Is this breaking NC?

[tragic visions]

I am a BW and have been back together with my FWH since last summer. Well, a few weeks ago, there was a "boys night out" that he does every year, and he went to the usual bar with his usual friends.

 

He was gone for six hours and did not call me.

 

I didn't see him until they all showed up at my house at 1:00am and then he left again and went back out to take friends back to their hotel. I don't even know when he got back home. I went to bed.

 

Anyway, no big suprise, I found out that after he left that the ex OW was there too.

 

What burns me is that this was something I wasn't even invited to. In fact, I was specifically not wanted around. So while I'm at home, being the good wife and cleaning and being the responsible one, this is insulting.

 

So, I guess wives aren't allowed but apparently old girlfriends are?

 

O RLY??

 

I confronted him right away, because at this point, I won't be coy and play these guessing games anymore. He said he didn't talk to her. He mentioned she was drunk and only said that he didn't do anything wrong.

 

He shouldn't have been there at all.

 

It doesnt feel like that's NC to me. NC means NC.

 

Hanging out in the same bar with the ex lover without the wife. Who in their right mind would be okay with that nonsense?

 

He just noticed last night I stopped wearing my ring. I just said I stopped wearing it that night you were out at the bar with OW and he didn't say anything in response.

[Mz. Pixie]

Yes, this is breaking NC.

 

For a wayward spouse this is crucial, because it can take them right back to square one where they were when they broke off contact.

 

He should have left immediately and told you about it. The fact that he didn't should really bother you.

[tragic visions]

It does bother me. It bothers me a lot.

 

I'm also starting to take note of the one sided marriage we have. When we got back together he was very attentive and focused on me. Now he does what he wants, goes where he wants with little or no consideration for me, unless he wants some ass. Otherwise forget it.

 

Last week I had to go to my dad's because he has cancer and he had surgery Thursday and I was there (Thursday - Saturday) to support him through things and FWH made party plans with (same) friends again.

 

He didn't tell me until AFTER he left and even then had our son tell me the message. He just dropped our son off with a neighbor for the night and split town when he should have been at home. I call that taking advantage of me again. Our son also told me that he is certian the ex OW was driving by our house Saturday.

 

He called me 1 time when he got to friends several hours later. I was so unnerved by this again that I went to friends house to make sure he was there. I'm assuming he knew all week that he was going and didn't bother to tell me, like I'm a useless doormat or something.

 

I also told him about the OW driving past the house and he had nothing to say.

 

Yesterday I brought him lunch at work (he's on the no carb diet and I brought him this special) and he said, "it's not bad, it's not horrible" and talks to me about broken toilets and taxes. No thank you's. No praise, compliments or even a hug. I left after 20 minutes of this bull and told him I regreted bringing him lunch.

 

I'm so mad I want to scream. Where is my affair? Is this how lunches with OW went too? Did he tell her what to do and did he appreciate her for her efforts? I am a hot, beautiful blonde, but he talks to me like his accountant or his repair man. **** you too, FWH.

 

After work yesterday, he just hung out in the garage (avoiding conflict) and a few friends showed up and he didn't come in until dark and ignored me. He actually got mad at me when I told him that I don't like the way he treats me. The icy cold "silent treatment" that makes me want to scream some more.

[JustBreathe]

Yes, it is breaking NC. If he did not know the OW was going to be there, he should have left upon seeing her. If he did know, he should not have gone at all.

 

Sorry. I know you're hurting.

 

How long were you seperated? Maybe it didn't sink in just how grave and serious all of this is and that some sitting in the dog house and buttkissing isn't going to fix what he's done because it runs very deep.

[tragic visions]

I'm sure the both of you are right. What you say makes sense. I just needed to ask a few people on the outside of the relationship to see what their feelings were.

 

I agree Pixie that this contact could easily turn into something, given the opportunity and the (relatively recent) history between these two.

 

I wouldn't know.

 

I wasn't there, you see.

 

He said he had only "one beer" and that "he left" once he "realized" what was going on, but there was a six hour time lapse that doesn't make any sense.

 

He also said that "had he known she would be there, he wouldn't have gone there. "

 

Well, that is just more double-talking to me. She was there and he stayed anyway, maybe he just did whatever he wanted, hoping I would never find out about it.

 

She knew a lot about his life and his routine. This night with the boys has been an annual event for many years. I would have to assume that she has been there before. He has used friends for cover for their romantic trysts before. Thats old news.

 

Ok, then there is the OW driving past the house issue. IDK. I never seen her car around here but then again if she knew I was gone, anything is game, my man, so whats the difference if it's my house too? IDK How do you figure out what people are trying so hard to keep behind your back. I can only guess. It wouldn't be too hard for them to keep it underground.

 

It would also be par for the course to get mad at me for getting upset. So he had a reason to cheat (because I'm so controlling) Whatever. I guess I can't hide things as well as others can.

 

Lets just say she's resurfaced twice within the last week and I find that strange. Once in a blue moon would be interesting, twice in the same week I should be concerned.

 

I am concerned, but FWH is the least concerned.

 

When he went out last weekend while I was at my dad's, FWS didn't call me (again) but this time says it's because he left his cell phone with our son. I know it takes four hours to go to this friends house. Our son called me at 11:30 to tell me he left and OW was driving by the house.

 

FWH called me from friends cellphone at 5:30. What happened to the two hours that are missing? Also the friend lives a half hour away from where I was staying at my dad's and he didn't even ask me out to dinner or make any attempts to see me, but somehow I managed to find the time to go see him.

 

Also, I have no idea why he just left our son without even talking to me. Why couldn't he just bring our son to my dad's house? Leaving him alone like this is not the norm, although my son WAS planning to go with me, but decided to stay with FWH at the last minute, who ended up dumping him on a Saturday night to go to his friends anyway.

 

< Always the last one to know I guess. >

[jmargel]

What are you getting out of this marriage? Not only is he continuing to cheat on you, he is disrespecting you in every other way.

 

The reason he is defensive/avoids these conversations with you is because he is still cheating. When my wife was doing that she would give me a major attitude and lay blanket statements on me on what was wrong with ME.

 

You know what is going on and you continue to tolerate it. Six hours? He spent time with her, that's what he did. He could have left as soon as he saw her, but good chance he knew she was going to be there. His ego is more important than his marriage.

 

Don't wait for him to make a decision, make it yourself. Starting today. Kick him out.

[JustBreathe]

Naw, TV, you are not the last one to know. You know already. It gets fishier and fishier the more info you post.

 

I think when we get messed over we begin to feel like we're incapable of making correct decisions, like our ability to discern truth from lies has left us and we can't be trusted to make right judgments. But nothing has changed inside. Trust your gut and what it's telling you. Trust yourself.

[quankanne]

are you guys in any sort of marriage counselling? Because it sounds there's a huge inability of communication in your relationship, especially on his end ...

 

as much as you want to blow up at the guy, anger isn't going to serve any purpose because (1) he expects it of you and (2) well ... it's not going to cause anything to change, even when it makes you feel better to get it off your chest. Maybe it's time to rethink the dynamics of the relationship? Ideally, you two would figure out how to honestly reconnect, but I get the impression that he's dragging his feet, so maybe it's time for you to start looking after your own needs. Do what you need to do to preserve your relationship, but not one bit more. Yes, it sounds like game-playing, and to a degree it probably is, but until he realizes what you have vested in your marriage, he is going to continue on the same path of taking you for granted. And that's not good for either of you.

 

it's kind of like raising your kids: You've got to follow through when they act out or disobey or cross the line. Not that your husband is a kid, but he needs to understand that there are consequences when he fails (or refuses) to fulfill his end of the deal, whatever that deal/agreement may be.

[tragic visions]

I'm not angry, I'm jaded (which isn't like me) but this A is changing me in ways I don't like. Nobody (meaning my FWH) asked or seems to care how I would feel. He knows I would be devistated.

 

I asked him if it would be alright for me to take off without him and go to that paticular bar that he went to for six hours, would that be okay and he got angry. Well until he disappeared again the next weekend when I was visiting my dad. What's a BS to do.

 

My brain is fried. I'm so tired. I don't think I can deal with another d-day, but that's what happens right. Once you open your eyes and start looking you can never go back. It will never be the same.

 

It's the one promise he made to me he would never do to me. It's very childish of me to believe in promises. Thats all they are, is just more promises.

[norajane]

May I ask why you want to stay with him? You don't sound very happy.

[IpAncA]

If he's honest about him not knowing she would be there, he shouldn't have stayed and told you about it when he came home.

 

Our son called me at 11:30 to tell me he left and OW was driving by the house.

 

I volunteer to raise the flag. Either he's still in contact her she's stalking him.

 

It's the one promise he made to me he would never do to me. It's very childish of me to believe in promises. Thats all they are, is just more promises.

 

That's just so sad TV. If he just makes promises and breaks them all the time, I'd never believe him either.

[tragic visions]

When he gets home from work we are going to dinner and I'm just going to put it out on the table. To make sure he understands what he is throwing away if he is unfaithful to me. How much it will devistate me and our son (and himself) if he falls.

 

I dont know how to answer people when they say to leave or why do you stay, my love isn't in doubt. The way I see it we belong together and she's making it hard for me and he isn't being straight with me. I don't sound happy? I'm not happy about my husband being at a bar with his ex OW and neither would you.

 

I feel doubt in my heart and have taken off my ring because I don't think he understands the symbol it represents. I carry this ring with me as if it were you, but if you're with another woman it doesn't mean anything to me at all but a broken promise.

 

I'm here just trying to put it together. Disappearing at a bar for hours and knowing the OW is there. How do you deal with the other person driving by your house when you are hundreds of miles away and you don't know where your husband is, your kid just called you to give you a message dad left at 11:30 and tells me OW drove by the house. What does a wife to do (or say) or know what to think.

[Bobby NoBrains]

What seems to "come out" is that he's not really dedicated to you, whatever the reasons may be, whether it is because he is seeing someone else, or whether he is just not "that into you" anymore, or whatever the actual reason may be. The fact that he is directly or indirectly ignoring your needs in respect of the behaviour pattern that you had set up with him indicates his lack of commitment to keeping this marriage strong. That's not a good sign.

 

What you need to do now is still not apparent, but you're obviously at the end of your rope. I think a sincere talk with him is required. You will have to be cold, non-accusatory, non-confrontational, but sincere and strong. Let him know how his behaviour is affecting you and that you are not able to tolerate it any more. His reaction to that will indicate exactly where this can or will go for the both of you.

 

Just my two bits ..

 

Bobby

[OpenBook]

I dont know how to answer people when they say to leave or why do you stay, my love isn't in doubt. The way I see it we belong together and she's making it hard for me and he isn't being straight with me.

 

And I bet this is what your WH is "banking" on. Why should he change his behavior? No matter what he does, you will still be waiting for him at home, bringing him lunch, taking care of his son.

 

I agree with the other posters. He has to experience consequences for the way he's treating you - or else he will just keep doing the same things.

[tragic visions]

I wanted to talk to him about my feelings, but I feel that door is closed. I know it shouldn't be, but there it is just the same.

 

We wen't out Saturday night and didn't talk about anything intimate, we had our son along. One the way home in the car, he started an argument about me, my faults (TMI) but I noticed that he's just making up things about me and I told him to stop it and he kept putting me down. So now I'm the bad guy (for something I didn't even do) and now I'm so mad that we're not even really talking at all. I feel like all of this was somehow turned around on me.

[Trialbyfire]

Your husband sounds like a very selfish man who has learned nothing from D-day. He neither appreciates you or the marriage.

 

If you're intent on saving your marriage, write down each and every issue. Lay it on the line for him with the associated consequences of not meeting your needs. If he fails, you're gone.

 

Myself, I doubt I would have the patience to deal with someone like this. No relationship is worth putting up with selfishness like this, who will not change.

[jmargel]

The affair is still continuing. Him starting with you and laying blanket statements was what my wife was doing when she was cheating. Even my counselor told me that is one of the sure signs that an affair is going on.

 

He's has a maturity problem something you can't fix. No words to him will do any good. It's time to get out of this marriage. Once the trust is damaged there is no way to repair it 100%.

 

Time to start making yourself happy.

[tragic visions]

Things blew up this morning (before work, lovely) he was up early (not like him) and he took a shower and shaved before going to his grungy job ??? he usually does the reverse and washes himself at night to get the grease off his skin and clothes.

 

So he said that he is upset because he heard (won't tell me who) that my attorney was at the bar and was drunk, talking about me as a client and that he hit on the OW, and supposedly sleeps around on his wife.

 

I havent even spoken to my lawyer in a year and a half. I think he is trying to shake my confidence and get me to fire my attorney. That's what I think. Cause I doubt by lawyer would jeopradise his career for breaking confidentiality and let alone involving himself with the personal lives of his clients.

 

The truth as I know it is that the exOW has hit on just about everyone FWS knows to make him jealous, including his best friend. She tries to hang out and ingratiate herself with his casual friends also. If there is any truth to this I would have to say that the person making the moves on anyone it's the exOW.

 

I asked him about the way he talks to me and he said he was embarassed when the guys tease him and bust his balls (about me) later on when no one is around. How else does a man talk to his hot wife, how does a guy keep a girl like me? I should show up there in a miniskirt, high heels and a tray of cookies I baked just to show them I am somebody who can't be messed with.

 

He also said that he hasn't had anything to do with her and doesn't want to stir the A back up again and reminds me he bought me a new car and how much he loves me. How hard he works.

 

It's weird I know all the signs and try to understand about infidelity as much as I possibly can and I don't understand why, after all these years, I still have to deal with this OW business, or why I got to worry because I'm not the one going out to bars here.

 

I'm at home being responsible. I may be the mommy at home, raising the kid and doing the dishes, but I look pretty damn cute doing it. I should have a guy who likes to stay home with me.

 

Trying to remember the whole thing but at some point he said that OW wasn't the kind of person I think she is.

 

I reminded him that I am honorable and it's one of the things a woman can never lose. Once a woman loses her honor she can't get it back. She's had half a dozen troubled relationships ~and~ had an affair with a married man, too, while I have had stayed with the same man forever.

 

Nevermind that I don't care WHO she sleeps with as long as it isn't FWS.

 

He may be a ****ed up man, but I sayed with him, through the worst, after a LTA, and if he doesn't have any value for that, if that is not his priority above everything then he doesn't deserve me.

 

I told him I took off my ring because I feel that it's symbolic of being with that person no matter where you are. If he's going out all the time, without me, then he isn't with me.

[Trialbyfire]

So he said that he is upset because he heard (won't tell me who) that my attorney was at the bar and was drunk, talking about me as a client and that he hit on the OW, and supposedly sleeps around on his wife.

 

I would call him on this. If he won't divulge who told him, tell him you'll call up your attorney and confirm the story.

[norajane]

So he said that he is upset because he heard (won't tell me who) that my attorney was at the bar and was drunk, talking about me as a client and that he hit on the OW, and supposedly sleeps around on his wife.

 

I havent even spoken to my lawyer in a year and a half. I think he is trying to shake my confidence and get me to fire my attorney. That's what I think. Cause I doubt by lawyer would jeopradise his career for breaking confidentiality and let alone involving himself with the personal lives of his clients.

 

Why are you letting him do this to you? All common sense should tell you if your lawyer hasn't spoken to you in a over a year, it's not likely you are top of mind and he's spouting off about you in a bar.

 

It actually sounds like the OW is trying to stir up trouble and told this story to your H. If your H won't tell you where he heard it, he is either lying about the whole thing, or his OW told him - and she is likely to be lying about the whole thing.

 

Maybe you should call your lawyer and have him draw up those divorce papers, huh?

[ookla_2]

...but from an outside perspective, it sounds like he is looking for an "out". He's starting fights with you, pointing out everything he thinks YOU have done wrong (and conveniently forgetting what he's done, I'm sure), probably expecting you to kick him out. Whether or not he is still seeing the OW, he is not respecting you AT ALL.

 

And the whole business about the lawyer being at the bar, getting drunk and discussing a client must be a complete fabrication. You made the point yourself that what lawyer would risk his job..just to have something to talk about at the bar???

 

You stay strong, girl! Keep posting!

[tragic visions]

After work I stopped to get groceries and saw my FWH drive past me on the way home. He called me on the cell phone and said he was going to the store. I made dinner and fed our son and when he got back I asked him, "who told you the lawyer was doing all this?" and then impatiently answered the question for him, "exOW?" And he said "yes".

 

He said he told me this a long time ago but that I didn't believe him then like I don't believe him now. Did I really forget that he told me that or is that re-writing history? I'm sure I would have remembered that. He acts incredulous and says he cheats on his wife when she goes out of town. Like he didn't do the same thing to me. Tsk. Tsk.

 

I just kept up the questions. I asked "so why is this bothering you so much now? When did she tell you this? During the affair? What is the timeline? Before D-day, after D-day?" And then he shut me down and said "he wasn't going to fight with me" and that" he wants all this to be over.

 

"Well,' I said, 'why do you always believe every single thing she tells you?" He said that he "doesn't believe everything she tells him" but he was repeating my question with the same words back at me, so I just stopped talking to him, period. It's makeing me insane.

 

Doing the dishes again this morning , lol (house cleaning gives you lots of time to think) I figured that at the bar, he at least made eye contact. If she made him uncomfortable he would have left but obviously he didn't feel threatened enough to leave, so he stayed because he felt comfortable being there. If I was at a bar and someone was there I didn't like (just broke up with - could lose my whole family for person) I wouldnt hang around for a second. There are actually a few places that I know HE WONT GO TO because he doesnt like the place or the people there.

 

You think he is going to be mean, or cold to someone he made love with and told everything to and shared our intimate personal lives with last year, like he doesnt even know her now? Why is FWS even in the same place again with exOW? Is there anyone that would be "okay" with their husband's in the same bar with their (recent) old lover? I don't accept this. Nothing he says can make this alright, acceptable to me. If you ask me what I think it is a slap in the face and I'm embarassed, again.

 

Now all this about the lawyer has come up out of the blue. You are right it's like he is deliberately trying to confuse me, or trying not to look like he's doing it.

 

God. I feel like crap.

[2sunny]

i think i would check his cell phone records and his computer.

 

sounds like he is still cheating.

 

have him followed if you need to.

[VIP]

I think you have too much time on your hands to imagine things. I don't know what your purpose is, but if you continue doing what you are doing, he will get fed up and leave. Nobody likes constant talks about the relationship, spying and control, mistrust. And when he decides to leave, there's no turning back. If you don't trust him so much, then better find yourself a job and make your life without him.

[jmargel]

You think he is going to be mean, or cold to someone he made love with and told everything to and shared our intimate personal lives with last year, like he doesnt even know her now? Why is FWS even in the same place again with exOW? Is there anyone that would be "okay" with their husband's in the same bar with their (recent) old lover? I don't accept this. Nothing he says can make this alright, acceptable to me. If you ask me what I think it is a slap in the face and I'm embarassed, again.

 

He was comfortable there with her and talked to her that night. Good chance that is when she told him about this lawyer crap. She continues to play mind games and the only way to beat this is to have him have NO CONTACT whatsoever.

 

It is NOT ok that your husband and exOW be in the same place with each other. That scenario is what basically destroyed my marriage. We are still together 2 years after the fact but when she would hang out with her ex-bf after we were married it created distrust and alot of resentment on my part. Since that has happened things haven't been the same.

 

You are on this roller coaster ride that I was on 2 years back. He says he's done with her, yet 'things' and 'chance meetings' still happen. It's not over, it's not over until he no longer has any physical contact with her and his mind and heart is 110% into you. It's not over until he repents for what he has done wrong and has taken steps to bring confidence back into your marriage. MC is only one step in this but it's apparent that he is not ready to do this. Perhaps you can print out my reply and show it to him.

 

This is for your husband: What you had done is emotional murder. You killed her heart without killing her physically. You took the bond that makes you two a couple and destroyed it. This marriage is not about 'you'. It's about you and your wife. I have been where your wife is now and it's a feeling that you never, ever want to experience. It is up there with losing a family member or a loved one. You are there physically but emotionally as a person you are dead. You are not the same person that we fell in love with and it's because of what you have done.

 

You will lose her, it's a guarantee. The way you continue to act and treat you wife and your marriage you are destined to be single again and puruse this OW. Only then can you live with the insecurities that your wife lives in now. Move in with this OW, marry her. Then play detective when red flags start showing up and how she is doing the same thing to you that you once did to your wife. This will be your life for the next ten years if you don't change your path. Find counseling, be HONEST with your wife and tell her EVERYTHING that she does not know. She has the right to know what has been going on so she can make her decisions on whether or not she wants to stay with you.

 

For you tragic it is time for you to stop waiting for him to make deicions and to start making them yourself. By the sound of it you sound like a true sweetheart and it would not be hard for you to find a decent guy. At some point you have to ask yourself what are you getting out of this marriage? Don't be afraid to move on when you feel the time is right.