Question for guys, how long would you wait?

[halfarock]

So, you're basically saying that, you don't feel that sex is a big factor in a relationship? Without a healthy sex life, a relationship is usually doomed for failure. My point is that why not be really close friends if sex isn't a big factor... logically speaking, I see sex as the primary difference between a friendship and a relationship. Then again, I don't consider many people friends.

 

Currently, my girlfriend is my closest friend. With her, friendship and relationship, it is all the same thing.

 

See, you are saying that you love a woman because you have sex with her.

 

I am saying that I have sex with a woman because I love her.

 

I guess it is just one of those chicken and egg things.

[FormerNiceGuy]

i've been in a ltr for close to 3 year and we haven't had sex yet. now i feel so silly, we had our first kiss only after 1.5yrs.

 

I'm sorry...but that's just sad, man.

 

 

anyways, there is no set date. You do it when you want to. And if he leaves you because of it...then oh well..Sex should be something you should feel that you WANT to give and do. It's not so much for the other person..but for yourself. If you don't feel it's the right time..then it's not the right time...regardless of what the hell he or she says..

 

 

But three years....that's pushing it.

[Lizzie60]

For example, you are dating a girl and she says she wants to wait to have sex. How long do you wait for her? Do guys have a set time in their minds? Like if she doesn't have sex with you, say after a month, do you dump her? Are you willing to wait as long as it takes if you really like her?

 

I don't think there is a 'standard' time for sex... Whenever the partners feel like being intimate...

 

but if one partner doesn't want it while the other wants...then I see that it could be a huge problem...

 

One month...it depends...if you see her everyday...one month is a looong time... but if you see her once a week... maybe it's not that long... it all depends...

 

Personally I see no difference in having sex the first night or 3-4 dates later... if the 2 persons really like each other, that won't make any difference. IMO.

[amber1]

:oAnd my apologies to the original poster. Not trying to take over this thread, but this thread is so releveant to my current situation.

 

No problem at all.

[amber1]

Thanks for all of your replies.

[Darkzen]

But when you explain it as a reason as to WHY sex needs to happen early in a relationship, then it appears that sex is a NEED not an expression of love.

 

And, what's the problem with wanting to have sex with your partner before you get into a relationship? I don't see the issue and I bet most people don't, aside from people who believe sex is something that is to be placed on a pedestal. It's part of the relationship, might as well put all the cards on the table before moving forward.

 

Actually, no, I am not. And yes it is important. I think where we disagree is if it is important to be jumping into bed within the first few months or dates of a relationship. Commitment is better for compatibility than performance.

 

We disagree, because you think I'm merely talking about the purely physical aspect of sex. It can be a lot more involved than just "getting off".

Since you are ruled by logic, then based on that logic, why not have sex on the first date? If sex is bad, the no more dates? Maybe because sex is more than driving a car?

 

My logic tells me to want the best understanding of a person as possible (physically, emotionally and spiritually), before making a commitment to them.

 

Sex is not some magical thing that either works or doesn't. It can be improved upon by practice. So, incompatibility the first time does not mean that the relationship should be over. Then too much emphasis is being put on the mechanics of sex. If you love the person, then the incopmpatibility can be worked on.

 

I'm not referring to just the mechanics of sex... just as I realize that you're not referring to just the concept of "love", instead you're talking about all the things that make "love", love. And yes, the mechanics of sex can be worked on, but by the same token... so can other mechanics in a relationship.

 

BTW, what does "incompatibility" mean to you?

 

It means to me, that one side has the inability to compromise, making all attempts for the situation fail. I.E. we're incompatible because we both refuse to budge on our views.

Yes, it is, but in many areas, the feeling that this is the person I want to spend my life with...this feeling will give you the desire to develop the compatibility. Some areas are not that way. Common interests are one, but again, if I don't like skiing and my lady does, then I can learn to like it. If I have a hard time shopping, then I can develop an interest because I love her. And if we have "sexual incompatibility," then this does not have to be a "ok, we just had bad sex..see ya" type of response. Personally, I am not married to the best kisser that I ever dated, but there is no way that I would ever trade my wife for the one woman that was. Kissing my wife is so much deeper than simply the technique. So, sexual incompatibility should not be the one deciding factor.

 

Sexual incompatibility would be something that isn't fixable, because no compromise can be made. For example, say I want to experiment with anal sex and my GF refuses. I can compromise and deal with or she can compromise and deal with it or hell we could even compromise together and she might allow me to stick a finger in there. Point being, it's incompatibility of a sexual nature, if neither is willing to compromise. Love for someone won't change your views, maybe make you willing to compromise, but sometimes that can lead to resentment.

 

Then I won't try. But I also think that dropping a girl because she won't "put out" soon enough is a way to lose someone who may be the best choice for a long term marriage.

 

Obviously, because you two see eye to eye on sex... it must mean big things for the marriage. The time frame is relative, but the concept is pretty set in stone. I'm not willing to start a LTR if the girl isn't willing to have sex before hand. I don't take commitment lightly, when I commit to someone I put my soul into it. Sorry if I would like to not jump into something without being as informed as possible... we're just going to have to agree to disagree.

 

Actually, most people turn it into a physical activity that has no bearing as an expression of love. We can be physically attracted and physicaly compatible, but our lives may be miserable. But we can have no sex and be great friends and have a great life. Sex in relationships is relative...some need a lot. Some don't. Just because sex happens a lot during dating does not mean that it will happen a lot during marriage. So many factors will change that. So, "knowing" that the two of you are sexually compatible is not enough. It is more important to spend that time prior to marriage learning as much as possible about likes, dislikes, interests, communicating verbally, and future desires/plans. Learning that you are sexually compatible falls way down on the list.

 

So because other people make sex purely physical, means that I do? Sex can be a beautiful thing for expressing yourself emotionally. You can convey things that words don't do justice. I firmly believe that action speaks volumes more than words.

 

Being open and honest about sex does not necessarily physically doing intercourse. This means that the two of you communicate expectations and desires. This means that you talk about what you like and don't like. This does not mean sexual performance. Too often during dating days there is NOT enough openess about sex. Yes, there is plenty of activity but not enough communication. That is why what seemed to be a good sex dating relationship turns into a low sex marriage. The guy expects sex every chance he gets, the lady figures once a week is enough. Talking would have helped...not performing.

Yes and no, depending on your views. Nor does sexual performance have anything to do with it. Being bad in bed can be worked on, feeling and expressing passion for the other person cannot.

Then you have not spent enough time communicating. But if she has sex with you...this in no way means that she will keep having sex with you. During dating days, everyone is on their best behavior...even if you are living together. Communication about children and sex is better than having children and having sex.

 

Actions speak louder than words. Words and love won't get you on the subway. Talking is cool and has it's place, but so does sex. Balance is the key. You keep assuming that I'm merely talking about just having sex. Not the bigger picture, that it's a piece of a puzzle and that puzzle can't be completed, if you don't have all the pieces.

Talking about sex is being open with one another. Having sex does not mean you are open with one another. And sex should be part of a commitment...certainly not a REQUIREMENT of commitment.

You can waste your time then. I try and reduce risks before taking chances. I don't think being properly prepared is such a bad thing.

 

No, and you don't have a baby and then give it back if it isn't exactly what you want. The car analogy is wrong on so many points, I won't go there. Some relationships go so much deeper than buying a house or car. Women are not objects nor are they property. They (hopefully) are the person with whom you will spend the rest of your life. When I did a check on statistics regarding cohabitation. premarital sex and divorce....the correlation is not more sex equals less divorce.

 

How many cars have you had in your life? Now how many GFs? Both decisions are important in the grand scheme of life. You're deluding yourself into believing that relationships are more than they are. Especially if you aren't informed in the "buying" stage. The analogy was used to show that being informed about a situation is important. Do you even know why people take a car on a test drive? It's to look for problems and learn more about the car, not because they want to cruise around for fun.

 

Many marriages have gone a lifetime with no premarital sex, but many marriages have failed because of no premarital communication.

 

I agree, communication is key in a relationship, probably the most important aspect TBH. That doesn't mean that sex shouldn't be a consideration before you get into a relationship.

[JamesM]

And, what's the problem with wanting to have sex with your partner before you get into a relationship?

 

BEFORE you get into a relationship? Does that mean on the first date? Or the second? I do see the issue and it is from experience. However, it is true if both want sex immediately, then so be it. But again, if sex takes away from the time that could be better used talking, then it will be detrimental to the LTR. What is sex for? Yes, there are one-night stands, etc., but in the scope of a relationship, sex is used for expressing love and it should say commitment. Again, to harp on the same thing, the key to a LTR is not good sex…it is good communication. It is making time for each other every day. It is knowing that the two of you are a team. Having great sex every night is not the key to a long and satisfying relationship. In fact, it plays a small part.

 

 

We disagree, because you think I'm merely talking about the purely physical aspect of sex. It can be a lot more involved than just "getting off".

 

I think we disagree because you compare sex to a chemical feeling that attracts you to a person…instead of a mutual expression resulting FROM the attraction. We disagree because I know that after almost 18 years of marriage and ten years of dating prior, love can be expressed through sex. It is not about technique…it is about expression and giving.

 

My logic tells me to want the best understanding of a person as possible (physically, emotionally and spiritually), before making a commitment to them.

 

You are right…it is best to get as best of an understanding as possible before marriage. The problem is as you undoubtedly have found out….we all put on our best behavior when dating. Techniques that are “enjoyed” at first are despised later. (Ask the guys…how many GFs do BJs as compared to wives who do BJs). The question is…should the compatibility in the sexual area have as much “weight” in a decision towards commitment as the compatibility in the emotional and spiritual areas? Is it more important to be great friends or to be great sex partners? I don’t think it can be said that it is equal. How do we get to know the other person…through sex or through communication?

 

And yes, the mechanics of sex can be worked on, but by the same token... so can other mechanics in a relationship.

 

That is correct. I am not the same person. My wife is not the same person she was when I married her. Her values have changed, her emotions are different, her physical appearance has changed, and her sexual interests have changed. Our interactions with one another have gone up and down. If I had used her sexual prowess/physical attributes or lack thereof as a measure of what she would be like today, then I would have been mistaken. While I know this played a factor in my decision, the amount of sex we had has no bearing on the actuality of what our sex life has been during our marriage. Fact is…I would have told you that sex would never be a problem area for us. And so the reverse has been true for others, sex was not as “wonderful’ during the dating days, but once they learned how to please each other, the sex improved tremendously as did their relationship.

 

Sexual incompatibility would be something that isn't fixable, because no compromise can be made. For example, say I want to experiment with anal sex and my GF refuses.

 

Based on your definition, then I agree. But communication about sex is more important to that than actual sex. And based on experience, it is fixable. Taking anal as an example….if she does not want to do it and it is that important to you, then you should leave. But is this something that needs to be tried or communicated? And does that mean she will never do it? Fact is…many people are willing to experiment AFTER a commitment has been made and trust developed. Since sex should be a mutual expression of love, then techniques should never be a reason for deciding a commitment…IMO. I can say that simply because she does or doesn’t want to do something at the point of commitment does not mean that she won’t change. Having sex is one thing, but to base your feeling that you will or won’t commit because of what techniques she is willing to do that is quite something else. Then too much emphasis is placed on the mechanics rather than on the expression of sex.

 

 

I'm not willing to start a LTR if the girl isn't willing to have sex before hand. I don't take commitment lightly, when I commit to someone I put my soul into it.

 

I think that for many people having sex does the opposite of what you say….because many dwell on sex, they are not informed about their partner as they could have been. Not saying that this is you. For most men, sex does not equal commitment. Many times the future is not investigated because the present is being enjoyed. And then commitment is taken lightly.

 

Actions speak louder than words. Words and love won't get you on the subway. Talking is cool and has it's place, but so does sex. Balance is the key.

 

I did not follow the subway analogy, but actions do speak louder than words. And sex is just one of the many ways to express love. Sexual techniques as part of expression are okay, but sexual “incompatibility” during the dating days as a direct correlation to how sex will be in marriage, IMO, does not relate. Being a sexual Casanova will have no correlation to how great of a partner you will be, nor will it show what kind of partner she will be. Communication will have a direct correlation.

 

You can waste your time then. I try and reduce risks before taking chances. I don't think being properly prepared is such a bad thing.

 

As Dr. Phil would say, “How’s that been workin’ for you?” I can say that it is good to reduce risks before marriage, but I know that if my wife and I had been more physical during dating, our lives would not be better today.

 

How many cars have you had in your life? Now how many GFs?

 

Hmmm. quite the comparison.

 

You're deluding yourself into believing that relationships are more than they are.

 

No, I have experienced that they are.

 

Do you even know why people take a car on a test drive? It's to look for problems and learn more about the car, not because they want to cruise around for fun.

 

I have probably had as many cars as girlfriends. And I have had a few dogs, too. And all have involved making researched decisions. And I have a house, too. Another researched decision. And a job. Another researched decision. But here is the key…choosing a wife is NOT the same as the other decisions I have made.

 

Relationships DO have great importance. How do you feel when one ends? How do you feel when you sell a car? It has been said…and based on my experience and observations…”the biggest decision a person can make in his or her life is the choosing of a husband/wife.” This will determine more of how your life goes than any other decision you can make.

 

No, I have no clue why one test drives a car. Pray tell me. But I will go with your analogy. When you buy a car…and I am in the process right now…you test drive a car to see how it performs. Having sex…in your mind…is a way to be informed about your future sexual prospects with the lady. Yet explain to me why when surveyed, couples who had premarital sex were more likely to divorce than couples who did not have premarital sex. And explain why couples who lived together before marriage were more likely to be divorced than those who didn’t. This is not to judge those who cohabitate, have premarital sex, or divorce, but it is a way to help those deciding how to “be informed” before marrying.

 

I agree, communication is key in a relationship, probably the most important aspect TBH. That doesn't mean that sex shouldn't be a consideration before you get into a relationship.

 

The OP never said it shouldn’t be a consideration, nor do I. But I do question the value of sexual activity as a way of deciding a commitment. How many divorced couples would say, “We should have had more sex while we were dating” as compared to the divorced couples who say, “We should have talked more about sex, finances, children, and the other many issues we face?”

 

Again, many marriages have gone a lifetime with no premarital sex. But many marriages have failed because of too little premarital communication.

[Darkzen]

I stopped reading after your third counter point... no point continuing this if you, keep turning every time I mention sex, into only the mechanics of it and not the entire concept.

 

Sex, when referred to in the context of a relationship, is more than just an action. Until you stop being selective to help makes points, I'm done trying to clarify and debating the topic with you.

[JamesM]

I stopped reading after your third counter point... no point continuing this if you, keep turning every time I mention sex, into only the mechanics of it and not the entire concept.

 

Sex, when referred to in the context of a relationship, is more than just an action. Until you stop being selective to help makes points, I'm done trying to clarify and debating the topic with you.

 

I will assume then that I read your comparisons to test driving a car and a chemical reaction as different than you meant. I thought I followed your examples of anal sex and techniques as an example of incompatibility. I quoted your words and thoughts. I never thought I was being selective, but I apologize if you thought so.

 

I don't think you meant only mechanics of sex, but I wonder if you placed as much emphasis on sex as an expression of love rather than a requirement of love. Since it has been shown that abstinence in dating can still lead to long and healthy marriages, then I think that explains it all.

 

But either way, you have your opinion, and I have mine. I doubt either is wrong or right as long as it works. I made my points...you made yours. So be it.

 

I think by this point our discussion has no longer been helpful to the OP. You are correct...there is no longer any need to continue.

[ahah2322]

I'm sorry...but that's just sad, man.

 

 

anyways, there is no set date. You do it when you want to. And if he leaves you because of it...then oh well..Sex should be something you should feel that you WANT to give and do. It's not so much for the other person..but for yourself. If you don't feel it's the right time..then it's not the right time...regardless of what the hell he or she says..

 

 

But three years....that's pushing it.

 

we do satisfy ourselves in other ways as obviously we both have high libido and urges. indubitably, sex changes the dynamics of a relationship.

 

on another note, your statements seem to contradict each other. while 3 years does seem like a relatively long time, if either one of us does not feel 'ready', i would suppose that it is pointless engaging in it.

 

not feeling 'ready' to engage in sex or love making is not an ominous sign for incompatibility. perhaps, it might be better to be affirmed of compatibility on non-sexual levels first before testing out sexual compatibility. moreover, not having sex does not preclude intimacy between a couple.

[Darkzen]

we do satisfy ourselves in other ways as obviously we both have high libido and urges. indubitably, sex changes the dynamics of a relationship.

 

on another note, your statements seem to contradict each other. while 3 years does seem like a relatively long time, if either one of us does not feel 'ready', i would suppose that it is pointless engaging in it.

 

not feeling 'ready' to engage in sex or love making is not an ominous sign for incompatibility. perhaps, it might be better to be affirmed of compatibility on non-sexual levels first before testing out sexual compatibility. moreover, not having sex does not preclude intimacy between a couple.

 

I never implied it did. I'm merely saying that it's an aspect of any relationship, it should be explored just as any other aspect should be. I'm not saying that it's required or that it hast to happen right away... I am saying that it should happen before a commitment is made, so that it doesn't lead to problems down the road.

 

You may be horrible in bed and your SO might lose attraction to you for it. Not saying that it can't be worked out, but it's a problem that could have been avoided, if people aren't willing to work it out... thus saving everyone time, headache and heartache.

 

 

That's why my opinion is to get it out of the way earlier, rather than later. In all aspects... be it communication, physical, beliefs, etc...

[Darkzen]

I will assume then that I read your comparisons to test driving a car and a chemical reaction as different than you meant. I thought I followed your examples of anal sex and techniques as an example of incompatibility. I quoted your words and thoughts. I never thought I was being selective, but I apologize if you thought so.

 

I don't think you meant only mechanics of sex, but I wonder if you placed as much emphasis on sex as an expression of love rather than a requirement of love. Since it has been shown that abstinence in dating can still lead to long and healthy marriages, then I think that explains it all.

 

But either way, you have your opinion, and I have mine. I doubt either is wrong or right as long as it works. I made my points...you made yours. So be it.

 

I think by this point our discussion has no longer been helpful to the OP. You are correct...there is no longer any need to continue.

 

Fair enough.

[alterego1234]

This is actually why I asked the question. I'm not a virgin but I have decided to wait until marriage now due to religious reasons. I just wanted to see how long a guy would wait if he was really into someone who was worth waiting for.

 

Wow, I didn't realize I had created a monster of a thread!

 

My ex and I first had sex successfully about 9 months after our wedding day. And I don't mean having a baby, I mean successfully having sex -- she had that "clamp up the vagina because she's freaked out" thing and I was wimpily being too patient. We dated about 4 years before we got married, so I guess I waited about 4 years and 9 months for her. While we were dating, we did "fool around" and do nearly everything else one can do without having sex, though.

 

But I had religious reasons for that, and I still hold those convictions today. But just speaking as a guy, I was tempted to have sex outside of marriage then and am tempted now.

 

I think in an ideal world it would involve dialogue and communication between the two people about sex (or any other subject, for that matter) so you can find out if you are compatible. If the two people are honest, it seems like that would work. Maybe I'm naive. But if I like sexual practice / object / behavior X, it seems I could just say, "Hey, what do you think about X?" and she could say, "Oh, I love X too!" or "Meh, I could take it or leave it..." or "I'd give it a try" or "I would never do X, that's disgusting!" or whatever she happened to think about it. She and I would not necessarily have to do X in order to find out if we're compatible. I mean, let's suppose X is a fantasy about a nurse/patient relationship -- if she and I talk about it and are both into that idea, I bet the details of whether the outfit buttoned up the front or the back, or if the patient had the flu or a broken leg are going to be sexual dealbreakers. Even then, it seems like even that stuff could be talked out ahead of time if it were important to both people.

 

Personally I would be attracted to someone that I could discuss this stuff with honestly, openly, and in an equal partnership manner where there was some back and forth -- say she says she's willing to try the nurse thing but she has concerns about the neighbors seeing through the windows, so the guy agrees to get window shades or rent a hotel room or whatever. Some negotiation (without playing games or a power struggle) and listening, respect for feelings, etc.

 

The fact that people seem to be saying that sex after a few dates is ordinary and waiting a few months is pushing the limits is a surprise to me. I knew that happened, but I didn't think the prevalence of it was quite what it appears to be. I know I need to keep this in mind, because I may innocently invite someone over to watch a movie at my house in the evening, or date someone a couple of times, and they're interpreting my actions as a prelude to sex when I am being hopelessly 1950's.

 

So amber1, I would say that a guy who is similarly minded about waiting until marriage would probably look at your decision and respect it, understand it, appreciate it, and maybe be a little bit frustrated physically by it. But even then, he's probably a guy worth waiting for ;-)

[Phateless]

For example, you are dating a girl and she says she wants to wait to have sex. How long do you wait for her? Do guys have a set time in their minds? Like if she doesn't have sex with you, say after a month, do you dump her? Are you willing to wait as long as it takes if you really like her?

 

 

depends on the situation and the girl. If i really loved the girl and she was a virgin or something, I would wait as long as she wanted. If it's just casual dating and I don't really see a future, I would probably get impatient after 2 months ish? Again, if she's a virgin, that changes everything and I would be patient until she's ready.

 

If i'm not serious about someone I don't want to spend a lot of time with them in the first place.

[Timberlane]

Reason #452 She didn't call back this week.

She left her phone at a restaurant and just discovered this today.

 

Yay! So we touched base and I am seeing her tomorrow night and then taking her to the airport the next morning. So nice how all of these little snaffus just roll off the back and turn out to be nothing. Such a cool girl.

[Cad Rake]

If it's just casual dating and I don't really see a future, I would probably get impatient after 2 months ish?

 

The internet has opened my eyes to behavior that I would not have otherwise thought possible.

 

"Casual" = 2 MONTHS??? hahahaha.. where I'm from, casual = 1 night.