SusanChess Posted October 28, 2007 Posted October 28, 2007 This is a guy used to work with. The problem is that we never go anywhere unless I ask, and even then it's only when he has nothing else to do. Here are the positive signs from him: When we did work together, he used to sing these stupid love songs around me. He sometimes calls me for no real reason at work, and has even admitted that they were things he could have looked up the answer to himself. He's very helpful and likes to offer advice. He sometimes pays for everything when we go places, and gets mad if I try to pay for him. He gets excited when we do go somewhere, and always ends up doing something that makes me wonder if he does like me after all. One time we were out with one of his ex fwb, and he started explaining what he was like in bed. That night I also got him to divulge the names of everyone that he had ever slept with that we both knew. (Yeah, I know that was mean.) He's really forgetful about most things, but: He remembers everything I tell him about myself If I've called or texted him and he hasn't called back, he'll immediately bring up whatever the message was the next time I talk to him. Same thing if he says he doesn't want to do something, he'll ask me how everything went. He seemed hurt when I thought I was moving away. Here are some signs from me that he could percieve as negative: I've never "flirted" with him He asked me if I liked him twice a few years ago and I either laughed or made a joke. We were out once and he tried to put his hand over mine, and I pulled my hand away without looking at him He's invited me a party at his house with his staff and several other coworkers and I didn't go. It turns out that his whole family was in town, and he looked pissed when I saw him the next day. I sometimes don't remember what I've called and left messages aboutr, or things he's told me. Another negative sign from him: He was dating someone else and didn't tell me. So he called me being more flirty than usual, and I asked him how things were with the new girlfriend. He got upset and said that she was NOT his girlfriend, and that she was coming to see him(they lived an hour apart), not the other way around. They broke up a few weeks later.
Author SusanChess Posted October 28, 2007 Author Posted October 28, 2007 Oh, and *please* don't just say to ask him. I want an idea of how most people would size up the situation since I've never dated anyone before because of religious reasons. I'm not part of that religion anymore and am considering starting to date. I just have no idea when people are flirting, etc., since I wasn't "allowed" to pick upon those signals.
MsArtful Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 Although I'm not terribly experienced with relationships, from what you've said, it does indeed sound like he likes you. Things like him putting his hand on yours and actually asking if you like him are fairly bold indicators of this.
Stereogram Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 He likes you. The holding hand thing is sort of big....IF...he wasn't drunk when he did it.
Krytie TV Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 This is a guy used to work with. The problem is that we never go anywhere unless I ask, and even then it's only when he has nothing else to do. That should be all you need to know. Either he's insecure and afraid to ask you or he just doesn't care all that much. I think all the other things are irrelevant next to this. I can tell you from experience, though you may not believe me, that you don't want to be in a relationship with someone who won't initiate. But then... women seem to really go for the unavailable type. I forgot about that.
Cad Rake Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 Honey, no offense, but this question is so stupid it makes my teeth chatter. How in the world are we to know if a guy likes you? We've never seen his interactions with you. If you can't tell, then we certainly can't either just by reading a few words on a screen. Why don't you ask him out for coffee and see. I don't understand why you have such difficultly with that.
Trialbyfire Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 I agree about non-initiators. Don't you want someone a little more confident? If you really like him and don't want to ask him out, which I fully understand, give him the big green light by flirting with him. Use your eyes, touch him and get into his personal space. Dress up for him a bit. Wear a scent that's lingering but be careful, bathing in perfume is a big no, no. If this doesn't work, he's either not interested or a basket case.
Cad Rake Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 Or she could just ask him out rather than being passive and expecting him to do it. Heresy I know! I always wonder why women are so passive. ???
Trialbyfire Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 I've never asked a guy out and don't ever plan to. There are more than enough men who have the confidence to initiate. Shy or timid guys, aren't my preference.
Cad Rake Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 How about guys who aren't shy or timid.. they just like women who like them? Of course it's just a power thing for women. Guys who are interested enough to take the risk to ask the woman out are easier to control, due to their high interest levels. I'm not so naive that I don't understand that. I just wish men would work together and stop asking women out, so that women would start having to put forth some effort and risk. I'm always wondering why young girls are advised how to play the dating/mating game but young boys aren't! Guess society wants to encourage marriage (crappy as it is these days) rather than teach guys how to bang lots of women. It's because of these inequalities that I feel no qualms about lying to women.
Trialbyfire Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 Simply put, no balls, no date. If a guy's going to play hard to get, I'll be running in the opposite direction. If a guy's only interested in one thing, he'll have to please himself, all by himself...
Cad Rake Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 Must be why you have the time to post more than 10000 messages to these boards
Trialbyfire Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 Exactly. I never get asked out. It's horrible not being able to find a date. I'm so depressed...
Author SusanChess Posted October 29, 2007 Author Posted October 29, 2007 That should be all you need to know. Either he's insecure and afraid to ask you or he just doesn't care all that much. I think all the other things are irrelevant next to this. I can tell you from experience, though you may not believe me, that you don't want to be in a relationship with someone who won't initiate. But then... women seem to really go for the unavailable type. I forgot about that. Is it likely or unlikely that things I've done (like not flirting, laughing it off when he asked how I felt about him, pulling my hand away) would make him insecure and afraid to ask me?
Author SusanChess Posted October 29, 2007 Author Posted October 29, 2007 He likes you. The holding hand thing is sort of big....IF...he wasn't drunk when he did it. I think he was maybe two beers in, but that's not a lot for him. He's usually fine until about the 4th or 5th. After that I don't take him seriously no matter what he says or does, so I left out some stuff.
Author SusanChess Posted October 29, 2007 Author Posted October 29, 2007 Cadrake and Trialbyfire, you're both right and very funny Trialbyfire, the only thing is that I'm in his personal space a lot and it doesn't seem to bother him. We tend to stand really close together. I'm not sure how much closer I could get without jumping on top of him, and as much as he might enjoy that I ain't doin' it. I dressed up a little (for me) and he looked sort of, well, dumbfounded. Not in a "big smile" way and he didn't compliment me, more like his eyes got big and he didn't know what to do or say. (it wasn't revealing or anything, but it was the first time he'd seen me out of a ponytail.) Also, I try not to make eyes at him because whenever I do he gets this big smile and stares me down. Then I get embarrassed and look away.
Cad Rake Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 Is it likely or unlikely that things I've done (like not flirting, laughing it off when he asked how I felt about him, pulling my hand away) would make him insecure and afraid to ask me? Um, why don't you put yourself in his shoes. If he didn't flirt, laughed at you and pulled his hand away, would you ask him out? Contrary to what a lot of people seem to think, men and women are more alike than they are different. Chances are if you want him to ask you out, you should behave in ways that would encourage you to ask you out if you were him. Get it? Kinda like the golden rule, eh?
Author SusanChess Posted October 29, 2007 Author Posted October 29, 2007 I knew I should've paid attention in Sunday school.
Kamille Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 Yay Susan! I'm so happy about this thread! You are so much more positive in this one. (I answered on your other thread). And, yeah, from what you've written here, most signs point to yes, he likes you and yes, you gave him signs that you weren't that interested. And I totally concur with Trial by Fire. Just because you think you are in his space, doesn't mean that you are indeed. I found that the best, most non-threatening way to give a guy the strenght to make a move is to touch him. Start by touching him on the arm while you are talking - or, my favorite move, when you two meet up, firmly touch his arm with a big smile on your face. Let him know you are happy to see him. If you already do that, then try touching his back when you two are standing at a bar. Once you've mastered that one, touch him on the knee. This moves felt awkward at first, but they have actually helped me improve my confidence with men. Every guy I've ever dated since discovering the touching trick has made comments about how they melted when I grabbed their arm or how they were putty in my hands when I touched their knee.
Trialbyfire Posted October 29, 2007 Posted October 29, 2007 I also agree with Kamille. Touch is a big deal, if he's interested. Think about the rush you received when he touched your hand. Susan, don't be afraid to maintain eye contact but not in an interrogating fashion. More with a smile in your eyes, give him flirtatious looks. One way is to look at him full on, he makes eye contact, you look down for a split second, then look back at him with a flirtatious smile.
Author SusanChess Posted October 29, 2007 Author Posted October 29, 2007 Thanks Kamille! Your post had a big impact, especially when you said "I was convinced that no guy could possibly want to date me and would therefore keep men at bay- simply by being awkward around them or downright stand-offish. I would avoid talking to men, especially men I found attractive, and if one approached me, I would cut the conversation short and walk away. Do you do any of that?" Seriously, it's like an exact description of what I always do. I'm concentrating on looking a little more "open" when I'm out in public now, trying not to look down and frown so much.
Author SusanChess Posted October 29, 2007 Author Posted October 29, 2007 Thanks everyone for the great, practical advice! Now of course I have 50 more questions What about doing these things? I remember a lot of our old coworkers would scratch the top of his head when they were happy with him, and he really seemed to enjoy it. I never did it though. Would something like that be too much? What about hugging him hello, goodbye, or as a thank you? (I've only done that once, and that was because he just moved back into town and I hadn't seen him in a long time. I haven't really done it since because I had to push him a way a little because he didn't seem like he was going to let go any time soon, and there were a lot of people around including his old (and my current) boss. Even then he made this weird grabby motion that I had to jerk away from since I guess he wasn't done yet.) What about things like grabbing his forearm to pull him a little in the direction I want to go (like say I wanted us to go in his office to talk or work on something, is it okay to give him a little tug?) I have a hard time maintaining extended eye contact with him because he always gets this look on his face and smiles, and if it goes on too long he'll start to lean in towards me. So I always get embarrassed and look down and away. Is there a way to avoid that, or should I look away? I can't figure out what he's going to do so I've just avoided finding out. Is looking away considered flirting/a good sign or continuing to look at him?
boop-oop-a-doop Posted October 30, 2007 Posted October 30, 2007 You're completely clueless, aren't cha?
Author SusanChess Posted October 30, 2007 Author Posted October 30, 2007 You're completely clueless, aren't cha? Pretty much. Any ideas on my questions?
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