance of evidence, and do everything I possibly can to stack the deck in my favor. Or, she might agree to everything and we don't go thru all that. Or, we might work out a deal. So, when I said "destitute", I meant that's the what the papers demand, not the guaranteed outcome. As far as saving the marriage, yes, she did take the first small step. Big deal. The only reason she did is because I made the mistake of telling her I now know with every fiber of my being that I no longer need her, and that I will get through this with or without her. She had nothing to lose. It was 'safe' for her to tell me. It wasn't out of any concern for me, rather, it was an attempt to manipulate me, for whatever reason she wants to stay married. Why is it that if a woman even comes close to mentioning abuse or violence, folks scream to end the marriage, yet if a man does people suggest working through it? This whole gender bias thing is the very reason my divorce papers stipulate what they do, and anyway, there is a huge difference between revenge and justice. I am seeking justice. 1
Woggle Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 Listen, you guys who are worried about my kids, for starters they are 14, 16, and 18 years old, they have been here to help pick up the pieces the last time she did this, and that abuse and child endangerment I mentioned is no joke. You guys just don't have any idea what she does to them, what they have been forced to live through. My whole time here I have focused on infidelity in my posts, as this is not a child/spousal abuse forum, and I only have so much time to type things out. Also, they are unfortunately well versed on this subject, and this is not going to be a surprise to them. Especially since I'm not the only one she confessed to. Once again she made a major decision affecting all of us without discussing it with me; she told them also before I could stop her. How dare she be the one to decide when to burden them with this! Yes, I most certainly have them in mind. As far as how the divorce is going to go, look, even my lawyer told me that the outcome may not be all we seek. When it comes to these matters, the precedents have severely biased the legal system in the woman's favor. That is ice cold rock hard fact. Therefore, to ensure that the kids and I come out of this OK financially, I must be every bit as ruthless as my lawyer wants, present an overwhelming preponderance of evidence, and do everything I possibly can to stack the deck in my favor. Or, she might agree to everything and we don't go thru all that. Or, we might work out a deal. So, when I said "destitute", I meant that's the what the papers demand, not the guaranteed outcome. As far as saving the marriage, yes, she did take the first small step. Big deal. The only reason she did is because I made the mistake of telling her I now know with every fiber of my being that I no longer need her, and that I will get through this with or without her. She had nothing to lose. It was 'safe' for her to tell me. It wasn't out of any concern for me, rather, it was an attempt to manipulate me, for whatever reason she wants to stay married. Why is it that if a woman even comes close to mentioning abuse or violence, folks scream to end the marriage, yet if a man does people suggest working through it? This whole gender bias thing is the very reason my divorce papers stipulate what they do, and anyway, there is a huge difference between revenge and justice. I am seeking justice. Amen. Women go for the jugular all the time in divorce court yet men are supposed to be gentlemen. I say the hell with that because being a gentlemen with a woman that resnts you and blames you for her unhappines will only get you steamrolled. 1
Author BetrayedMM Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 Oh, I forgot to thank everyone for their support. THANK YOU! I have had nobody else to talk to about this(a lawyer ain't much of a shoulder to cry on), and you folks really do help probably more than you know!
OpenBook Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 Why is it that if a woman even comes close to mentioning abuse or violence, folks scream to end the marriage, yet if a man does people suggest working through it? Probably because men are generally physically larger and stronger than women, and can (and do) use that to cow the woman into submission. Listen, you guys who are worried about my kids, for starters they are 14, 16, and 18 years old, they have been here to help pick up the pieces the last time she did this, and that abuse and child endangerment I mentioned is no joke. You guys just don't have any idea what she does to them, what they have been forced to live through. Then I hope your lawyer is prepared to answer the court if they ask why has she gotten away with abusing your kids for so long, and now all of the sudden (when she cheats on you) it's suddenly not OK with you?
Author BetrayedMM Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 OB, she has a criminal record. Domestic violence is part of that. She beat my younger daughter unconscious 2 years ago, gave her a concussion. She will never even remember the beating. And that certainly wasn't the only case, just an outstanding example of what I meant. Stop assuming I don't know what I'm talking about. My lawyer is not an idiot, neither am I. Except for being a doormat for so long. But, trust me, criminal convictions do indeed count as evidence.
Author BetrayedMM Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 So, this big ugly brute of a man has been cowing this poor defenseless woman into submission? Stop watching lifetime. You have no idea who you are sticking up for here. If you want to identify with her and twist me into a monster, go right ahead. Konw this though: you don't know what you are talking about. The fact that you would insinuate this nonsense just really pissed me off. Thank you for that. Your assumptions have proven my point about gender bias. You are displaying extreme bias with your assumptions.
OceanBlue Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 OB, she has a criminal record. Domestic violence is part of that. She beat my younger daughter unconscious 2 years ago, gave her a concussion. She will never even remember the beating. And that certainly wasn't the only case, just an outstanding example of what I meant. Stop assuming I don't know what I'm talking about. My lawyer is not an idiot, neither am I. Except for being a doormat for so long. But, trust me, criminal convictions do indeed count as evidence. I read all the back and forth above by The throne, Chrome & Trimmer and thanked God for the voice of reason from Trimmer. (and I'm not a religious person!) Then I read the ages of the children and Betrayed's response and thought, okay, he is thinking of the kids. Good for him. The above quote floors me. Had my xH laid a hand on one of my kids, nevermind beaten them unconscious, his a$$ would have been out the f'ing door so fast it wouldn't have been funny. I certainly wouldn't be sitting collecting evidence about an A 2 years later.
Author BetrayedMM Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 like I said, I'm an idiot for being a doormat for so long. I tried my level best to work through all of this with her. I can't cure bipolar disorder. I can't fix my marriage. I can't fix her. BTW, mental illness is her only potential defense. However, manic depressives do indeed know what they are doing.
marlena Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 (edited) This is one of the most disturbing threads I have ever read on this site. It makes me shudder to know that there are people out there who actually think like THE THRONE! To me, they are a danger to society. To the OP, I, like Oceanblue, am apalled that you stayed with a woman who practically beat her child to death. I can't believe that your uppermost concern is destroying your wife when what should concern you most is your children's well-being. From where I stand, neither one of you is a good parent to these poor children. And, yes, thank goodness there are quality people like Trimmer on this site. Edited January 27, 2008 by marlena spelling
Author BetrayedMM Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 Marlena- didn't you read my posts? What makes you think the kids are better off with her? We are NOT rich. Split our incomes in half, and we are both poor. Why should my kids pay the price for what she's done? I don't understand why so many of you are telling me I don't have their best interest at heart. 1
Woggle Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 Marlena- didn't you read my posts? What makes you think the kids are better off with her? We are NOT rich. Split our incomes in half, and we are both poor. Why should my kids pay the price for what she's done? I don't understand why so many of you are telling me I don't have their best interest at heart. You are a man and any man standing his ground will be looked down upon point blank.
Author BetrayedMM Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 Good point Woggle, but Stamp is a man also.
Woggle Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 Good point Woggle, but Stamp is a man also. He is also whining because a woman cheating on her husband won't let him be her knight in shining in armor so take his opinion with a grain of salt.
stampdaddy Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 He is also whining because a woman cheating on her husband won't let him be her knight in shining in armor so take his opinion with a grain of salt. so now my opinion, because my heart is breaking, because I became involved in a situation I "thought" would turn out OK for all concerned, now my opinion means "nothing"?? I know where my heart is, and I know I care about people, like BMM here... So Woggle, why dont YOU be a man and recognize this
marlena Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 MM, Yes, I have read your entire thread. I never said your children would be better off with her. I simply said that neither one of you is doing a good job at parenting. You should have left your wife, in my opinion, the very first time she became abusive towards her children. By staying, you aided and abetted her crime..for, indeed, what she did was criminal. If I were in your shoes, I would be glad to divorce this woman, as quickly and as civilly as possible, and then get on with looking after my children and my own personal happiness. Surely, you can't still have feelings for a woman who beats her children and then goes on to have a stupid affair?
Author BetrayedMM Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 I hear that. Know this folks- I have been struggling FOR my kids for an awful long time. The main reason for me to be seeking justice is so THEY aren't forced to accept a lower quality of life. SHE has just as much responsibility to provide for them as I do. Now, please, stop telling me I'm a selfish horrible parent for doing this. Nothing could be further from the truth. I personally don't need much, my kids DO. Get it? I need to take a break from this thread and calm down. The bigotry has gotten to me, and I'm more disgusted than I should be.
marlena Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 I am not questioning her responsiblity towards her children although I think this woman should be kept as far away as possible from her children. She is,to say the least, a horrendous influence. Her presence in their lives will likely do more harm than good. What I can't wrap my head around is your continuing to stay married to this woman for two years after that horrible incident. I would have pressed charges and made sure the law kept her in check. Why on Earth would you even want to get even with someone like this?
Author BetrayedMM Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 Why on Earth would you even want to get even with someone like this? We are NOT rich. Split our incomes in half, and we are both poor. Why should my kids pay the price for what she's done? The main reason for me to be seeking justice is so THEY aren't forced to accept a lower quality of life. SHE has just as much responsibility to provide for them as I do. I personally don't need much, my kids DO. Get it? What I can't wrap my head around is your continuing to stay married to this woman for two years after that horrible incident. like I said, I'm an idiot for being a doormat for so long. I would have pressed charges and made sure the law kept her in check. she has a criminal record. Domestic violence is part of that. Are you sure you read my posts?
Mr. Lucky Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 I don't understand why so many of you are telling me I don't have their best interest at heart. I think most of us (including those, like me, that have been through what you're going through) feel that your focus should be on improving your situation and relationship with your kids. Lots of ways to do that without the emphasis on taking away from your STBX wife. Sounds like she's got plenty of her own problems... Mr. Lucky
mopar crazy Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 I am so sorry for the pain your stbxw infidelity put you through. It hurts like hell! I have a very good friend that was diagnosed w/ depression and if I remember right bi-polar, years ago. She had a long term A w/ a co-worker. After about 12 years she went on to have numerous A w/ men she met online. I think her H knew about the A w/ the co-worker but didn't do anything about it. After he found out about the men she met online he kicked her out of the house, filed for a D, and started seeing another woman. She called him one day, apologized her heart out and wanted to work on the M. He did take her back and have been back together, happily, for about 5 years. She had the A b/c of her illness. She didn't feel good about herself, her H never gave her any affection, so she felt like she needed to go outside her M to find acceptance from other men that she was worth anything. Sad thing was, she wasn't worth anything but a roll in the hay to this men. Now, the man she had a long term A w/ loved her very much. He was M also but told me that he stayed only b/c of the kids. His W also knew of the A but didn't do anything about it, just accepted it. I haven't read all your replies but whatever you decide to do I wish you happiness and your children get a positive change in life w/ you. I'm sorry. I wouldn't wish the pain of infidelity on anyone but my H's xOW.
Author BetrayedMM Posted January 27, 2008 Author Posted January 27, 2008 Mr. Lucky- would you care to elaborate on these alternative solutions? Or are you only saying there is more than merely divorce to consider? If so, I agree. But, if you're saying I shouldn't present a strong case in court, shouldn't seek divorce, or should allow my kids' quality of life to suffer, I would be interested in hearing exactly why you would advocate this approach. Yes, I know I'm not being kind to her. This is a divorce, not marriage counseling. She canceled the marriage counseling. Because of the gender bias in the court system (my lawyer explained that in great detail), I must either present the strongest case I possibly can, or take one for the team. Well, there is no team. There is only the ruins of a dysfunctional family. Her happiness is not my responsibility. I did not make her unhappy, she did. I cannot fix her issues, and she actively resists working on them. There is nothing I can do about that. And, I tried. You don't have to believe me, that's not important to me. This has been helpful for me, but this internet forum is not reality, just an imaginary place where people who don't know each other can go to help work thru their own issues.
Woggle Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 My lawyer said the same thing to me. He told that this is war and I need to fight with everything I have. I got divorced and was unscathed so this tactic does work for men. When you have her pinned down and the sword right up to her then you can maybe show some mercy but inititally a man has to stand his gorund.
stampdaddy Posted January 27, 2008 Posted January 27, 2008 Mr. Lucky- would you care to elaborate on these alternative solutions? Or are you only saying there is more than merely divorce to consider? If so, I agree. But, if you're saying I shouldn't present a strong case in court, shouldn't seek divorce, or should allow my kids' quality of life to suffer, I would be interested in hearing exactly why you would advocate this approach. Yes, I know I'm not being kind to her. This is a divorce, not marriage counseling. She canceled the marriage counseling. Because of the gender bias in the court system (my lawyer explained that in great detail), I must either present the strongest case I possibly can, or take one for the team. Well, there is no team. There is only the ruins of a dysfunctional family. Her happiness is not my responsibility. I did not make her unhappy, she did. I cannot fix her issues, and she actively resists working on them. There is nothing I can do about that. And, I tried. You don't have to believe me, that's not important to me. This has been helpful for me, but this internet forum is not reality, just an imaginary place where people who don't know each other can go to help work thru their own issues. I think he meant what I meant.. go thru with the Divorce, yes.. Hit her hard if you have to, and yes, your attorney is correct, make it lopsided at the start, so when she counters (if she does) it will meet more in the middle of "fairness" for both... My point is the "bigger picture" of years down the road and even more effects on your kids.. I understand that they are older, but the are also wiser, and if they saw their dad "take one for the team, THEIR team", I think it would have a more positive effect on their future relationships than continuing to trample their mother. He was correct in saying that she already has enough problems... hang in there
Recommended Posts