Can we stop with the hate?

[Melovator]

I'm getting kind of disturbed about the anti-man/ anti-woman stuff that's floating around.

 

Not all men are bastards and not all women are bitches.

 

We are people, some of us have innies and some of us have outies. And you can argue about whether our differences are biological or social or a combination of the both, but what it means is f**ked up women f**k men over in a particular number of ways and f**ked up men f**k women up in particular different ways (as the threads attest because patterns keep coming up). It's still just people being mean to other people.

 

It doesn't mean everyone is like that. In fact if I really wanted to get on the all men are bastards bandwagon I'm sure I could find a forum for that, but I don't believe that all men are bastards- it just gets hard when you keep reading 'all women do XXXXXX' try even saying "a whole lot of really f**ked up women who need to get their **** together do XXXXXX". Same for the ladies try "A lot of men are XXXXX".

 

'Cause you know what? There are patterns of f**ked up male behaviour and there are patterns of f**ked up female behaviour. Sharing them and learning from them will hopefully make us all un-f**ked up people with radars for bullsh*t.

 

Thank you for reading.

[sumdude]

I second the notion. People in general are messed up ... make mistakes ... get selfish... If marriage isn't for you then fine, that's okay .. no need to vilify the other sex to justify your choice.

 

You have the people who were effed over who end up different. Trust is harder to give again ... a lot of the walking wounded out there. It's no wonder second marriages have a lower success rate than first marriages. Those getting married again are either the ones who end up repeating mistakes from the first one ... or the ones who were left and have hair triggers for problems. Ending up reactionary and making kneejerk decisions.

 

That's why it's so important to get your head back on before entering a new relationship. Go to the crash site and peice togetehr what you can to learn from it.

[Woggle]

In a way I agree with you but if women start bashing men I can repay the hate tenfold. I always make it clear that I am not talking about all women but a whole lot of women today are like I describe.

[Lyssa]

I agree with Melovator and sumdude. I have only been here less than a month and every day I see people getting bashed. It's really upsetting especially to see those who come here for advice and support, get bashed. They are here because they need some sort of a support system but what I see is, them getting bashed. They are already feeling s***ty for their mistakes so I don't think they need someone or a few people who have different opinions to kick them even deeper to the ground when they fall.

[Ladyjane14]

I'm getting kind of disturbed about the anti-man/ anti-woman stuff that's floating around.

 

Not all men are bastards and not all women are bitches.

 

We are people, some of us have innies and some of us have outies. And you can argue about whether our differences are biological or social or a combination of the both, but what it means is f**ked up women f**k men over in a particular number of ways and f**ked up men f**k women up in particular different ways (as the threads attest because patterns keep coming up). It's still just people being mean to other people.

 

I'm in complete agreement and soooo glad you posted this.

We're not talking about specific cases in which one person treats another person badly, and then receives various (and sometimes quite vociferous) opinions on their actions. We're talking rank prejudice... no different than the persecution of people based on racial or religious bias. It's prejudice based singularly on a group dynamic... gender.

 

I think it's natural that in a format where we discuss romantic relationships between men and women that there be some disharmony and occasional generalization. But this is different. This is the use of hate-language and the spreading of hate for hate's sake... which should NEVER be tolerated.

 

Personally, I'm going to start using the reporting tool whenever I see it, and I'd encourage others to do the same. Although I seldom report for content on a post... I've had it up to my ears with men coming in here to demonize and degrade women as a group.

 

With women comprising at least half, if not more of LS membership, it's like somebody coming into your house specifically to call you names and denigrate you. Unacceptable.

[Lyssa]

I'm in complete agreement and soooo glad you posted this.

We're not talking about specific cases in which one person treats another person badly, and then receives various (and sometimes quite vociferous) opinions on their actions. We're talking rank prejudice... no different than the persecution of people based on racial or religious bias. It's prejudice based singularly on a group dynamic... gender.

 

I think it's natural that in a format where we discuss romantic relationships between men and women that there be some disharmony and occasional generalization. But this is different. This is the use of hate-language and the spreading of hate for hate's sake... which should NEVER be tolerated.

 

Personally, I'm going to start using the reporting tool whenever I see it, and I'd encourage others to do the same. Although I seldom report for content on a post... I've had it up to my ears with men coming in here to demonize and degrade women as a group.

 

With women comprising at least half, if not more of LS membership, it's like somebody coming into your house specifically to call you names and denigrate you. Unacceptable.

 

I agree!!!! You're good....

[Missy27]

Post Deleted

[lindya]

Personally, I'm going to start using the reporting tool whenever I see it, and I'd encourage others to do the same. Although I seldom report for content on a post... I've had it up to my ears with men coming in here to demonize and degrade women as a group.

 

I've noticed one or two twats who have joined relatively recently, who compulsively post negative assumptions about women and present those assumptions as though they're important academic findings.

 

There's one whose whole life seems to be devoted to gathering information to fuel his own bitterness. I've seen a few threads he's started up - always asking some ludicrous question of the board that bases itself on some totally skewed and negative "insight" into the average female mind. I'm sometimes tempted to invent a new male alias and pose as one of these twats for fun. I'd start a thread with this question:

 

"Is it wrong that men should be permitted to walk down the street without goose-stepping feminists dressed in leather hunting them down and beating them with spiked metal bars? Come on ladeeez - help a fella out here. Is our presence on the streets so offensive and dangerous to you that we should all have curfews slapped on us, because that's where society seems to be going as far as I can see....blah blah whine whine. I'm not saying I hit women, but if one hits me she'd better not expect to be able to stand up for a while, blah blah....men are starting to fight back after a few too many years of being forced to wear pink lacy panties and clean out their partners' lavatory bowls with their tongues....blah blah."

 

It's ridiculous. Those posters, with all the frantic "research" they carry out to justify their bile bring to mind a vision of Scrooge. I see him raking about the local tip on a frosty day in search of grubby bits of paper...then dragging it all home to make a short-lived fire which he'll warm his liver-spotted paws against, before rushing back out into the freezing cold to find some more fuel.

 

Phew. I feel better now. What was the topic again? Oh yes....we should all stop hating eachother. Peace out, I love you all.

[Geishawhelk]

Oh boy...Should i post this....?

yeh, why not?

I'll toss my hat into the ring and see what happens....

 

we soon stop thinking about how different we are when we actually realise we're not.

 

If I was blind and deaf, and someone nudged me, I would immediately neither know, or even care, perhaps, what their gender is. In fact, even their colour, ethnic origin and religious belief would be way far down my priority list.

As far as waht I practise is concerne, the first and foremost consideration is the person is like me. Human. And that's where we need to start from. Because we're all born the same way, and pretty much sooner or later, we all end up the same way.

so why give a fig about the middle?

It's all conditioned response, all lllusion.

[Trialbyfire]

all men are bastards and all women are bitches.

But there's truth in these words. Everyone has this side to them. To pretend otherwise, is to be in denial.

[Storyrider]

Classification, categorization and generalization are quite useful to a point when it comes to understanding human behavior.

 

But if we view an entire gender safely through preconceived lenses and filters, we miss connecting with the real messy, lovely unique person.

[Gunny376]

Sadly, but generally speaking for most men, all that is required of any given woman to qualify as a "bitch" is her willingness to sleep with virtually any other man than him.

 

ANY of the sins, crimes, mental, emotional illnesses of humanity can committed by or visited upon ANY one individual regardless of who or what they are.

[Melovator]

Sumdude: People in general are messed up ... make mistakes ... get selfish... If marriage isn't for you then fine, that's okay .. no need to vilify the other sex to justify your choice.

 

That's why it's so important to get your head back on before entering a new relationship. Go to the crash site and peice togetehr what you can to learn from it.

 

I agree and just have to add that getting your head together doesn't involve slagging off the half of the human race you'd like to scrog (that's just such a great term Gunny!). In fact if you really think that way then your options are: 1) be celibate, 2) change your sexual preference, 3) become a male/ female sepratist and live on a commune surrounded only by the hormones of your own gender, and your final option 4) Accept that any relationships you have while you have that attitude are bound to fail because constant misogyny/ misandry is very unattractive in a partner.

 

Woggle: In a way I agree with you but if women start bashing men I can repay the hate tenfold. I always make it clear that I am not talking about all women but a whole lot of women today are like I describe.

 

And I could, if I chose to, repay the hate to blokes out there- but what is the freaking point? It isn't going to make me happy, I might get a brief warm glow of- 'heheheh take that you misogynistic piece of cr*p' but what the hell am I going to learn from that? How on earth does being hateful allow me (or anyone else here) to grow as a person and to have non-f**ked up relationships in the future? Or to even get along with the other gender and its not like men and women can avoid each other- try this experiment I attempted a few years back: for a day accept only services and conversation from your own gender. It doesn't work, at some point you have to interact with someone from the opposite side of the chromosome divide.

 

LAdy Jane: We're not talking about specific cases in which one person treats another person badly, and then receives various (and sometimes quite vociferous) opinions on their actions. We're talking rank prejudice... no different than the persecution of people based on racial or religious bias. It's prejudice based singularly on a group dynamic... gender.

 

I think it's natural that in a format where we discuss romantic relationships between men and women that there be some disharmony and occasional generalization. But this is different. This is the use of hate-language and the spreading of hate for hate's sake... which should NEVER be tolerated.

 

Damn straight- it is predjudice, one of the last bloody bastions left along with that against the fat. It is not acceptable to denigrate persons of different ethnicties, cultures, racial backgrounds, religions, persons with mental and physical difficulties and its just as not acceptable (I read like friggin' SuperNanny- and on a side note just how do the parents on that show let everything get so out of control?) to denigrate the opposite gender.

 

Geishawhelk:we soon stop thinking about how different we are when we actually realise we're not.

 

If I was blind and deaf, and someone nudged me, I would immediately neither know, or even care, perhaps, what their gender is. In fact, even their colour, ethnic origin and religious belief would be way far down my priority list.

As far as waht I practise is concerne, the first and foremost consideration is the person is like me. Human. And that's where we need to start from. Because we're all born the same way, and pretty much sooner or later, we all end up the same way.

so why give a fig about the middle?

It's all conditioned response, all lllusion.

 

Trust a Bhuddist to cut through the web of illusion...YES!!!!! We're all born, we all die, we all have some pain (and taxes!) in the middle. LS is a place where some of the conditioned responses and illusions we have about relationships can be picked apart, understood and hopefully once that's done individuals can discard the cr*p they've picked up and be better people who carry less baggage around with them.

 

TrialbyFire: But there's truth in these words. Everyone has this side to them. To pretend otherwise, is to be in denial.

 

How about this then: All women have the potential to be bitches should they choose to be and all men have the potential to be bastards should they choose to be.

 

Potential can be negative or positive, its what we choose to do with our potential.To Say ALL women XXX or all men XXX is to deny free will and ultimately removes responsibility from individuals for their actions- She might be a bitch but its not her fault because all women are like that. So engaging in ALL women XXX or all men XXX actually means you're reinforcing the behaviour you dislike because if its inherent then nothing can be done about it.

 

Soryrider: But if we view an entire gender safely through preconceived lenses and filters, we miss connecting with the real messy, lovely unique person.

 

Again YES! Exactly what I'm getting at!

 

Gunny: Sadly, but generally speaking for most men, all that is required of any given woman to qualify as a "bitch" is her willingness to sleep with virtually any other man than him.

 

ANY of the sins, crimes, mental, emotional illnesses of humanity can committed by or visited upon ANY one individual regardless of who or what they are.

 

I love you Gunny. None of us man or woman is perfect, we all do sh*tty things to each other but just because someone of a particular gender treated you in a bad way doesn't mean the next one will- unless of course you drag the attitude that they WILL treat you in a bad way into it. It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy where the other person thinks "well they expect that I'm a complete f**ktard so I might as well act like one."

[DavidB]

I understand it's hard to step back and look objectively at people's behaviour; it's easier to generalize about people as opposed to looking at them as individuals.

 

We all get hurt in life, and we all hurt others too. That's not an excuse to lash out. Being angry all the time is really self-destructive, colours your perspective on life, and can end up turning you into one of those bitter people who just aren't very pleasant to be around.

 

I am very glad to have found this site; it's been very helpful and I know it will be a resource I turn to in the coming months, however I can do without the vindictiveness that does float around this board.

[Gunny376]

I know I can be a bastard! Trust me! The Corps has taught me well.

 

Its not the bitches I have a problem with, Bitches? I can deal with ~ just move on! Its the bastards that I have a problem with!

 

They make it harder for a decent woman to meet a decent man! SOB's!

[Woggle]

Many people on this forum are in pain and lash out at the opposite sex. Believe me lashing out on this board is much better than me lashing out at my wife or lashing out at the women around me. I just get this feeling that if I were a woman the same women who are offended by me would be agreeing with me.

[Trialbyfire]

How about this then: All women have the potential to be bitches should they choose to be and all men have the potential to be bastards should they choose to be.

 

Potential can be negative or positive, its what we choose to do with our potential.To Say ALL women XXX or all men XXX is to deny free will and ultimately removes responsibility from individuals for their actions- She might be a bitch but its not her fault because all women are like that. So engaging in ALL women XXX or all men XXX actually means you're reinforcing the behaviour you dislike because if its inherent then nothing can be done about it.

 

This works too but I don't see the other as dismissive of individual foibles.

 

How about:

 

All women can be bitches and all men can be bastards.

 

When people lash out, it's not necessary a conscious choice, although a personal choice it is.

 

LS is one big bowl of emotional jello sprinkled and embedded with glass shards.

[amaysngrace]

Many people on this forum are in pain and lash out at the opposite sex. Believe me lashing out on this board is much better than me lashing out at my wife or lashing out at the women around me. I just get this feeling that if I were a woman the same women who are offended by me would be agreeing with me.

 

You can justify your own pain and anger anyway you'd like Woggle. But if you recognize it's a problem for you, wouldn't the responsible thing for you to do is to get help for the problem?

 

Why take it out on ANYBODY? It's not ANYBODY'S fault that you have unresolved problems in your life, especially the ones you are admittedly aware of.

 

But that's just like a man...won't go see a doctor for what's ailing him.

[Woggle]

You can justify your own pain and anger anyway you'd like Woggle. But if you recognize it's a problem for you, wouldn't the responsible thing for you to do is to get help for the problem?

 

Why take it out on ANYBODY? It's not ANYBODY'S fault that you have unresolved problems in your life, especially the ones you are admittedly aware of.

 

But that's just like a man...won't go see a doctor for what's ailing him.

 

Because I feel that if I let it go I will become one of those spinless nice guys who let women take advantage of them.

[amaysngrace]

Because I feel that if I let it go I will become one of those spinless nice guys who let women take advantage of them.

 

No you won't. You will just be more balanced. Right now you're off-kilter but if you go back and change what's changed about you you are still going to be the same guy. With the same core values.

 

Addressing your problems just makes you a happier person, a more peaceful person. It's like taking the anchor that's been weighing you down and casting it out to sea.

[Citizen Erased]

Because I feel that if I let it go I will become one of those spinless nice guys who let women take advantage of them.

 

Then you are a sad twisted pathetic man.

[Melovator]

This works too but I don't see the other as dismissive of individual foibles.

 

How about:

 

All women can be bitches and all men can be bastards.

 

When people lash out, it's not necessary a conscious choice, although a personal choice it is.

 

LS is one big bowl of emotional jello sprinkled and embedded with glass shards.

 

I agree with you that it is not always a conscious choice to lash out in unacceptable ways, it is quite often a dysfunctional learned behaviour we probably picked up from our parents or in childhood or in some kind of emotional trauma- and overcoming that is a matter of self-insight, knowing what 'issue button' is being pushed and then dealing with that issue yourself instead of passing it off onto others. Some people are not capable of self insight- women and men both- they keep hurting others and themselves and blame everyone and everything around them for their own actions and misery.

 

I like to think that LS is a place where the emotionally run over who are seeking to move out of cluelessness can learn to identify human battering rams so they can steer clear of them for ever onward.

 

Woggle: I just get this feeling that if I were a woman the same women who are offended by me would be agreeing with me.

 

Uh no... I find misandry just as unattractive as misogyny, a view which made me unpopular when I expressed it out loud in the wrong place, but bias is bias, hate is hate. There's no excuse for it.

 

Because I feel that if I let it go I will become one of those spinless nice guys who let women take advantage of them.

 

You don't have to be spineless to be nice, you can have boundaries and still be a good person. If you have strong internal boundaries then people can't take advantage of you. You don't forget the lessons you learned, you just apply the learning next time. But if you don't let it go you won't have boundaries, you'll have walls.

[Woggle]

You admitted though that condemning misandry made you unpopular with other women. I commend you for taking that stand but I think that deep down most women are manhaters so I figue I will keep that hate to be used at any time if I have to. It will not be used against all women but I once reduced a manhating feminazi to tears and I always want to have that backbone. If a woman respects me however I will respect her back.

[Citizen Erased]

You admitted though that condemning misandry made you unpopular with other women. I commend you for taking that stand but I think that deep down most women are manhaters so I figue I will keep that hate to be used at any time if I have to. It will not be used against all women but I once reduced a manhating feminazi to tears and I always want to have that backbone. If a woman respects me however I will respect her back.

 

or do they just hate you? Of course all you will come across is negative aspects of women because you are so hostile towards them. A woman WILL hate you for putting them in the same column as the very select few who hate men.

 

Look at what you do on here. You make these bold sweeping statements about how ALL women or MOST women hate men, think you are pigs etc. Yet when someone calls you on it, you make silly little excuses, and backtrack saying you meant only "some women" "in my experience" etc. You say them as if they are fact and then won't back them up or stand up for what you say.

 

It would be like me saying "well woggle thinks that all women (or is it "most" ) hate men, he has such a low opinion of them. Oh, that must mean ALL men (or "most) think like this, I should hate them all. Lump them into one category." And the rain of fire that would come down on me if I posted that crap.

 

Stop getting ****ty if we pull you up on it, saying it wasn't aimed at us. You make statements about our gender, of course we take it as an insult. That's our mothers, grandmothers, sisters, aunts, cousins etc you could be talking about. At least have the decency if you are going to spout your crap to stop making your little excuses and own what you are selling.

[sumdude]

You admitted though that condemning misandry made you unpopular with other women. I commend you for taking that stand but I think that deep down most women are manhaters so I figue I will keep that hate to be used at any time if I have to. It will not be used against all women but I once reduced a manhating feminazi to tears and I always want to have that backbone. If a woman respects me however I will respect her back.

 

 

My question is why do you even let those sort of people get to you? Why is it so important to engage and defeat or at least battle? The strongest of trees sway with the winds. If they were too rigid they would snap. McFly!