Does my CLIENT feel guilty for kissing me or does he still want me????

[Centar13]

I must have missed the part where you told him about your emotional affair with your client.

 

 

 

Why does it matter 2 you why your H is suddenly attentive, so long as he's attentive? And in a healthy manner! His therapist probably had some relationship-building suggestions for him!

 

 

 

Good. Hopefully, you will be completely truthful with your therapist, if you can't be with your H. And maybe your therapist can help you 2 find ways 2 be truthful with your H.

 

 

 

One thing you'll quickly learn from therapy - if your therapist is any good (and not all are, sadly) - is that you need 2 stop these disrespectful judgments of your H.

 

best,

-ol' 2long

Hey 2long... I did not have an emotional affair with my client... My H was never discussed nor was anything about my marriage that I am unhappy. my conversations with him were always business related

 

and yes.. the therapist gave some reading material to help build the relationship, altough majority of it did not pertain to our relationship it did have some good points to it.

 

As for being truthful... thats insane to tell a jealous person that I kissed another man that meant nothing. As for H... I'll give you another instance why i have resentment.. there has been numorious times when H openly flirted with women in my presence - ie. crude comments, touching (he didn't know I saw it). But yet if he sees me talking to man (laughing) with him he goes insane... so being totally honest sometimes is not best thing to do. I know what I did was wrong.. and it is not continuing.

 

All my client did was WAKE ME UP! I felt alive and want more in my life.... I can look past that we don't do anything together, that he doesn't listen to me, doesn't buy me anything, that our sex is just a selfish act for him, doesn't ever tell me if I look nice, etc... BUT what I can't look pass is when he humilates and embarrasses me in public by yelling at me... well thats when I say..I HAD ENOUGH

 

they are not disrespectful judgements... it is a reality and he even admits it... that he has a problem even in a social envirnment

[Centar13]

I'm just pointing out that he may listen more than you think. It really hurts to be ignored by someone you love... and sometimes that hardens you towards the times they do listen.

 

To his mind he is simply working off a very basic positive and negative feeback cycle. He was escalating the situation until you would drop it... thus his goal of avoidance was acheived.

 

What I suggest is using that same basic system to your advantage. Reward all positive behaviors! Provide negative incentives for all bad behaviors.

 

In essence when he says "hey I would like it if we did something together". Insead of getting upset... because he waited so long to do this and providing negative feedback, reward his positive behavior. It can be as simple as saying "thats a very good idea... I would like to do that also... but I'm not at a place where I can do that yet".

 

Seems like I'm kind of just rambling... but do you see where I am going.

 

This isn't a knock on you... actually its commendable that you put up with him so long!

Cobra.. thank you and its not rambling.. I appreciate all comments. I stayed becuase we are surviors.. For the first 5 years of our marriage my H and I lived away from both of our home towns... we had no family and only friends but not the close ones like you have from home towns. We both said had we lived in home towns we most likely be divorced because of everyones input to our relationship.

 

Having his parents move to where we are also added stress to our marriage..

 

I hope I am doing the right thing...

[Cobra_X30]

Cobra.. thank you and its not rambling.. I appreciate all comments. I stayed becuase we are surviors.. For the first 5 years of our marriage my H and I lived away from both of our home towns... we had no family and only friends but not the close ones like you have from home towns. We both said had we lived in home towns we most likely be divorced because of everyones input to our relationship.

 

Having his parents move to where we are also added stress to our marriage..

 

I hope I am doing the right thing...

 

Does he stand up to his parents for you?

[Mr. Lucky]

Hey 2long... I did not have an emotional affair with my client...

 

Just out of curiousity, Centar, what label do you put on this:

 

I have a crush on my client who also has a crush on me. Everytime I would go to his office he would flirt with me - sit real close to me, rub my shoulders, put his hand on my leg, etc...

One night I saw him out with my friends - he and his friends hung out with us we danced real close but no kisses. That night he openly said he couldn't do anything with me since i'm married. OK I accept it. As I was leaving - I couldn't take our near miss kisses all night - so I finally said - "just kiss me already". And he did - I LOVE IT!

 

I don't want flirting to end - I felt soooo alive - I dont want to go back to feeling dead inside

 

 

Mr. Lucky

[Centar13]

No he doesn't - his mother is the biggest problem... even my h doesn't get along with his mother. they have terrible relationship. I will give you an example of my mother inlaws doing... My in-laws had a labor day party(on a sunday) which they invited all of my f-law's work friends... i didn't know any of them... so ....... I went to the party and I was laying on the couch watching TV and I fell asleep. I awoke to... My M-law telling all the people at the party that I was hung over becuase I was out with my friends on Friday til 1:30 am (and yes it was the night my client kissed me)... I was confronted by people (strangers) telling what to do for a hang over... well then i had to set my M-law straight and the people in the party... I said... LOOK.. I'm not hung over... 1. my last drink I had on Friday was at 9:30 pm.. and i'm just tired because we didn't come home until 3:30 am! And my friends, H and I went to dinner last night and we were up late...

 

thats the kind of stress she adds to our marriage... let me add... that too was 10 years of i had enough!

[Centar13]

I know.. what I said about the crush...and not wanting the flirting to end...but I know nothing going on or ever go on between us... it was just a wake up call... thats all...

 

there never will be anything with that client...

[Centar13]

funny - 2long...

 

i'm not in denial

[Cobra_X30]

No he doesn't - his mother is the biggest problem... even my h doesn't get along with his mother. they have terrible relationship. I will give you an example of my mother inlaws doing... My in-laws had a labor day party(on a sunday) which they invited all of my f-law's work friends... i didn't know any of them... so ....... I went to the party and I was laying on the couch watching TV and I fell asleep. I awoke to... My M-law telling all the people at the party that I was hung over becuase I was out with my friends on Friday til 1:30 am (and yes it was the night my client kissed me)... I was confronted by people (strangers) telling what to do for a hang over... well then i had to set my M-law straight and the people in the party... I said... LOOK.. I'm not hung over... 1. my last drink I had on Friday was at 9:30 pm.. and i'm just tired because we didn't come home until 3:30 am! And my friends, H and I went to dinner last night and we were up late...

 

thats the kind of stress she adds to our marriage... let me add... that too was 10 years of i had enough!

 

Hmmm... Perhaps not the best of example's... but I understand there is alot of backstory between you and the MIL. Does she feel like you are not good enough for her son?

 

Where was your H when his Mother was telling everyone you were hung over? Did he say anything to her or did he stay out of it?

[Centar13]

2Long...

 

I understand everything your telling me..and what I should be doing to save my marriage but I don't know if i love him or ever loved him... let me explain... and this might be long... sorry..

 

I know what love is and how I should feel... I was married before...

I met my first husband when I was 18 and we married at 22 years old.. yes we were young but in love.. when he turned 25 he said to me I don't find you attractive anymore I love you but i'm not in love with you.. I want a divorce.. he went to the attorny next day and I received my separation papers on our 3 year anniversary.

needless to say... we got back together then split up 6 months later and then our divorce was final about 2 months later... here comes the messed up part... we started dating after we divorced and THEN! we went to counciling... (yes after we divorced) - My ex-H and i dated for about 1.5 after we divorced and when I said ok.. lets get back together he said.. No.. and then a year later he married someone else.

 

a year later and soooo heart broken.. I picked myself up and said i'm moving 600 miles away.(job) left my family business and all my friends, family.. and thats when I met my H =- (we met at work)

 

brb... I have pick up kids...

 

story will continue...

[Centar13]

Hmmm... Perhaps not the best of example's... but I understand there is alot of backstory between you and the MIL. Does she feel like you are not good enough for her son?

 

Where was your H when his Mother was telling everyone you were hung over? Did he say anything to her or did he stay out of it?

I don't know if she thinks i'm not good enough.. and my H was outside. when I told him when I woke up what was going on.. he got upset about his mothers actions, didn't say anything to her...and then we left

[Centar13]

continued...

 

My H and I met at work..we were both northerns living in the south.. we became friends and it was nice hanging out.. i could be myself around him.. after about 8 months he said he was buying a house..and he didn't want me to renew my lease and move in with him... i was on the fence about it because i felt like i was giving up my independence... so I made the call back to my strick family... scared i might add and yes i know stupid to be scared to tell parents that your making adult decisions at the age of 29 to move in with someone.

so..... after about 3 months of living together I had to make the call back home..to tell my parents that i was pregnant... I didn't want to get married and wasn't planning on getting married becuase of my H's family and I knew their influence would affect our marriage. plus I didn't want to feel trapped...what if i wanted to move back home... i wouldn't be able to do that if i got married..

 

sooo... exactly 2 weeks before giving birth our house burned down... and we were homeless no where to go until the insurance paid out... all worked out.. insurance paid and we moved into an apartment and I gave birth 2 weeks later... then the holidays came thanksgiving and 30th bday, christmas,, and I didn't get to go home to see my family cause he didn't want to go... and I was feeling so depressed and I think it might have been post partum... and it was new years eve.. and we were at work and i said.. ok... lets go..we'll get married . We left work went to the court house got married and then went back to work.- I felt it was wrong but i did it cause of the baby and felt i shouldn't feel scared about marriage. Plus I still needed to get over my EX-H.

 

My long point is...I don't know if i ever loved him... I know I never loved him the way I love my Ex-H. So I don't know if any relationship building, therapists, no negative behavior is ever going to work if I don't love my husband......

[ookla_2]

...you still love your Ex-H?

[Centar13]

...you still love your Ex-H?

not anymore...it took long time to get over it but I did.

[ookla_2]

okay...just checking. Perhaps that was a mis-type, and you meant to write "like I loveD my ex-H"?

 

I don't doubt that you have many issues to contend with...your H is verbally abusive and overly jealous....you don't know if you really love him....let me just tell you though, that developing feelings for another man who gives you positive attention (and you did indicate that there were some feelings there - how good he made you feel - how alive) will only complicate things further. It sounds like you have a lot of hard thinking to do about how you are going to proceed with your life. It's a tough position to be in, and I am sorry to hear about it...I just don't want you putting too much thought into your client and what his thinking/motivation is for anything or what his actions mean. You need to focus on the situation at hand, and that is whether or not your marriage can be saved. Only you can truly answer that, and only after you have done all you can do to try and save it.

[Centar13]

okay...just checking. Perhaps that was a mis-type, and you meant to write "like I loveD my ex-H"?

 

I don't doubt that you have many issues to contend with...your H is verbally abusive and overly jealous....you don't know if you really love him....let me just tell you though, that developing feelings for another man who gives you positive attention (and you did indicate that there were some feelings there - how good he made you feel - how alive) will only complicate things further. It sounds like you have a lot of hard thinking to do about how you are going to proceed with your life. It's a tough position to be in, and I am sorry to hear about it...I just don't want you putting too much thought into your client and what his thinking/motivation is for anything or what his actions mean. You need to focus on the situation at hand, and that is whether or not your marriage can be saved. Only you can truly answer that, and only after you have done all you can do to try and save it.

ooka

thank you..but not sure if you read all threads... but I do realize and I know..there is nothing going on between me and my client.. and there newer will be any type of relationship other than a business relationship.

[lostboy60645]

I gotta hand it to you Centar.

 

You've had what sounds like a very abusive man treat you as an inferior for far 2long (pun intended, but don't read into it).

 

Being the serial cheater on my soon2bEW, I'm always worth a couple of comments from 'the other side'.

 

My first thought is how surprisingly similar your situation is to my marriage. I was the quintissential a**h*le to my wife. Perhaps not as blatantly abusive, particularly with the foul mouth in front of others, but I did a lot of 'crazymaking' things that made her feel like something was wrong with her.

 

"Your a piece of sh*t" is the comment that has come to the minds of many when they take the above at face value.

 

Although my bad behavior was never justified, I have to say that it was and is always a two way street, and that my poor self esteem ran downhill like diarrhea down a porcelain wall--my parents were/and are cruel, angry, depressed and delusional people who made for a terribly abusive environment when I was growing up.

 

I was verbally, physically, and sexually abused by my dad, verbally and physically abused by my mom, and verbally, sexually, and physically abused by a brother and a neighbor.

 

I'm not saying poor me. I'm not saying that they caused me to be abusive to my wife or caused me to cheat on her. Nor did they cause me to look at the porn sites and masturbate incessantly at work and at home.

 

Where's all this going? Good question.

 

I forgot...

 

Oh yeah...

 

Anyways, I'm the abusive, jealous, angry husband who never made my wife feel like a woman.

 

Nearly two years after D-day and just days away from finalizing my divorce, I see that yes, I have a tremendous amount of baggage that I should have dealt with years ago in intensive therapy. Much pain and suffering could have been avoided by my wife and boys.

 

But the flipside, which I'm just beginning to see, is that my W was also, for unclear reasons, blindly accepting of me at my worst.

 

This is the 21st century and we're in, ostensibly, a "Westernized" society (hence the LS postings we're all enjoying). She also could have helped herself avoid some of this pain.

 

No, I don't blame her, or you, for sticking it out, remaining loyal, and trying to make the best of a bad situation.

 

But I think the part that ALL distressed marriage partners could benefit from, is some deep, intense introspection to look at how you became involved with this person, what 'made' you feel bad about what he said/did, and start to realize how you can avoid his or anyone's bad behavior from causing you to feel like you're any less of a person.

 

It's complicated, this 'co-dependency' thing. I, for one, never wanted to admit having any faults, but particularly one that sounded so vile.

 

It's a misnomer, co-dependency is, but it's something a lot of us ON BOTH SIDES of the cheating/abuse fence should learn about and identify how our role in the relationship may be 'co-dependent'.

 

More importantly, our goal should be to find out where our self esteem problems came from and how we should deal with being comfortable in our own skin no matter who says what to us.

 

Good luck

 

LB

[Cobra_X30]

ooka

thank you..but not sure if you read all threads... but I do realize and I know..there is nothing going on between me and my client.. and there newer will be any type of relationship other than a business relationship.

 

 

I agree with you that the Client at this time is a moot point. The problem stems directly from your unhappiness within your marriage.

 

I know you've done alot of therapy... however I dont think it is a good idea to compare your old feelings for your ex to your current feelings for you Husband. The reasoning is that you Ex rejected you, which oft heightens those feelings, and your husband met you afterwards... once you were more balanced... yet also more guarded due to the pain of your prior marraige.

 

Do you really feel like you dont love your husband?

[Centar13]

I agree with you that the Client at this time is a moot point. The problem stems directly from your unhappiness within your marriage.

 

I know you've done alot of therapy... however I dont think it is a good idea to compare your old feelings for your ex to your current feelings for you Husband. The reasoning is that you Ex rejected you, which oft heightens those feelings, and your husband met you afterwards... once you were more balanced... yet also more guarded due to the pain of your prior marraige.

 

Do you really feel like you dont love your husband?

 

thank you... finally..someone is understanding... and agreeing that I know there is nothing going on....

 

as for comparing my current H to XH - I don't compare anymore and I haven't since 8 years ago..

 

yes... i really feel that i don't love him

[Cobra_X30]

thank you... finally..someone is understanding... and agreeing that I know there is nothing going on....

 

as for comparing my current H to XH - I don't compare anymore and I haven't since 8 years ago..

 

yes... i really feel that i don't love him

 

It's good that you dont directly compare... however doesnt your past marriage help define your idea of love?

 

2long mentioned this earlier.

 

What is love to you? What is it? Sometimes it is best to define your terms to understand your feelings.

[Centar13]

hmm what is love...

 

it should be

unconditional - the way you are with friends and family

considerate - the way you are with strangers, neighbors,

team player - they way you have each others back- pick each other up when down - help each other reach goals.

Passionate - the way you are about any thing in life whether its work you love to do, working out, i guess that also means devoted, committed

Respect - the way you are when you first meet that person

 

its not all about sex... thats just maybe 50% to make a relationship work you need all the other items

 

my Ex-ML told me once... in relationships you have to give in 50% sometime is 40% - its give and take but if you give in to all demands or treatment over 65% - they are just going to drag you all the way

 

I think...i should have gave ultimated years ago to wake him up

[ookla_2]

ooka

thank you..but not sure if you read all threads... but I do realize and I know..there is nothing going on between me and my client.. and there newer will be any type of relationship other than a business relationship.

 

Yes, I read all of your thread, and I am glad that you are not pursuing anything with your client. My point was...flirting with/kissing another man while dealing with what you are dealing with will only complicate an already complicated situation.

 

I was not pointing fingers nor was I judging. Just apparently stating the obvious.

[Cobra_X30]

hmm what is love...

it should be

unconditional - the way you are with friends and family

considerate - the way you are with strangers, neighbors,

team player - they way you have each others back- pick each other up when down - help each other reach goals.

Passionate - the way you are about any thing in life whether its work you love to do, working out, i guess that also means devoted, committed

Respect - the way you are when you first meet that person

 

its not all about sex... thats just maybe 50% to make a relationship work you need all the other items

 

my Ex-ML told me once... in relationships you have to give in 50% sometime is 40% - its give and take but if you give in to all demands or treatment over 65% - they are just going to drag you all the way

 

I think...i should have gave ultimated years ago to wake him up

 

How much of that list do you have with your Husband? See love is very complicated... and often we dont realize what love is or even that we have it.

 

How much of that list do you think your husband would have in common with you? How well do you feel he knows you?

[Bobby NoBrains]

A friend and I once sat down and composed a list of what makes love = love ..

 

Love is .. Affection, Respect, Desire, Consideration, Accomodation, Courage, Sacrifice

 

And most importantly for a relationship this has to happen in both directions ...

 

Your posts are getting more bitter as you go on ... I hope you're only getting the feelings out and not focusing on only the bad parts of the relationship. Because that would be counter-productive to your wish to make things better ...

 

I'm very glad that you realized what your attraction to the client was - A wake-up call. Hopefully the fact that you *have* woken up will help to do wonders for your marriage. Just remember that just as you want him to change, there prolly are some things about you that you also need to do or to change to make your marriage as strong as you would wish it to be. Don't just wait for him, do your bit also

 

Just my two bits ..

 

Bobby

[redfathom]

If I can say, the issues with the MIL are not that bad. Honestly, the people at the party were giving you advice on what they assumed to be the problem, it's not like they were chastizing you. Shoot my MIL was dating my dad and because we were not talking she stopped my dad from going to MY wedding (to her son) and would hang up on me when I would call my dad. She would call me the worse names and throw things at me.

 

Honestly at 30-somthing, you must know you can't always get what you want, life is not fair, people will treat you poorly. I mean I hate the grass is always greener on the otherside syndrom. Look the grass is greener because someone put some hard work into it and you too can have greener grass in your marriage with some hard work (from YOU and your husband). People talk about the whole grass is greener thing like it's magic. Sure, it might be green when you first go over there but with out hard work, attentiveness (not sure if thats a word), love, devotion, etc it too will turn brown. Love is so fragile and people seem to think it comes naturally, but with all that ice in your heart spring will never come. If you H is actually trying then let him, see where this goes.

 

As for never loving your H well, it seems you were not over the exH at the time you started to date your current H, you were expecting him to fill something that was missing people don't complete one another they compliment them.

 

Seperating might be a good idea, but have the intention of going home. If your H is picking up some of the slack let him carry most of the load right now, but you still need to carry some.

[Cobra_X30]

Love is so fragile and people seem to think it comes naturally, but with all that ice in your heart spring will never come. If you H is actually trying then let him, see where this goes.

 

As for never loving your H well, it seems you were not over the exH at the time you started to date your current H, you were expecting him to fill something that was missing people don't complete one another they compliment them.

 

Seperating might be a good idea, but have the intention of going home. If your H is picking up some of the slack let him carry most of the load right now, but you still need to carry some.[/quote]

 

Hi Red! Great point... its actually what I was driving at from the start.

 

Centar, I think your dealing with a failed understanding of what love is.... coupled with a huge pile of resentment towards your husband.

 

You chose to marry him at one point. You may not have felt the same way about him that you felt about your exh, but that choice means so much! That choice is the part and parcel of what love truely is.

 

If he makes those changes your going to be presented with a choice. You can mentally feed those thoughts of resentment and anger... or you can choose love.