OpenRoad Posted January 19, 2008 Posted January 19, 2008 (edited) I've been married for nine long years and have wanted out for a long time. I've finally reached the breaking point. Not only is coming home too emotionally oppressive, but it's keeping me from building the life I'd rather have. I won't get into the details of the dysfunction at this point, but I'll say that there's no realistic hope of therapy salvaging this. We need to go our separate ways. I would have done it by now, but there are a few potential obstacles. We have a three-year-old son with autism. He's very affectionate, so I'm sure it'll scar him if one of his parents leave. He's barely verbal so far, so we can't explain things to him. On the other hand, the dysfunction he sees between his parents isn't doing him any favors. I think it's better for him too for the marriage to end, but it needs to be managed carefully for his sake. Second, my wife is Asian and came to the US with me shortly before our son was born. She hasn't adapted very well and will need to go back if we split up. I lived there for nine years and plan to go back indefinitely, so we won't have to worry about one parent being on the other side of the world. My desire is for us to live in the same neighborhood so that we both can be close to our son. I'm sure she'd want that for him; in fact, she'd need it because she clearly isn't up to raising him by herself. Unfortunately, I'm at least three years away from setting myself up for a secure life there. I can't go back without that security (I'll need that for child support), but those three years will be painful for us and possibly harmful for our son. So it would seem that discussing this goal with her and getting her agreement would make it simply a matter of time. But I don't think she'll stay rational for those three years knowing that we're on borrowed time. She'll also be talking to her mother and other people about the pending separation, and I expect that some of them will fill her head with more pessimistic ideas that would undermine my plans for a future that allows our son to have us both. My plan certainly isn't bullet proof, but it's the best start I can think of. Thanks for lending your cyber-ear. I'd appreciate any thoughts you'd like to share. Again, the idea here is for our son to have regular access to both of us. Edited January 19, 2008 by OpenRoad
norajane Posted January 19, 2008 Posted January 19, 2008 That's a tough spot to be in. Are you able to separate without getting a divorce so she can stay here until you are able to move?
Author OpenRoad Posted January 19, 2008 Author Posted January 19, 2008 (edited) Are you able to separate without getting a divorce so she can stay here until you are able to move? I'd rather we didn't divorce or even separate until after we move (my comment about living in the same neighborhood is for when we get back to Asia). My area of the US is too expensive for me to support two households, and I also need to save money to move us back to Asia. And again, my wife hasn't gotten to the point of being independent in the US. If she's going to be here and handling a significant portion of caring for our son, she'll need my help. Edited January 19, 2008 by OpenRoad
Trialbyfire Posted January 19, 2008 Posted January 19, 2008 Have you discussed the impact of a separation on your son, with a professional? It appears that your major concern is for your son, which is commendable but there's a strong element of control, in regards to your wife. She's a free human being therefore, you can't control her actions to suit your personal needs.
norajane Posted January 19, 2008 Posted January 19, 2008 Then you have three choices: 1 - say nothing and do nothing for the next three years until your plans can happen 2 - talk to your wife and tell her what's what, and deal with her reaction and her decisions about it, whatever they might be. That's the most honest thing to do, and probably the best, as it allows HER to also make plans for her life. You don't trust that she would make decisions based on your son's welfare? What are you afraid she would do if you told her the truth and told her your plan? I think your instincts are right and the best thing is to share this with your wife. It's her life, too. 3 - try to fix whatever is the problem with your marriage. You say it can't be done, and maybe it can't, but I wonder if you've tried? It can't hurt, might help. You can start with some honesty and tell her your marriage is in deep trouble and ask her to see a marriage counselor with you. Counseling probably would help anyway as I'm sure it's extremely difficult to sustain a marriage when there's an autistic child to care for - lots of people have trouble with that.
Ronni_W Posted January 20, 2008 Posted January 20, 2008 I can't help but wonder: Are you feeling overwhelmed by what I can only imagine are INCREDIBLE pressures and responsibilities of being the "rock" for your family? Such chronic stress without any apparent end in sight certainly can make one act dysfunctionally and want to run away. What have you done to acquire the very best coping skills and personal support network for yourself? (Not for your wife or about your wife...for YOU.) It may make what you're considering more palatable when you say that all your plans are with your son's best interest in mind but, to be frank, it comes off a bit disingenuously. You are rightly concerned for your sanity...and it may even feel like your ultimate survival. There are many more noble ways of "saving" yourself than abandoning your wife and child.
Author OpenRoad Posted January 20, 2008 Author Posted January 20, 2008 Ronni, not so fast with that gavel, especially when it concerns questioning people's love for their children. Regarding my son, there's pretty much nothing to cope with. He's mildly autistic, is making great progress, and is a joy in every way. It's the thought of spending time with him that brings me home directly after work. I certainly don't plan to "abandon" him, and my stress over this decision is because of the possibility of losing him or having unacceptably little access to him. I have no problem being the rock for my family, but I have a problem with being constantly disrespected and belittled despite my best efforts. I've tried hard to introduce healthier relationship habits into my home, but we always end up in the same rut. It's like our kitchen. She considers it her room and keeps it a horrendous mess despite the ample cabinet space. I've tried helping her to clean it up, but she refuses. It's apparent that she needs that mess.
Trialbyfire Posted January 20, 2008 Posted January 20, 2008 It's like our kitchen. She considers it her room and keeps it a horrendous mess despite the ample cabinet space. I've tried helping her to clean it up, but she refuses. It's apparent that she needs that mess. Once more, does it really matter that much if the kitchen is a mess? If she's responsible for the cooking, the majority of times, perhaps it's best to close the door and leave it as her turf.
Storyrider Posted January 20, 2008 Posted January 20, 2008 Once more, does it really matter that much if the kitchen is a mess? If she's responsible for the cooking, the majority of times, perhaps it's best to close the door and leave it as her turf. I think he was using the kitchen as an analogy for the state of the relationship and her attitude towards it.
Trialbyfire Posted January 20, 2008 Posted January 20, 2008 I think he was using the kitchen as an analogy for the state of the relationship and her attitude towards it. Okay. I get the feeling this is a two-way street...
Author OpenRoad Posted January 20, 2008 Author Posted January 20, 2008 (edited) Okay. I get the feeling this is a two-way street... What gives you that feeling? If you're going to accuse people of being disingenuous, you should back it up. Edited January 20, 2008 by OpenRoad
Ronni_W Posted January 20, 2008 Posted January 20, 2008 Ronni, not so fast with that gavel, especially when it concerns questioning people's love for their children. ...I have a problem with being constantly disrespected and belittled despite my best efforts. ...It's apparent that she needs that mess. OR, I did not question your love for your child...I questioned an action you are considering, and wondered about possible stresses that might be underlying the move toward that action. Obviously feeling disrespected and belittled is a BIG problem...as is needing a chaotic kitchen for whatever relief that brings. These suggest that individual therapy for both of you as well as couples' counseling may produce at least some awareness of the different issues and dynamics. But you banged the gavel on even trying therapy, have unilaterally decided that you both "need to go your separate ways" and are, in effect, plotting your escape. Those are actions of abandoning a problem rather than making sincere and honest attempts to resolve it.
Trialbyfire Posted January 20, 2008 Posted January 20, 2008 What gives you that feeling? If you're going to accuse people of being disingenuous, you should back it up. I think you may have some control issues which she attempts to combat in different ways. It's not to say that she's not culpable, as well. I have no doubt she is and that she has some serious issues. You can't always be in charge and maneuvering the other person, to what you feel is right.
Ronni_W Posted January 20, 2008 Posted January 20, 2008 (It won't let me edit the previous.) Wanted to add: Possibly it is a difference in our personal definitions of "abandon" -- for me, we can abandon people AND continue to love them -- abandon is an action (for me) and love is a feeling.
Author OpenRoad Posted January 20, 2008 Author Posted January 20, 2008 Ronni, I intend to discuss the past nine years with a professional to both minimize my baggage and to understand my negative contributions. I hope she'll do the same, but it's up to her. Seeing a psychologist has a stigma in her culture, and I doubt she'll want to do it. If she does, I'll of course support her. I'm sure couples therapy would help us to have a healthier living arrangement, but it's not going to make me fall in love with her. As far as marriage as a romantic or spiritual relationship is concerned, none of that is left for me here. I don't see that as unilateral, but as knowing where I am on the matter. But I'll do this: if the person I see for individual help thinks after hearing me out that I should try couples therapy, I will.
Ronni_W Posted January 20, 2008 Posted January 20, 2008 ...couples therapy ... it's not going to make me fall in love with her. I don't see that as unilateral, ...if the person I see for individual help thinks after hearing me out that I should try couples therapy, I will. Hi OR. Those sound like positive steps and, really, what you owe yourself and your son. Believe me, I know the pain and confusion of being in a love relationship that has stopped working...no matter what the reasons. The thing is -- you need/want a divorce because you're out of love with your wife. Pure and simple. (Not because it's best for her or best for your son. There are some parts of a divorce that won't even be best for you. But you want/need it just because you're out of love with her. There is no sin or shame in that.) You're correct that how you've restated you thoughts on couples' therapy is not unilateral . But deciding, as you have, that you will undertake couples' therapy knowing that your wife attaches stigma to counseling is...well, not bilateral . I mean, would you BOTH not need to agree to it, before you can be so certain? If/when it comes to that, I'm sure that your wife will do what she feels is best for herself and her child -- as you will do what's best for yourself and your child. To me, that's the beauty of relationships and parenting.
Author OpenRoad Posted January 20, 2008 Author Posted January 20, 2008 The thing is -- you need/want a divorce because you're out of love with your wife. Pure and simple. (Not because it's best for her or best for your son. There are some parts of a divorce that won't even be best for you. But you want/need it just because you're out of love with her. There is no sin or shame in that.) That was my point from the beginning. The constant strife has burned it to the ground. I'm not talking about divorce for my son's benefit (although it must be considered that being in such an unhealthy atmosphere isn't good for him), but I want to do what I can to keep him in my life and minimize the split's impact on him. But deciding, as you have, that you will undertake couples' therapy knowing that your wife attaches stigma to counseling is...well, not bilateral . I mean, would you BOTH not need to agree to it, before you can be so certain? I meant that I would be willing to do it. It goes without saying that if she won't participate, couples therapy won't happen. If/when it comes to that, I'm sure that your wife will do what she feels is best for herself and her child -- as you will do what's best for yourself and your child. I think so too. But if what she thinks is best for her and him would remove me from his life (especially when I'm being careful about keeping her in his life), my response will be about more than the beauty of choice. I know what divorced husbands face, so I'm being as careful as I can. Writing this thread has helped me come to terms with the fact that leaving this marriage comes with a huge risk of losing my son. Regardless of what preparations I make now, I'll always be at a severe disadvantage. I suppose I was hoping that somebody would have words that might in some way alleviate the pain that comes with this possibility, but I'm now facing the fact that such words don't exist.
norajane Posted January 20, 2008 Posted January 20, 2008 Writing this thread has helped me come to terms with the fact that leaving this marriage comes with a huge risk of losing my son. Regardless of what preparations I make now, I'll always be at a severe disadvantage. I suppose I was hoping that somebody would have words that might in some way alleviate the pain that comes with this possibility, but I'm now facing the fact that such words don't exist. I think you might want to speak to a lawyer and find out what your legal rights are in a divorce as it pertains to your son. For example, if you divorced, I don't think she can can take him out of the country if you are actively caring for the child (have not abandoned them, the legal definition of abandonment). Also, you can file for primary custody or joint custody, and then legally, you either have your son living with you, or are entitled to him half the time.
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