Mino Posted November 1, 2007 Posted November 1, 2007 I did n ot know I am not allowed to put links like this on LS!!!! I thought it was good information. Tried to edit it out, but it was too late. Hope I dont get in trouble again........
LucreziaBorgia Posted November 1, 2007 Posted November 1, 2007 Nadia, those traits you mentioned aren't the sort that change when your relationship does. It will only get worse when he is divorced. When that happens every little bit of guilt he feels over what he had done will manifest itself in comments like "I gave up my marriage for you", "I gave up my life to be with you" etc. and he will place all of the blame squarely on you when things don't go his way. He may even say stuff to you like "I can't believe I gave up my life for this!" This guy sounds worse with each posting. I'm not sure at this point exactly what you would be gaining by ending up with him, except a life of emotional abuse.
Author nadiaj2727 Posted November 1, 2007 Author Posted November 1, 2007 Norajane -- Thank you for sharing your friend's experiences. You're right, if he wanted to be getting a divorce, he would be, no matter what his WORDS are telling me... I can see his is not getting a divorce. Mino -- I have often wondered if he is bi-polar. He sure acts like it. I'm not sure but he's somehow crazy, I'm convinced of it. BTW last we talked you were trying to do complete NC w/ your MM. How is that going? Mine is obviously not going that well -- I'm TRYING not to talk to him but he keeps finding (supposedly work-related) reasons to talk to me. But I am not seeing him outside of work nor being physical with him etc. and I honestly have no desire to, so that's a big step. LB -- You're right, I think his traits/ behavior will get worse once if we were in a committed relationship. If he's this insecure and jealous NOW when he's married to someone else, I'd hate to see how it is when it's just him and me. That is not my type at all -- I crave my freedom and independence. I don't know how I got into this!!! He keeps calling me and asking for clarification on something, and he keeps asking me if I can "leave some room in my heart for him" once he's divorced and not call it off completely. He also asks me not to make decisions about whether or not we're totally over when I'm "upset" with him for being immature and selfish lately. He admits he's being this way but claims it's only b/c of the situation and says he's lonely and sad. He says it will be okay in the future. I don't believe him b/c how would I know he would change? Also if we were going through any hard times that made him feel lonely or sad or any other bad emotions, he would start acting like this again, and that's not what I want.
Mino Posted November 1, 2007 Posted November 1, 2007 Hi Nadia, I lasted 5 days!!! But in the meantime I did get myself back into counceling, and this time he did too. He knew that we were not getting anywhere with how we had been doing it. He is trying to figure himself out, and I am too. Very tough, since I see him everyday. But the good thing is he has relized what he is doing is selfish. and he is trying hard to figure himself out. At this point we are both kind of lost. He needs to learn to love himself, or this is somthing he will continue to do. He is looking to fill his emptyness with my love. That will never be enough. He needs to love himself completely. If he does not do this, and we were together, he would be soon looking elsewhere to fill this void, meaning he will cheat again. I know I do not want this in my life. In the meantime, I am dealing with myself. Trying to create a life not dependant on him. The problem we are now running into is how much do we back off of each other, completly or limited contact for us both to go through this process. So we are both healthly, and maybe pursue a heathly relationship. But it looks like this is going to take quite some time. We really want to continue at least with limited contact, because we are afraid to loose each other in this process. But in my heart I think, not sure, that we do have to let us go for now. I am lost on this one and so is he. any suggestions would be helpful:)
Author nadiaj2727 Posted November 2, 2007 Author Posted November 2, 2007 Hi Mino, It's great that you got into counseling. Do you think you can figure yourself out while you are still in the middle of this up-and-down relationship? Perhaps you both need a true break from each other to be able to think clearly, step back and gain some objective perspective. I do realize how hard that can be. But it can feel very empowering, like, "I'm FREE of the weight of that emotional rollercoaster right now, and free to concentrate on my own life for awhile." I don't know, just a thought. Good luck.
frannie Posted November 2, 2007 Posted November 2, 2007 I'm keeping this list as a reminder that I can never ever ever see him again. I don't think our biggest problem was that he was married. In fact I'm glad he's married b/c it's an easier out than trying to explain that I think he's verbally controlling and just not right for me (although I've tried to explain that, and he's come up with his arsenal of verbal tactics listed above). I don't know why his poor wife is still married to him, but she can have him. Thank you ladies for giving me this information, I always knew he was immature and childish but only now do I see that he was trying to manipulate and control me all along. nadia I'm so pleased for you :):)
Author nadiaj2727 Posted November 2, 2007 Author Posted November 2, 2007 Thanks, Frannie, it is definitely thanks to your help and others here. Yesterday he emailed me and told me he's sorry for hurting me and he understands my feelings and he hopes I can leave my heart open a little bit for him. That was the email where I was wondering if he finally "got it", before I did some reading about manipulative tactics and posted the list of manipulative things he does... including, I now know, telling me he's sorry and he understands. This morning on my way to work he called me. I did not answer of course. He left me a 5-minute long voicemail (I am not exaggerating). I am going to just start deleting them... they drive me crazy but they also remind me that's HE'S crazy and that I should never call him back or answer his phone call. In his voicemail he told me he doesn't think we should talk anymore (like it's his idea!) and that I've told him everything he needed to know. It's obvious to him that I don't have feelings for him, and that's all he wanted to know. (OBVIOUSLY. At least he's F-in' ADMITTING that all he cares about is how I feel ABOUT HIM -- not how I'm feeling in general, not how he feels about me, etc.) Then -- this totally proves my theory that everything he does is based on manipulation, even pretending to understand me and apologize -- he said, "You didn't even respond to my email yesterday where I'd asked you to please think about leaving your heart a little open for me when I'm divorced. So I guess you really don't care at all." OMG he ALWAYS does stuff like this -- he expects me to respond to any little "hint" he throws at me, without even asking me a question! He acts like he said, "Can you please leave your heart open for me?" and I'd totally ignored him (which I would have done anyway at this point, but still. But instead he just says something that he WANTS me to respond to with "of course my heart is still open for you, as long as it takes you to decide whether or not you may or may get divorced, I'll still be here waiting for you with my poor little lonely open heart, which only you can fill", and when I don't say that, because that's ridiculous, he gets offended and brings it up as something *I* did wrong. I hate this jerkoff so much. I'm sorry for ranting on here but it's the only thing I can do besides go tell him off, which I REALLY don't want to do, because he'd like that negative attention... at least it's attention.
Author nadiaj2727 Posted November 2, 2007 Author Posted November 2, 2007 Ha ha ha, thanks for making me laugh. If I've become wise, why do I feel so stupid??? I guess because I realize how STUPID I was from the get-go, and it's hard to understand how I could have let myself get into this mess.
frannie Posted November 2, 2007 Posted November 2, 2007 Ha ha ha, thanks for making me laugh. If I've become wise, why do I feel so stupid??? I guess because I realize how STUPID I was from the get-go, and it's hard to understand how I could have let myself get into this mess. In my experience it can take a while to realise just how nutty and manipulative some people are... it's no reflection on you at all, so no... you're not stupid (which I'm sure you realise! ) oh, and P.S. ... just reading about him puts my stomach in knots!
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