Author frannie Posted January 24, 2008 Author Posted January 24, 2008 Hello all. I thought I had better pop in and give an update. I'm OK. Everyone's OK, I haven't said anything. I came on here Tuesday morning and I was overwhelmed by the helpful, supportive and touching responses. I just couldn't write anything at that time. I really was blown away by people's kindness. I feel a bit bad for not having responded sooner. I haven't been debating anything with myself. I realised the morning after I posted that it would be better not to say anything to her. For lots of reasons. For one thing, it wouldn't bring anything to an end, which was the primary reason for my impulse. I just wanted to be out of this after four years. I have been 'breaking things off' with him since last year, and I'm so tired of it. But would telling her make a difference..? I'd just be exchanging one difficult situation for another... waiting to see what would happen once she knew. Pointless to do it for that motive... Also, I can't remember who it was said that telling her would be robbing him of his one chance to get this right. And I think that was really the swinger for me. Of course that feeds into the crippling hope which I just wish would go away (and at the same time don't)... Also, if he decides that he wants to keep his family together, then what the devil business is that of mine? And if he left (or was kicked out) as a result of my telling her, then how would we ever survive as a couple? The one thing I know won't happen is that I stay in an affair with him for x years until the children are grown. Either he comes to me having left, or we don't see each other again. That was the plan last week and I really have to stick to it. I really hope that someone somewhere learns something or changes something as a result of reading all this stuff. I can't say I wish I'd never met him, because we had some great times and I really thought we had a future, but I sincerely wish I hadn't had all this pain and anguish, which is not even now anywhere near over. Once again, thanks everyone for taking your time to respond to the thread. I'm not going to get into a debate about anything myself now, because I'm trying not to think about it all. Just keep my head down and get through the days. But I wanted to come back and let you all know what was happening. Thanks x
whichwayisup Posted January 24, 2008 Posted January 24, 2008 You've come a long way and will continue to go a long way...Each day you'll detach more and have him in your thoughts less and less. By not having him in your daily life and having time on your side, you WILL have no choice to but detach, enough that your heart will close off to him and you won't care one way or another what he does/thinks/says. That will make NC even easier on you because if he tries to contact you, you can ignore him and just go on like he doesn't matter at all. I am glad to hear that you're not going to tell his wife. All that does is open a big can of worms you don't need to deal with. Stay strong and take it day by day..
marlena Posted January 24, 2008 Posted January 24, 2008 (edited) I really hope that someone somewhere learns something or changes something as a result of reading all this stuff. Yes, this is why I respond even after four years have passed since my long, disastrous affair. I'm not going to get into a debate about anything myself now, because I'm trying not to think about it all. Just keep my head down and get through the days. But I wanted to come back and let you all know what was happening. Frannie, this is a time for pampering yourself and removing all stressors from your life. Take care of yourself and just know we are all here for you should you ever need us. I am so glad you responded. Marlena Edited January 24, 2008 by marlena
CAT100 Posted January 24, 2008 Posted January 24, 2008 Frannie I hope you are ok, and now is the time to put yourself first. Much as I feel it is right that the BS knows who she is married to (ie someone who has been deceiving her for years) I do also see that if you really ''feel exchanging one difficult situation for another... waiting to see what would happen once she knew. Pointless to do it for that motive...'' then maybe you should just leave it. If you do not tell her I guess MM will have a chance to either rebuild his M or leave it and be with you. And you will not run the risk of a possible scenario where his W knows, kicks him out and so he goes to you, almost by default. If he decides to be with you, it would be better for you (and your R with him) if he does so purely because he cant be without you any longer. Good luck x
melbar68 Posted January 24, 2008 Posted January 24, 2008 Frannie you advised me well when i was asking for help with my MM and now i am giving you mine. I dont think you should tell the wife as that will defenetly end things between you and your MM i am sure because he will probably see a side of you he has never seen. Also i know its difficult i am in a similar situation and its only been about seven months i dont know how i would take it after four years, you are a brave soul. seven months is killing me because he tells me the same thing yours tells you that he cant leave because of the children, when it actually gets more difficult as the children get older i know been there. just use him or see him when you want to and not when he wants to see you thats what i do and believe me its not love its lust. if you guys are not spending quality time together it will never work out. if its only sex i am telling you move on or just see him to benefit you not him. stay away for about a month and even though that might be difficult do it your heart will tell you what to do
melbar68 Posted January 24, 2008 Posted January 24, 2008 Frannie you advised me well when i was asking for help with my MM and now i am giving you mine. I dont think you should tell the wife as that will defenetly end things between you and your MM i am sure because he will probably see a side of you he has never seen. Also i know its difficult i am in a similar situation and its only been about seven months i dont know how i would take it after four years, you are a brave soul. seven months is killing me because he tells me the same thing yours tells you that he cant leave because of the children, when it actually gets more difficult as the children get older i know been there. just use him or see him when you want to and not when he wants to see you thats what i do and believe me its not love its lust. if you guys are not spending quality time together it will never work out. if its only sex i am telling you move on or just see him to benefit you not him. stay away for about a month and even though that might be difficult do it your heart will tell you what to do
Babybird Posted January 25, 2008 Posted January 25, 2008 If I were the OW, I would not stay...I think we are talking about several more years, right? I would not stay because even though I would admire that he feels so strongly about his children, I would feel it is a form of hypocrisy to say you can't leave their mother but you can cheat on her because of your love for them... I would say that I love you and I love that you love your children, but this is my life and I'm not going to waste it waiting around for you for several more years...What about college, marriages, grandchildren...Always an excuse to stay for love of the children...and I'm not arguing that it is not valid or noble etc. I just wouldn't believe that it would ever happen and that would eat away at my love for him... Now as the BS, I would already know that my M was crumbling...I would choose not to stay in it...I know this for a fact because I was in that situation...I did not need anyone to tell me what was going on, it was right under my nose...That's why I think some people are ok with status quo because it requires no change...Life continues with no one the wiser... I would want my MM to know that I would end my R with him and never look back if he chose to continue status quo...That if whatever was keeping him there was more important than our R, then that's fine, but I wouldn't be waiting around...And of course I'm talking a reasonable amount of time, not like the next-day type time frame... Mostly, I'd want to see him fight for me, be strong for me and show me that "us" is important to him...And if he really believes that the only way to be a parent is to be in home with no love between the man and woman then maybe we aren't as compatible as we thought... That's just my opinion... (((FRANNIE))) Good advice GEL!
Babybird Posted January 25, 2008 Posted January 25, 2008 Frannie, My MM stuck in his M for 10 years because he wanted to be there for his son. Now that the M is over his son(17) is having an incredibly hard time dealing with things. He is withdrawn, depressed, losing interest in everything he once liked to do, and needs to go see a counselor. Your MM should know that the D isn't easy no matter what age they are but it seems the older they are and the more they understand the harder it is for the children to deal with. I tried to imagine waiting for, I'm guessing, 5 years. God, HOW?? I would go nuts. I literally would go nuts wondering why, why not, what I did or didn't do, why I wasn't good enough, etc. I think you are sweet and I don't doubt for a second that he thinks he's doing the right thing for his children. Being so selfless could be seen as an honorable thing. BUT, he needs to know that he can still be a good parent even if he isn't married to the mother. I know that loving someone so much is hard. I would be willing to bet that things are wonderful between the two of you and the only disagreement you have is about him leaving his W. With that being said how can you dump someone that makes you happy in every area but one?? I know. That is a huge one but when you're together it seems so far away. Yours is a tricky dilemma my dear. I don't have any words of advice except remember who you are. What advice would you give your best friend or sister if they came to you in this situation? Whatever your answer is is who you are. Good luck and we are all here for you!
overandout Posted January 26, 2008 Posted January 26, 2008 Isn't the harsh truth of this scenario that Frannie's mm just doesn't want to be with her enough to change his lifestyle. I feel that he never had any intention of leaving and the affair was convenient and easy for him to continue; I believe Frannie lives a long way from the family home, so no danger of neighbors seeing him Why I find it hard to swallow his excuse of staying for the the kids is that he spent half the week away from them maintaining contact with them was an evening phone call. How did he participate in their development from this distance? Please, the man is a user. I doubt that he is, or was, that unhappy at home; probably just bored. Frannie needs to stay away and cut all contact with him and allow him to find her, but from his behavior to date and what he has told her, that is unlikely to happen. Frannie's realisation that she has been used accounts for her bitterness including toying with telling the bs imo. I just want her to move on and hopefully she will see her (x) mm for what he is. I don't want her to spend one more nanosecond on him. He will not and doesn't want to deliver anything more than he has so far.
overandout Posted January 26, 2008 Posted January 26, 2008 The fact is you don't know anyone's intentions...And that wasn't the point of Frannie's OP...She said she wouldn't argue the validity of whether or not he was staying for the children, because she believes he is and that's what matters here... Ok, but I doubt if any OW would put their life on hold for x number of years when there is no guarantee at the end of it. It would, I think, be like torture to live a life in limbo effectively, and the expectation of him leaving or not, would probably take its toll on the relationship. As other posters have said, he isn't willing to do what it takes to be with Frannie. MP do leave their families; it happens quite frequently. There is a heavy price to pay when marriages break down but some people do make the break because they want to be with the OP. I believe they call it being in love! In some respects, it doesn't matter what reasons Frannie's mm gives her because the end result is the same; he is staying with his wife and children for the forseeable future at the very least.
OpenBook Posted January 26, 2008 Posted January 26, 2008 Ok, but I doubt if any OW would put their life on hold for x number of years when there is no guarantee at the end of it. Judging from the posts in the Infidelity forum, there's no guarantee it'll work out if you marry the guy either. It's all a crapshoot, either way.
White Flower Posted January 28, 2008 Posted January 28, 2008 I hope you don't mind me giving you an advice... Sometimes we don't see everything clearly when we're in love. I am sure that your MM loves you and he feels torn between his children and you. But I don't think it's fair to you that you have to stand by until he decides that his children are grown enough... I think children suffer as much as their parents do an unhappy relationship. My parents were unhappy. They argued a lot. My sister and I would cry that they would even talk about a separation. They never did. Unfortunately. I say unfortunately because,now, 20 years down the line I wish my mom had found another man and be happier. And I wish I did not have to live through this. My sister got married at 17 by escaping from home cause she had had enough of our parents arguing. And my sister is now unhappy. I left home when I was 16 going very very very far away just to be on my own and not to have to deal with this on an ongoing basis. Overall I feel that I am happy because I achieved many things along and I formed my character. But, girl, what a mess I was. it took me years to get over some of the insecurities and I still struggle with them sometimes. Frannie, tell your man that he's not making anybody happier. He's hurting everybody: himself, you, his children, his wife... Happiness cannot be based on lies no matter whom he's lying to. Maybe he's telling the truth to you but he's lying to his wife and his children. You and him will never be happy with that. His children will never be happy. Why does his wife not have a right to know the truth and be happy with somebody else while she's several years younger and has more choices to find her own happiness alone or with somebody else? If I were her, I would want to know the truth. While I don't usually think that it's right to tell the BS about it, I think you should confront your MM and tell him that if he loves you he has to choose being with you because this is the single right decision that he can make for everybody: himself, you, his kids and his wife. And also, tell him that if he has no balls, you are going to tell his wife on a specific date, let's say end of February or end of March? Don't give him much more time. If he replies to you that he'd rather not see you any more than you tell his wife, then walk a way. You don't need him in your life. It's not fair for you to love so much someone who's ready to through you away like this... God, your post just stands out so strong to me. I am one of four siblings. We all saw the good times and the bad. I am one of the two youngest and we saw the worst of it. If I could go back now and say, "Mom, just let Dad go", I would. I would say that so she wouldn't have felt so obligated to stay for us kids. Maybe she would have found someone new. Actually, she had started to talk to someone while my dad was in an A, but she didn't let it get very far. I wish she had. If she found someone who made her feel alive maybe she wouldn't have had that heart attack. And if she still would have had the heart attack, maybe the new love of her life would have loved her back to health. Maybe she would be alive today. Maybe. Maybe she would have been here to watch my kids grow and attend their graduation ceremonies. Maybe she would have even gone to their weddings and seen their kids be born. But no, she stayed for me and my sister. She suffered with strokes and died at a very young age. She died of a broken heart. Not because Dad had an OW, but because she didn't find someone who loved her for her. She had let that man go because she 'was doing the right thing.' She died in a hospital bed with nobody to hold her hand. Frannie, please have MM read this and ask him how he sees his life ending. Whose hand does he want to hold at the end?
jaslene2009 Posted February 1, 2008 Posted February 1, 2008 Well for all intended purposes: Most Of ALL MM use that same line. If he was so miserable with her than what does the kids have to do with it? The MM I am seeing tells me the same thing. I am a mother and I know that if my H pushed me, it would be over. I feel that poeple can be great parents and not live in the same household. The problem is that the MM waits until they get caught with OW and then the BW wants the divorce and she will parental alienate the children. He should talk to her about his needs and wants before he strays. If she doesn't want to meet hin halfway, than he needs to look at his options. Nevertheless, staying for the children is a bunch of crock. I don't buy it and I hope that you don't either. If he is in LOVE with you, than he should know that you would make a awesome partner and a good stepmother to his kids. Think about it? Well, here I am asking for advice. Don't faint. I've done it before. Four or something less years of an affair. And I know he loves me, I am absolutely sure of that. And I know he wants to be with me. But he has this thing about his children. Only none of you believe it, but imagine it were true... I want you to imagine this is true... Imagine a man who does not love his wife, loves his children. He finds a woman he does love... and who loves him. Only he feels that he should be there for his children. He will stay with them until they are grown and then be with the woman he really loves... ... you might not believe it. But imagine it is true. And YOU are the OW. What would you do? And if you were the BW... would you want to know..? All comments accepted. Only do comment on if the scenario is true, not whether you believe in its veracity or not. I know it IS true... so I want to know... if it WERE true.... what would you do or want?
Author frannie Posted February 8, 2008 Author Posted February 8, 2008 Just a quick update. Three weeks of NC now. He knows I love him, and I know he feels the same way. However, an affair is no longer good enough for me, which he also knows. So, having ended it, I feel fine. While we were together it was great, but it was also clouded and horrible and insecure... so no more of that for me. I just thought I'd update on the situation... brief, but to the point: in my mind, I no longer want him unless he can deliever on his 'wants'... words aren't enough. They never were, which is why I was never quite comfortable with the whole affair thing. Luckily for me I got to the point where I knew it had to end... so I ended it. I really want to thank everyone who added a positive and supportive message to this thread, you just can't know how much words really are enough at times... heh heh. Anyway... there's my update... life goes on
whichwayisup Posted February 8, 2008 Posted February 8, 2008 I'm glad to hear you're holding up okay. His loss...
Author frannie Posted February 8, 2008 Author Posted February 8, 2008 I'm glad to hear you're holding up okay. His loss... Thanks wwiu x
Lyssa Posted February 9, 2008 Posted February 9, 2008 Just a quick update. Three weeks of NC now. He knows I love him, and I know he feels the same way. However, an affair is no longer good enough for me, which he also knows. So, having ended it, I feel fine. While we were together it was great, but it was also clouded and horrible and insecure... so no more of that for me. I just thought I'd update on the situation... brief, but to the point: in my mind, I no longer want him unless he can deliever on his 'wants'... words aren't enough. They never were, which is why I was never quite comfortable with the whole affair thing. Luckily for me I got to the point where I knew it had to end... so I ended it. I really want to thank everyone who added a positive and supportive message to this thread, you just can't know how much words really are enough at times... heh heh. Anyway... there's my update... life goes on Hi Frannie, Glad you updated. Was thinking of you - glad to know you're doing well.
OpenBook Posted February 9, 2008 Posted February 9, 2008 Just a quick update. Three weeks of NC now. He knows I love him, and I know he feels the same way. However, an affair is no longer good enough for me, which he also knows. So, having ended it, I feel fine. While we were together it was great, but it was also clouded and horrible and insecure... so no more of that for me. I just thought I'd update on the situation... brief, but to the point: in my mind, I no longer want him unless he can deliever on his 'wants'... words aren't enough. They never were, which is why I was never quite comfortable with the whole affair thing. Luckily for me I got to the point where I knew it had to end... so I ended it. I really want to thank everyone who added a positive and supportive message to this thread, you just can't know how much words really are enough at times... heh heh. Anyway... there's my update... life goes on Frannie I'm so glad to see that you have put your foot down on this. You felt it wasn't right for you, so you did something about it. I think it's always good when a woman deals with men from a position of strength. I'm a big fan of your posts as they are always thoughtfully and carefully written, and I've never seen you in attack mode or flaming anybody. (Which shows way more self-control than I have.) I hope you keep posting and giving advice.
marlena Posted February 9, 2008 Posted February 9, 2008 Frannie, I so admire strong and independent women. Take good care of yourself. Marlena
GreenEyedLady Posted February 9, 2008 Posted February 9, 2008 Frannie! So glad to hear that you are strong and doing well! (((HUGS)))
White Flower Posted February 10, 2008 Posted February 10, 2008 Good for you, Frannie. As a hopeless romantic I would like to think this will make him think that he can't live without you. But, you have to do what's right for you and waiting forever just isn't in the picture. Best of luck.
Chapter2 Posted February 10, 2008 Posted February 10, 2008 Frannie, below is one of the many posts from you two years ago...you know exactly what you are worthy and deserving of just as I did at the time and still do. This is (as I proved many times in my process) a three steps forward, two steps back process at times and you are in the thick of it. There isn't a doubt in my mind that you can do this. Its so cliche and so tossed around on this forum but its true...your needs matter and they are valid. I'm not saying he doesn't agree...just that he is making the choice not to meet them. It is definitely painful to go back and read some of our old threads, but its healing, too. I would encourage anyone, no matter how they arrived at this point, that they are worthy of a whole relationship. I know first hand you can do NC...you've done it before for even longer and you can do it longer this time. Hang in there "Stating what you want and need from a situation is NOT NEEDY. Needy is bending over backwards and accepting Anything he throws your way because you don't have the guts to say, 'this isn't working and I need more, and if you can't help with that, then we'll have to part'. Needy is afraid to state needs in case they don't get met. As for the first part of your statement: If a MM cares for you, he Will Let You Go, because he cannot give you what you need. Hanging onto people because of your own desires is selfish, not caring. You state what your needs are, and if he can't meet them, he lets you go, and you walk away with dignity. That is how it should go. Either that, or he gets his act together and leaves his M, and catches up with you later, IF you're free."
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