tinke Posted December 16, 2007 Posted December 16, 2007 hey greencove....good to see your post! funny, as i had a rather "down" past few days with reminiscing...i had wondered how you're holding up. please do share if you get a response to the questions asked to annieo. quite interesting! for the most part, i am on the road to acceptance. still when that deep pain hits (at times, out of the blue as you had mentioned), it is the way in which he left that still stings! one would think it would make it easier to move on, that he really IS that shallow. but somehow, it adds to the hurt and confusion. i am working on me, and adjusting to life without him...still! it is more real to me now. when i think back, i would NEVER want to go back to that intense pain in the early beginning. so, i see i am making great strides. i am going through my transitional phase and making some life changes. as you, i get hit very strongly at times with memories. yes, i too know what i would have changed...but, i also think what i would have liked him to do differently. truly, i have learned some very important lessons that i will incorporate in the future. i also know what i value in a relationship....quite honestly, communication IS important to me, sensitivity is important to me. so, i guess my radar will be activated in that regard. still, i do believe and it brings me comfort (out of our control) that there is a reason for this. just to let you know, i've been thinking of you and we are on a similar road. i do understand a great deal from your last post. take good care (hugs)
Author Zapbasket Posted December 16, 2007 Author Posted December 16, 2007 I would really appreciate some perspective. I'm thinking seriously about moving from NYC by summer 2008 and I'm interested in hearing others' experiences with moving after a break-up, or what people think about this option given my circumstances. Back when the breakup first went down, I considered moving to a different city, but at the time it felt like that wouldn't have been the most grounded decision and so I committed myself to finding an apartment here in NYC and getting involved in activities, etc. But over the past several months, several things have happened: I have determined that my job does not challenge, fulfill, and remunerate me in the way I'd like and so I want to change industries; I've discovered that one of my oldest friends is not really, after all, such a great friend and while I am beginning to secure new friendships, I see that some of my older friendships are not as strong as I'd thought so really I have no "ties" here; and as this year draws to a close with no contact from my ex the possibility has dawned on me that truly we may never have contact again. On the one hand, I want to stay so that I'll know I didn't run away from anything, and just keep working on coming to terms with things and moving forward with my life. Every day I feel like I am growing and each day presents me with new surprises. I have yet to know, for example, what will happen with the friend who went AWOL on me (my oldest friend); I have yet to know what kinds of new job opportunities I can unearth, or whether I'll truly make a whole new set of friends or it will continue to feel lonely and empty despite my showing up at all kinds of events. And I have yet to know FOR SURE that my ex won't contact me and we'll have a chance to talk things through or maybe even get back together. I'd hate to leave and not find these things out. But I feel that as long as my ex and I are both here, I'm going to hold out hope that we'll somehow find our way back together, or that I'll hear from him, or that we'll run into one another and it will end up being an incredibly positive (and not a mortifying and traumatic) experience. I FEEL his proximity every day and even as I move forward I feel this little piece of me waiting patiently for some kind of contact from him. This while a more practical part of me is gradually acclimating to the idea that CONTACT MAY NEVER HAPPEN. So, I feel like maybe I need to do something a little drastic so as to reclaim my life from this and not fool myself that I'm moving on when really I'm still waiting and only discover that this is the case years--and several failed relationships--later. My thinking is that if I set a plan over the holidays to look for X-type job in X, Y, Z, etc. cities and start the ball rolling, that act alone of anticipating a completely new life elsewhere will help tear me away from my ex. And actually moving there will forcibly kill any hope that he would contact me, because there would be no point. Being in this new city would be a public announcment to myself that despite whatever emotions I may feel I am in a NEW life and for pure survival I have to focus forward since I wouldn't want a long-distance relationship with my ex, anyway. Does this sound...sound? Or too drastic? I just feel like I have tried everything to heal from this breakup, and while I've made a lot of strides I just can't kill my love for him and hope for reconciliation of some form, initiated by HIM. I feel like I can no longer trust my emotions to resolve to the point where I am free of the pain and confusion and longing. And I don't want to stay here hoping in spite of myself and then hearing that he's deep in a new relationship and seems really happy, or that he's moving from the city himself while I"m still here and have HIM dash my hopes yet again. Better to take action to kill the hope myself, and force myself into a situation where I truly must live forward and not kidding myself that I'm moving forward while thoughts and hopes regarding my ex pervade my mind every day. Yes? No? Thoughts appreciated
Leikela Posted December 17, 2007 Posted December 17, 2007 Please let me interject here and offer my thoughts. I can see why you are still so connected to your ex. He left you in limbo. You still have unanswered questions about the relationship. Holding out hope in this situation is normal. Moving away would help, but is it neccessary? Ever thought about calling him and putting all your cards on the table? Maybe asking him the questions you need answers to? You tried to move on but something is tying you to him. Maybe an all out open and honest conversation is what you need with him to gain closure.
annieo Posted December 17, 2007 Posted December 17, 2007 Hi AnnieO, Thanks for your message. Your story is amazing and really had an impact on me: I feel so reassured that it can indeed sometimes take a long time to overcome deep feelings of love for someone and the anguish of losing them. I'm so glad for you that you finally found real love again and are happy, after all those years of what I'm sure must have been a lot of growth (gained through pain--it's always that way, isn't it?). A question: did you ever, in all that time, contact your first love? During your first marriage, where you nursed regrets over letting your first love go, did you ever reach out to him? Or he you? Are you in contact with your first love now, and if not, do you feel that in those 11 years of sorting through your feelings, he really became a part of you, or you became him in certain respects? I'm so glad you wrote because I can see that it's going to take me a long time to fully come to terms with this, to the point where I can truly say it's all behind me. I'll be in the subway and suddenly remember some little loving interaction we had and my eyes will well up. Or I'll go from feeling intuitively that I will definitely hear from him in the next year, to feeling, again intuitively, that I'll never hear from him again. I'll feel very far away from him, and then very close. I swing from intense anger to deep longing and love. I feel like for the next couple of years and maybe more, this is going to be one of those Big Events that will change me fundamentally in a lot of ways, and hopefully in the long run, for the better. Right now I just feel like I'm swimming in confusion. I'd really be curious to hear more about your story; you can pm me if you want to go into more detail. For instance, I'm curious: why did you end the relationship and then what made you feel subsequently that you made a mistake? Or did you feel it was a mistake? If you had it to do all over again, knowing what you know now, what would you have done differently? Why did you marry your previous husband when you knew you did not love him in the fullest sense? Hi, Green Cove, I'm happy if I made you feel like you are not the only one. You aren't, and you will get through this. It won't be easy, but you will. And you'll be the better, wiser woman for it. To answer your questions, I still keep in touch with first love's parents (mom, especially). I loved them and they seemed to like me too. I'll call once or twice a year, and we exchange Christmas/birthday cards. I talk to her to find out about her, but she does tell me what ex bf is up to, and it's nice to know he's alive and well. He and I did keep in touch initially, but his current partner (of many years) didn't like it, so we stopped. I haven't spoken to him in ages and that is probably for the best. Yes he's a part of me and always will be. But I have now put our relationship in the past, where it belongs. I'll never forget him, though, and I will always care about him. I ended our relationship because we were living in different cities and I wanted to have the experience of different people, relationships. We were pretty young when we got together and I wondered what was out there. I did, for a very long time, think it was a mistake, but then my children came along and I realized that there is a reason for everything happening the way it did. I wouldn't change one thing, one decision, because of my kids and because all of these choices led me to where I am now, with a husband I love and children I adore. It all makes sense now, but that did take time. i married my previous husband because he seemed like a nice man, I didn't think it was possible to feel love the way I had for first guy (wrong, I feel more for my current husband than anyone, ever) and I really wanted to have children and didn't want to wait too long. Not great reasons to marry someone, but it made sense at the time. And again, I wouldn't change a thing. I don't see that marriage as a mistake - I learned so much about myself and I have my kids. For that, I will be forever grateful to my ex-h. Just go with the flow, grieve, feel your pain and hang in there. Life isn't always happy, pleasant and sometimes it takes awhile to see the point of things.
Author Zapbasket Posted December 17, 2007 Author Posted December 17, 2007 Hi Leikela, Thanks for your thoughts and support. Yes, I have thought about doing as you suggest and in fact, I think that thought was inspired by you several months back (and several pages back in this thread). After calling him in early September, I felt I'd done all I could at that point, and from then on I just needed to focus on coming to terms with things. But back then I really believed he'd have contacted me by now. I think if it were someone else, your idea would be perfect. It would be a great help to sit down and have a full, real conversation. But in all honesty he's not capable. He'd never agree to it, and all my cards laid out would result in silence, or a very short reply asking that I not contact him. Most likely silence. Even if he were to agree to a conversation, it just isn't his language and so anything he said would not mean anything--because he won't be able to answer the questions I'd need answers to. He flounders in situations like these and so to count on such a situation to clarify things for me would never work. The greatest clarity would be if he approached me himself with something to communicate. The rest of the time in the relationship he avoided every kind of difficult discussion and I can see how I completely overwhelmed him with my desire for mutual disclosure and communication. The only way anything can be clarified at all would be if he reached out, because then, finally, it would all be on HIS terms and I didn't enable that much in the relationship (unintentionally, of course). This all confuses me. I just have a feeling that were I to reach out, I'd receive nothing back. Somehow that should tell me everything but it does not, since he was so avoidant in the relationship, too.
Leikela Posted December 17, 2007 Posted December 17, 2007 Greencove, You state a good point. If he is the type that clams up regarding these discussions then most likely you contacting him again would be futile. If your ex behaves in this manner though, then perhaps, even though you feel he is perfect for you, he is not meant for you. How would you face the trials and tribulations that life throws at us as a couple if he clams up? You would indeed have a most frustrating life with him. I know how hard it is to heal from such a relationship. What has helped me in the past, as corny as it sounds, is self help books. Or join a support group online. Talking about it with others who have been there (besides us here on Loveshack) can be really beneficial. I wish you the best! PS- And I don't mean to sound like Loveshack isn't helpful. It is VERY helpful, but it is a start. Reading books and interacting with support groups help too.
Author Zapbasket Posted December 17, 2007 Author Posted December 17, 2007 Greencove, You state a good point. If he is the type that clams up regarding these discussions then most likely you contacting him again would be futile. Yes, I thought it over some more as I folded laundry just now and I really think it does have to come from him. I feel like maybe in constantly begging him to communicate I didn't really listen to him, and I'm 'listening' now. Either I'm finally hearing or he only started 'communicating' fully when he broke up with me and 'stopped' communicating (yeah, I'm trying to wrap my brain around that one, too), but his silence is speaking volume after painful volume. And I guess I want to ask him, "Is this really what you mean? You are this absolute in wanting absolutely nothing, NOTHING, to do with me?" Silence speaks, but words clarify, and so I guess I'm destined to continue with no real answers and just accustom myself to the silence and his absence, as I have been doing. But it's all so confusing that I feel like the only way to leave this behind me, in addition to working through it emotionally, is to physically leave. I don't want to run into him and have him treat me like a stranger. Or be friendly while I stand there wondering if he has any idea how long I spent reeling in confusion. Ugh. If your ex behaves in this manner though, then perhaps, even though you feel he is perfect for you, he is not meant for you. How would you face the trials and tribulations that life throws at us as a couple if he clams up? You would indeed have a most frustrating life with him. Can you help me here? Because this is what confuses me most, this "he is not meant for you." What do you mean? I mean, he's meant for SOMEONE. And how will she cope with the various trials and tribulations? Will it be because he'll feel he can communicate with her? Or because she'll know just the perfect way to handle his timidity around difficult discussions? It all seems to go back to what did I do wrong, that this didn't work to the extent that we never even got the chance, after all that energy expended, to be together in this city. It also indicates that he understood something about our relationship that I failed, and fail, to understand--meaning, he understood that we weren't meant for each other and why don't I understand that? This is the first time I have been unable to sort something out. I really thought that after a year I'd recognize that he wasn't the person for me, if that was indeed the case, and that's not what I feel or think. I can't tell what's blocking me, if anything IS blocking me from understanding. That's why I'm contemplating moving, because then I'm physically forcing myself out of this circling confusion. I know how hard it is to heal from such a relationship. What has helped me in the past, as corny as it sounds, is self help books. Or join a support group online. Talking about it with others who have been there (besides us here on Loveshack) can be really beneficial. I wish you the best! PS- And I don't mean to sound like Loveshack isn't helpful. It is VERY helpful, but it is a start. Reading books and interacting with support groups help too. Thanks, Leikela. Any self-help book recommendations? I'm definitely open to that and I agree that it could help clarify things a lot. I have thought about joining a support group and I may do that. Currently I'm in individual therapy but I feel like maybe I could get further if I had a chance to hear, live, from others in this city struggling also with moving on after a hairy breakup. Loveshack does help very much but you're right; it's a start. That said, I'm super grateful to this site nad the people on it as I think I'd be much less far along without it.
sunshinegirl Posted December 17, 2007 Posted December 17, 2007 I will take a brief shot at this: Can you help me here? Because this is what confuses me most, this "he is not meant for you." What do you mean? I mean, he's meant for SOMEONE. And how will she cope with the various trials and tribulations? Will it be because he'll feel he can communicate with her? Or because she'll know just the perfect way to handle his timidity around difficult discussions? GC, I went through an excruciating breakup in Jan 05 where I found myself asking many of the same questions you are. I, similarly, never got an explanation I could wrap my head around, and so I spent a year, more than a year really, trying to sort it all through. To your question - my best guess is that your guy's communication patterns are less likely to change than he is to find a woman who is equally avoidant, who hates conflict, who is emotionally guarded herself. Or whatever your guy's patterns were, he'll probably find a woman who does the same thing herself. Those kinds of people tend to find each other. In my Jan 05 ex's case, he married someone else a year ago. When I found out who she was (I knew her, casually), at first I was dumbfounded, but later I thought - aha! that makes perfect sense! My guy was totally avoidant. Couldn't handle strong emotions, whether positive or negative. Would make jokes about any/all serious topics that came up between us. He also needed to be the center of attention. He married one of the most dour, proper, un-interesting, not-nice people I've ever met. I am not prone to exaggeration, and in fact I have 3 friends who knew her better than me, and they each independently told me stories of how unfriendly she is. So anyway, I guess I finally realized that this ex and I were NEVER meant to work out, if he ultimately wanted to marry a woman like that. Seems to me that she 'fits' his personality in a way I never would. I don't know if that helps at all. But stay strong!
Racquel Colette Posted December 18, 2007 Posted December 18, 2007 Just because you weren't the one he is spending is life with, doesn't mean that there isn't another woman more compatible with him. He will find a woman who he is more compatible with and ultimately TRULY loves, and won't treat her the way he treated you. Men don't treat ones they really love the way he treated you. If he had really loved you, he would not have let you go, and he would not let so much time pass without wanting any contact with you. I am sorry you are hurting but you are wasting so much time and deliberation thinking this out and it's over a man who wants absolutely nothing to do with you. Think about it...just for a second, though, you've spent too much of your life pining and wondering. It's ovah.
Author Zapbasket Posted December 18, 2007 Author Posted December 18, 2007 I can't believe I'm even asking this but I can't help wondering if it could hurt that I try to reach out one more time. It's the holidays; what if I sent an e-mail or card wishing him happy holidays and either really coming out and saying I'm still in love with him or just saying that I really miss having him in my life and would like to see him? I get all encouraged when I read things like, "The enemy of love is fear," etc. You do hear stories of people reaching out and things working out.... But then I am well aware that he has rejected all my previous attempts. It's just so hard to know whether this silence is a kind of waiting period or truly The End Forever. I just wonder whether in my not just putting it all out there I'm keeping myself from having to know *for sure* it's permanently over and I have to give up. I'm *trying* to let go of hope because he's given every indication that it's Done. It's just so hard to read people who tend to bottle things up and shut down and shut people out when there's conflict. A perhaps wiser part of me thinks that maybe in that statement is the key for my moving on, i.e., do I really want people in my life who force me to have to always guess what's going on with them rather than just coming out and stating how they feel and what their needs are and being open to having a conversation? This could all be a clue that really I must have a partner who is more communicative. But even so, the fact remains that I wound up with this person who happened to have un-communicativeness as one of his attributes and I fell in love with his whole package that includes so very many wonderful qualities that will be very hard to find in someone else and I just don't know what to do with the lingering love and concomitant lingering questions and hope. I'm afraid you all are going to think I sound completely pathetic, to once AGAIN circle around to thinking about contacting him when I went through that over the summer, made an attempt at contact and in 3.5 months there was nothing from him. He wants to get over me, it seems, and if I love him I have to respect that.... It's just so hard because with everyone else I've ever in my life reached out to, even if it doesn't result in everything I wanted the other person is always responsive and touched that I reached out. I hope you're not laughing.... If not hing else writing this helps me see my own state of mind staring back at me. It's frustrating that everything I know to work and be 'good' in dealing with other people seems NOT to be in this case. So sad and confusing....
sunshinegirl Posted December 18, 2007 Posted December 18, 2007 He wants to get over me, it seems, and if I love him I have to respect that.... How about recasting that as "If I want to get over him, it seems, and if I love myself, I have to respect that..." From what I have read of your story (and I have skimmed this thread (it's a long one!) so maybe I missed something), but your ex has been extraordinarily clear that this relationship is over and HE is moving on. As unfair and inexplicable and wrong as it seems given what your relationship was like, he is not coming back, sweetheart. So I don't think you should contact him again - you will only get hurt again. Have you heard the analogy of getting over an ex being like kicking an addiction? Any contact you make, or attempt, is akin to a relapse and will set your recovery back (by a little or by a lot). But it is your decision, of course. And if you choose to send him some kind of message, please at least stop to consider how you will feel if/when you don't hear back from him. Will it ruin your holidays? If so, WAIT until after the holiday season to act on your impulse.
Author Zapbasket Posted December 18, 2007 Author Posted December 18, 2007 No, I don't think I'm going to write him. The impulse is different from what it was back in August that led me to actually call him in September. It's different because I have yet more evidence supporting the possibility that he really intends never to contact me again and will follow through impeccably on his intention. From what I have read of your story (and I have skimmed this thread (it's a long one!) so maybe I missed something), but your ex has been extraordinarily clear that this relationship is over and HE is moving on. As unfair and inexplicable and wrong as it seems given what your relationship was like, he is not coming back, sweetheart. But...can't someone say "I want nothing to do with you and never want to see you again" in the heat of the moment and then feel differently once they've had time to process things? It's just so foreign to me, to cut someone off in anger and hurt and then not want, ever, to take up an opportunity to clarify things, or forgive, or respond to the person reaching out. It confuses me because I truly did try to be a good girlfriend and I had no idea that our arguments hurt him so much, as clearly they must have. It makes me confused about what I have to offer someone as a girlfriend--maybe I sent out wrong messages, messages opposite to those that truly came from my heart. All I remember now is that I was very resentful of him for never bringing up the subject of our future together, and then not rising to my many invitations to talk about our immediate future, i.e., moving in together, etc. I mean, now that I've been single for a year, I can see that being in an intimate relationship puts you in a mind- and experience-state that is totally like that when you just have to think about yourself. It's like an alternate universe. I'm so afraid that when I'm in a relationship again, I'm going to see dynamics come up that are the same and I'm only then going to learn what made me such an awful girlfriend that my ex felt he had to rid himself of me so vehemently and permanently. You're right, I'm sure. Everyone who has told me he's done and not looking back is probably right. I feel so very ashamed that here I sit, a year later, and I'm unable to understand. I know, baby steps...and I've taken baby steps, at least.
sunshinegirl Posted December 18, 2007 Posted December 18, 2007 Don't feel ashamed that it's taking awhile to recover... be glad that you are capable of loving someone that much! For me, a big turning point came after I attempted contact with my ex 3 months post-breakup. I had been harboring a lot of hope that he would reconsider - after all, things had been wonderful and then he suddenly, inexplicably, ran away. It was when I contacted him and he was friendly but abundantly clear that we were O-V-E-R, that I finally understood that the door had been slammed. That there was no hope, we would not have a second chance, he was not coming back. I had to come to terms with THAT, and once I did THAT, I was able to reorient my entire perspective. Life from that moment on became about my need to move on, to reclaim my life, to get over him. Up until that point, I had been completely obsessed with trying to understand what went wrong, trying to figure out how to win him back, wondering when he would come to his senses. Basically, there was no way I was going to heal and move on as long as I harbored hope that he would come back and we would get a second chance. But...can't someone say "I want nothing to do with you and never want to see you again" in the heat of the moment and then feel differently once they've had time to process things? Um, I guess so. But that's kind of fantasyland thinking, GC. It would be one thing if he said that right when you broke up. If he didn't mean it, then maybe a week or a month later he would have contacted you. But he apparently said this in September, ***9 months*** after you broke up? That does not sound like a 'heat of the moment' kind of message. And he's had 3 months to contact you to say he didn't mean it. The bigger issue is that you need to knock this guy off his pedastal! Why would you want to get back together with someone who told you he never wants to see you again??? Seriously! Don't you see you deserve more than that? On another note, I think you said you were seeing a counselor, yes? What do you talk about in your sessions? Is he/she helpful in helping you work through some of your thinking? You are holding him up as the end-all, be-all. I don't care how great he was, I promise you that he is not the end-all, be-all of men. The very fact of how he has handled your breakup is proof.
Author Zapbasket Posted December 18, 2007 Author Posted December 18, 2007 Don't feel ashamed that it's taking awhile to recover... be glad that you are capable of loving someone that much! Thank you for these charitable words! It's just that my loving hasn't led anywhere yet--not in any of my relationships! Maybe I'm somehow missing something? I don't know. It just seems like from my perspective I give a lot of loyalty and I have yet to have anyone be inspired to give the same loyalty in return...not that I ever ask for it because I don't! For me, a big turning point came after I attempted contact with my ex 3 months post-breakup. I had been harboring a lot of hope that he would reconsider - after all, things had been wonderful and then he suddenly, inexplicably, ran away. I can identify with your story so much and I can just imagine how hurt you were. From reading some of your posts closer to the time this all went down, it sounds like your guy knew how to do all the motions of committment without really knowing how to commit from within. It sounds like once the relationship hit that "now we are truly an item" mark he split, not because he was deceiving you but because it simply took him into territory he didn't know how to handle. He probably married the person he did because in her coldness she allows him the emotional distance he needs to feel safe--safe enough to not run away. Um, I guess so. But that's kind of fantasyland thinking, GC. It would be one thing if he said that right when you broke up. If he didn't mean it, then maybe a week or a month later he would have contacted you. But he apparently said this in September, ***9 months*** after you broke up? That does not sound like a 'heat of the moment' kind of message. And he's had 3 months to contact you to say he didn't mean it. But this is why I'm so confused: he told me to get lost in an e-mail in ***February***. It was quite a nasty e-mail--not viscious but just very, very cold and it definitely had a bite of "I'm being cold to hurt you." I was shocked and devastated and did not dare contact him. But as the summer drew to a close, I felt it couldn't hurt to try. So I called him and he was not only affable, but quite forthcoming with information about himself and he honestly sounded glad to hear from me. But he said nothing about being sorry for what he said before, and when I said at the end of the conversation that maybe we could meet up sometime, he only mumbled "maybe" the way you'd say, "I don't think so." What I didn't--and don't--understand is why he bothered to humor me, if that's what it was, by being friendly when since he didn't apologize for his awful e-mail seemingly he still stood by everything he said. In many ways our conversation only left me more confused. The bigger issue is that you need to knock this guy off his pedastal! Why would you want to get back together with someone who told you he never wants to see you again??? Seriously! Don't you see you deserve more than that? You may have a point... I guess what mortifies me is that seemingly he never wants to see me again because he felt that HE deserves more than that--more than ME, that is. I'd love to say that someone who can hold a grudge that tightly (and he'd admitted that he was a grudge-holder and it was problematic) and who on top of it is unwilling to talk things through is not someone I'd want to be with forever...but I can't help feeling like his cold and definite "get lost" in word and action is a statement that from his perspective he can do better than me. That's one reason why this is feeling so awful. On another note, I think you said you were seeing a counselor, yes? What do you talk about in your sessions? Is he/she helpful in helping you work through some of your thinking? I am indeed seeing a counselor and have been since February. To be honest I'm not sure she's all that helpful. She doesn't say much, even when I ask her for her feedback, and I find that very frustrating as I feel I most need feedback kand outside interpretations. Just some PERSPECTIVE. She feels my reaction to this has to do with losing my father when I was two...and I can see some truth to that but that is so deep and far back in the past that without more interaction about the more surface aspects of dealing with this it's like she's reading from a textbook. I'd try to find another counselor but I can't afford to and I'm afraid if I leave her I will quit; I'm not feeling very high-faith in counseling lately as I just feel in so much pain it seems impossible that anything but my own hard efforts is going to make me feel any better. You are holding him up as the end-all, be-all. I don't care how great he was, I promise you that he is not the end-all, be-all of men. The very fact of how he has handled your breakup is proof. I breathed a sigh of relief when I read that, Sunshinegirl. Thanks! I want to believe I deserved better because from my perspective the way he acted about the problems we were having and then commensurately the way he acted about the breakup was just awful and very immature. Still, as I comprised 50% of the relationship, I carry blame for how things went down and I feel just awful to have been part of something, and cared so deeply and been so excited about something, that ended so very badly. I thought our relationship was much, much more special than to have it end at all, let alone end with nothing but all blame pushed on me and a door slammed in my face after 5 years.
norajane Posted December 19, 2007 Posted December 19, 2007 I thought our relationship was much, much more special than to have it end at all, let alone end with nothing but all blame pushed on me and a door slammed in my face after 5 years. You know, if you read the threads in the Infidelity forum, you'll see that a LOT of people feel that way when they find out they don't have what they thought they had in their relationship. And those are husbands and wives, often with children. It happens to a lot of people every day. You are not alone in feeling the way you do.
Racquel Colette Posted December 19, 2007 Posted December 19, 2007 Greencove, I honestly think he doesn't blame you for anything. There is nothing to blame you for; he simply fell out of love with you, and he knows this is not your fault. You weren't compatible; he didn't feel the proverbial 'it' for you. Believe me, you want someone who feels 'it' for you. He will find someone he feels 'it' for, as you will find a man who feels 'it' for you, and this man will be but a mere memory and you will wonder why you spent so much time pondering it. People fall out of love all the time. Sucks, but it's life, and you have no choice but to move on.
Author Zapbasket Posted December 19, 2007 Author Posted December 19, 2007 Yes, Norajane, I do read the infidelity forums from time to time, and I know well I am not alone. And while that certainly does offer some solace in the form of being able to relate to others' pain and know that others can relate to mine, I *am* alone in that I trusted *this* specific person above all other people and no one else chose to trust this particular person. Each of us is alone in that way. Knowing, therefore, that this kind of thing happens ALL THE TIME doesn't eliminate my confusion. And it certainly doesn't eliminate my guilt at having obviously hurt this person to such an extent that he would feel he wants nothing to do with me. I know he wouldn't have done what he did unless he felt driven to it by extreme circumstances and somehow I managed to create those extreme circumstances. I know that when he said he wanted to be with me forever, he meant it. He left because he determined that he simply could not be happy in a relationship with me and he wanted to eliminate all vestiges of it (including me) from his life in hopes of finding someone with whom he *could* create a relationship that could make him happy. Here I sit, still loving him and longing for him, when if I'm really honest I know that in all my resentment that built up I failed to make him feel that I truly accepted him just as he was. I have learned a bitter lesson that it doesn't pay to get angry at someone you love, and it doesn't pay to be stubborn. I understand that I did my best and I was angry and stubborn for a reason and turning myself into a doormat wouldn't have been a good idea, either. But I failed to really think about how much it meant to me to have this person in my life as my love, and be sure to act accordingly--such as, for example, showing up at his apartment with a suitcase when he moved here and keeping him company while I trusted that all the financial, etc. logistics would get worked out piecemeal as we went along. All he wanted originally was for me to come to the apartment. Granted, he said things that were hurtful and made me think he *didn't* want me there. I wish he were out there thinking as I am, because I would like a second chance for the two of us. But of course, that's because this time apart has made me realize more fully than ever how very much he meant to me and how much he brought to my life, and that I could have done more on my end to ensure our relationship was something we both enjoyed being in. From his behavior so far, clearly for him this time apart has only spelled relief and whatever unhappiness he may have felt or be feeling this past year does not equal, for him, the unhappiness he felt while with me. That is a very humbling, deeply painful thing to recognize. I didn't intend to write so much in reply! These thoughts just came pouring almost on their own. But in response to your comment, NJ, I come here because I do derive a great solace from being among others who are going through, or have gone through, similar pain and are willing to share their stories and feelings here. I think this site has done much to remind me that this is just how the universe and human relationships work, that you can never, ever go along thinking that the life you built up around you will stay intact indefinitely. At any moment it could all be gone and you should life your life with that always in your awareness, and no matter how frustrated you are you should treat those in your life like the fleeting treasures they are. And to clarify, mostly for myself: what I'd have done differently is to have addressed my frustrations with his communication much more as "This is a problem WE are having" rather than as "You HAVE to communicate with me; please communicate with me; I'm furious with you for not communicating with me; etc."
Racquel Colette Posted December 20, 2007 Posted December 20, 2007 I can't believe I'm even asking this but I can't help wondering if it could hurt that I try to reach out one more time. It's the holidays; what if I sent an e-mail or card wishing him happy holidays and either really coming out and saying I'm still in love with him or just saying that I really miss having him in my life and would like to see him? I get all encouraged when I read things like, "The enemy of love is fear," etc. You do hear stories of people reaching out and things working out.... But then I am well aware that he has rejected all my previous attempts. It's just so hard to know whether this silence is a kind of waiting period or truly The End Forever. I just wonder whether in my not just putting it all out there I'm keeping myself from having to know *for sure* it's permanently over and I have to give up. I'm *trying* to let go of hope because he's given every indication that it's Done. It's just so hard to read people who tend to bottle things up and shut down and shut people out when there's conflict. A perhaps wiser part of me thinks that maybe in that statement is the key for my moving on, i.e., do I really want people in my life who force me to have to always guess what's going on with them rather than just coming out and stating how they feel and what their needs are and being open to having a conversation? This could all be a clue that really I must have a partner who is more communicative. But even so, the fact remains that I wound up with this person who happened to have un-communicativeness as one of his attributes and I fell in love with his whole package that includes so very many wonderful qualities that will be very hard to find in someone else and I just don't know what to do with the lingering love and concomitant lingering questions and hope. I'm afraid you all are going to think I sound completely pathetic, to once AGAIN circle around to thinking about contacting him when I went through that over the summer, made an attempt at contact and in 3.5 months there was nothing from him. He wants to get over me, it seems, and if I love him I have to respect that.... It's just so hard because with everyone else I've ever in my life reached out to, even if it doesn't result in everything I wanted the other person is always responsive and touched that I reached out. I hope you're not laughing.... If not hing else writing this helps me see my own state of mind staring back at me. It's frustrating that everything I know to work and be 'good' in dealing with other people seems NOT to be in this case. So sad and confusing.... I am sorry but you seem a bit unstable here and it is kind of scary. You are obsessing over a man who wants nothing to do with you, and hasn't for a year. It is reminding me of Glenn Close's character in Fatal Attraction. Please get some help. You say you have been seeing a therapist but may I suggest a better one?
Author Zapbasket Posted December 20, 2007 Author Posted December 20, 2007 I am sorry but you seem a bit unstable here and it is kind of scary. You are obsessing over a man who wants nothing to do with you, and hasn't for a year. It is reminding me of Glenn Close's character in Fatal Attraction. Please get some help. You say you have been seeing a therapist but may I suggest a better one? You know, I was *just* about to head over to his apartment to boil his pet bunny and wait for his new girl in the bathroom, kitchen carving knife at the ready. You definitely caught me in the nick of time!
PinkRibbon Posted December 24, 2007 Posted December 24, 2007 So Greencove did you contact him? I am really curious about the outcome because I feel alot like you as I have many unanswered questions about my husband leaving me and having no contact and I love to read your posts.
tinke Posted December 24, 2007 Posted December 24, 2007 greencove, how's it going? although i am not a religious (spiritual, yes) person, i have found great comfort with the knowledge that we cannot control things/situations. as time goes by, i am still not completely over him, but, i feel the way in which he left, hurts most. in the down times, i have to believe something/someone higher has said NO to the relationship...no matter how badly we may want them. as painful as it is, perhaps it is to spare us from greater grief in the long-run. you've said you have learned so much from your ex. maybe that was the purpose of your time together...to learn these lessons..for the future. with time, the pain is dulling...still feels surreal at times. but, i have come to the realization that we cannot control this. and during these times, i do find some comfort in knowing it is out of my hands, someone else is leading. don't mean to get religious, but i just wanted to share some thoughts that have helped me. hope they may help you, too. we have similar situations and felt similar emotions to the sudden departure, so i do understand your pain. well as far as contacting him.......you have to work on what is right for YOU. if contacting him once again will give you the solid answers(even with no reply) you need, then do it. but try somewhere to have your limits or you'll be back to analyzing everything with no real conclusion. thinking of you wishing you peaceful holidays
Author Zapbasket Posted December 24, 2007 Author Posted December 24, 2007 I don't know what happened but there were some great replies from Florida and AnnieO that suddenly disappeared.... Florida, thanks for all you said and for your understanding. You said a lot of great things and I hope your post is restored. In particular, you said something along the lines of me not focusing on FACTS and being blinded by a combination of idealism that is incommensurate with the facts and an ego that just can't wrap itself around such utter rejection, and this really hit home for me. You're right; my lens is overly idealistic. I value my idealism but I think perhaps I get messed up in not just this breakup but a lot of other situations by holding too fast to what I feel *should be* and not being accepting of *what is*. Perhaps this is why I am finding myself deeply disappointed not only with what happened in my relationship, but with some of my friends (e.g., the one I mentioned a page or two back, who hung out with my ex and then, when I told her that I felt hurt and explained why, immediately went on the defensive and said, "Well, honestly I wasn't thinking about you" and "I have trouble having empathy for you because I don't think ____ was that great of a guy," and then, after I left her apartment in the middle of the night and left a message saying through audible tears, "I know it's irrational and I'm so sorry but I feel so betrayed," said she'd call me that weekend and then never did and now it's been nearly 2 months). I don't hold in mind what I fundamentally know about these people--such as that this friend is impulsive and basically selfish and I've known that since we were 12 years old and that my ex can be very rigid and uncommunicative and I knew that within the first few months of our dating--so that I can maintain reasonable expectations of what I'll get from them emotionally, etc. I think that's what you may have been alluding to? I think you're pointing to my many posts on this thread along the lines of, "How can he do this?" and then I'm not looking at the answers I already have: he can do this because he perpetually wound up making assumptions based on his insecurities and projections rather than COMMUNICATING with me how he felt; he can do this because he has it in him to be very hard and non-accepting; he can do this because in several instances he indicated that he wasn't 100% sure about me or that I bothered him in certain fundamental ways; he can do this because our relationship was in a very difficult place and during relational crossroads like these, ESPECIALLY when you're not married with a family, people can always choose to stay and keep working on it or to go and he chose to let it go because his frustration level was frankly high enough and his maturity level was low enough that he didn't see a way through it and didn't want to hang on to see if a way would materialize. Is this more the kind of thinking you advocated in your post? I was so appreciative of how well you understand the mindf*ck one goes through after a sudden and unwanted (on one side) split. It's so hard to wrap your mind around someone's decision to leave when you can see a way through and you have so much attachment to the person. It's hard to imagine that the other person envisioned his life without you and found it appealing--it feels so cold and degrading--and he must have done so before breaking up otherwise he'd never have gone through it. Especially what's hard is the fact that I could really see myself spending my life with this person and it seemed, even while other, negative things were manifest, that overall he felt the same way and moreover I FELT that from him. It's confusing because even while I FELT his love and devotion I also FELT his withdrawal; what is particularly confusing is that the withdrawal was a constant characteristic with him--not just with me but in other situations I witnessed--and so I'm left wondering whether his withdrawal that I felt was just him being him or evidence of his gradual emotional disengagement from the relationship that precipitated his breaking things off with me. I suspect I'll never have answers to these questions. Sorry for the long response but your post really made me think and I hope it comes back so I can read it over again. Thanks for your insights
Racquel Colette Posted December 24, 2007 Posted December 24, 2007 Please don't contact this man. Leave the poor guy alone. I can see that you weren't compatible; guys tire of women overanalyzing and women 'going on' about things. Maybe that is something you should think about. You add too much drama and love shouldn't be so much work and drama. You scare men away with that.
Author Zapbasket Posted December 24, 2007 Author Posted December 24, 2007 AnnieO, ditto to you re: what I said to Florida. Thanks so much for your post and I hope it returns. I didn't fully understand the part about pulling out the thorn--did you mean really facing the very likely possibility that he'll never come back, never contact me and planning my life accordingly? I don't know how! The only way I can think of is to move from here. My ex is back in his homecity and I can't tell you how nice it has been this weekend to romp around the city knowing he's not here. I was even able to go up to his neighborhood--which was MY neighborhood; I lived there for 5 years--and toodle around purely carefree. Usually on the rare times I have to go to his neighborhood I feel like I'm trespassing and I take every step in dread (and hope!--or something between dread and hope; there really needs to be a word for that..."drope," maybe?) that I'll run into him. Even not in his neighborhood, I feel such a relief; I didn't realize until this weekend how oppressed I feel knowing that he is in the same city as I am and yet I am completely cut out of his life. I can't bear this anymore and I know I'm going to keep hoping as long as the very real possibility exists that we could cross paths so it seems the only solution is to begin looking for jobs not just in NYC, but other cities, as well. Re: the letter from your ex's mother and your indifference at his being only 30 minutes away this holiday after not seeing or speaking to each other for 18 years.... I have a hard time identifying with that. How did you reach that point? Doesn't *something* stir up in you, even if just caring curiosity? Is it partly, you think, that you are *afraid* of what might get stirred up if you were to meet face to face after all this time? I hope you don't mind my asking this. It just frightens me regarding what love really means if you can at one time envision yourself living your whole life in partnership with a person, spend a significant portion of your life with them and create a bond and feel deep devotion to them, and then find that those feelings are no more and only indifference exists. I know I'm young(ish) but so far there is no one I've ever loved towards whom I feel indifference, even if I haven't spoken to some of them in years. This is why I feel confused about how to handle this breakup.
Author Zapbasket Posted December 24, 2007 Author Posted December 24, 2007 So Greencove did you contact him? I am really curious about the outcome because I feel alot like you as I have many unanswered questions about my husband leaving me and having no contact and I love to read your posts. PinkRibbon, I read your story and I am so sorry for you and your daughter. I hope you get some answers soon regarding what happened and I hope you'll find this site helpful in processing things. No, I did not contact him. I want to, just as I've been wanting to this whole year. I may try one last time, especially if I decide to move from this city. But now it seems best to refrain; I can console myself with the fact that I *did* reach out 3.5 months ago and it seems wisest for now to hold on to some dignity--after all, if he were to ignore me or say something hurtful it would spin me into a deep hole and I'm already busy enough trying to dig myself out of the hole I'm currently in. But the impulse is hard to resist. I'd love to contact his parents but I know that's probably unwise, too. It's hard. But I think what I surmised before still stands: that it has to come from him if there is to be any contact. That, or we randomly encounter each other, which terrifies me as I dread being treated indifferently after all these months of crying over him and missing him every day. I share your confusion (as you know!) re: someone with whom you had a history and a connection just cutting out in such an ugly way. When I'm not feeling utter despair, I'm consoled by this little "truth" (if that's what it is): that we are all fundamentally alone and it's illusory to expect that we can rely on anyone or anything to be around with us forever. I don't think it means we can't trust anybody, just that maybe we should view the time someone devotes to us as a *gift* and not as a given, and love as wholly as we can while keeping oriented to the possibility that X person or situation is only with us temporarily. It's a hard balance to achieve and I don't know that I'll ever achieve it; it seems inevitable that part of the "specialness" of forging a connection with someone is the anticipation of its permanence in our lives; this anticipation seems to be part of the chemical cocktail of love and thus is present even in contradiction to past experience and common sense. I know that when I fall in love again and am fallen in love with again I will once again be susceptible to this anticipation. But maybe also by then I'll have learned through this present awful experience that only I can make my happiness and that my loveability is not measured by whether someone chooses to stay or go, but rather by my ability to give love freely when I feel it. Of course, I have a long way to go before I reach this point! One thing abbout this breakup is that it's shown me how very little I know and how immature I really am. I hope things look up for you, PinkRibbon.
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