OWs: Why is your MM cheating on his W with you??

[reboot]

If you don't allow for the questioning OW to listen to any point of view but your own, you may be doing them a HUGE disservice.

See, I really don't get this. As I just posted in another thread, I DO understand there ARE a few truely bitter people here that don't offer much that is useful. But this idea that giving people nothing more than validation is to be preferred over giving them something that could lead to their own self-preservation is absolutely daft.

[White Flower]

Flower, my mouth dropped open when I read this. I was wondering if anyone else observed the same thing about their MM!! I remember this strongly with my exMM... and I see it coming with my potential MM and it's stopping me in my tracks. Interesting that both of them were so irritated with their W's... but I know that would be turned around on me, in time. I have also read the male perspective in some threads here (can't remember which ones), that "the devil you know is better than the devil you don't", and that's why they're reluctant to leave their W and take up with the OW.

Yes, I think about it a lot. MM and I have discussed it, although he never said he would eventually get sick of me. He didn't have to. Excellent quote for this topic!

[White Flower]

Amen, GEL, A-MEN!! This is one of the main reasons why I'm here on LS. It is teaching me a lot about human nature, from a relatively safe distance. I wonder if people realize how revealing their posts are about the state of their own souls. The message they're sending is more telling about the messenger than it is about the "deliveree" that it's aimed for.

 

Of course, I'm also here on LS because I'm just plain ADDICTED.:D "Hello, my name is OpenBook and I'm a LoveShack poster."

Gotta love it!

 

I should have chosen, "Wearin'myheartonmysleeve"!

[nadiaj2727]

Because people believe that what you are doing isn't right, and that it will not be allowed to prosper for any long term gain, doesn't mean that we are bitter( got Jesus, not bitter:D), it just means that our belief systems are different.

 

I completely agree with this (except the Jesus part, as I'm not religious.) Just because someone doesn't agree with what someone else is doing doesn't mean they're bitter or unhappy. Especially when they are just trying to help based on their own past experiences. There is nothing wrong with that, and if people don't like to hear other views that don't condone what they're doing -- or if they would rather call people with different views "unhappy" -- than they shouldn't come to a public forum and ask for advice from who knows who!

[Shades of Grey]

I have no problem with opposing views. None whatesoever. Everyone is entitled to an opinion and sometimes things do need to be said however much people don't want to hear them.

 

It's the spirit in which some of the advice is given and the nasty undertones implied which I have a problem with. I just don't see the need for it. I know it's been said over and over again so I don't know why i'm bothering really. It just upsets me when I see nasty comments been given to vulnerable people.

[GreenEyedLady]

Amen, GEL, A-MEN!! This is one of the main reasons why I'm here on LS. It is teaching me a lot about human nature, from a relatively safe distance. I wonder if people realize how revealing their posts are about the state of their own souls. The message they're sending is more telling about the messenger than it is about the "deliveree" that it's aimed for.

 

I think it's also funny how words can sometimes "convict" certain people...

 

My thoughts were my observation concerning unhappy people, not meant for anyone in particular...

 

And yet some people took offense at my words...I am wondering why they would believe that I meant them in particular?

[luvmy2ns]

I think it's also funny how words can sometimes "convict" certain people...

 

My thoughts were my observation concerning unhappy people, not meant for anyone in particular...

 

And yet some people took offense at my words...I am wondering why they would believe that I meant them in particular?

 

Any time you have EVER used the term "bitter" you alway aim it at anyone who doesn't applaud the cheaters and their partners.

 

Some people convict themselves by their own behavior and choice of verbage.

[GreenEyedLady]

I mean exactly what I say...While I guess the written word is always subject to interpretation, I try to take "the guessing" of what I mean out of it...If you're taking it personally, that's something you might want to explore within yourself...

[silktricks]

And to the many BS's who frequent this OM/OW forum... What do you think drove your H to cheat on you? Is it some character flaw within him? Was he unhappy in the M? Was there anything you could have done to prevent it?

To get back to the original question:

I think all people have character flaws, and yes, that is part of what caused my h to cheat.

 

Could I have done anything to prevent it? Absolutely. I could have dealt with my problems differently. I could also have dealt with my h each time he reverted to passive-aggressive behavior. In the long run, however, I don't know if that would have been more or less beneficial to our marriage.

 

We have both been able to deal with some long-term issues we were avoiding. My husband in particular had some issues with women that he has been able to work out. I have always been most straightforward about what was on my mind, but had fallen into the habit of ignoring issues and burying myself in distractions.

 

Things needed to be addressed, and now they have been.

[OpenBook]

We have both been able to deal with some long-term issues we were avoiding... Things needed to be addressed, and now they have been.

 

Good for you Silk! And I mean that. I cannot know what it's like inside a LTM (long-term marriage). All I can do is guess at it, and try to glean anything I can from people who are in it (if they talk about it, that is). If it works, it works.

 

It just makes my stomach turn whenever I see married people treating each other so badly in public... snarling at each other, dismissing each other's needs, treating the other like a slave,... I just wonder how they could live like that.

 

It's also very refreshing to see marriages that DO work. Unfortunately, they're all too rare.

 

And I still can't get past my conviction that once a PA occurs outside the M, there's no hope of the M ever really recovering (but if it was an EA, or a ONS, I think there's a chance). But that's JMO... and I realize others have very different opinions about that.

[silktricks]

It just makes my stomach turn whenever I see married people treating each other so badly in public... snarling at each other, dismissing each other's needs, treating the other like a slave,... I just wonder how they could live like that.

I agree. My h and I never really treated each other badly, especially not in front of others. In point of fact no one, even our relatives knew when we were separated, and would have been amazed had they been told.

And I still can't get past my conviction that once a PA occurs outside the M, there's no hope of the M ever really recovering (but if it was an EA, or a ONS, I think there's a chance). But that's JMO... and I realize others have very different opinions about that.

I honestly don't think there is any universal answers to anything. What you could do, I possibly could not handle, and vice versa.

[IWALH]

I used to think it was for serious reasons, because he did fall in love with me, blah blah blah....

 

With time and no contact with him, I have come to realize the truth: I was a hot, carefree 20 year old and he was an average looking 40 year old living a slightly boring, monotonous life with his wife and children. That's why he cheated with me. He had "been in the game" for a long time and knew exactly what buttons to press and exactly what he had to say to get in bed with me, and he did it. I thought I was "street-smart" before I knew him, but he definitely proved me wrong!

 

He is just a con man, like his biological father. I don't really blame him anymore... that's just how he is hard-wired. When he wants something/someone he KNOWS exactly how he has to get it and he works hard to obtain whatever it may be. He's very good with his words, very good at what he does, he is a master at the art of womanizing.

 

So yeah... he cheated with me because he could. He did it in the past with other women and he wanted to do it again. He thrives on that kind of stuff. That's all.

[White Flower]

I used to think it was for serious reasons, because he did fall in love with me, blah blah blah....

 

With time and no contact with him, I have come to realize the truth: I was a hot, carefree 20 year old and he was an average looking 40 year old living a slightly boring, monotonous life with his wife and children. That's why he cheated with me. He had "been in the game" for a long time and knew exactly what buttons to press and exactly what he had to say to get in bed with me, and he did it. I thought I was "street-smart" before I knew him, but he definitely proved me wrong!

 

He is just a con man, like his biological father. I don't really blame him anymore... that's just how he is hard-wired. When he wants something/someone he KNOWS exactly how he has to get it and he works hard to obtain whatever it may be. He's very good with his words, very good at what he does, he is a master at the art of womanizing.

 

So yeah... he cheated with me because he could. He did it in the past with other women and he wanted to do it again. He thrives on that kind of stuff. That's all.

So, IWALH,

How long were you in the R and when did you see the light? Did you ever confront him with who he really was?

[child_of_isis]

This spoke to me for some reason. Isn't that what it is about?

 

Average looking guy

middle aged

average life

average this

average that.

Just plain ole average man....and never going to be anything but average.

Thinking he is going to get a piece of the good life by porking a hot young one. All of a sudden he doesn't feel average anymore.

 

Then reality hits and he comes to the conclusion that no matter how many young ones he bangs...he is still going be to be middle aged.

 

And he will always be average.

 

So he goes back to the tried and true....his family.

 

Wow! That is kind of pitiful.

 

I was a hot, carefree 20 year old and he was an average looking 40 year old living a slightly boring, monotonous life with his wife and children.

[White Flower]

So yeah... he cheated with me because he could. He did it in the past with other women and he wanted to do it again. He thrives on that kind of stuff. That's all.

Hi IWALH,

When did you finally catch on? How long did it take you to leave? Did you ever confront him on his cake-eater ways?

[IWALH]

Hi IWALH,

When did you finally catch on? How long did it take you to leave? Did you ever confront him on his cake-eater ways?

 

Well, it's really hard to say when I truly "caught on." I was with him in 2005 for about half a year and he left his wife and was living with me for a short time. When I became pregnant with his child, he left me and went back to his wife. He spoke to me several times after that and told me if I would have "just had patience" and "just listened to him" we would have been together. So I started beating myself up about it and truly thought it really was "all my fault" for the relationship ending. When I started to believe the bullsh*t he was feeding me, I caved and started "seeing him" again in late 2006.

 

The second time around I was patient. I did everything he told me to do. I went along with everything he wanted me to go along with. I even completely compromised my morals and did some very awful things that I will forever be ashamed of... My mom told me he was like a puppet master and I was his puppet that he was stringing along. I didn't listen. I believed every single word he said to me... until D-Day #2. The last time I spoke to him was shortly after D-Day #2. He told me he loved me and said he would call me the next day and would come down and pick me and our daughter up whenever I wanted him to (I didn't have my own car at the time). He never called me the next day. I didn't call him.... I can take a hint. I guess that's when you could say I "caught on."

 

I haven't attempted to contact him since and I won't. It's hard sometimes, of course. I just want to ask him why and how he could say those kind of things and do those kind of things and it all be a lie. I'm sure he would just blame me again like he did the last time if I did talk to him... since I did let his wife know some things I shouldn't have (according to him). When I really think about it, though, I just don't want to talk to him. Or see him or anything ever again. I'm just done with it all and truthfully I feel more apathetic than anything else about the entire situation at this point. It hurts sometimes and I get angry and/or sad at times. But it's just... whatever. That's just the way it is. I hope he and his family are happy and doing better... which I am sure they are since my daughter and I are completely out of their lives now.

 

Sorry if my wording is weird or I am grammatically crappy tonight... I have been slammed with school work and my brain is pretty much dead at this point, haha.

[nadiaj2727]

I used to think it was for serious reasons, because he did fall in love with me, blah blah blah....

 

With time and no contact with him, I have come to realize the truth: I was a hot, carefree 20 year old and he was an average looking 40 year old living a slightly boring, monotonous life with his wife and children. That's why he cheated with me...

 

So yeah... he cheated with me because he could. He did it in the past with other women and he wanted to do it again. He thrives on that kind of stuff. That's all.

 

Yep, these are common reasons MM cheat: boredom, midlife crises, wanting to "escape" to fantasy land with someone besides their wives. It all boils down to plain selfishness, shame on them. And you're also right that they cheat because OW *let* them cheat with us, shame on us. I realized it too with NC: my xMM, no matter how much he "thought" and said and "meant" that he loved me and wanted to be with me, started wooing me b/c he was bored with his life, and continued being with me and saying he was getting divorced, etc., because he wanted to keep the thrill. Therefore I blame myself and xMM for his DECISION to cheat on his W (and mine to help him do it), definitely *NOT* his W. She is innocent in terms of cheating, we were not. I don't make excuses, I see things as they are and I blame the culprits -- I was, and he was and in my opinion still is. I'm glad there are other former OWs like you on here that think the same way.

[nadiaj2727]

Well, it's really hard to say when I truly "caught on." I was with him in 2005 for about half a year and he left his wife and was living with me for a short time. When I became pregnant with his child, he left me and went back to his wife. He spoke to me several times after that and told me if I would have "just had patience" and "just listened to him" we would have been together. So I started beating myself up about it and truly thought it really was "all my fault" for the relationship ending. When I started to believe the bullsh*t he was feeding me, I caved and started "seeing him" again in late 2006.

 

The second time around I was patient. I did everything he told me to do. I went along with everything he wanted me to go along with. I even completely compromised my morals and did some very awful things that I will forever be ashamed of... My mom told me he was like a puppet master and I was his puppet that he was stringing along. I didn't listen. I believed every single word he said to me... until D-Day #2. The last time I spoke to him was shortly after D-Day #2. He told me he loved me and said he would call me the next day and would come down and pick me and our daughter up whenever I wanted him to (I didn't have my own car at the time). He never called me the next day. I didn't call him.... I can take a hint. I guess that's when you could say I "caught on."

 

I haven't attempted to contact him since and I won't. It's hard sometimes, of course. I just want to ask him why and how he could say those kind of things and do those kind of things and it all be a lie. I'm sure he would just blame me again like he did the last time if I did talk to him... since I did let his wife know some things I shouldn't have (according to him). When I really think about it, though, I just don't want to talk to him. Or see him or anything ever again. I'm just done with it all and truthfully I feel more apathetic than anything else about the entire situation at this point. It hurts sometimes and I get angry and/or sad at times. But it's just... whatever. That's just the way it is. I hope he and his family are happy and doing better... which I am sure they are since my daughter and I are completely out of their lives now.

 

Sorry if my wording is weird or I am grammatically crappy tonight... I have been slammed with school work and my brain is pretty much dead at this point, haha.

 

I'm really sorry for what he put you through IWALH. That's horrible. He's so selfish. Thank you for sharing. I hope current OWs and those thinking of potentially becoming OWs will listen to your story instead of the "happily ever after" BS spouted by some who are convinced that one day Mr. String-Her-Along will one day become Mr. Knight and Shining Armor. I think your story is a lot more illustrative of what usually happens to the common MM and OW, since, as we've seen on this thread and elsewhere, it's all about MM being selfish and pathetic. So far on this forum I have only seen one OW whose xMM (now boyfriend) has divorced his W and is with her, and she has said she would not have waited for him if he hadn't quickly delivered on his promises. (I haven't been here all that long so I'm sure there are a few more I haven't heard of or threads I haven't read). But I've heard a lot a lot a lot of stories like yours, where MM promises OW this and that but delivers a big fat nothing to her... even after she sacrifices so much to be with him. And as much as OW like to bash BS, I've heard of many more (x)MM (and (x)MW) being successful at turning around their marriages and actually delivering on the promises they originally made to their spouses than leaving them to be with OW. I don't mean to minimize what you've been through but instead to thank you for sharing your hard experiences with us and for giving us a dose of reality. You sound like you've learned so much and come so far.

[Impudent Oyster]

I'm really sorry for what he put you through IWALH. That's horrible. He's so selfish. Thank you for sharing. I hope current OWs and those thinking of potentially becoming OWs will listen to your story instead of the "happily ever after" BS spouted by some who are convinced that one day Mr. String-Her-Along will one day become Mr. Knight and Shining Armor.

 

Ok, can we talk about this for a bit? What do you mean what HE put HER through? Did she not know he was married? What about HER selfishness in wanting a man who was married with children?

 

I'm not saying the guy wasn't a jerk, maybe he was, maybe he wasn't, we're only hearing the scorned OW's side, but what about taking responsibility for getting involved with a MARRIED MAN? I don't see it, all I see is what a bad guy HE is for stringing the OW along, but where is her responsibility? My god, she got pregnant, how selfish is that? It's his fault that she believed a known liar?

 

I'm sorry but I have ZERO sympathy for a woman who gets dumped by a married man. She knew what he was and that he was committed to someone else when it started.

 

If you want to play with fire you'll likely get burned.

[IWALH]

Ok, can we talk about this for a bit? What do you mean what HE put HER through? Did she not know he was married? What about HER selfishness in wanting a man who was married with children?

 

I'm not saying the guy wasn't a jerk, maybe he was, maybe he wasn't, we're only hearing the scorned OW's side, but what about taking responsibility for getting involved with a MARRIED MAN? I don't see it, all I see is what a bad guy HE is for stringing the OW along, but where is her responsibility? My god, she got pregnant, how selfish is that? It's his fault that she believed a known liar?

 

I'm sorry but I have ZERO sympathy for a woman who gets dumped by a married man. She knew what he was and that he was committed to someone else when it started.

 

If you want to play with fire you'll likely get burned.

 

 

Firstly, I never asked for anyone's "sympathy." I don't need sympathy at this point. I am here to merely share my experiences with other women who might be going through something similar to what I went through. This is, after all, the other woman forum.

 

Second, it is obvious that you have never been in that kind of a position. I knew he was married, true enough. But he told me that he was about to be going through a divorce, it was hard to get things started, it had been coming for a long time, there was no real love between the two of them anymore, and the list goes on. He fed me line after line after line. And I believed him. I didn't intentionally get involved with a married man. Before I was ever an "other woman" I shook my head in disgust at them just as you are now. What I hate about this board is the BS or women who haven't been OW that get on here and just shame the OW as much as possible when they cannot possibly fathom what it was like and what the OW went through, themselves. I take full responsibilty for my actions, and as aforementioned, I am very ashamed of many of them. But it was like I wasn't me... I was so unbelievably naive, it's ridiculous. He was a predator and I fell for everything he said, hook, line, and sinker. I was 20-years-old when the affair began! Three years prior to that I was a minor and he was 37! That is a HUGE difference in life experience and he used that to his advantage.

 

Third, it wasn't "selfish" of me to get pregnant. I mean, seriously? For one thing, I was told by my OBGYN after I had gynecological surgery that I was most likely not going to be able to have children. I definitely didn't think that 10 months later I would be pregnant with xMM's child. If I was intentionally trying to get pregnant, I could understand your rationale, but it was anything but intentional. I did sleep with him, of course. But the time I got pregnant was after he had left his wife and was living with me in my apartment and was allegedly starting divorce proceedings. It was after I got pregnant that he went back to her.

 

Lastly, I wasn't dumped by him. He was supposed to call the next day after I last talked to him and didn't. I could have easily called him and who knows what might have happened. But I didn't. I finally did the right thing and just closed that door of my life. I am now in school full-time, raising a happy, healthy, and beautiful little girl, and I am doing exceptionally well. Like I stated before, yes I do think about him sometimes and it can make me upset, but it's usually just a fleeting thought. I am much happier now than I ever was throughout the course of my "relationship" with him.

 

I don't want to argue with you people anymore like I have in the past. Sure, you can rationalize that what I did was wrong. It was. And I was deserving of the heartbreak I felt at the beginning of the end. But don't pretend to know what it is like to be someone in that position when you truly have no idea. I thought I was smart... but I was a little girl. How can a 20-year-old girl (fresh out of an abusive relationship) know how to react when a 40-year-old man is playing with her heart so intensely? I was naive, I was stupid, and I was wrong. But try to understand it from someone else's POV for a change rather than just thinking narrow-mindedly.

[Impudent Oyster]

Second, it is obvious that you have never been in that kind of a position. I knew he was married, true enough. But he told me that he was about to be going through a divorce, it was hard to get things started, it had been coming for a long time, there was no real love between the two of them anymore, and the list goes on. He fed me line after line after line. And I believed him.

 

Third, it wasn't "selfish" of me to get pregnant. I mean, seriously? For one thing, I was told by my OBGYN after I had gynecological surgery that I was most likely not going to be able to have children. I definitely didn't think that 10 months later I would be pregnant with xMM's child. If I was intentionally trying to get pregnant, I could understand your rationale, but it was anything but intentional. I did sleep with him, of course. But the time I got pregnant was after he had left his wife and was living with me in my apartment and was allegedly starting divorce proceedings. It was after I got pregnant that he went back to her.

 

 

No, I have never been in that kind of position because I wouldn't allow myself to be used like that. Don't you think most women are hit on by men, even when they're 20? Well I was, a lot, some of them married and I just said NO.

 

Don't start calling him a predator just because he went back to his wife, because you know damn well if he stayed with you you would be referring to him as the love of your life, not as a predator.

 

It seems that all OW cry victim when they get left, don't they?

 

You've learned a valuable lesson the hard way, but you really ought to start accepting responsibility for your actions. Twenty is young but it's not that young, and it's no excuse for sleeping with a married man, no matter how many lies he told, because they all lie. They all claim to have unhappy marriages, they all claim to be divorcing, blah, blah, blah...

 

He's a liar and a jerk, but not a predator and you're no victim. I've heard the exact same words from OW twice your age, they too claim they were victims of some lying bastard.

 

When I read about these OW who come here and think their MM are different, theirs are REALLY leaving, theirs REALLY love them, I wish I could slap them with reality, but just like you, they will learn the hard way, and just like you, they will claim they were victimized by those horrible, evil MM who at one time were so wonderful.

 

Live and learn I guess.

[IWALH]

No, I have never been in that kind of position because I wouldn't allow myself to be used like that. Don't you think most women are hit on by men, even when they're 20? Well I was, a lot, some of them married and I just said NO.

 

Don't start calling him a predator just because he went back to his wife, because you know damn well if he stayed with you you would be referring to him as the love of your life, not as a predator.

 

It seems that all OW cry victim when they get left, don't they?

 

You've learned a valuable lesson the hard way, but you really ought to start accepting responsibility for your actions. Twenty is young but it's not that young, and it's no excuse for sleeping with a married man, no matter how many lies he told, because they all lie. They all claim to have unhappy marriages, they all claim to be divorcing, blah, blah, blah...

 

He's a liar and a jerk, but not a predator and you're no victim. I've heard the exact same words from OW twice your age, they too claim they were victims of some lying bastard.

 

When I read about these OW who come here and think their MM are different, theirs are REALLY leaving, theirs REALLY love them, I wish I could slap them with reality, but just like you, they will learn the hard way, and just like you, they will claim they were victimized by those horrible, evil MM who at one time were so wonderful.

 

Live and learn I guess.

 

I get hit on all the time as well. I always have. I have been hit on numerous times by married men but NEVER acknowledged them. When xMM and I first became friends and he tried to hit on me I told him "Sorry, but I will never date a married man." Then he worked very hard and convinced me his marriage was almost over and they were going to be getting divorced at the end of the school year so it wouldn't be as hard on his daughter, etc. He fed me a plethora of lines that I (foolishly) fell for. I didn't think of myself at the time I was seeing xMM as being used. I didn't think he was using me! I thought he was about to get a divorce. He was always over at my house (or at work) literally crying to me about everything that was wrong with his life. We became friends for a long time before we started anything more. And I only allowed it to become more because I TRULY thought he was in the process of a divorce! Silly me for believing him, sure. OW cry victim because they are victims (in a sense) in many cases. Before you attack me for that, realize that I am not calling myself a victim. I AM responsible for my actions and I feel foolish for believing him. I made a mistake and feel apologetic (to his family, not anyone on here) for my mistake and misjudgement.

 

Basically, everything you are saying is out of pure ignorance. You do not and can not fathom what it is like to be in that position and therefore have a very narrow-minded view on the subject.

 

As for calling him a predator, I did not call him that because he went back to his wife. Haha. I called him that because when I was 15-years-old, he was 35. I would put money on him trying the same exact thing that he did with me 5 years later if he knew me back then. Why? Because he did it to an underage girl before! That's what I was told by his wife! That makes him a sexual predator. He was JUST LIKE those guys in "To Catch a Predator" on Dateline. But he was smarter and more conniving.

 

You keep referring to me "learning the hard way." I don't consider the way I learned to be "hard" at all. I am actually very glad I went through that life experience because it taught me SO MUCH about men and people in general. I am doing fantastic now. I was fine after he didn't call me back like he said he would (albiet a little bitter at first), I wasn't crushed. If I would have never went through what I did, I might still be very naive when it comes to men. I don't have the best history with men (including my father), so maybe that's why I was more susceptible to falling for his lies and whatnot. I don't know. All I know is I feel bad for what I did because of what that put his wife and family through, but I am glad I (personally) went through it because I learned some valuable life lessons that I will never forget. I am in no way personally torn up about it. I just feel bad for his family.

 

By the way, I don't think he is an evil person. I think he has some psychological issues (that stem a lot from his horrible upbringing with his mother and issues with his biological father that he has never met) and has a history of alcohol/drug abuse which probably contributed to what he "did to me" and other women in the past. But essentially, I don't think he is a bad person. He has just done some very bad things and needs significant psychological guidance.

[nadiaj2727]

Ok, can we talk about this for a bit? What do you mean what HE put HER through? Did she not know he was married? What about HER selfishness in wanting a man who was married with children?

 

I'm not saying the guy wasn't a jerk, maybe he was, maybe he wasn't, we're only hearing the scorned OW's side, but what about taking responsibility for getting involved with a MARRIED MAN? I don't see it, all I see is what a bad guy HE is for stringing the OW along, but where is her responsibility? My god, she got pregnant, how selfish is that? It's his fault that she believed a known liar?

 

I'm sorry but I have ZERO sympathy for a woman who gets dumped by a married man. She knew what he was and that he was committed to someone else when it started.

 

If you want to play with fire you'll likely get burned.

 

I agree with you IO that we should all take responsibility for our own actions. I feel that IWALH is doing that, though. I feel that I have more empathy and compassion for her than you show... perhaps because I've walked in her shoes. I am NOW smart enough (like you are) to say I would never date a married man no matter what, and follow through with that even if I had feelings etc. But when it happened to me and he was telling me all the same things IWALH's xMM was telling her (and they all tell all OWs), I honestly believed him because I was gullible, naive, and thought I was in love, and I thought he was a good person. I had never been married and I couldn't imagine how someone could be married but want to date someone else... so when he told me they were not in love, they both wanted a divorce, and he had feelings for me that he never had for anyone else, I believed him whole-heartedly and very foolishly. It was easy to believe him when he moved out and spent every day including holidays etc. with me... it LOOKED like he was separated and getting a divorce. Now I am smart enough to know that even if a man IS separated, I *still* shouldn't date him until he's divorced, especially if he's not telling anyone else, including his W, that he's seeing me. But I learned all of that the hard way. Not everyone is automatically wise as you are, some people have to do the wrong thing until they wake up and say, wait a minute, I want to do the right thing. I admire IWALH for doing this. And I also feel that her xMM WAS the predator b/c when you are young and looking for love, and an older married man tells you that you are the love of his life, you tend to believe him. I think he manipulated her and took advantage of her. A lot of MM do that. I am *not* saying she was "forced" or that she had no part of the problem. I'm just saying that for SOME people, it's not at first as clear cut as "he's married", but through a hard and stupid experience, they realize that that SHOULD be the case, as they learn through their bad decisions in the past. I am like that and I think IW I guess I'm trying to say that not everyone is like you IO. People are different. I am very black and white now that affairs are wrong, and I will never see any reason to justify them nor will I ever be part of one again. But I also have empathy for women that were strung along by a man who lied and cheated, and I admire people that figured out that's what was going on and changed and became better people.

[OWoman]

Here is the catchy part...if you live with him 24/7, there will be off moments when he will not see you as any of this.

 

Maybe you are sick. Long hours at work. Too many things to do. Or just don't feel up to it.

 

Then after a few down times (he wants to play, but you don't feel up to it) he says...but you use to be fun, available, blah blah...

 

So now, you no longer feel fun, available, etc. You internalize it. Become it.

 

This bit used to worry me, too - MM seemed to have such a positive image of me, always on top of everything, never letting anything get me down... and then, during one of our extended periods together, I got really sick. Neither of us realised at first how sick, but my mood was awful, my energy low, and of course physically I was off so not my usual passionate self. For more than a month, around the clock, I was misery incarnate to MM. His response? Beyond the most compassionate caring I'd ever experienced, what really struck me was his relief! That I also had "off days", that I was also vulnerable, moody, physically susceptible and human! And, of course, when I did finally succumb to his insistence and see a doctor, the diagnosis immediately galvanised him into action, taking over all the chores and pampering me until I was fully recovered. And then some.

 

We've lived with each other 24X7, in my space, in his space, in neutral space, in foreign (to both of us) space for extended periods of time. He's pretty much seen what there is to see. It hasn't put him off - rather, it's filled in the blanks and strengthened the bond. We've done normal, we've done exceptional, we've seen each other at work and at play, under pressure and at rest, we've shed tears of sadness and laughter, and done the sickness&health thing.

 

Everything indicates he's in it for the long haul. I only hope I can match him on that. The costs are far greater for him than for me, and it would be really unfair if I were to drop him after ten minutes because I became bored.

[White Flower]

This bit used to worry me, too - MM seemed to have such a positive image of me, always on top of everything, never letting anything get me down... and then, during one of our extended periods together, I got really sick. Neither of us realised at first how sick, but my mood was awful, my energy low, and of course physically I was off so not my usual passionate self. For more than a month, around the clock, I was misery incarnate to MM. His response? Beyond the most compassionate caring I'd ever experienced, what really struck me was his relief! That I also had "off days", that I was also vulnerable, moody, physically susceptible and human! And, of course, when I did finally succumb to his insistence and see a doctor, the diagnosis immediately galvanised him into action, taking over all the chores and pampering me until I was fully recovered. And then some.

 

We've lived with each other 24X7, in my space, in his space, in neutral space, in foreign (to both of us) space for extended periods of time. He's pretty much seen what there is to see. It hasn't put him off - rather, it's filled in the blanks and strengthened the bond. We've done normal, we've done exceptional, we've seen each other at work and at play, under pressure and at rest, we've shed tears of sadness and laughter, and done the sickness&health thing.

 

Everything indicates he's in it for the long haul. I only hope I can match him on that. The costs are far greater for him than for me, and it would be really unfair if I were to drop him after ten minutes because I became bored.

Nice story, Owoman; I am really happy for you.