Star Gazer Posted August 6, 2007 Posted August 6, 2007 You don't start dissing your friends (male or female) for some guy you just started dating. Amen, sista!
Krytellan Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Everyone's getting all excited. I'm not trying to dump on your parade, but don't go too overboard until his actions match his words. Just sayin... emails are easy.
Star Gazer Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Everyone's getting all excited. I'm not trying to dump on your parade, ... Yes you are. And you were getting "all excited" in a negative way earlier in this thread.
lino Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 I'm glad its going better for you shadowplay. Now just try to relax
Author shadowplay Posted August 7, 2007 Author Posted August 7, 2007 Thanks guys for sharing in my happiness and supporting me through all the drama!! See, sometimes these things do have a happy ending. All along I felt like something didn't add up because he seems like decent guy and blowing me off would be out of character. I'm glad that instinct was right despite my worst fears to the contrary.
bish Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Fantastic! I knew it! All the men here that said they would dump a girl if she went off with guy friend to NYC, should ask themselves: is this sort of behaviouar a reason they are single? You all sound wayyyy too bitter to me. if the guy wants to be played for a fool, that is his choice.
amerikajin Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 This has always been one of those "gray areas" for me. I don't think it's wrong to have friends of the opposite sex, but you do have to be careful. I think the rule of thumb is to ask yourself how you'd feel if the tables were turned, and think about how your behavior might be interpreted by someone who doesn't know you all that well yet, regardless of however benign your intentions were. I wouldn't say to a girlfriend that she can't hang out with a man or even a group of guys; I wouldn't want a woman telling me I can't be around other women, either. But I would definitely have a problem with a woman who did boyfriend-girlfriend type things together, especially if I wasn't involved. I'll tell you what my gut says about your current guy: I truly believe that he's not being straight with you, and that the truth is he almost put you out on the curb. I say this because I know that if I'm into a girl, I wouldn't wait 8 or 9 freakin' days to get back to her, not letting her know where I was and what I was doing. Not that she owns me, but that that's just not really showing signs of interest - any guy knows that. He was playing it cool, because he was protecting his feelings and his ego. Mind you, I don't think he can be criticized for this, as it is the natural thing to do when you are questioning whether or not to take a relationship seriously. When he texted you the evening before the NY weekend and offered you a place to stay, didn't that drop a hint? That was his way of saying "I'd rather you sleep far away from this guy. I don't know him. I don't know what he is to you. This makes me uncomfortable. What would you say to an alternative?" And before you ladies jump all over the guy for "not being straight" and "not having the decency to tell you face to face" or "not being man enough to come out and speak his mind"...well...guess what, not everyone's going to - we're all different. And as said initially, this is a gray area. Maybe he felt like he wanted to come out and express his dissatisfaction with it, but not knowing the score, felt like he really couldn't. You saved the relationship (for now) because you showed him that you had a lot of interest. You reassured him that he wasn't just some plan B punk to you. I don't think you keep this up forever, but for right now, definitely think about how you come across to anyone you end up dating. Hope it works out.
Krytellan Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Yes you are. And you were getting "all excited" in a negative way earlier in this thread. Your "anti-everything-I-say" is really quite funny. I'm a guy. I know easy. Emails are easy. Following through is hard. But you're right... you know all. Obviously based on your experience... why would I question? I'm providing a cautionary approach. How dare I. Pffft....
mental_traveller Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Someone you're dating and not in an exclusive relationship with is NOT your SO. What someone you're dating and not in an exclusive relationship with is really none of your business (or in this case, the guy's). She was honest and upfront with this dude, he should at the least respect that. That's not true. If you are dating someone, that's a prospective relationship - it's entirely reasonable to be interested in how this prospective partner acts and conducts themselves. If they spend weekends swapping saliva (or more) with other guys, this is definitely something that will affect any normal guy or girl's opinion of them as serious relationship material. Of course, not being their SO, you have the *right* to do whatever you want. But equally, they have the right to enquire, and to stop dating you if you give the wrong answer, or refuse to tell them.
mental_traveller Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Fantastic! I knew it! All the men here that said they would dump a girl if she went off with guy friend to NYC, should ask themselves: is this sort of behaviouar a reason they are single? You all sound wayyyy too bitter to me. It was a little more than that - she shared a room overnight with her male friend, and did it without checking first if her bf was cool with it. At the very least, that's a tad inconsiderate of how he would feel. If you think it's "bitter" to be suspicious about your SO or potential SO spending the night in a big town with a member of the opposite sex, then you have a touching faith in human nature which unfortunately is likely to be brutally shattered at some point in your life. There is a line between being generally trusting, and totally naive and gullible. Cheaters are common and staying overnight with an opposite sex "friend" is exactly the kind of excuse they come up with. This is precisely why most people with some consideration and common sense would avoid this situation - even if nothing happened, it does look a bit suspicious. Sure, someone could be doing that for innocent reasons, but it's rather cavalier to act just like a cheater would, and not expect that it might put some doubts into the other guy's head. Finally, check the thread title - "Guys, would you be turned off...". She was asking guys for their opinion - would they be turned off if this happened to them. The unanimous answer was yes, and even a couple of women agreed. So it really doesn't behoove you to try to denigrate the men's replies when all they were doing was answering the question. Luckily for the poster, this guy was cool with what happened, but many men would not be - just for basic, common-sense reasons, and nothing to do with bitterness, loneliness or insecurity.
Krytellan Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Of course, not being their SO, you have the *right* to do whatever you want. But equally, they have the right to enquire, and to stop dating you if you give the wrong answer, or refuse to tell them. And this concept of choice is paramount to any degree of "shouldas", "couldas", "wouldas", and "I have the right tos". You have the right to do absolutely anything your heart desires. Just as the other person has the right to react accordingly.
Star Gazer Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 If they spend weekends swapping saliva (or more) with other guys, this is definitely something that will affect any normal guy or girl's opinion of them as serious relationship material. Are you missing something? He was a FRIEND. She said he was a friend, told the guy she is DATING (NOT a boyfriend) that he is a FRIEND. No saliva is being swapped here, dude. That was clear to me from the very first post. It was a little more than that - she shared a room overnight with her male friend, and did it without checking first if her bf was cool with it. Again, you're missing the fact that he is NOT her "boyfriend"!! Finally, check the thread title - "Guys, would you be turned off...". She was asking guys for their opinion - would they be turned off if this happened to them. The unanimous answer was yes, and even a couple of women agreed. So it really doesn't behoove you to try to denigrate the men's replies when all they were doing was answering the question. Luckily for the poster, this guy was cool with what happened, but many men would not be - just for basic, common-sense reasons, and nothing to do with bitterness, loneliness or insecurity. I hate to point out the obvious, but LS is a land filled mostly with people who have been burned or hurt and carry that around in their responses. As a result, the majority of opinions in MOST threads re: dating are actually quite negative. So receiving a general consensus from men who have been burned and (many of whom) have proven themselves here to be bitter in most other respects will fall on deaf ears. And as much as I hate to admit it, Tanbark's response (as ususal) was the most calm and rational, and he's been through it all.
annabelle75 Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Are you missing something? He was a FRIEND. She said he was a friend, told the guy she is DATING (NOT a boyfriend) that he is a FRIEND. No saliva is being swapped here, dude. That was clear to me from the very first post. Again, you're missing the fact that he is NOT her "boyfriend"!! I hate to point out the obvious, but LS is a land filled mostly with people who have been burned or hurt and carry that around in their responses. As a result, the majority of opinions in MOST threads re: dating are actually quite negative. So receiving a general consensus from men who have been burned and (many of whom) have proven themselves here to be bitter in most other respects will fall on deaf ears. And as much as I hate to admit it, Tanbark's response (as ususal) was the most calm and rational, and he's been through it all. I agree with everything you just said. I think we all need to understand the fact that most people come here after getting burned in a relationship. Alot of the advice given can be from a very negative point of view. On this particular subject what became the issue for most of the guys here was they couldn't seem to conceive that she could spend a weekend with a male freind with out "hooking up" with him. Its probably based on past negative experiences with cheating women. They need to learn that they can't judge every woman based on experiences with one. I personally have a ton of male friends that I spend time with it. If I start dating a guy that can't handle it I stop dating him. I respect my freinds too much to start ditching them because of some guy I have been on a few dates with.
annabelle75 Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Are you missing something? He was a FRIEND. She said he was a friend, told the guy she is DATING (NOT a boyfriend) that he is a FRIEND. No saliva is being swapped here, dude. That was clear to me from the very first post. Again, you're missing the fact that he is NOT her "boyfriend"!! I hate to point out the obvious, but LS is a land filled mostly with people who have been burned or hurt and carry that around in their responses. As a result, the majority of opinions in MOST threads re: dating are actually quite negative. So receiving a general consensus from men who have been burned and (many of whom) have proven themselves here to be bitter in most other respects will fall on deaf ears. And as much as I hate to admit it, Tanbark's response (as ususal) was the most calm and rational, and he's been through it all. I agree with everything you just said. I think we all need to understand the fact that most people come here after getting burned in a relationship. Alot of the advice given can be from a very negative point of view. On this particular subject what became the issue for most of the guys here was they couldn't seem to conceive that she could spend a weekend with a male freind with out "hooking up" with him. Its probably based on past negative experiences with cheating women. They need to learn that they can't judge every woman based on experiences with one. I personally have a ton of male friends that I spend time with it. If I start dating a guy that can't handle it I stop dating him. I respect my freinds too much to start ditching them because of some guy I have been on a few dates with.
squeak Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Annabelle75 I like your style! You give a nice balance around here! Original Poster-going forward with this guy if I could offer my 2 cents-for yourself try to check out how compatible you both are in terms of ideas on appropriate behavior with opposite sex friends (is he okay with them visiting and staying with you? Is he going to throw a fit if you keep up your friendships with them, can you handle changing if necessary?) and be honest with yourself if you share the same beliefs/values, and how much you are both willing to compromise. Mostly because you don't want this happening again without being aware of your current partners threshold. Good luck!
amerikajin Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 I agree with everything you just said. I think we all need to understand the fact that most people come here after getting burned in a relationship. Alot of the advice given can be from a very negative point of view. On this particular subject what became the issue for most of the guys here was they couldn't seem to conceive that she could spend a weekend with a male freind with out "hooking up" with him. Its probably based on past negative experiences with cheating women. They need to learn that they can't judge every woman based on experiences with one. I personally have a ton of male friends that I spend time with it. If I start dating a guy that can't handle it I stop dating him. I respect my freinds too much to start ditching them because of some guy I have been on a few dates with. I don't disagree that a lot of the advice on these boards comes from people who have been burned, but even so, I don't think you can dismiss some of the responses that have been given already. I would agree that you don't "dis" your friends just because you date some guy, but I'm sorry: the reality is that things do change somewhat once you're in a romantic relationship, especially if we're talking about friendships between the sexes. As I said earlier, I would never tell a woman she can't hang out with her guy friends, and I wouldn't want her telling me I can't hang out with chicks, but how you hang out together, what you do, and with whom...those are the issues here. In my opinion, I don't think the OP meant any harm, but she did make some errors in judgment. I think she could have gone off and had a perfectly nice time and it would have been completely cool if she had approached it differently. And no offense, Star Gazer, but your delineation between "committed" and "not committed" is not really valid at all here. This is just a bunch of semantic crap that people use to leave the door open in case they make "mistakes" under the influence of alcohol. I'm not in any way suggesting that the OP would approach a relationship like this, but unfortunately there are a lot of others who would. Remember, they're still getting to know each other. He doesn't really know her and what she's all about just yet, so can he really be blamed for taking a few steps back? "Only fools rush in".
bish Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Fantastic! I knew it! All the men here that said they would dump a girl if she went off with guy friend to NYC, should ask themselves: is this sort of behaviouar a reason they are single? You all sound wayyyy too bitter to me. So let me get this straight, you like a guy, he likes you...you think there might be a chance at a good thing. then he goes off for the weekend with another woman....you'd be ok with that eh?
bish Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 I don't disagree that a lot of the advice on these boards comes from people who have been burned, but even so, I don't think you can dismiss some of the responses that have been given already. No..you can't dismiss it. People that have been burned have been there, done that...and can smell shi!t a mile away.
squeak Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Personally, I wouldn't like it it at all to be on the other side of it, but I think what Annabelle was saying that even if you don't like it, it doesn't necessarily mean the girl (or guy) is some creep out to screw with their trip partner the weekend in question. It could look or feel like that, but that may not be the case. Some people just don't want the hassle of trying to figure out which it is, so in something heading towards a relationship it is best to not bring those doubts up.
Star Gazer Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 And no offense, Star Gazer, but your delineation between "committed" and "not committed" is not really valid at all here. This is just a bunch of semantic crap... Then what is the point of BECOMING exclusive? Of being in a COMMITTED RELATIONSHIP as opposed to NOT being in a committed relationship? What is the point of COMMITMENT then, if not to COMMIT to not date others? The moment we start seeing someone, are we now to instantly agree to not date others and (in this case) not even hang out with members of the opposite sex? That's bologna! Remember, they're still getting to know each other. He doesn't really know her and what she's all about just yet... EXACTLY. They are just getting to know each other, they are NOT in a relationship, they are NOT exclusive, they are NOT boyfriend/girlfriend. So why the heck should she put her entire PLATONIC social life on hold?
Star Gazer Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 No..you can't dismiss it. People that have been burned have been there, done that...and can smell shi!t a mile away. Obviously not! If you were the OP's dude, you would have thought you smelled sh*t here, but you would obviously have been wrong. Just because one woman cheats, doesn't mean another will. Just because one woman uses a euphamism for "friend" doesn't mean another will. To think otherwise IS to be bitter and shortsided.
amerikajin Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Some people just don't want the hassle of trying to figure out which it is, so in something heading towards a relationship it is best to not bring those doubts up. Well said. Moreover, I think a lot of people need nothing more than just a little perspective. I really wonder - honestly here - what the OP would have thought if the roles were reversed; if he had gone away for the weekend to a concert or on some vacation somewhere and stayed in the same hotel or house with some chick. I can't help but think it would be "different" then.
amerikajin Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Then what is the point of BECOMING exclusive? Of being in a COMMITTED RELATIONSHIP as opposed to NOT being in a committed relationship? What is the point of COMMITMENT then, if not to COMMIT to not date others? The moment we start seeing someone, are we now to instantly agree to not date others and (in this case) not even hang out with members of the opposite sex? That's bologna! I know what you're saying, SG, I guess it's just that the older I get and the more I've dated around, the less I agree with 'playing the field' and the less I believe in the 'we're not officially in a committed relationship' - that's a technicality. That might work fine in a courtroom, but it ain't gonna work with me and it doesn't really set too well with a lot of people when you get right down to it. Why play games? Are you interested in dating me or not? Am I interested in dating you or not? Do you want to just hook up and have sex once in a while (settle down, Tanbark, it's merely a rhetorical question)? Jokes aside, I'm just sayin' let's just cut through the crap. Nobody says you have to put your platonic life on hold, but you do have to start paying attention to how things might look to someone else who doesn't really know you all that well. That's just one of those basic things you have to understand when you start dating someone you like. I mean, I agree: there are no real rules when it comes to dating. There is absolutely nothing written in stone or on page 318 of the dating handbook which states that you have to ask a guy's permission to do anything. Then again, keep in mind there's nothing that compels him to maintain any level of interest in you, either. So my advice is, if you are unequivocally interested in someone - and the OP is obviously interested in this guy - then you try to remove as much ambiguity as possible. Am I wrong?
bish Posted August 7, 2007 Posted August 7, 2007 Obviously not! If you were the OP's dude, you would have thought you smelled sh*t here, but you would obviously have been wrong. How do we know? How do we know she didn't shag this guy? And I'm sorry, whether she did or not, if she wants a relationship with this other guy, going off for the weekend with ANOTHER GUY is NOT the way to go about it. She doesn't have to put her life on hold...she can go off for a weekend with "the girls". Anytime you go away for a weekend, no matter what happens, with the opposite sex, then you are sending the wrong message to the person you'd like to be with. There is NO WAY if I was not in an exclusive situation with a woman, but I really liked her and wanted to make a go of it, would I in any way entertain the idea of spending the weekend with another woman. I'd deserve to get smacked upside the head for that one. Just because one woman cheats, doesn't mean another will. Just because one woman uses a euphamism for "friend" doesn't mean another will. To think otherwise IS to be bitter and shortsided. Sorry, but some of us "bitter and [shortsighted]" have been there and done that. Some of us know the signs that a relationship isn't going to work and what she did was one of them. Now if this other guy doesn't care for whatever reason...maybe he hasn't gotten in her pants yet and is willing to put up with a little to get there, then thats his choice. He may have his reasons for not caring if she stayed with another guy for a weekend. maybe its because he doesn't see her as someone long-term, but just wants to kick it with her once in a while. But for me, if I wanted to give it a shot at a long-term relationship, then a woman that thinks she wants that with me that goes off and stays with another guy overnight/weekend, whatever....is a deal breaker.
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