I made a mistake with my secretary - but why is this an "unforgiveable sin"?

[SixthSt.Girl]

I think you should get a divorce. You at least owe it to your wife to tell her what's been going on. I don't know why people stay in marriages when they're obviously into other people (doesn't matter if the other woman is interested in you or not). How can you love your wife and be infatuated with someone at the same time?

[whichwayisup]

LPat, you still reading on LS? If so, we'd be interested in an update with your situation. Hope things are better..

[Deanster]

I think you should get a divorce. You at least owe it to your wife to tell her what's been going on. I don't know why people stay in marriages when they're obviously into other people (doesn't matter if the other woman is interested in you or not). How can you love your wife and be infatuated with someone at the same time?

 

Wow - that's an amazingly black-and-white vision of the world for someone who has spent more than about 10 minutes looking around this site.... If everyone who had an interest in someone other than their spouse divorced right on the spot, there'd be precious few married people left in about a week!

 

Similarly, if your expectations of yourself and your SO are such that you think you'll both be so into each other that you can't/won't form an interest or attachment to others, you're going to run into a big hard wall of reality, and most likely sooner than later.

 

For the OP - it's an unfortunate situation, indeed. We don't always get to choose who we form an emotional attachment to, and we don't always handle it skillfully either way. Take this as a 'lesson learned'... and move on.

[SixthSt.Girl]

Wow - that's an amazingly black-and-white vision of the world for someone who has spent more than about 10 minutes looking around this site.... If everyone who had an interest in someone other than their spouse divorced right on the spot, there'd be precious few married people left in about a week!

 

Similarly, if your expectations of yourself and your SO are such that you think you'll both be so into each other that you can't/won't form an interest or attachment to others, you're going to run into a big hard wall of reality, and most likely sooner than later.

 

For the OP - it's an unfortunate situation, indeed. We don't always get to choose who we form an emotional attachment to, and we don't always handle it skillfully either way. Take this as a 'lesson learned'... and move on.

 

 

I've been at this site for a long time, dude. I haven't been a regular poster for awhile, but I've been here quite a bit in the past. Read my profile before making assumptions. The OP is obsessed with another woman - it's obviously not just a passing interest in someone else. This woman is also 20 years younger than he is. I can't imagine the wife would be too thrilled about it. What would he had done had the woman been interested in him? Likely had an affair. People don't know how easily dangerous STD's and HPV can be spread - HPV is on the rise and carries with it some very damaging consequences for women. I would like to believe that the OP is over the little infatuation, but since he seems to care more about the secy than HIS WIFE, I don't see that as being very faithful to his marriage. I'm just glad I'm not married. Most wives in the scenario would likely be upset but all would be forgiven if the husband didn't actually do anything. Blech, again, I'm glad I'm not married. I feel better and better about being a single woman with each passing day.

 

I was interested in someone who was going through a divorce. He also was interested, but I turned down his advances because he was still legally married. I wanted to wait until he actually got divorced, not just separated. He ended up going back to his wife due to pressures from her and his family despite admitting having serious feelings for me. I think that if I had responded favorably to him during that time, he would've left her in a second. I just felt majorly uncomfortable and taken off-guard since the separation was a big surprise to me. There are still feelings there, and there are still major problems in his marriage, the same problems that led to the divorce. Why do men feel they have to stay in these messy marriages? Is it comfort? Sex? He's not getting any sex so can't be that. I admit I love watching him squirm and suffer through this. I want to tell him, just get a divorce! but whatever, he can suffer with that old naggy wife of his because as long as he's got the ring on his finger (actually, it's been off for some time though, like his marriage, lol!), he's not getting anything from me.

 

To the OP - honesty is the best policy. I don't know if you even care about your wife at this point since you've made any mention of her, or maybe you think you're in the clear since she's in the dark (but what if she catches wind of it?), but don't you think you owe her an explanation? She's got to know something's up since you say this has affected you emotionally and physically. What if she finds out about this on her own? I think, really, you brought this upon yourself by not being honest about your feelings to start with. That's not being fair to all parties involved, including yourself. If you want to play the field, then that's fine - get a divorce. If you think you can get over this and focus your love and attention on your wife, then do that, but this situation will haunt your marriage, especially with you continuing to see the secretary every day. It sounds like you're really heartbroken, and that this is far from being over.

[JosieMcCoy]

This reminds of a guy I knew printed off my picture and masturbated to it and ripped it up afterwards! That was SOOOO CREEEEPY!!!

 

Why did he have to tell me?!?!

 

I haven't talked to him in YEARS, and I always thought about him different after that. I don't think I could ever look at him the same way again.

 

Cheers!

[LPat]

LPat, you still reading on LS? If so, we'd be interested in an update with your situation. Hope things are better..

 

I have indeed told my wife everything, shortly after my very first post. Fortunately, an emotional affair is easier to forgive than a physical affair. But I am married to the most wonderful woman in the world! This awful situation has had one benefit: it has brought us very close together and has strengthened our marriage.

 

Someone suggested that I would have jumped at the chance to have a physical affair with the secretary if she had been willing. I'm nearly sixty and have been married for thirty of those years. I have never had a physical affair while married (despite many opportunities). I don't deny a few other workplace "crushes" over the course of forty years. Perhaps it was because this woman was so totally unrealistic in my mind as a willing accomplice (i.e., safe) that I allowed myself to get too close to her and did not hit the brakes on the "friendship" when it began to get out of hand for me long before this incident.

 

I have learned that my ex-secretary and her husband have been "trashing" me to others in the office and within the professional community and, as many of you had predicted, consider me a "freak," "creepy," etc. She has flatly rejected my attempts to have a civil relationship in the office and still ignores me as if I were not present except when she absolutely must speak to me on business. Fortunately, I was able to move to another office far down the hall last week where we now have virtually no daily contact any longer.

 

The "infatuation" is long gone. It took a few weeks. But nothing puts the fire out more quickly than hearing that I am being brutally trashed by my former "friend," and finding that my best friend was the woman I get to sleep with every night!

 

But I am now publicly branded as a "dirty old man" and can assure you that this one isn't going to blow over with time, as many of you predicted, nor will I ever be able to recover my prior reputation, professionally or personally. I have indeed learned my lesson well.

[JamesM]

LPat,

 

Thanks for your update. It was a difficult lesson for you, but on the positive side, it could have been much more difficult. You have come out of it better than it could have been.

 

I think that this ex secretary is blowing things out of proportion and should not be slandering your name. Sadly, we all jump to such conclusions too often.

 

Hopefully this will blow over. It make take a year, but i think most of it will blow over. She moves on, and it will blow over even quicker.

 

Thanks for sharing. You never know who may have benefited from your experience. And we never know who may have been prevented from falling into the same situation because they read the result of your situation.

[Mary3]

One thing to realize . You have been with your wife 30 years and its understanding that you might fantasize about another women. I mean come on 30 years is a lonnnng time to be with one person. So that fact that you let your mind wander and fixate on another is not soo bad.

But the picture episode is what did you in. And now this lady is trashing your name. VERY unprofessional. What is her goal ? To make everyone detest and hate you ? Well if its possible , you should try to look for work elsewhere. I mean we are talking about a picture ( I hope it was a clean pic ) of this lady that slipped out of a file ....and she is making your life Hell now...

[BlueEyedGirl]

LPat,

 

I'm curious what would have happened if things turned out differently. Say if your secretary returned your feelings and tried to initiate something physical (before the whole picture episode). Do you think you would have been strong enough to say no?

[whichwayisup]

LPat, I am sorry that the office atmosphere has changed and I do hope she shuts up and stops bashing you. That does no good for anyone, let alone, it makes HER look bad as she is gossiping and spreading stuff about you. All I can say is, no matter how difficult it is, put on a happy face and don't let it bother you as you cannot control what others think. Before this happened you had a good reputation and those who know you well won't let this one mistake ruin their opinion of you. Besides, they are hearing it from her side, through her eyes.. Most know there's 3 sides of the truth. Yours, hers and the actual truth.

 

ON a good note, it's great that you are connecting again with your wife! Focus on her and your life together, work is work and what counts at the end of the day is who you go home to and who is there for you.

[Ariadne]

Hi,

 

why a solid, long term friendship is not just damaged, but completely destroyed, by my actions. I also want to understand the nature of the injury that I have inflicted upon her that has provoked such a reaction.

 

It was not destroyed by your actions.

 

It was because your object of infatuation is a total idiot.

 

Ariadne

[mental_traveller]

I think she was upset because you basically deceived her for years. You pretended you were her friend, whereas in fact you were more interested in perving over her (in her mind). That deception would have made it a much greater shock when she found out in fact you were infatuated with her.

 

However, she does seem to be overreacting. All you did was have a photo of her in your drawer. Big deal. Unless you confessed that you jerked off to her pic nightly, then I don't see what's "dirty" about that. A little unusual maybe, but you could easily have passed it off as just starting a family album, or a collection of photos of work colleagues etc.

Edited February 21, 2008 by mental_traveller

[vintagecat]

As a now middle aged woman who in her earlier years was in the place of "the secretary" a couple of times in her career, I can tell you how completely off putting it is to discover that the friendly older father figure has feelings that go outside the bounds of friendship/mentorship and professionalism.

 

When I was young and single I had one unfortunate love note that came out of the blue from a much older married peer, one married co-worker old enough to be my father who showed up drunk at my house at two am and another that made an inappropriate comment that just creeped me out in around a ten to twelve year span of work in a male dominated profession.

 

All of these situations I managed to ignore, joke about to "smooth over" and keep in check in order to keep the working atmosphere from becoming intolerable (we worked closely in teams) but you can bet that it changed my working relationship with each of these men. After preserving peace, I essentially cut them off. I discouraged non-work conversation, no after work drinks with the "boys", no socializing with the family, etc.

 

The final straw was a quid pro qou sexual harassment situation (it was unreported because back in the day in my profession women who reported such things were very often marginalized and eventually fired) that had me afraid for my career but that was a married man in my age group who was a direct supervisor of my training in a new position. I handled it under the radar but it wasn't fun and it wasn't easy.

 

To survive a 25 to 30 year career of close teamwork with mostly older males, I had to look at what I was doing to possibly unintentionally provoke these reactions in mostly good men (excluding the harasser) and as a result became much less friendly and open at work and though I dressed modestly at all times, I took the feminine touches and colors, make-up, scents etc. out of my work wardrobe entirely. And I rarely attended company functions and parties until I was married. Then I got fat and that of course worked brilliantly but I don't recommend it to women as a coping strategy as it has it's own lasting issues.

 

You've heard it all. The only thing you owe her, yourself, your workplace is no more drama. Unfortunately she continues to stir the pot after the "threat" has been neutralized for her own purposes and that will make things harder for both of you. Of course you know this but stay and do your job with the highest level of professionalism possible and retire when able without fanfare.

 

FWIW, it's a very good thing that you have confided in your forgiving wife. If nothing else that is the silver lining in this cloud. Good luck to you.

 

Cat

[vintagecat]

Oh and the advice that I always give to anyone thinking excessively about a co-worker that is married, committed or otherwise inappropriate or out of bounds, just stop it before it gets out of hand. Even seemingly innocent crushes can get totally out of hand and destroy careers, marriages, lives. seen it happen too many times.

 

This very thread should be a cautionary tale for anyone headed down the path.

[twice_shy]

Now, however, I am trying to understand how what I have done could be completely "unforgivable,"

 

Uh, trying to woo a married woman? Maybe that is it.

 

 

and why a solid, long term friendship is not just damaged, but completely destroyed, by my actions.

 

Because clearly there was more than "friendship" on your mind.

 

You don't buy a married woman gifts like you did, take pictures of her, and hide them so you could do whatever it is you probably did with them.

 

You probably got her in trouble with her husband. And she is probably justifiably pissed at you. I'm surprised you weren't turned in for harrassment.

 

However, she took the gift, so I couldn't have been completely one-sided.

She maybe deserved a little turmoil with her husband for accepting expensive gifts from another man. Maybe now she will be on the straight and narrow. And that seems to be what she is doing now.

 

I also want to understand the nature of the injury that I have inflicted upon her that has provoked such a reaction.

 

Uh, her husband found out and is pissed off at her because of what you did. You are lucky the husband didn't stomp a mudhole in your arse.

 

 

Yet she is making me feel like she has lost nothing at all, and that she has happily moved on with her life and I’m not in it.

 

Are you mentally insane? You say it was a "friendship", but you clearly are describing this like it was an affair.

 

 

I’m not looking for advice as much as I am for insight into these questions to help me cope with the consequences of my acts.

 

Bottom line, you were stepping over the bounds of flirting with a married woman. The husband caught wind of it and that is that. Nothing more to be said.

 

You did this to yourself and she helped by accepting gifts from you and probably flirting back.

 

So if you want insight to cope with your actions, make sure your actions don't include trying to win over married women any longer.

 

I'm surprised the husband didn't demand she quit her job.

Edited February 27, 2008 by twice_shy

[twice_shy]

Personally, I don't understand why your secretary is making such a big fuss...was the photo of her provocative in any way?

 

He said he took an attractive photo of her and touched it up. Now if anyone that saw a "touched up" attractive photo of her in the office and know who took it and doctored it up, then the rumors would be flying all over the office that they are having an affair.

 

She did the right thing by telling her husband before any rumors got started.

 

But my question is, how did she explain the camera that he bought her to her husband? If a man bought my SO or wife an expensive gift at work and she accepted, I think I'd be quite pissed about it.

[Mary3]

You said you were * financially helpful * to her ? What does that mean ? Did you give her generous raises ?

 

After re~reading your post AGAIN I think you were deeply infatuated if not loving her all these years.

 

She was creeped out by it.

 

Lets assume you are 50 years old. And she is 30. Thats way too vast an age difference . She was happily married....weren't you ??