frannie Posted October 10, 2007 Posted October 10, 2007 Hmmm... I don't find it at all surprising that a W might want to do anything possible to save her marriage. Even if that meant 'begging' or pleading or any other tactic. Why would wives be any different than OW..? We are all in love or in some need of this man in our lives. W and OW aren't cut from completely different cloth, however many times people claim they're two different races or something. They're all just women at the end of the day.
PoshPrincess Posted October 10, 2007 Posted October 10, 2007 I don't know about that. I think this situation makes women strong. Have you ever read the BS boards? They never mention begging and pleading unless it's the mm doing it for forgivess. I just think mm likes to paint this weak willed helpless woman to his ow so they seem the sweetheart when they do things they "say" they really don't want to. Ok, point taken! Having not been a bs I don't know first hand, of course, but I saw my Mum like that many a time with my Dad. Posh I find it hard to believe you would cry and beg a man. Thanks for the compliment. Even my friends think of me as confident and together but they'd be surprised if they saw how vulnerable I can be in Rs. I didn't quite beg exmm but I may as well have done as I feel just as pathetic for the way I behaved! Crying down the phone telling him how much I love him wasn't my finest moment, I can tell you! I like to think I have learned never to be that weak again. Fingers crossed!
frannie Posted October 10, 2007 Posted October 10, 2007 Hm. I think it's pretty harsh - and I don't say this as a flame to you OWoman, just a general comment on the topic - to dismiss women who fall apart in the face of shattering news as not strong. Perhaps, as Frannie says, such behavior is manipulation. From personal experience, I call it temporary insanity. I fell apart, too, and said things I'm not proud of. I called, I sobbed, I pleaded, I raged. I went through hell. Yes, I wish I'd gone back and edited my post after I hit, 'send' because I realise that it looked like I was being critical of the W for being manipulative. I wasn't meaning to be so. I can quite understand what she's doing and why. And I don't blame her in the slightest for her reactions and buying the tickets or anything... I wrote something of the kind in my post that I think was posted at the same time you sent this, SM.
serial muse Posted October 10, 2007 Posted October 10, 2007 Hmmm... I don't find it at all surprising that a W might want to do anything possible to save her marriage. Even if that meant 'begging' or pleading or any other tactic. Why would wives be any different than OW..? We are all in love or in some need of this man in our lives. W and OW aren't cut from completely different cloth, however many times people claim they're two different races or something. They're all just women at the end of the day. Again - I'm not sure I'd be so quick to call everything the other person in the triangle does a "tactic." Sometimes it's just genuine emotion and hurt. But I agree with you - we have more in common than not, more often than not.
frannie Posted October 10, 2007 Posted October 10, 2007 Again - I'm not sure I'd be so quick to call everything the other person in the triangle does a "tactic." Sometimes it's just genuine emotion and hurt. But I agree with you - we have more in common than not, more often than not. LOL... OK I hope my postion on this is clear now. I seem to be using very emotive language. Let's substitute 'behaviour' for 'tactic' and then maybe it won't seem so critical. I don't think any of it is necessarily premeditated or conscious.
serial muse Posted October 10, 2007 Posted October 10, 2007 LOL... OK I hope my postion on this is clear now. I seem to be using very emotive language. Let's substitute 'behaviour' for 'tactic' and then maybe it won't seem so critical. I don't think any of it is necessarily premeditated or conscious. Ha - I was just editing my post to say that I was getting caught up in semantics but I understand what you're saying. You were too quick for me.
Author OWoman Posted October 11, 2007 Author Posted October 11, 2007 Hm. I think it's pretty harsh - and I don't say this as a flame to you OWoman, just a general comment on the topic - to dismiss women who fall apart in the face of shattering news as not strong. No, absolutely, that was the point I was trying (perhaps too incoherently) to make. My colleague is a VERY strong woman, I see her every day in perfect control of a very difficult and demanding portfolio where she's respected (and feared!) and to see her in such a state where she was prepared to compromise her dignity like that in front of others BECAUSE OF THE SITUATION was disturbing. My point was in response to NF's assertion that the SITUATION made women strong - I was saying that sometimes it has the opposite effect and makes a strong woman behave in very uncharacteristic ways.
torranceshipman Posted October 11, 2007 Posted October 11, 2007 Hey OWoman, Please be careful - I'd stake a bet FOR SURE that this guy will DEFINITELY go on vacation with his wife and kids, and has always planned to go, because he wants a family vacation (and probably helped plan it). So much of this story sounds fishy and I think he is manipulating you by telling you a load of stories about how bad his life is - yet he's still at home! - I think he is trying to make you believe this bull so you don't complain that he is going on vacation with his family - and even more, that the vacation wont make you made or stop hanging out with him, so he gets his vacation AND you. If it was that bad at home, and he wanted to make it easier on the W and less confusing for the C - he'd have moved out and be renting a place by now - it isnt hard to organise that...if the W is having mood swings and drinking, thats probably because he is treating her badly and gaslighting her all over the place, by having an A with you...driving her a bit crazy, basically - remember this is her family that is being messed around here. You dont have anything to lose by being more critical of this situation and trying to find out the truth yourself i.e. not from his mouth - from a more impartial source.
stillafool Posted October 11, 2007 Posted October 11, 2007 OW I have to somewhat agree with Torranceshipman. Something is fishy. I think you should tell MM you do not want him to go on vacation with W and kids. What good would it do anyway? It's just going to make them both more miserable and not very much fun at all for the kids. I think it is giving her "false hopes" if this is true. Somehow I don't feel he is being truthful with you. I think you should demand he not go and see what happens. There's no good reason for him to go.
Author OWoman Posted October 11, 2007 Author Posted October 11, 2007 OK, Update on this: MM has organised a family friend to go in his place. Not exactly a friend of theirs, but one of the kids' friends' parents, who's an archaeologist and who did some work in the area they'll be visiting. She's booked for her kids to join them, so it'll be two families, no dads. The kids are cool with that - they'll have friends, and W is not saying much either way, but I'm sure she'll be fine once they go. Friend doesn't know the details of why MM can't make it, but seemed happy enough to fall in at short notice. MM has meantime booked to come visit me while they're away! He sent me the flight confirmation details and asked me if I could fetch him at the airport but I'm not sure that's a good idea. I know he's wanting it to be a nice surprise, but the timing is not great for me work-wise, or for him, and I'd much rather he defer it for a while. I've mailed him what I hope is a diplomatic reply telling him I'd love to see him when we can properly appreciate the time together. No response yet but he's busy doing Dad Stuff so won't read his mail for a while. Thanks for the advice guys - it really helped and I'm glad things seem to have worked out well all round.
Impudent Oyster Posted October 11, 2007 Posted October 11, 2007 That IS serendipitous, imagine, the friend AND her kids were able to make a decision to take the time off and book their tickets and plan a vacation all in one day! Why it's almost unbelievable....
frannie Posted October 13, 2007 Posted October 13, 2007 He... can't afford to take the time off work as he's made commitments. He's angry at her for not considering his work demands - she knows he's working to tight deadlines at the moment... MM has organised a family friend to go in his place. W is not saying much either way, but I'm sure she'll be fine once they go. MM has meantime booked to come visit me while they're away! He sent me the flight confirmation details and asked me if I could fetch him at the airport but I'm not sure that's a good idea. I know he's wanting it to be a nice surprise, but the timing is not great for me work-wise, or for him, and I'd much rather he defer it for a while. So... he tells his W that it's not convenient because of work pressures... then books to come and see you..? No wonder she's not getting the message. Why can't he be straight with her..? (rhetorical question in some ways) Is she really 'not saying much either way'..? What is the situation regarding him leaving..? And is that OK with you..?
Author OWoman Posted October 13, 2007 Author Posted October 13, 2007 So... he tells his W that it's not convenient because of work pressures... then books to come and see you..? Exactly. Idiocy doesn't begin to describe it. But he did see sense and reschedule it for later. Maybe I'm more tactful than I give myself credit for!! No wonder she's not getting the message. Why can't he be straight with her..? (rhetorical question in some ways) Is she really 'not saying much either way'..? Telling her it would create false hope didn't seem to register. The "not saying much" about the friend as a substitute... hard to know really - I've only got what he's told me, and as he's been avoiding her there's not really been much of that. What is the situation regarding him leaving..? And is that OK with you..? He's gone to see the grand total of three places. One was a complete dive, I think the usual kind of tenants must be accommodated behind in a secure facility for the moment . Another one - the first one he went to see - was very far out and was really tiny. He was prepared to move there at least until something better came up but the kids refused. The third one looks more positive although it's pretty pricey, but there's someone else also interested who got in ahead so he's waiting to hear on that one (and seems to have stopped looking since). It's not my business and I don't much care where he's staying - originally I'd suggested not moving out completely because of the disruption for the kids and because the additional expense will delay our being together full-time, but given the way things are going now, desperate times call for desperate measures. The kids are not so happy about it - there was a heated discussion (after the visit to the tiny place) about why shouldn't the W be the one to move out and the kids and MM stay on in the house instead of them all moving and she stays... She wasn't in the room at the time was in the house so must have heard.
cheryl14 Posted October 21, 2007 Posted October 21, 2007 I feel he should definatley NOT GO- I agree with the post he should have a family friend go with them instead.
Recommended Posts