loversrock Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 Hi, I'm a 32 male, with a 3 year old son. My marriage is hanging on by a hair. And that hair is now straining, one slight breeze would break the hair and everything would come crashing down. Especially now that she confessed to me the other day that she's starting to fall for some guy she's working with. Thing is though, the thing that makes me dazed and confused is that I didn't know what happened. A few months ago we had a big fight, I was jealous of this same guy and confronted her about it. She was all defensive and said that nothing special is going on. Then the next day we had a long talk. She told me she's just fed up with me. That I don't listen, that I don't do all the stuff she asks of me. I admit that I made a lot of mistakes in the relationship. We're only married for 5 years. I told her that both of us are still inexperienced in marriage. They didn't teach marriage at school, so coming into this marriage we're both rookies, amateurs. We did not fight a lot before this happened. But if we did, it's usually major. We agreed to work it out with some changes. A couple of months has passed and we had another fight. Now she's accusing me of spying on her. She said that she couldn't trust me anymore. Thing is though, I really wasn't spying. She accused me of going through her stuff and checking her cellphone. I wasn't. Actually, after that fight I now am suspicious. I started spying. What is she hiding? I know she's hiding something because she's not a very good liar. I didn't find anything serious except for a note containing a list of her future plans. The list was kinda generic. But the thing that made me think is the line "What do you like about me? What do you not like about me?" Is this line for me of someone else? Days has passed waiting for her to present me the list. I thought she was just listing things she might want to talk to me about. That day never came. I don't know why. So probably the list wasn't meant for me. After the second major fight, I asked her where we are going in the relationship. I asked her if the workout period is over or are we still in it. She said that we're still in the period and we'll try a different approach. Another couple of months we arrive to where we are now. A few days ago she made the confession. Thing is, during our first big fight, I looked her in the eyes and asked her if she's having an affair or at least a fling with this guy. She said no. I believed her then. Now after she confessed, I can't trust her anymore. Last Saturday, after we went for grocery shopping she said that she has to leave for a few hours because she has to deal with something. She has to talk to this guy and settle things. She was gone for 6 hours, she works on a night shift by the way and has to go to work in the next hour. I usually drive her to work, but when she got home she said that he would instead drive her to work. I begged her to let me drive her to work because I have a lot questions to ask. She said I have nothing to worry about. But I insisted. She finally agreed. Long story short, she's asking for a trial separation, some time for herself. I'm confused now, she said I have nothing to worry about and now she's asking for separation? I don't understand. I asked her if she's willing to go to marital counselling. At first she doesn't want to. But I told her that before we do the trial separation we should try to do counselling as a last resort, since nothing has worked. She then agreed. I don't know if this counselling would work though. I have my doubts. By the way, she said that she doesn't see the benefit in marital counselling because she thinks married life is probably not for her. I asked her if she wants to be a single mom or single again. She can't be a single mom because I'm still here and won't give up on my son. She insist that it would be better if we give each other some distance so that we have some time to reflect. I said that after we go to the counselling we'll talk again and decide if it's worth goint to another session or do the trial separation thing. I'm not optimistic. I think that even if the counselling would help a lot, in her mind separation is the only solution. I have a gut feeling that she's holding something back from me. There were instances that I know she went out for dates with the guy. She said that she just went out with friends. She went for a 3 day training in Seattle before all of this started. She even brought the camera. She said that it was a group training, but when she asked me to transfer all the photos to the computer I've noticed that there were some images that were deleted, based on the file names. And strangely, all the photos there are solo pictures of her. No group picture whatsoever. It might be nothing, but it could be something. After the counselling we would talk about arrangements and stuff. But I would also like to know everything. I want her to be brutally honest with me. Is it OK if I ask her to tell me everything? The brutal truth? Would she tell me everything? Or is she just going to deny everything? I don't trust her anymore so even if she says she didn't cheat on me I don't think I can believe her. I need to know the truth so that I can be set free. If I know the truth now I can then start to cope, heal, and probably forgive. To move on and focus 100% of my attention and time to my son whom I love more that life itself. Sorry for the length of the post, but I just need to vent my feelings to someone, to something. Do you think it's stupid to hope for a reconcialiation in the future? Or is the situation already dead as freakin' fried chicken? Thanks for reading. Any advice from you guys would be appreciated.
Cobra_X30 Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 Yeah, I have some advice! Get a lawyer as fast as possible. Your wife is gone. You and I both know this. In time your heart will know this too. Some day you will regret every moment you spent diddling around playing at trying to win her back. Walk now!
Lyssa Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 Is it OK if I ask her to tell me everything? The brutal truth? Would she tell me everything? Or is she just going to deny everything? I don't trust her anymore so even if she says she didn't cheat on me I don't think I can believe her. I need to know the truth so that I can be set free. If I know the truth now I can then start to cope, heal, and probably forgive. To move on and focus 100% of my attention and time to my son whom I love more that life itself. It is okay to ask and want to know everything but do you really want to know? A lot of times, people want to know the truth but when truth is out they cannot accept it. In your case, I guess you want closure? So that you can move on and start afresh with your son. If I was in your situation, I would walk away. You love your son more than life itself, take him with you. I think he's better off with you, anyway.
Mr. Lucky Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 Get a lawyer as fast as possible. Your wife is gone. You and I both know this. In time your heart will know this too. Some day you will regret every moment you spent diddling around playing at trying to win her back. Well, I'm usually more from the "work on it" school of thought, but it may indeed be too late. It takes two to work on a marriage and, unless you're willing to lock her in her room, sounds like one doesn't want to be there. I feel for you - your head must be spinning with a million questions and thoughts. Go slow. You'll have a lot of important decisions to make without much input from her. Focus on your son - he's going to need you now more than ever... Mr. Lucky
Yamaha Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 Time away is NEVER a good way to "think about things". It just gives her more time to be with him. I would tell her that if she needs a separation then you are filing for a divorce. You need to make it clear to her that she will lose something ( you ) if she goes down this road. If she still wants the time away then you know there is little hope for the future. I don't know if it is the guy so much or if she just doesn't want to be married but I think she has made up her mind and you are not in her future plans.
Cobra_X30 Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 Well, I'm usually more from the "work on it" school of thought, but it may indeed be too late. It takes two to work on a marriage and, unless you're willing to lock her in her room, sounds like one doesn't want to be there. I feel for you - your head must be spinning with a million questions and thoughts. Go slow. You'll have a lot of important decisions to make without much input from her. Focus on your son - he's going to need you now more than ever... Mr. Lucky Well, my thoughts are typically on the same line Mr. Lucky! I would usually say stop bieng a Dbag and start working on your marriage! This is different. There is another man involved. When it comes to marriage.... Its all or nothing. No, fence sitting, no trying out other men. Your either in or out, and guys who let thier wives sit on the fence with a foot in both pastures, miss this point. Time to knock her off the fence, who cares if she physically cheated or not. She wants to... thats plenty enough!
LifesontheUp Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 Usually when there is another person involved and a trial seperation is requested its so that they can continue to see the other person without having to deal with any questions the husband/wife/partner would throw at them. Basically it allows them the freedom to carry on their affair without having to justify "missing" time to their partner and it can also ease any tension they may feel by having to hide stuff/actions linked to their affair. I agree with Cobra, she's either in the marriage or not. Don't let her keep you dangling whilst she "test rides" another model. That isn't fair to you or your son.
Ladyjane14 Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 Hi, I need to know the truth so that I can be set free. If I know the truth now I can then start to cope, heal, and probably forgive. To move on and focus 100% of my attention and time to my son whom I love more that life itself. You don't need somebody else to "set you free" or decide the course of YOUR life for you. What you already know for sure is that your partner is NOT meeting her responsibilities within the relationship. So... your best bet is to decide what you're going to do about that. Yes. Marriages can be salvaged even after an infidelity. But in order to accomplish reconciliation, you have to have TWO people who want it. Right now, it looks like your WW (wayward wife) is only trying to placate you and keep you calm while she extricates herself from the marriage. Typically, marriage counseling is ineffective when there's an affair underfoot. I think your best chance for initiating a change of heart on her part is probably going to be to throw some tough love her way. Fact is, cheaters aren't well known for being responsive to their mates while they're 'under-the-influence' of their infatuation. As long as there are no consequences for their actions, their actions will usually remain selfish. Now, if it was me and my spouse was cheating and 'gaslighting' me... I'd probably just divorce him out-of-hand. I'm not so keen to hear a pack of lies as to hang around waiting for them. And cheaters lie until the truth is rubbed on their nose. So do their adultery partners. Neither are worth wasting your God-given time on in that respect. It's not until they've been left without a rock to scrabble under that the lies will stop. So... you can either expend your energy on detective work, or roll with what you already have, unless it makes a difference in the divorce proceedings in which case you'd need to compile your evidence. There is no book or program that is 100% effective and will guarantee you results. But, I think Willard Harley's Surviving An Affair and Michelle Weiner Davis' Divorce Busting are probably your best bet. You might read through a copy of Love Must Be Tough by Dobson as well. If you type into your browser "what are plan a and plan b, marriagebuilders", you'll find an article there which briefly describes Harley's program. You might want to read through his Basic Concepts section as well. And here is an excerpt from Weiner Davis: 1. Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or implore! 2. No frequent phone calls 3. Do not point out good points in marriage 4. Do not follow him around the house 5. Do not encourage talk about the future 6. Do not ask for help from family members 7. Do not ask for reassurances 8. Do not buy gifts 9. Do not schedule dates together 10. Do not spy on spouse 11. Do not say "I Love You" 12. Act as if you are moving on with your life 13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive 14. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get busy, do things, go to church, go out with friends, etc. 15. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words 16. If you are in the habit of asking your spouse his whereabouts, ASK NOTHING 17. You need to make your partner think that you have had an awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you are going to move on with your life, with or without your spouse 18. Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull back and wait to see if spouse notices and, more important, realize what he will be missing 19. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment. Show him someone he would want to be around. 20. All questions about marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while) 21. Never lose your cool 22. Don't be overly enthusiiastic 23. Do not argue about how he feels (it only makes their feelings stronger) 24. Be patient 25. Listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you 26. Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you want to speak out 27. Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil) 28. Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly 29. Know that if you can do 180, your smallest CONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say or write 30. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are desperate and needy 31. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse 32. Do not believe any of what you hear and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because he is hurting and scared 33. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel 34. Do not backslide from your hardearned changes Now, if you've already done a pretty good "Plan A", you might consider going right to "Plan B". If not, then your better bet is to step up your "Plan A" for a little while longer. It's the contrast, between a partner who's proved himself to be ready, willing, and able to meet ENs (Emotional Needs) and one who isn't, which can sometimes wake a WS up to the fact that they're REALLY going to lose their marriage. In "Plan A", you show your WS a more attractive alternative to the blank slate and possible ruination that's before them. All that said, I think "Plan A" works best when used in conjunction with some of Weiner Davis' 180's, (just the ones which feel more honest and true to your situation), because the utilization of 180's will remind a betrayed partner not to cling or behave in a needy way. They also create an air of mystery, which can sometimes peak a WS's interest. Typically, a WS wants to keep his/her partner on the backburner while they explore their affair, much as LifesontheUp has said... a safety net against wreck and ruin. Remember, there are REASONS why a WS keeps his/her mate in the dark. Sprinkling the 180's into your plan helps to keep them a little uncertain as to where they stand with you. To keep them a tad off-balance is good. It makes them second-guess themselves and focuses their attention more tightly on YOU.
Ladyjane14 Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 You might want to read through some threads in the Separation/Divorce section here at LS as well. Unfortunately, it's chock-full of guys with similar stories to yours. Check out Mike1966's thread in SecondChances too. I think he really had 'The Right Stuff' during his "Plan A", and even though things didn't pan out the way he had initially hoped, he seems fairly content with his efforts and with the final resolution. Remember... this is just a temporary phase in your life. One way or another, eventually this too shall pass.
bish Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 Yeah, I have some advice! Get a lawyer as fast as possible. Your wife is gone. You and I both know this. In time your heart will know this too. Some day you will regret every moment you spent diddling around playing at trying to win her back. Walk now! I agree 100% with Cobra, she is messing around on you big time and there is no way you want to stay with a woman like that. I thought I could do it for the kids sake....boy was I wrong. I'm now in the process of divorce and not regretting it. Sure it will be a lifestyle change, but it will be a life without a cheating huss. Only regret is that my kids lives are turned upside down by this, but this is not my doing its hers. She is the cheater. And this is your situation to. You are not doing this to your family..SHE IS. Divorce her and move on. If you have any dirt on her to get custody....use it!
LaughMachine Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 Your never a fool for being a nice guy, but you are a fool if you are too nice.
lexi29 Posted October 31, 2007 Posted October 31, 2007 Usually when there is another person involved and a trial seperation is requested its so that they can continue to see the other person without having to deal with any questions the husband/wife/partner would throw at them. Basically it allows them the freedom to carry on their affair without having to justify "missing" time to their partner and it can also ease any tension they may feel by having to hide stuff/actions linked to their affair. I totally agree with this. Your wife wants to "try out" life with the other guy before she totally lets go of you. She wants the chance to see if she can be happy with him while she holds on to her old life with you (you are probably taking care of your son, paying bills etc). If you let her stay in the comfort of your marriage while she dates some new guy, then of course she will probably fall for the new guy because she has nothing to lose. You need to give her an ultimatum, shake her little fantasy world up. Kick her out of the house, start divorce proceedings, something to wake her up to reality. If she doesn't want to work on the marriage, she needs to tell you, not string you along as her back up plan in case things don't work out with the new guy.
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