Salvagable?

[oppath]

I gotta tell ya, Oppath, you're still off the mark here.

 

And you are the only one who seems to feel that things were moving too fast out of the bedroom. That pace was perfectly fine for both of us, and your comment is purely your judgment, but it is also not applicable to us. We were both enjoying the frequent contact, and if it hadn't of been for the holiday, we would have seen each other sooner than the weekend. That was not a problem.

 

I can't have feelings for someone after 2 dates. All I can do is like them. Nothing antiseptic about that, as my defintion of feelings means strong emotions, and I don't think it is reasonable to have strong emotions so soon. I think more reasonable is strong hopes. And while talking every day may seem fine for you, who knows: he felt like you were mad at him and that he did something wrong. Perhaps he was thinking "we have been talking a lot right away. Maybe we should move a little more slowly and take our time getting to know each other." Maybe he wanted to slow things down a little. I am just asking...is there a chance he felt that way? A possiblity?

[shadowplay]

No, I was not placing all the blame on him at all. I said in my last post that his insecurities fueled mine. It was shared responsibility for sure.

 

And I didn't write him not to bother. I think most interested guys would have stepped up to say I had read his distance wrong, that he was still interested, but was trying to give me space. At this point, I would be fair in thinking he went MIA because he didn't get laid. I think HIS reaction was extreme and out of line and that HE misread me entirely. And I still think you are misreading what happened between us. Not wanting to screw was not a big deal. We had no drama over it, and continued to cuddle and talk.

 

 

Not true. I think most guys, interested or not, would be taken aback by your text, and decide they just don't want to deal with a messy and potentially (from his perspective) hopeless situation. Guys aren't good communicators and often take the path of least resistance. Don't ever "test" a guy and then wait for him to come running to you because it won't happen. I think you were testing him and hoping he would step up to the plate, which was the wrong move.

[Jilly Bean]

Sorry, that's entirely wrong. How was I testing him? I just didn't expect an abrupt change in behavior. There was no testing...

 

I do feel, though, the right guy never plays games like this and the right guy has never stressed me out to this degree. I have to take it all as a bad sign of things to come. I have to remember this is a man who told me he used to dismiss women if they wore the wrong nail polish color. I have to think this whole mess happened because it is the Universe's way of protecting me from a hopeless situation...

 

Oppath - feelings = LIKE. There was no stronger intention than that. I think you are misinterpreting my wording of FEELINGS. Feelings does not mean love. It is semantics on this one...

 

And no, there was no possibility he thought that. And if he did, it was his doing. I actually never called him once. He would call me at least once a day, often multiple times a day, so he was the one setting the pace. He also would send me random texts. I never initiated any of our communication.

 

Regardless guys, I really appreciate the comments, but I am done with him. We have been communicating tonight, and he seems to feel that he did absolutely nothing wrong and did not give me one reason or explanation for why he stopped calling me. He has not offered that he thought I was mad at him, or that he wanted to give me space, etc. NOTHING. Except to say that I have started behaving "strangely". lol. Which is fair, since once I get a bee in my bonnet, I have to get it out. And for some reason, tonight was the night I needed to try and have some resolution. His messages convey that he is either mad at me NOW, but also that he trying to turn this around on me entirely. Which is OK.

 

This honestly is all very new to me. I have always been in long relationships, and haven't done a ton of casual dating. I did date someone recently who was kind of like this guy. He started out nice and sweet, then started blowing off dates, phone calls, etc., which of course made me a little uneasy. I really feel like the guys who complain that women are crazy are the ones who DO the things that make women crazy. I am not used to this kind of drama and games, I'm really not.

[shadowplay]

I stand by my assertion that you were testing him.

[Trialbyfire]

Chill Jill.

 

We're talking about date #2, with a little messing around at the end. Try not to project your past experiences to this guy. He barely knows you and you barely know him.

 

Relax.

[gonetildecember]

Hi Jilly. (I missed a lot today)

 

Are you still talking to him?

 

Did he initiate the texts or did you?

 

I really think that it can be summed up as a misunderstanding. I don't think that his lack of calling the next day should have been attributed to him not getting sex fast enough (Think about it, when you said you wanted to top he backed off, you cuddled, the he thought YOU were mad at him) And the fact that he hung around long enough to hug you and kiss you goodnight, and then again asked how you felt to me says he was more interested in you than in sex.

 

I think he was just giving you some time, and thought maybe he would wait to see how you felt the next day since you kept going on about being upset about the situation and being mad at yourself for it.

 

Then when he got that first test which right off the bat said that you understood that he wasn't interested and you would leave him alone, he was just kinda SHOCKED.. because I'm sure he was still interested.

 

Even with the texts that u mentionned today, you're still assuming that's how he felt. Let him tell you what he was thinking. I don't think you have to apologize like someone else mentionned, but I really don't think his intentions were as bad as you thought. (I think he was still interested- which is confirmed by the fact that he's still texting you- if he was done with it, he would just ignore you all together and move on)

[Jilly Bean]

Well Gone, he told me tonight via text that he would have called me, and he didnt not because I didnt put out, but because of my response and behaving strangely. I think he was referring to SAT night. So, he was saying that he really HAD no intention of calling me again after SAT night.

 

So, I don't think he was interested past SAT night, if I interpret his text correctly.

 

Honestly, there was NO drama on SAT. Except for me wanting to stop fooling around, which, I strongly suspect he processed as fierce rejection, and is now projecting it on me. And granted, me pulling away happened during an act that was being performed on him...

 

Gone, I think that he has NO intention of telling me how he feels. His texts were pretty terse and basically conveyed nothing. He had no answer for why he never called again, except to say he thought my text was a joke and was going to call me, but didnt because of my response (so, perhaps he meant to the text message). I told him that he had done a 180 and that pulling away confirmed my fears that fooling around would ruin things, blah blah.

 

I just think right now he thinks Im a total nut job.

[gonetildecember]

Did he specifically say he wouldn't have called you after Saturday (as in not wanting to pursue you again) or did he mean it as he wouldn't initiate calls (waiting to hear from you first) because of your strange reaction SAT night?

 

I don't thik that it was only that he saw it as rejection, but maybe more that it was SUCH a big deal to you. Ok so yeah you said you didn't want to go too fast physically, but things went a little faster (not because of him or you- just because).. I guess he was just expecting you to say ok.. it happened...and not get as upset/mad at yourself over it. (i guess it also didn't help that you kinda had ur little freak out during an act)

 

I know when these things happen it goes like 7 million times slower in our minds.. but like.. there was basically one full day of no contact.. yeah ur used to hearing from him daily.. but u had just had a date.. one in which YOU also pulled away.. so to tell you the truth i can understand why he didn't call right away sunday. And I'm sure he works or does something during the day, so maybe he was going to call you when he was done with his stuff on Monday. AND THEN HE GOT YOUR TEXTS.. which would have made me think...OKAY.. where the hell did that come from.. He was prob just confused. The tenseness in his texts now is probably him walking on eggshelves because the texts you've metionned come across liek you already know how things are and how they are going to end.... so to him its like okay.. why even try.

 

How did you guys leave things?

[Jilly Bean]

I have no idea what he meant - he was not totally forthcoming.

 

And I can't say this enough. THERE WAS NO DRAMA on SAT night. There was no big hairy deal of me over-reacting. The truth of what happened, if it sheds some light, is that we were cuddling, which was nice. He took my hand down his pants, and pretty much demanding a HJ (im trying not to break rules of posting here, so bear with me in the wording- lol). I was REALLY not into it, because again, I did not want to cross those lines with him, and he knew it. So, I thought fine, let me get this over with and well be done. Well, he sensed I was not very into it, mainly when he asked if he could release on a part of my body (er, no...). I think told him it all wasn't feeling right. He then brushed my hand away from his unit, and said, "well, get off of it then." We then dozed a while, then he said he was going to go since his snoring was keeping us both up. He then said I must be aggravated with him. I said no, I was mad at myself for crossing lines I didn't want to, and you know the rest from there.

 

So, it wasn't that it was SUCH a big deal to me, but it was a big deal to HIM, since he knew he pushed me where I didn't want to go. That is why he kept asking if I was mad at him. It was late, I was tired, and I just wanted to not have to deal with him continuing to ask me if I was pissed at him.

 

So, I DID NOT have a freak out during the act. I was put in a situation that I did not want to be in, and told him so. End of story. No freak out, no big screaming match. It was more like a HS back seat experience where the guy is pissed because he doesnt get off, and the girl feels guilty about getting him excited. Then he feels guilty for being so pushy and then turns it around on her.

 

We did not have one date, it was our second date. And though we knew each other for only two weeks, there was a ton of contact during that time.

 

And yes he has a job, but it also had it for the past two weeks - lol. He had no problem contacting me many times a day beforehand.

 

Honestly, the more I think about it, I think he felt like a heel for being so pushy sexually, and then decided to turn it around on me because I was mad he stopped calling entirely. After his texts tonight, it's almost like he was looking for a reason to say he was justified in not calling me for two days.

[Star Gazer]

I agree with Shadow, Oppath, and TBF.

[oppath]

And no, there was no possibility he thought that. And if he did, it was his doing. I actually never called him once. He would call me at least once a day, often multiple times a day, so he was the one setting the pace. He also would send me random texts. I never initiated any of our communication.

 

I actually have a 3 date rule. If the woman has not contacted me of her own volition after date 3, there probably won't be another date. A simple "thanks, I had fun last night" text or email goes a long way. Why is this a rule? My best, most intense relationships, it happened automatically, usually the woman emailing me the night of our first date saying "I had an incredible time." I've also dated women for weeks and they never took the initiative. It's not much of an investment on the woman's end to say "I had fun last night." Why do I bring this up?

 

I really do think that he would have called you again after another day or so. He was initiating all of the contact with you. Things get sexual. You tell him "this is too soon, I don't know you well enough. We are rushing into sex." No doubt in my mind, he felt like he had moved EVERYTHING too fast. I would feel that way in that situation. He probably was reflecting: "I've been calling this woman every day. Things are moving too fast for her. I'll slow down." You did basically tell him "obviously you lost interest so don't bother." I'd feel really rejected as a guy in that situation and not want to bother.

 

If you are new to casual dating, you will be treated far, far worse than this guy, and I bet you treat a guy or two pretty poorly yourself. We all do it. None of us are perfect. We all flake or act with a lack of integrity when there is not a history established with someone or we feel ambivalent. It's a disappointing part of dating, but it is important to have that perspective. This guy really did not do anything wrong. If I were him I would be saying "so what. You have NEVER called me. I call you, I take you out, and you want to slow things down, so I did. If you wanted to talk to me, you could have called me yourself. Why do I always have to be the one that calls?" Consider his perspective just a little. The best way to get him to see yours is to consider his and acknowledge his. Why? Because it disarms him. It validates him. In any argument, that is a surefire strategy to break ground.

 

Does this post make me callous? Sure, I'm callous. But I've dated enough women who never called, and while I don't expect the woman to put forth 50/50 effort, I do expect 70/30.

 

I do understand how and why you feel this way, and it would have been nice if he had called, it would have shown sensitivity. But it is an irrational conclusion to think "he hasn't called like usual, therefore, he only wanted sex." There are several other possibilities, and casual dating will be reif with disappointing experiences if you read minds and jumps to conclusions. I'm not saying this to be mean or argumentative, I am saying it because I have been there as a guy, me usually being the one who wanted more commitment. I'll go on 7 dates with a woman and they'll disappear. Drop off the face of the earth. I've seen it all, and it is disappointing, but what this guy did is nothing. You will experience much worse, and I don't doubt you treat some guy poorly too. We all do it. It's part of dating and dealing with conflicts and communication with people we don't know well.

[Jilly Bean]

Well, if that were true, Oppath, then at ANY time he could have vocalized this. And I agree he has a perspective on this. But as he wrote me tonight that he doesn't appreciate someone telling him how he feels, he still wasn't going to step up and TELL me. Even as a gesture of closure, he was not willing to have an adult convo on what happened (I'm good for a post-mortem - lol).

 

You need to also understand he is a deeply insecure person. At the end of our first date, he asked if I wanted to get together again, and joking, I said no way, and he took it seriously. I wrote him the next day, and he called me, and admitted he was not going to contact me, because he wasn't sure what I felt. He also said it was awesome that I contacted him (OK, I guess I DID initiate one contact! lol), as being a guy, its nice for him to not have to wonder and have me make a move once in a while. When we were out on SAT night, he made mention of a table of men who were checking me out. I suppose it bears some mention that I had a very long and successful modeling career, and still do well with it. He is honestly probably the least attractive man I have ever dated (not that I really cared), and I wonder if that weighed on him.

 

I am not convinced he would have called me again. After our exchange tonight, part of me feels like he knew he was wrong in being so pushy sexually (honestly, I haven't had a guy beg for a HJ like that since I was 15) and I think getting shot down and knowing I was NOT into it really affected him. You have to understand that THIS was the sexual boundary that was crossed that I was not happy with. It was the one that he forced and created. It did not occur from me wanting to go there and then pulling back when it seemed like a bad idea. Everything else that transpired, happened naturally and was nice. This, however, was a little date-rapish in ways. I mean, I have never had a guy need to direct me to where he wants me to go, as I am already there! lol. So, I kind of feel that now he is projecting this back on me, as if to say that because I sent those texts, he doesnt want to communicate anymore, rather than admit that he crossed a line and he knew it.

[mishy]

Geez Jilly Bean, you've gone through hell over this guy. And he's probably barely given it all a second thought, apart from thinking you have been acting "strangely".

 

Guys just dont understand what "not contacting" a girl actually does to her....

[Trialbyfire]

Is this where I step in and yell "Will all you conflict-adverse, noncommunicating men please step down from the podium?".

[Jilly Bean]

Mishy - true dat, girl!

 

Trial - I don't see anyone on the podium, do you?

 

Yes, I have gone through a bit of an ordeal, but at least now it's over. It's pretty clear he was not up for having a rational discussion. His messages tonight belie a man who knows he has done wrong (pushing the HJ) so then he becomes defensive and strikes out to blame the demise on my text messages and "acting strangely".

 

Whatever, really. When I do retrace the root of me not wanting to continue on sexually, it was not anything I initiated, it was him behaving like a 16-year old and forcing my hand down his pants. I know, I know, whats a hand job between friends, right? But I really think he felt remorse for that the next day, and NOT because of me not wanting to give him full release (ha!) but because he knows acting like that makes him out to be a Class-A jerk.

 

What WAS I thinking?

 

Once again, I think the Universe makes these things happen for a reason. Remember, wrong color nail polish - dismissed. No happy ending for forced hand job - also dismissed. Oh, and with the label of being nuts thrown in. lol

[gonetildecember]

Well, if that were true, Oppath, then at ANY time he could have vocalized this. And I agree he has a perspective on this. But as he wrote me tonight that he doesn't appreciate someone telling him how he feels, he still wasn't going to step up and TELL me. Even as a gesture of closure, he was not willing to have an adult convo on what happened (I'm good for a post-mortem - lol).

 

You need to also understand he is a deeply insecure person. At the end of our first date, he asked if I wanted to get together again, and joking, I said no way, and he took it seriously. I wrote him the next day, and he called me, and admitted he was not going to contact me, because he wasn't sure what I felt. He also said it was awesome that I contacted him (OK, I guess I DID initiate one contact! lol), as being a guy, its nice for him to not have to wonder and have me make a move once in a while. When we were out on SAT night, he made mention of a table of men who were checking me out. I suppose it bears some mention that I had a very long and successful modeling career, and still do well with it. He is honestly probably the least attractive man I have ever dated (not that I really cared), and I wonder if that weighed on him.

 

I am not convinced he would have called me again. After our exchange tonight, part of me feels like he knew he was wrong in being so pushy sexually (honestly, I haven't had a guy beg for a HJ like that since I was 15) and I think getting shot down and knowing I was NOT into it really affected him. You have to understand that THIS was the sexual boundary that was crossed that I was not happy with. It was the one that he forced and created. It did not occur from me wanting to go there and then pulling back when it seemed like a bad idea. Everything else that transpired, happened naturally and was nice. This, however, was a little date-rapish in ways. I mean, I have never had a guy need to direct me to where he wants me to go, as I am already there! lol. So, I kind of feel that now he is projecting this back on me, as if to say that because I sent those texts, he doesnt want to communicate anymore, rather than admit that he crossed a line and he knew it.

 

 

To me , him telling you he did not like you telling him what he was feeling was him telling you what he was feeling. Many men are non-confrontational, so he wouldn't bring up other issues, but would deal with the one that you were addressing (him not calling- instead of gettig into why or why not)

 

Also, you said that he is very insecure...hence the reason maybe he was waiting for YOU to call him..seeing as you were the one who was upset (didn't freak out, but was upset) about how things had gone down. He asked you several times if you were mad at him, so maybe he was just waiting for the go ahead again from you.

 

Date rapish? If that is really how you feel you shouldn't have even wanted to pursue anything after than night with him. Thats not a situation any woman should have to go through. But if at first you thought what the hell, then half way thru you changed your mind.. I can see how he could be feeling insecure and maybe a little nervous about calling because maybe he felt you blamed him for forcing him into it. Just a thought, if you really think he forced, you shouldn't want any contact with him at all.

[Jilly Bean]

No, he didn't really force me into it like I was pinned down kicking forced. I was going to comply because 1) I was dog tired and as women, we all know sometimes we have to throw one out for them so we can get some sleep - lol) 2) I figured it would be quick and it's not like it's territory I haven't been in thousands of times before. This was more like he really pushed for it, and I was clearly NOT into it.

 

So yeah, I am sure he knew I was upset. What was I upset over? Him pushing for the hand job when I said over and over I did not want to go there. Why did he keep asking if I was mad? Because he knew he crossed a line and screwed up and was fearing that he had really blown it.

 

And you're right - perhaps he was waiting for a green light. Because he knew he was out of line in getting me upset to begin with! When my first contact was to let him know I was pissed he hadn't called me, he decided to take the other stance, and claim that he's not calling because of how I responded in the texts. Which is bunk, really.

 

I think if he hadn't of had the guilt he had, then he would have been a lot more forthcoming. But to be forcing yourself sexually on a woman you like and are dating, then to get smacked down for it, and see how she was not happy about it, he chose to not step up. I grew up in a household with men who would never take responsibility for their actions, and when called out on it, they would try and invalidate me. He kinda did the same thing by refusing to acknowledge why he never called again. It's like, honey, I just screwed your sister. Why are you acting so nutty? lol

[nicki]

If he forced your hand down his pants and everything went down the way you said it did, I can understand why you felt vulnerable and afraid. Good for you for stopping when you did. You ALWAYS have that right.

 

I wonder, though, if it is possible that he was simply reacting passionately to the moment and placed your hand down his pants,hoping that you would want to do that, too?

 

I don't think if things are getting a little out of hand it is necessary a date rapish situation. It becomes a date rape scenario if you say no or push him away and he keeps going (or if you are obviously drunk and can't say no)....maybe he did that and you already said it before, so I apologize if that's the case.

 

Anyway, I'm glad he noticed you weren't into it. I wish you hadn't felt like you had to continue on if you didn't want to do it. You didn't have to wait for him to say something. The minute you didn't want to do it you could have stopped. You didn't owe him anything.

 

As for "throwing one out so we can get some sleep," I think that's very sad. Maybe true for old married couples once in a while, but not for new relationships. Again, don't do anything sexually YOU don't want to do, ever.

 

I know you know that, but I feel like there may be an undercurrent of feeling like you don't have much personal power in these situations. BUT you do. You can act to take care of yourself first.

 

You don't need people to validate what you know is going on. It would be nice, yes, but, it's enough that you know and call it as you see it. It doesn't make it any more reality just because he says it is so. It's enough that you say it is so. And it's a good idea to look at from all possible angles, too.

 

Of course, a guy in a relationship needs to have clear sight and be on the same page as you, but that's different. I grew up much the way you did, and I had a hard time telling the difference on that one.

 

For me, it helped for me to focus on myself and what was going on internally. Instead of telling the guy how HE feels, why don't you try more to talk about how YOU feel and then see what he says. Or even a simple "I don't understand what was going through your head about that" is good. That should get him talking to explain what was going through his head.

 

I've been with pushy guys before who were insensitive to my slower speed. Maybe that's this guy. You are better off losing him, in that case.

 

Anyway, it's a good opportunity to learn more about yourself and about where you might be stuck or where you need to speak up. It's better to be clumsy and do something like share your feelings, than to not do it at all. So what if one relationship gets burned in the process. It's more important that you take care of yourself. In learning to do that, sometimes you will over-react and under-react. That's okay. You'll land in the middle.

 

I know I did, but it took a long time and several relationships.

 

But, even with all this introspection, it could still simply be a matter of insecurities on both sides messing things up. Happens all the time! Just be good to yourself.

[Jilly Bean]

Hi, Nicki, thanks.

 

When I said "throw one out for them", I meant that like this. In all of my long-term relationships, there comes that time when my partner would want sex, and I wouldn't (and vice versa)! and I would let him (or he would let me) do what we need to do. There wasn't a ton of passion involved, it was more like a "courtesy", if you will - lol. Desires don't always match in relationships, and in my healthier ones, we had no problem being "less involved" than normal in order to please our partners. That's what that meant.

 

Yes, perhaps date rapish was too strong. I guess because I have never had to have a guy demand anything from me sexually, that it was an odd energy for me. I am a super sexual person and am pretty assertive in bed, so that had never happened to me. I think he was feeling frustrated from being excited for hours, and just wanted some relief. I wouldn't say his move came at a time when there was a ton of passion - we were pretty much cuddling and dozing at this point. I just think he needed the release. Which made it ALL the more impersonal to me, which is what I was trying to avoid from the get-go!

 

The real irony of this whole thing and what is making my friends grin because of the irony, is that I am so sexual, and I have NO problem having sex on the first, or second date. I have always gone with my passions, which do run high, and I have never thought twice at the time about NOT being sexual when I felt like it. Some of these guys worked out, but many more DID NOT. So, I thought I should try a different tactic, and NOT get into bed too soon. It's just so funny to me that the first time in my life I decide to make a life change to better my relationships, it completely blows up on me. Part of me thinks if we had banged it out large, then I wouldn't be on the board...

 

I think his final reactions to me, which came last night in text messages, seemed to have a lot of anger. Which I think is displaced. I think the reason he stopped calling is because he knew he was out of line in forcing the HJ, and that is why he kept asking me if I was mad at him that night. I think it's why he went MIA, because he was NOT giving me space, he was waiting to see how I reacted to what he did. When we were messaging last night, he never once explained why he stopped calling, he only said that since I sent those messages, I had started "behaving strangely". I had told him last night I had wanted to wait because I thought with him it would be special, and that when I didn't hear from him which was not like him, I assumed he moved on and had lost interest. And he refused to acknowledge any of this. So, his final reactions seem out of sorts to me. There were many openings for him last night, and he took none of them, except to somehow passive aggressively blame me for the demise.

 

A learning experience for sure, but I have to think he was the wrong guy on a lot of levels.

[nicki]

Yeah, it sounds like a miss with him.

 

It sounds like the emotional charge is mostly gone from the situation, and that you've had a chance to put things in the right place in your mind.

 

I think you were smart taking things slowly in the sex department. Next time, just don't go to his apartment until you are sure you want to get intimate.

 

I, too, am passionate and love sex. I swear guys know it, even if you want to take things slowly. I even had one guy who pushed for sex on the first date, saying "I know you are a freak. You are so sensual in everything you do. Come on, lets eff. " What the heck? Nice manners, dude. Next.

 

Anyway, glad you are feeling better....

[Jilly Bean]

Yes, thank you Nicki, MUCH SO! I think I got it all out of my system last night when I had a (tiny) confrontation with him over text. That, combined with my eventual epiphany of WHY he went MIA and how I was internalizing more than my fair share of blame contributed to make me see how things got off track.

 

Agreed on the sex thing. I think if the wine hadn't lowered my inhibitions so much, I would have rethought taking him to bed at all. It was totally impaired judgment on my part. However, he was still wrong in "trying to get a piece" when he knew how I felt about it. Until that moment, we hadn't crossed lines that made me upset. I suppose I was not only mad at myself for being foolish enough to put both of us in that situation, and also at him for taking advantage of it. A shared responsibility for sure.

 

I don't think it speaks volumes about his character, but I do think how he managed it afterwards sure did. But, I suppose few men would call the next day to say, "hey, about last night? I was a jerk, and I think I pushed you where you said you didn't want to go, and I really apologize. I had been drinking, I was super turned on, but still no excuse for being an *******. I hope you're OK and we can get past it, as I do really like you and want to continue to get to know you."

 

And as mentioned earlier, I really do think his guilt was what was behind him not contacting me for 2 days. It wasn't about the space, it was about him feeling remorseful, and not sure how he could, or even should, try to remedy it. I think he was waiting to hear from me, and when I did, and blasted him for not contacting me, he thought I was pretty mad and decided to transfer his own feelings on his behavior to be my fault, and blame the end of things on me and my crazy text messages...

 

Thanks for checking in.

 

Oh, P.S. That guy you went out with? I hope you slapped him or dropped him ASAP!

[Racquel Colette]

A guy who really is into you will not back off just because you have said you wanted to slow down sexually. If he really cares about you, he will still ask you out, he will let the relationship simply not get too sexual too soon. You can still pursue a relationship without having sex. This doesn't mean putting all the romantic moves on the woman, either. You can get close, hold hands, have conversations and dates and get to know each other better without having sex and a guy who cares about you will realize this and let the sexual aspect develop naturally after letting the relationship develop.

[melodymatters]

Ok, I admit by page four I was skimming, but my end game conclusion is the same. I am single and 40 now, with three relatively LTR's in my 30's until now, and one thing i CAN say, is that if ANY of them put my hand down their pants, they would have been " disqualified" asap.

 

Instead, my experience was that the guys were really taken with me and ALL of them left it TOTALLY up to me, when, where, and how far we'd go.

 

Sometimes it was sooner, sometimes, later, but I knew it was never sexually based only.

 

Long and short of it is Jilly, I think you we're blessed by avoiding a longer term relationship with an immature guy !

 

Stick with your instincts, and better luck next time !

 

( jeez, a 37 yr old, initiating a HJ with a 42 yr old, kinda embarassing imo !)

[Jilly Bean]

Yep, Mel, I am with you. NO ONE has EVER tried that with me. It was pretty desperate and pathetic on his part, and I am sure that is why he went MIA. Cowering in his embarrassment somewhere - lol.

 

I think I was forgetting the whole where and how of why I pulled back sexually and how impactful it really was to the story, because you know how it is when you have been dating someone for a bit, and you are a little emotionally invested, so it takes time for those positive feelings towards the person to be superceded by their jackass behavior. Luckily they did meld...

 

Yep, dodged the bullet with him. And you just KNOW he will be back...they always are, right?

[phoensam]

And I am 42. And still a mess - lol.

 

Pity, I really liked him. But I am sure he is long gone.

 

Did you hear from him again??