BF is in a bad mood...

[KenzieAbsolutely]

In an idealized romantic relationship, both partners will always be perfect with each other, never snapping or projecting, always respecting each other as perfect individuals.

 

Okay, now back to reality folks!

 

It's how you both choose to deal with it that affects make or break. There will be some non-negotiables and some soft boundaries, giving leeway if and when needed.

 

this is true, but i don't think anyone has told her that her relationship isn't worth it unless it's perfect. it would just be nice if there was some balance instead of the constant "you hurt me, so then i say i'm sorry to you to avoid a break-up' bit. there's no such thing as a perfect relationship, but there does exist the idea of a relationship that contains a substantial amount understanding, respect, responsibility, accountability, and reasonable communication.

 

not to mention, no would be commenting on this at all to begin with if star didn't have these problems to post about.

[Trialbyfire]

this is true, but i don't think anyone has told her that her relationship isn't worth it unless it's perfect. it would just be nice if there was some balance instead of the constant "you hurt me, so then i say i'm sorry to you to avoid a break-up' bit. there's no such thing as a perfect relationship, but there does exist the idea of a relationship that contains a substantial amount understanding, respect, responsibility, accountability, and reasonable communication.

 

not to mention, no would be commenting on this at all to begin with if star didn't have these problems to post about.

True Kenzie. I'm not debating that there are issues that require some form of rectification. What I'm debating is the extent of rectification and the timing of it.

 

At minimum, twelve times a year, women expect men to be understanding, unless they've gone through menopause. This is a non-negotiable for most women.

 

Right now, SG's b/f is going through some major life-changing issues. We're talking about a full life change that requires an understanding partner. He's also experiencing some déja vu, in that his past partner was demanding and needy. What he fails to understand is that he is also creating a not exact, but similar situation, by pulling away when he should be seeing her as a form of support. This isn't an unusual guy thing to do. "I can handle this on my own and don't need help. Me, man." In reality, "me, boy".

 

On the other hand, SG has issues with being uncertain when to demand and when to fall back and simply support, due to not knowing what's internalized or externalized stresses.

 

These two need to learn what is a happy medium. He needs to learn to share his issues, so she doesn't internalize his irritation, as issues with her. She needs to learn to relax and realize that when he externalizes to her, unless he states it's issues with her, she needs to shrug it off and continue doing her own thing.

 

Communication!!!!!!!!!

[climbergirl]

In an idealized romantic relationship, both partners will always be perfect with each other, never snapping or projecting, always respecting each other as perfect individuals.

 

Okay, now back to reality folks!

 

It's how you both choose to deal with it that affects make or break. There will be some non-negotiables and some soft boundaries, giving leeway if and when needed.

 

I like the way you think, TBF.

 

The only thing that comes to mind to me, Star, is that you've had a pretty stressful month as well and shouldn't he be considering your feelings during this time like you've been considering his?

[Trialbyfire]

I like the way you think, TBF.

 

The only thing that comes to mind to me, Star, is that you've had a pretty stressful month as well and shouldn't he be considering your feelings during this time like you've been considering his?

Thanks climbergirl. Btw, love the sig. Oh so true.

[climbergirl]

Thanks climbergirl. Btw, love the sig. Oh so true.

 

 

Aw..thx TBF. If only I could follow that sig as a credo instead of an occasional reminder.

 

But, really, what you said is paramount to the situ. Communication is key, here. And, Star, he probably feels the same way about you as you do for him, but without putting your foot down you're setting some form of precedence on how he can react to you.

 

I'm in no way saying he's a bad guy, but your feelings matter as well.

[Star Gazer]

I had kinda hoped this thread would just die out...but oh well.

 

Really late reply here - sorry bout that! But what you have said here is so true for so many people and it is GREAT that you are realizing it! Were you an only child? Did your mom basically build her world around you or was she distant? Maybe growing up you felt a HUGE responsibility for the happiness of your mom and that is a tough burden for a little kid. Kids that grow up the center of attention (not saying that like you are spoiled but with no one else to take some of the "stuff") tend to feel they are responsible for everyones happiness and feel like no matter what they do it is not good enough.

 

Yes, I am an only child, to a single mother who was herself an only child to an almost-single parent. Interesting perspective there, Sweet.

 

That all having been said... I have some news. In essence, I gave him my heart, and he handed it right back.

 

Yesterday BF and I had plans for NYE - just a nice dinner at home and chill evening because we were to go skiing this morning. I spoke to him at noon yesterday, he said he'd call right back, but didn't. I called at 3:30 and again at 6:00. In my gut, I thought he was flaking on me, and I was livid. However, he finally called me back at 6:15 p.m. and said that he wanted to talk to me about what had been putting him in such a bad mood.

 

(Cue: foreboding music.)

 

I show up at his doorstep and am greeted with a warm smile (he honestly doesn't smile that much), a kiss, and leads me to the couch to talk. He basically comes out and says that he knows I'm falling in love with him, he can tell by my actions, but that he doesn't feel the same way...he won't allow himself to, period. He must focus on himself right now, and not allow ANYONE - me, family, other friends, etc. - have ANY influence on his career/life decisions.

 

He said, "I just cannot be in love right now, Star. I just can't. I just can't. I can't let that happen." He explained that he didn't think it would be a good idea for us to continue seeing each other romantically, but asked that we be "friends."

 

He also said that he had very strong romantic feelings for me, but that they started weakening earlier this month. (I believe this to be true, because that's about the time we were seriously talking about his future plans...at that time, I intuitively felt him pulling away from me, even before he ever manifested it in his behavior.) He said he adores me as a friend, but when it comes to "romantic feelings," he now has none. He doesn't know why those feelings disappeared, but reasoned that they likely vanished because he didn't want to experience them. I honestly took this to mean that he wasn't attracted to me anymore, which kinda creeped me out because we have a very active sex life.

 

Anyway, I told him he was a f*cking jerk for ruining my NYE, particularly given the sh*tty Christmas I had. He responded that he had forgotten that it was a holiday, and commented that this was his first Christmas and Thanksgiving he'd spent with family in 10 years, so he often forgets about the importance of holidays. I again told him he was an ********* for ruining my holiday, and for essentially leading me to believe we were building a future together.

 

Of course, I was pretty much crying my eyes out through the entire conversation. He begged me to remain "friends" with him, and asked me to stay the night so we could go skiing in the morning, and after about another hour of conversation, I agreed. I make myself a bed on his couch, he balks and asks me to sleep in his bed. So I do so. He attempts to snuggle with me. He touches my face, looks into my eyes, tries to kiss me, starts actually kissing me, is ridiculously romantic and passionate, and he's very "excited." I'm confused. I tell him, "This is not what "friends" do. I am so confused about what is happening right now." He pulls back and looks at the ceiling and says, "I have no idea what's happening right now either."

 

I tell him that what's confusing to me is that (1) he adores me as a friend, (2) clearly still very attracted to me... so why is there not "romantic feelings"? Isn't a best friend who you want to bone the epitome of the perfect relationship?

 

After pushing him off me about 5 time, we finally went to sleep. No sex, no rubbing, nothing. I was a good girl.

 

In the morning, I see him in an entirely new light. I don't know how to explain this, but I actually am more easy going with him and seeing him and what he really can offer me at this point all for what it really is. Before, I was afraid. Now, I'm not...because I'm not looking at him as though I'm about to lose the love of my life anymore, because I already lost him in that sense... I guess you could say that my rosy colored sunglasses are off.

 

We went up to Squaw and had an awesome day skiing, and now we're back at his place about to do the usual make-dinner-and-watch-a-movie. He keeps trying to be affectionate with me, and I keep pulling back and saying, "That's not what friends do." Then he pouts and I go on about doing whatever I'm doing...like typing to you guys right now rather than fawning all over him like a lost puppy dog. And this seems to have gotten his attention, because he's being more attentive and affectionate...and this was the case ALL DAY!

 

How can a guy be a complete jerk to you and make you worrry, and then break up with you, and then the next day act like nothing's ever happened?

 

WTF is going on, I have no idea. He keeps saying that I deserve someone who's able to give emotionally what he can't give to me now, and I keep agreeing with him. I'm not trying so hard to please him anymore (actually, not at all!), because in my mind, he has ended our romantic relationship. It's done.

 

But now HE seems like the one who's confused...like he's regretting our conversation last time.

 

Anyway. Happy New Year to me!

 

(I'm happy you got your way, Lishy!)

Edited January 2, 2008 by Star Gazer

[Florida]

Star-I didn't comment initially on this thread because I couldn't tell if any of it meant anything or not.

 

But I don't like this guy-he just pulled a 180 on you, and he is messing with your heart now. You felt it all along, yet I thought he would pull through and make the right choice.

 

Is this all because he is moving away? He was distancing while you were trying to stabilize with him?

[Florida]

Star-I didn't comment initially on this thread because I couldn't tell if any of it meant anything or not.

 

But I don't like this guy-he just pulled a 180 on you, and he is messing with your heart now. You felt it all along, yet I thought he would pull through and make the right choice.

 

Is this all because he is moving away? He was distancing while you were trying to stabilize with him? I would take it very seriously what he said. You are right in not being intimate with him now, sty that way. He just demoted the relationship yet still wants all the good stuff after breaking your effing heart?????

[climbergirl]

I had kinda hoped this thread would just die out...but oh well.

 

 

 

Yes, I am an only child, to a single mother who was herself an only child to an almost-single parent. Interesting perspective there, Sweet.

 

That all having been said... I have some news. In essence, I gave him my heart, and he handed it right back.

 

Yesterday BF and I had plans for NYE - just a nice dinner at home and chill evening because we were to go skiing this morning. I spoke to him at noon yesterday, he said he'd call right back, but didn't. I called at 3:30 and again at 6:00. In my gut, I thought he was flaking on me, and I was livid. However, he finally called me back at 6:15 p.m. and said that he wanted to talk to me about what had been putting him in such a bad mood.

 

(Cue: foreboding music.)

 

I show up at his doorstep and am greeted with a warm smile (he honestly doesn't smile that much), a kiss, and leads me to the couch to talk. He basically comes out and says that he knows I'm falling in love with him, he can tell by my actions, but that he doesn't feel the same way...he won't allow himself to, period. He must focus on himself right now, and not allow ANYONE - me, family, other friends, etc. - have ANY influence on his career/life decisions.

 

He said, "I just cannot be in love right now, Star. I just can't. I just can't. I can't let that happen." He explained that he didn't think it would be a good idea for us to continue seeing each other romantically, but asked that we be "friends."

 

He also said that he had very strong romantic feelings for me, but that they started weakening earlier this month. (I believe this to be true, because that's about the time we were seriously talking about his future plans...at that time, I intuitively felt him pulling away from me, even before he ever manifested it in his behavior.) He said he adores me as a friend, but when it comes to "romantic feelings," he now has none. He doesn't know why those feelings disappeared, but reasoned that they likely vanished because he didn't want to experience them. I honestly took this to mean that he wasn't attracted to me anymore, which kinda creeped me out because we have a very active sex life.

 

Anyway, I told him he was a f*cking jerk for ruining my NYE, particularly given the sh*tty Christmas I had. He responded that he had forgotten that it was a holiday, and commented that this was his first Christmas and Thanksgiving he'd spent with family in 10 years, so he often forgets about the importance of holidays. I again told him he was an ********* for ruining my holiday, and for essentially leading me to believe we were building a future together.

 

Of course, I was pretty much crying my eyes out through the entire conversation. He begged me to remain "friends" with him, and asked me to stay the night so we could go skiing in the morning, and after about another hour of conversation, I agreed. I make myself a bed on his couch, he balks and asks me to sleep in his bed. So I do so. He attempts to snuggle with me. He touches my face, looks into my eyes, tries to kiss me, starts actually kissing me, is ridiculously romantic and passionate, and he's very "excited." I'm confused. I tell him, "This is not what "friends" do. I am so confused about what is happening right now." He pulls back and looks at the ceiling and says, "I have no idea what's happening right now either."

 

I tell him that what's confusing to me is that (1) he adores me as a friend, (2) clearly still very attracted to me... so why is there not "romantic feelings"? Isn't a best friend who you want to bone the epitome of the perfect relationship?

 

After pushing him off me about 5 time, we finally went to sleep. No sex, no rubbing, nothing. I was a good girl.

 

In the morning, I see him in an entirely new light. I don't know how to explain this, but I actually am more easy going with him and seeing him and what he really can offer me at this point all for what it really is. Before, I was afraid. Now, I'm not...because I'm not looking at him as though I'm about to lose the love of my life anymore, because I already lost him in that sense... I guess you could say that my rosy colored sunglasses are off.

 

We went up to Squaw and had an awesome day skiing, and now we're back at his place about to do the usual make-dinner-and-watch-a-movie. He keeps trying to be affectionate with me, and I keep pulling back and saying, "That's not what friends do." Then he pouts and I go on about doing whatever I'm doing...like typing to you guys right now rather than fawning all over him like a lost puppy dog. And this seems to have gotten his attention, because he's being more attentive and affectionate...and this was the case ALL DAY!

 

How can a guy be a complete jerk to you and make you worrry, and then break up with you, and then the next day act like nothing's ever happened?

 

WTF is going on, I have no idea. He keeps saying that I deserve someone who's able to give emotionally what he can't give to me now, and I keep agreeing with him. I'm not trying so hard to please him anymore (actually, not at all!), because in my mind, he has ended our romantic relationship. It's done.

 

But now HE seems like the one who's confused...like he's regretting our conversation last time.

 

Anyway. Happy New Year to me!

 

(I'm happy you got your way, Lishy!)

 

Oh sweetie I'm sorry you're going through this but...

 

just know that he's confused. Back off for awhile. I'm not saying it will be all better in the long run, but he's going through something that makes him incapable of having a solid relationship with anyone.

 

I've been through this recently and it's been from his perspective. I just can't get involved. I honestly think him telling you is a good sign that he's honest about how he feels. But if he's not at that point, I respect that about him that he doesn't want to hurt you.

 

I'm so sorry that you're hurting, though.

[Krytie TV]

Does this mean, Star, that you two are still pursuing a relationship together? I can't tell. If not, why are you doing dinner and a movie with him?

[Trialbyfire]

Sorry to hear this SG. Another push/puller. What the hell is wrong with some guys?

[Ariadne]

Wow,

 

What a mess.

 

You know, now that I have started to like you, I feel bad for you.

 

(even though I want everyone to break up etc).

 

I guess BlueEyedGirl got it right here:

 

This relationship was doomed from when he said "I need space from you today". I would give odds of this all working out as similar to winning the lottery.

 

Well, I don't even know what to tell you.

 

Hope the New Year brings better things your way, at least you had some good moments with him.

 

It was too complicated anyway, with his job etc.

 

(This is another thing I don't understand. SG seems awesome to me. She's nice, she's smart, and she's beautiful. Things are so weird sometimes).

 

Ariadne

[climbergirl]

Wow,

 

What a mess.

 

You know, now that I have started to like you, I feel bad for you.

 

(even though I want everyone to break up etc).

 

I guess BlueEyedGirl got it right here:

 

 

 

Well, I don't even know what to tell you.

 

Hope the New Year brings better things your way, at least you had some good moments with him.

 

It was too complicated anyway, with his job etc.

 

(This is another thing I don't understand. SG seems awesome to me. She's nice, she's smart, and she's beautiful. Things are so weird sometimes).

 

Ariadne

 

 

I agree with everything you're saying. But it's not her from what i've read, it's all him.

[Ariadne]

I agree with everything you're saying. But it's not her from what i've read, it's all him.

 

Proabably.

 

But what I mean is that guys should be kissing her feet or something. But no.

 

She's nice, cooks for him, treats him lovingly, thinks of moving wherever he goes, and she gets dumped.

[norajane]

His first Thanksgiving and Christmas with his family in 10 years? And now he can't allow himself to fall in love you?

 

I guess he's in the right line of work, then, the kind that keeps him from forming any lasting attachments.

 

I'm sorry, Star. Do listen to what he's telling you, though:

He keeps saying that I deserve someone who's able to give emotionally what he can't give to me now

 

When a guy tells you who he is, pay attention. Ultimately, that inability or resistance to giving emotionally IS at his core. Whether it's because of his career or something else, that's the kind of guy he is. He won't give you what you deserve and what you want out of life.

 

And, I think you know, it's better for you to make the decision to walk away from this 'friendship' thing. It won't work for you because you want so much more, so it will hurt you more in the long run to hang around hoping he changes his mind, rather than CHOOSING to walk away.

[Trialbyfire]

Proabably.

 

But what I mean is that guys should be kissing her feet or something. But no.

 

She's nice, cooks for him, treats him lovingly, thinks of moving wherever he goes, and she gets dumped.

 

He must focus on himself right now, and not allow ANYONE - me, family, other friends, etc. - have ANY influence on his career/life decisions.

 

Ariadne, he's determined to make his decisions by himself.

[Krytie TV]

But what I mean is that guys should be kissing her feet or something. But no.

 

No offense to Star, but this should never be the case... unless the guy wants to be taken advantage of.

[Ariadne]

Ariadne, he's determined to make his decisions by himself.

 

I know but, how can he not love her?

 

As she said: (1) he adores me as a friend, (2) clearly still very attracted to me... so why is there not "romantic feelings"? Isn't a best friend who you want to bone the epitome of the perfect relationship?

 

And if he does, where does the love go?

[Krytie TV]

I know but, how can he not love her?

 

As she said: (1) he adores me as a friend, (2) clearly still very attracted to me... so why is there not "romantic feelings"? Isn't a best friend who you want to bone the epitome of the perfect relationship?

 

And if he does, where does the love go?

 

Maybe the love was never truly there. Some people, by upbringing or otherwise, are just not predisposed to feeling it. I had a small suspicion that could be the case here, and obviously will never really know. Maybe as the pressure became more for him in the relationship sense he just realized/decided that he needed to fess up and let her know. Maybe it was just too much to carry it on any longer when there aren't feelings. Tough to say.

[Trialbyfire]

I know but, how can he not love her?

 

As she said: (1) he adores me as a friend, (2) clearly still very attracted to me... so why is there not "romantic feelings"? Isn't a best friend who you want to bone the epitome of the perfect relationship?

 

And if he does, where does the love go?

I would say he does have romantic feelings for her but chooses not to address them. In essence, he's compartmentalized her, so he's able to make his own decision.

 

I can do this too but I'm a lot more cut and dried. If I've done this, it's over. No more contact.

 

He's not completely able to let her go. SG's withdrawal is a good thing in that it makes him begin to realize what he's giving up. If I were SG, I would withdraw all the way, enough to make his head spin.

[underpants]

If I were SG, I would withdraw all the way, enough to make his head spin.

 

Now we are talking...

 

Girl,

 

Time to spin some things.

 

Shine on you crazy diamond.

[Ariadne]

Maybe the love was never truly there. Some people, by upbringing or otherwise, are just not predisposed to feeling it.

 

No, I don't believe that.

[Ariadne]

I would say he does have romantic feelings for her but chooses not to address them. In essence, he's compartmentalized her, so he's able to make his own decision.

 

So where does the love go? It just dies?

[johan]

The withdrawal method is almost as risky as doing nothing at all.

 

Sorry to hear this happened, Star. It's good that you've been able to put your emotions back in the box. That's probably why he feels more comfortable with you now. Because without all that love hanging over things, he has an easier time dealing with things. The reason he was snapping at you was just due to his guilt for all that. Now he's got that off his chest.

 

There's a guy out there for you.

[Trialbyfire]

So where does the love go? It just dies?

Think of it as a little germinating seed. If you don't feed it, it will die.