Is Our Marriage Repairable Or Am I Dumb As Mud

[LabradorsGalor]

Let me start by saying the heart and emotions are a strange and mysterious thing - at least to me.

 

My wife and I have been together for about 13 years with most of that time being trying and difficult for both of us. She has had issues with trust and commitment with me and I have had issues lack of sex and now trust with her. In short, I have been in a sexless/low sex marriage for nearly 11 years and its taken a toll on both of us. Last weekend I finally asked my wife for a divorce after 7 months of counseling. Now I am questioning my decision and am asking for input from the board.

 

She revealed to me in January that she had an affair. It was very intentional, deliberate and planned. She met a guy in December at a skiing event who was in town visiting. She then followed up with him on the phone keeping it very secretive. Eventually, she arranged to meet with him and spend a couple of weekends with him while she was traveling on business trips. I found this hurtful, devastating, but hardly surprising since our marriage was particularly strained. I agreed to enter counseling as a couple and also sought out my own therapist as did she.

 

My wife is a low sex drive person which became evident within the first year we were together. Our sexual encounters became infrequent from a couple of times a week, to once a week, to once a month and settling into once ever 2 to 4 months. In fact we have gone as long as 9 month. More importantly to frequency, the quality and level of intimacy of our sex plummeted as well. In most occurrences, she would usually capitulate to having sex. She never initiated sex and in most occasions would usually rebuff my advances at first and then realize it had been a while. I usually felt that she was agreeing out of obligation rather than desire. She agrees this is the case.

 

Over time, I quit initiating sex because I was tired of being hurt and feeling constantly rejected. That's about the time we started experiencing sex only once every 1 to 2 months. We were at about our second or third year of marriage. I also became increasing angry and short tempered with her and we started to engage in fewer and fewer activities that we shared and enjoyed in common such as biking, skiing, and camping among others.

 

I also started a business, which I know didn't help my stress level or relationships. I was constantly working and traveling in an effort to launch a new business that went from me in a spare bedroom to a $1 million enterprise. I am proud of that accomplishment but now realize it played a big toll on our relationship. She feels neglected and unimportant. But wait so do I.

 

In addition (as though that isn't enough), I began surfing the internet view sites such as Adult Friend Finder and engaging online chats and what I now realize as cyber affairs. She has discovered these accounts at various times during our marriage. Each time I promise to terminate the activity but have found myself returning to the sites when other aspects of our marriage such as sex and intimacy never improved. The first two times she "caught" me, I was very remorseful and truly did not want to hurt her, and agreed to go to counseling with her to focus on my problem. Unfortunately, we didn't think to ask or address other root problems in our marriage.

 

My desire to use the sites is low and nonexistent when my wife are getting along and having sex on a "regular" basis. Our regular basis is probably infrequent for others. However, I desire a high quality, loving experience more than I desire going at it like bunnies. I have worried that I have some type of internet porn dependency, but know that I can and have walked away from it when my intimate/sex life with my wife is better or at least improving. I recently read the following article that I found extremely helpful in understanding both the impacts of my actions on my wife as well as understanding my chronic behavior. http://netaddiction.com/articles/cyberaffairs.htm

 

The article helped me understand that the actions were not necessarily sexual but a desire to connect with someone on an intimate level.

 

I feel extremely guilty and feel like the demise of our relationship is largely my fault and that I pushed her to an affair. At the same time, I have a hard time reconciling how she can desire sex with someone else and still look me in the eyes and tell me it wasn't about sex but about connecting with someone emotionally and that I simply haven't been available for most of our marriage. I feel she pushed me away and rejected me early in our relationship and that contributed to me seeking our gratification in other forms. I also worry that I am rationalizing and justifying my behavior.

 

Again, I asked my wife for a divorce on Sunday after 7 months of therapy. We have been seeing a couples counselor but we sort of settled into a routine where I felt that we were making limited progress after the time frame. I am not expecting miracles but I made it clear to my wife that I did not want to continue living in a sexless marriage when we initiated our efforts in January after she revealed her affair.

 

We have been enjoying each others company over the last 7 months but our sex life continues to be limited and infrequent despite us getting along. I also found my self returning to my online behavior and don't like it. I want a real relationship. She discovered a bill charge and I denied I was online out of fear but then shortly after really questioned if things were moving in the right direction. I also had been asking myself a lot if this is the relationship I want. It definitely isn't and I didn't like the path we were on. I could only see that I would be frustrated in a year and that we would still be in a sex starved marriage, me angry and both of us feeling untrusting, isolated, and angry. It was at that point, I indicated to her I think we should get a divorce.

 

She has explained or justified her behavior and lack of sex drive as first stress associated with starting a new job and relationship, then my distance, and now my cyber activities. It seems she always has an excuse, though I have researched information on low sex drives and these appear to be common problems for women. Though I'm not sure what I did to start the downward spiral.

 

I love my wife dearly despite all of our problems. She is an intelligent, educated, beautiful and fun woman in many ways. I also have enjoyed the last 7 months of working to renew our relationship. I have lost 35 lbs by traveling less and working out more regularly. She indicated found me less attractive in January and was one of the reasons she had the affair. I immediately lost weight and got fit. All and all not a bad thing.

 

I am now second guessing my decision. My wife and I are talking more about our relationship and feelings than we have in the past 7 months. We are getting along. She was usually reluctant and resistant to talking when I wanted to talk and work on things. I know see i fell into a pattern similar to our sex life where I quit pushing when she rejected.

 

I honestly do not know what to do. My head says leave and end the marriage. My heart says give it one more shot but this time really make a difference. My therapist has told me that its a mistake to look back and that I should not view asking for a divorce as a way to fix my marriage. I understand that and it wasn't my intention when I asked for it on Sunday. So what do you think?

[tommyr]

Our sexual encounters became infrequent from a couple of times a week, to once a week, to once a month and settling into once ever 2 to 4 months. In fact we have gone as long as 9 month. More importantly to frequency, the quality and level of intimacy of our sex plummeted as well. In most occurrences, she would usually capitulate to having sex. She never initiated sex and in most occasions would usually rebuff my advances at first and then realize it had been a while. I usually felt that she was agreeing out of obligation rather than desire. She agrees this is the case.

 

Over time, I quit initiating sex because I was tired of being hurt and feeling constantly rejected. That's about the time we started experiencing sex only once every 1 to 2 months. We were at about our second or third year of marriage. I also became increasing angry and short tempered with her and we started to engage in fewer and fewer activities that we shared and enjoyed in common such as biking, skiing, and camping among others.

 

Boy does this sound familiar: I could have written that myself!!! Also the part where internet "adult entertainment" becomes your sex replacement.

 

My friend, I was right there with you a year ago. Considered divorce too. Decided that working on our marriage was worth my honest effort. Decided that I was not wrong to wish for an actual sex life in my marriage. Decided that I should talk openly, honestly with wife, not just complaining about MY NEEDS but also discussing HER NEEDS because clearly she did not feel very close to me.

 

It has been hard, stressful, expensive, nerve wracking, etc but today our marriage is back in order AND the sex is great. What I learned is that my wife actually DOES love me. She is even willing to do certain things for me simply because she likes to make me happy. Ok so her sex drive is lower than mine, it often means I must make extra effort to hint around, let her know I am hoping something will happen, and often I must initiate. That is fine, I can do that. And it works- she is usually a willing partner - but if she really is not up for it tonight she will make extra effort to be available tomorrow.

 

Now for me, I also love her and am very willing to do stuff that makes her happy. She asked if I would send her a friendly email from work during the day. Makes her feel "connected" to me. It is easy, and it makes her happy so I just do it! There are many other small things like that (no big deal for me, why so important?) that it seems for her those are VERY important. But unless we are able to have those honest conversations, I would not

[Cobra_X30]

If you spend 6 months single... you will never ever want to go back to a marriage like that.

Do you think she will ever be capable of providing the level of intimacy you desire?

 

Do you really think that it is your fault she had an affiar? Was she unable to ask for a divorce? Do you think your online activity equates to a physical affair? Can you truly move past and forgive that?

 

I've heard that the only thing worse than bieng in a terrible marriage for 13 yrs... is bieng in a terrible marriage for 13 yrs and 1 day!

 

You need to really sit down and consider why your willing to go for another round! Are you afraid to lose money in the divorce?

[Daniella]

I've been in your wife's position, with the exception of the affair. Thought it might be helpful to get my point of view.

For several years, about 19 to be exact, I placed no value whatsoever on sex and intimacy. Never intentionally to hurt my husband, just busy and tired, typical things heard often. I never really thought about it until my H started acting strangely. He did some things that should have made me file for divorce...shocking, manipulative things that hurt to the core. I'm still coping.

My point is that I never knew it hurt him so badly..didn't think of it like that until one day he actually spoke about feeling hurt and rejected. That combined with the things he did was like a wake up call. I was a changed woman from that moment on. Something clicked and if it hadn't my marriage would probably be over.

Communication is key and you say that she is more willing to open up now, but it seems to me you are the one making the most effort.

I don't believe that you pushed her to have an affair. I can't imagine how devastating it would be to have a non existant sex life with a woman who is going behind your back to have sex with another man??? It's not that she didn't have sex drive, just not with you...sorry if that sounded harsh.

I wish I could have gone back and changed things...is your wife even remorseful?

Bottom line is..sometimes it's just time to call it quits. Are you willing to feel this way for the rest of your life?

Marriage is tough and she has to be willing to meet you half way in the love and respect department.

Good luck to you, Lab.

[justice]

If you spend 6 months single... you will never ever want to go back to a marriage like that.

Do you think she will ever be capable of providing the level of intimacy you desire?

 

Do you really think that it is your fault she had an affiar? Was she unable to ask for a divorce? Do you think your online activity equates to a physical affair? Can you truly move past and forgive that?

 

I've heard that the only thing worse than bieng in a terrible marriage for 13 yrs... is bieng in a terrible marriage for 13 yrs and 1 day!

 

You need to really sit down and consider why your willing to go for another round! Are you afraid to lose money in the divorce?

 

I agree with Cobra here. These are very valid points made.

[LabradorsGalor]

Thanks everyone for your input. It is helpful to gain perspective. As I'm sure you can imagine or experience, I am expriencing emotional turmoil. I am second guessing may decisions both professionally and personally at the moment and have promised myself to go slow for a bit. I know my relationship is dire with my wife.

 

We are talking - more than we have in the last 7 months. She continues to bring up the sex/online addiction concern and its one that her therapist put forward base on the descriptions my wife provided. Part of me feels like her therapist maybe presenting this as a way for my wife to validate her own feelings, issues and emotions - allowing her to avoid a bigger question of her lack of sexuality. My wife says she is sexual person, and does attribute her low desire to stress, poor relationship, and my internet activities that have violated her trust. I understand these are clearly things that have caused that problem. I still am unclear how my wife knows she is a sexual person since she hasn't been for the better part of 13 years.

 

Her affair, she claims, was not about sex but about having an emotional closeness. Believe me I can understand that and would contend that my internet AFF/chatting activity was about the same thing. It wasn't about sex but filling a big void in intimacy in my life. The irony of her affair is that the way she fulfilled closeness was by having sex with the guy. I have pointed this out to her and she just shrugs her shoulders.

 

I have matured a lot in the last 13 years and in big part to my relationship with my wife. I must admit the last 1.5 year and in particular the last 7 months I have given a lot of thought to what I want from a life partner. Here are just a few of the biggies for me:

 

1. Affirmation of Love a) through actions such as being understanding and forgiving when necessary (not to say the person should be a doormat and put up with abuse) b) through sex and physical intimacy, and c) verbally by simply saying "I love you."

 

2. Openness: I want someone that I feel comfortable taking things to good, bad, sexual, problematic, ect and know that the person will be there to help, listen, provide support and most of all not be critical, judgmental or angry. I know this has been a problem for me with my wife. She is very closed sexually and has a quick temper and has failed me on several occasions when I was in need of help or support.

 

I continue to struggle with the question of if my internet activity is a compulsion/addiction. I think its a fair question to ask since I have been engaged in it for such a long time. But then again, I have also been drinking alcohol for a long time and am by no means an alcoholic. Does this sound like justifying my behavior?

[sunshinegirl]

If your wife is anything like me, then feeling emotionally close to someone arouses the sexual, sensual side.

 

While not condoning her affair in any way, to me it makes sense that she had sex with this other guy if he made her feel wanted, loved, etc - essentially if they had an emotional closeness that seems to be missing in your marriage. That kind of closeness, attention may have aroused her sexual side. There seems to be a lot of baggage for both of you in your relationship w/ each other, which is probably why her sexual side virtually disappeared.

[Cobra_X30]

Thanks everyone for your input. It is helpful to gain perspective. As I'm sure you can imagine or experience, I am expriencing emotional turmoil. I am second guessing may decisions both professionally and personally at the moment and have promised myself to go slow for a bit. I know my relationship is dire with my wife.

 

We are talking - more than we have in the last 7 months. She continues to bring up the sex/online addiction concern and its one that her therapist put forward base on the descriptions my wife provided. Part of me feels like her therapist maybe presenting this as a way for my wife to validate her own feelings, issues and emotions - allowing her to avoid a bigger question of her lack of sexuality. My wife says she is sexual person, and does attribute her low desire to stress, poor relationship, and my internet activities that have violated her trust. I understand these are clearly things that have caused that problem. I still am unclear how my wife knows she is a sexual person since she hasn't been for the better part of 13 years.

 

Her affair, she claims, was not about sex but about having an emotional closeness. Believe me I can understand that and would contend that my internet AFF/chatting activity was about the same thing. It wasn't about sex but filling a big void in intimacy in my life. The irony of her affair is that the way she fulfilled closeness was by having sex with the guy. I have pointed this out to her and she just shrugs her shoulders.

 

Lab, I dont know how to tell you this... but there are better women out there.

 

Your wife has for 13 years failed to provide for your BASIC needs. That pretty much forced you to find alternate methods to assuage those needs. Did you go have an affair? So, now your hurting and pull back emotionally... guess what... she does have an affair. Do you see the difference? That's a huge friggin difference! I can fit a planet into the difference there! Where is your anger?

 

Has she even really apologized? Did she come out and tell you about the affair due to guilt or was there another reason?

 

Look, this dumb counceling has you thinking this is all your fault... we both know its really not! It was her choice to cheat, many women put up with MUCH worse and never do that.

 

I dont understand your lack of anger... cause I'd be boiling! Scratch that, cause I am boiling...

[LabradorsGalor]

Cobra I completely see your point. I am a hard charging person and certainly capable of anger and even spite. I must admit I am feeling guilty for my own actions and is probably why I don't feel the rage and anger you want or expect. Also, this is a close emotional issue and I have enough problems to sort through. Actually, I have been anger with my wife for years for denying me sex.

 

So the latest is that she and her therapist seem to think I am hooked on internet porn. I will admit I have a lot of time on AFF and chatting on line. More than I should. But then again, I have been drinking beer for longer than I've been online and have drunk to excess on more than one occasion. Each time when I wake, I say never again. I hate hang overs, but guess what I'm 38 and I still have the occasional hangover. Am I an alcoholic? Hardly. I'm no tea toddler but am by no means an alcoholic.

 

I have read numerous articles on the web and most would suggest that may behavior exhibits additional behavior. My interest in sex ebbs and flows as does my use of the internet. Again, there are articles that explain this that this is the white knuckle cycle. Hmmm...maybe my reoccurring hangovers are whiteknuckle alcoholic cycles.

 

Anyway, I am going to ask my therapist what he thinks. We have never really discussed it directly but I did let him know I have used porn on the internet and chatted with people online. He provided me with several reading materials, the "Ask Me Anything" series on sex. It was very good in explaining there are a lot of sexual interests out there and all are very acceptable.

 

I guess my only concern is that I know from time to time I have spent a lot of time in single settings on AFF or chatting with people. Am I a internet porn addict?

[Daniella]

 

So the latest is that she and her therapist seem to think I am hooked on internet porn. I will admit I have a lot of time on AFF and chatting on line.

 

I guess my only concern is that I know from time to time I have spent a lot of time in single settings on AFF or chatting with people. Am I a internet porn addict?

 

Answer this...would you be able to give up the internet if your marriage was suddenly everything you want and need?

I personally feel you are not addicted. I feel you use the internet to compensate for what is lacking emotionally in your marriage.

[tommyr]

So the latest is that she and her therapist seem to think I am hooked on internet porn. I will admit I have a lot of time on AFF and chatting on line. More than I should. But then again, I have been drinking beer for longer than I've been online and have drunk to excess on more than one occasion. Each time when I wake, I say never again. I hate hang overs, but guess what I'm 38 and I still have the occasional hangover. Am I an alcoholic? Hardly. I'm no tea toddler but am by no means an alcoholic.

 

Please re-read what you just wrote, but pretend it was your spouse who wrote that. Does it sound like a person who you want to be intimate with?

[Cobra_X30]

She revealed to me in January that she had an affair. It was very intentional, deliberate and planned. She met a guy in December at a skiing event who was in town visiting. She then followed up with him on the phone keeping it very secretive. Eventually, she arranged to meet with him and spend a couple of weekends with him while she was traveling on business trips.

 

Tommyr,

 

Does that sound like someone YOU want to be intimate with?

 

A better question is... Does that sound like someone you could be intimate with?

[Cobra_X30]

Cobra I completely see your point. I am a hard charging person and certainly capable of anger and even spite. I must admit I am feeling guilty for my own actions and is probably why I don't feel the rage and anger you want or expect. Also, this is a close emotional issue and I have enough problems to sort through. Actually, I have been anger with my wife for years for denying me sex.

 

So the latest is that she and her therapist seem to think I am hooked on internet porn. I will admit I have a lot of time on AFF and chatting on line. More than I should. But then again, I have been drinking beer for longer than I've been online and have drunk to excess on more than one occasion. Each time when I wake, I say never again. I hate hang overs, but guess what I'm 38 and I still have the occasional hangover. Am I an alcoholic? Hardly. I'm no tea toddler but am by no means an alcoholic.

 

I have read numerous articles on the web and most would suggest that may behavior exhibits additional behavior. My interest in sex ebbs and flows as does my use of the internet. Again, there are articles that explain this that this is the white knuckle cycle. Hmmm...maybe my reoccurring hangovers are whiteknuckle alcoholic cycles.

 

Anyway, I am going to ask my therapist what he thinks. We have never really discussed it directly but I did let him know I have used porn on the internet and chatted with people online. He provided me with several reading materials, the "Ask Me Anything" series on sex. It was very good in explaining there are a lot of sexual interests out there and all are very acceptable.

 

I guess my only concern is that I know from time to time I have spent a lot of time in single settings on AFF or chatting with people. Am I a internet porn addict?

 

Look, you will never know if your actually addicted or if its just a crutch for you until somebody meets your needs.

 

Let me explain why I feel you need to get fired up. Anger can go outward or inward. If you point your anger inward, towards yourself, it fuels and feeds depression. Getting depressed and blaming yourself is not going to help you at this point... you need to take action and make changes! Take that anger and channel it outward, use it to help you get moving. Why do you need to get motivated? Because your life needs changes!

 

I know you have some issues, and that you helped cause this marriage to fall apart, but your wife killed it. Make no bones about that!

 

Isnt it time to move on and find someone better? Are you afraid? Do you feel like you couldnt find anything better?

[LabradorsGalor]

Thanks for explaining your anger. i agree I don't want to get depressed and can see that. I agree I need to move on. That's what my head says. My heart says I love the woman so its very difficult to leave.

[Cobra_X30]

Thanks for explaining your anger. i agree I don't want to get depressed and can see that. I agree I need to move on. That's what my head says. My heart says I love the woman so its very difficult to leave.

 

 

I think your making the right move here. I am providing you a link to Dazed's thread. I think you will share many of the emotions he felt. FYI... he recently came back 3 years later and has decided to file for divorce.

 

I will bet you may see a little bit of your wife in this thread too.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t40398/

 

Best of luck in everything you do... and If you ever need assistance feel free to contact me!

[bish]

I am now second guessing my decision.

 

Don't do that. Your wife spread her legs for another man...and thats all you need to know. You will never trust her again and she isn't to be trusted. Take if from someone who was willing to give a cheater the benefit of the doubt. I learned better.

 

Just divorce her and get on with your life with someone that will have sex with you and not give it up to another man.

 

And don't ever feel like her getting stuck by someone else is somehow your fault. It wasn't. Her cheating is all hers.

[whichwayisup]

The thing is, if the sexual chemistry isn't there between you and your wife, your marriage won't last because she may cheat again, or you'll turn to the internet stuff.

Marriage counselling can help, her being on medication or getting checked by her dr to make sure there's nothing wrong with her hormones will help, but you BOTH have to be willing to make the marriage work. To be honest, I'm not too sure she is really willing to, or if she has the staying (is that the right word?) power to keep the effort going...