luckyinlove Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 So, my boyfriend and I of about 1 1/2 years love eachother to pieces. But, over the course of the last couple months we've started arguing significantly more often. Usually due to miscommunication, lack of understanding one another, or petty things. Generally he will do something that doesn't quite make me terribly happy (for example, he knows one of my biggest pet peeves is not calling when he says he's going to), I'll ignore it, then it (or something else) will happen again, I'll confront him, he gets defensive and tells me I am overdramatic about things and that I'm being ridiculous. Right there we've wasted a perfectly good hour or two together. The arguments are almost always elevated because the two of us tend to get very defensive. We are both getting very sick of this, it's exhausting! Everytime we argue about something we usually conclude exchanging "i love you's" and talking about how ridiculous it is that we have to argue, but things NEED to change. Now, my questions are... How healthy is it for two people to argue? Could this be a phase we will be able to get through or will it most likely just be a downhill path from here? Any arguement control suggestions? and very importantly, any tips for dealing with an EXTREMELY defensive, stubborn male?
mattea Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 hi luckyinlove, i don't know if i have any great suggestions for you, but i do have similar questions! my bf and i argue a lot and believe me, i know how lame it is to spend precious time being highly upset and arguing! my family really avoids conflict so i guess i probably need to learn how to resolve conflict in a healthier way. i'd say in my relationship i tend to be the defensive one. i feel like i am trying to be loving, attentive, caring, affectionate, etc. then my boyfriend will start telling me how i am not being loving just because i am a bit stressed/cranky one day, and he's ready to bail on our plans because he can't be around me when i'm like that. all the while i've been trying to still be loving and caring while dealing with my own stress, so when he starts saying those things my frustration level just multiplies. i seriously get so angry with him because i feel that i am being attacked when i've been doing my best. i bring this up because i'm wondering how/when you approach it when you're upset about something. i totally think it's valid to be upset when he doesn't call when he said he would, especially given that he knows this is a sore spot for you. and i'm sure when you try to talk to him about it, the last thing you want to hear is that you are being ridiculous! my guess is that when he says that he is feeling pressured and attacked. maybe he's trying really hard to be loving, and he gets really busy or preoccupied or stressed when he's supposed to call and he forgets. maybe you could just pick up the phone and call him and let him know you're waiting to hear from him? maybe he doesn't mean to be hurtful at all? like i said, i don't feel it's unreasonable to expect a call when he said he would. but how do you let him know that you are upset that he didn't call (or whatever)? what words do you use?
Geishawhelk Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 Hya 'guys'...Would you like me to contribute? I think I might be able to provide some insight.... Believe it or not, Relationships are all about Control. All our lives, as youngsters, we are constantly at the beck and call of others around us. Parents, relatives, brothers and sisters, teachers... all kinds of people who are there to Lord it over our formative years... Now, how these years go, depends upon how 'good' these people are at the job, because that's what colours our perceptions and starts to 'load our baggage'...So what we learn from them, forms the foundation and basis of our opinions of how things should go. That's part one... The next bit is that, once we're old enough and mature enough to gain our independence, we then find a significant other who loves us with all their heart and soul. Finally we have someone who will do what we want/need, who will love us enough to want to make us happy, and be at OUR beck and call. Finally, we have the opportunity of being Put First. The trouble is.... They're thinking this way too.... Relationships do occasionally become a struggle, because we believe that, if the other person loved us 'correctly', then they'd do what we ask, and keep us happy by complying with our wishes, desires and requests. SUBconsciously, they see this as you trying to govern their lives, and run things your way, without compromise. We expect our partners to be understanding, co-operative, and sometimes, just plain psychic! And when they rebel, and go against our wishes, all they're doing is resisting what they perceive is OUR control, and exercising theirs.... Do you see what I mean? Should I go on, or am I off tangent?
mattea Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 geisha, i don't think you're off on a tangent, but is there some way to resolve this?
Geishawhelk Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 Yes. But as with any partnership, it's worth you both understanding this, and trying at least to appreciate it on the same level....After all, it's all about communication and co-operation.... You need to make every situation, win-win. And primarily, this means taking responsibility for your reactions and responses. For example, instead of using the perpetual "you always...." and/or "you never...." try to shift it around and explain that when something happens, it makes you feel... For example... "I hate it when you tell me you're going to call, then you don't, you really piss me off!" "I get really angry when I'm waiting for a call, and it doesn't come, I get really pissed off!" The former creates an impression of attack. So even before the sentence is finished, they're on the defensive. The latter takes the heat off them, and just expresses how you feel, without the attack aspect. So they're less likely to get defensive, and try to explain, instead.... Relationships are complicated, and no 2 situations are ever the same. It sound as if luckyinlove's relationship might have reached a point where some aspects are becoming...'stale'... and there's a sense of frustration there, because although you both want the relationship to continue, LiL... you're becoming maybe a bit set in your ways.... There's a technique called the 'Speaker/Listener' technique, which is extremely effective in getting both members to speak - and be heard - and get their point across effectively. I have used it in counselling, and you would truly be amazed at how it can honestly transform sitations from banging arguments to compromises.... This from our manual on techniques: (I suggest you copy into a word.doc, and print off, if you can.....) Advantages of using the Speaker-Listener Technique: It counteracts the destructive styles of communication -- The WINE signs -- Withdrawal, Invalidation, Negative interpretation and Escalation. It allows a couple to use structure to make it safe to communicate openly and clearly. When couples regularly use rules and techniques for dealing with the issues in their relationships, they develop an increased sense of confidence. Your communication is protected against destructive patterns, making possible clear and safe communication that can bring you closer together. RULES FOR THE SPEAKER: Speak for yourself. Use "I" statements and talk about your feelings. Don't go on and on. To help the Listener keep you statements brief and to the point. Stop and let the Listener paraphrase. Allow the Listener to say in their own words what they think they've heard. If the paraphrase was not quite accurate, politely restate what was not heard the way it was intended to be heard. Your goal is to help the Listener hear and understand your point of view. RULES FOR THE LISTENER: Paraphrase what you hear. Briefly repeat back what you heard the Speaker say using your own words if you like and make sure that you understand what was said. Focus on the Speaker's message. Don't rebut. In the Listener's role, you may not offer your opinion or thoughts. Wait until you are the Speaker to make your response. As the Listener, your job is to speak only in the service of understanding your partner. Use the LDD Method – Listen, Don’t Defend RULES FOR BOTH: The Speaker has the floor. (If necessary, hold an object [like a glove, or orange] to denote your status, and pass it over when you have finished - truly finished - speaking and BEING heard to your satisfaction) Speaker keeps the floor while Listener paraphrases. Share the floor Use the LDD Method – Listen, Don’t Defend Remember this: We all want and need to be understood and appreciated by the people we love. We stay with partners that make us feel good about ourselves when we are around them. Good luck to all of you. PS: It might be useful to try this exercise with a trivial topic, and with a neutral, sensible and impartial friend as an arbiter to begin with. It takes effort and practise, but as is so often the case, the worthwhile things always do...
Author luckyinlove Posted December 30, 2007 Author Posted December 30, 2007 Mattea: When I confront him I usually do so initially calmly, or even sometimes jokingly to kind of tease him in a lighthearted way. Sometimes I'll say "hey, why didn't you call me last night...you know that really gets to me?" or, "thanks for calling yesterday", sometimes I'll see him the next day and say something sarcastic about how I didn't think he was still alive because I didn't hear from him. I guess thinking about it the sarcasm probably isn't really the best approach. But, he then gets defensive, plays the ridiculous card, and when I try to explain things he tells me I'm just making excuses to make him feel bad. When things start reaching this level I start getting upset and depending on the situation I either get emotional or angry. I never yell though, if anything I either cry or get very stern. Ultimately things always get turned around and I'm ALWAYS the one that is "wrong". ALWAYS. Example runthrough of a typical argument: What sparked this thread was an incident that happened last night. He had some friends over and we were all drinking. We were all having a great time and he ended up passing out. I tried cuddling up next to him but he wouldn't budge and I was terribly uncomfortable so I went back downstairs to hang out for awhile longer. When returning to the bedroom I realized two of his friends had played a prank on me, making it seem like he was cheating on me (in a mocking way because of a previous incidence)... being that I was slightly intoxicated I started getting emotional. Once he explained what the deal was I apologized but still felt horrible... He immediately got mad at me for being upset at first and told me I was crazy. I tried apologizing, and laid down next to him and he kept pulling away from me whenever I would touch him. So, with him taking up the majority of the bed with no real way for me to sleep comfortably, I went back downstairs to get something to eat talk with some of his friends. I finally went back upstairs and he asked if I was okay, I said "Yes, and I'm sorry I got so upset, but your friends really need to realize that that wasn't a very funny joke. It made me sad because I care about you." We fell asleep, and this morning things were okay, then all of a sudden he stands up and says "WHY WERE YOU SO MAD AT ME LAST NIGHT?!" To which I gave a confused look, and told him I wasn't mad at all... I got a little upset because of what happened but I was in no way mad at him. He started sarcasticly laughing at me, and told me that he wanted to be alone and that I need to start acting better towards him. Which, I didn't understand. I explained everything to him as it went down (He was very drunk, but I was still coherent) and told him that he must have had a different perception. He then got extremely defensive, told me he knew exactly what happened and that he did nothing wrong. He told me that I was being horrible and mad towards him all night for no reason. After saying, "Don't you remember all the mean things you were saying to me?" I just kind of laughed. I barely said anything to him because he was barely coherent. The only things I said were listed above. But, once again I was wrong. He also said that he can NEVER end a good night well with me (which is untrue, and makes me feel HORRIBLE). He insisted that I "step out and look at myself" and that I would realize how crazy I was acting. I immediately apologized, now teary eyed, explained to him what upset me, and he accused me of making excuses, getting overdramatic, blowing things up, and enjoying arguing with him. I was dumbfounded. I told him that if he thinks all of these horrible things of me all the time that he should consider whether or not he really wants to be with me, because I want to feel special, not like an inconvenience. He assured me that he loved me and that it was something small, but it's getting to not be so small anymore when it KEEPS happening. He told me he wanted to be alone, so I left and am awaiting a promised phonecall that I almost KNOW I won't be getting. I'm sick of being treated like a little kid, and not being able to get through to him. And Geisha: No, I don't think you're off at all... I would definitely agree with what you've said about relationships. because we believe that, if the other person loved us 'correctly', then they'd do what we ask, and keep us happy by complying with our wishes, desires and requests. SUBconsciously, they see this as you trying to govern their lives, and run things your way, without compromise. We expect our partners to be understanding, co-operative, and sometimes, just plain psychic! This explains things perfectly, but how to adjust that subconcious...? I still want to know if it is possible to overcome something like this, and if so how. Also, how can I deal with his arguing "style"?
Trialbyfire Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 Whoah Geisha, talk about learning to suck it up and communicating clearly. Well said!
Geishawhelk Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 This explains things perfectly, but how to adjust that subconcious...? I still want to know if it is possible to overcome something like this, and if so how. Yes. And it's all done by constructive communication, as I highlighted above. remember, they have as equal a right to be heard and understood, as you have. The Subconscious can only be adjusted if what we believe we perceive, changes for the better. It's having that 'ahaaah' lightbulb moment that adjusts the subconscious. This sometimes means communicating things in a different way, until they 'get it'.... People believe the subconscious is there to protect us. I don't believe it is. I think that it can be likened to a ferocious guard dog that has become so possessive of what it is guarding, that it will bite our hand if we try to release the object it's guarding... The secret is to distract the guard-dog.... The way to do this is to show it that there's a better option than locking the object away... You need to access the source of the belief that fuels how he behaves as he does. What is he origin of his behaviour? (I'm just giving example suggestions here, I'm not saying that this IS the way it is....) Example: How did his father treat his mother? Was he encouraged as a child to take responsibility for himself, or was everything pretty much done for him? Also, how can I deal with his arguing "style"? He argues in this way to belittle you, because in fact he knows you're right, but he feels defensive. "The best form of defence is attack" is quite a sound saying.... The only way to change his style - is - to change yours. We can only respond to what we receive. If we receive Anger and confrontation, then chances are, we'll respond likewise. If we pick our moment (neutral territory, unassociated situation) and approach the subject gently, there is more likelihood of it becoming a discussion, rather than it turning into a slanging match.... I hope that what I am contributing will be both constructive and helpful. But understand this: it's not a one-off. It means changing your perspective and communication style - for good..... it also takes practise, but it's extremely rewarding, and after a while becomes quite natural. Put it this way - if what you're doing isn't working, then obviously, you need to implement changes and try something that might.... No?
Geishawhelk Posted December 30, 2007 Posted December 30, 2007 (edited) Whoah Geisha, talk about learning to suck it up and communicating clearly. Well said! well thank you hun!! BTW...it's nearly midnight here right now, so I'm heading to 'Bed-side manor'....! I'll be back in my tomorrow, and I hope it's been of use so far.... Edited December 30, 2007 by Geishawhelk Night-night!!
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