My Situation

[CAMAYPARK]

I have known my MM for nearly 2years now. He's much older than me with 2 kids. They are nearly grown up with one of them in college already. He is still married to his wife.

He has made it clear from the onset that he won't be divorcing his wife; for financial reasons as well as for the sake of his kids/family life. He says that it is up to his wife to divorce him. He has been married for married for over 20years, there has never been any love in their marriage. He has never loved her nor can he ever love her apparently because she's a really cold person and some of her behaviour are intolerable. However, that's not my business really.

They do not sleep together nor have they ever slept together in the same bedroom after the initial 2years of their marriage. They each have their separate rooms and they have not had sex for 3years now.

Do I believe him? Yes, I do actually. Why? Because from a lot of the conversations etc and mutual friends that we have in common with.

We don't meet up every often, a fortnight once every 6months or so. We live in different continents.

I will be moving closer if not to the country that I have always wanted to live the rest of my life and he would like to eventually retire there too but unlike me he only wants to live there part of the time only not 24/7.

Do I mind him not leaving his wife? Yes and No. Why is that you may ask? Mainly because I don't really want to be married to him or to anyone else. I merely want him to spend more time with me.

We do love each other deeply, but I hate these roller coaster of emotions, with me feeling guilty etc etc. But I don't know how to end the A either. There are days that I do want to end things desparately and there are days that I don't.

I sound like a headcase, don't I

[GreenEyedLady]

If he won't see you more and that's what you want, the answer is you need to end the relationship...R's should be balanced between the two peoples wants and needs...and if yours aren't being met, you know what you need to do...He won't know how important it is until you break up with him...then maybe you can come to some type of compromise that meets both of your needs...

[whichwayisup]

I have known my MM for nearly 2years now. He's much older than me with 2 kids. They are nearly grown up with one of them in college already. He is still married to his wife.

 

He's still married to her, by choice.

 

He has made it clear from the onset that he won't be divorcing his wife; for financial reasons as well as for the sake of his kids/family life. He says that it is up to his wife to divorce him. He has been married for married for over 20years, there has never been any love in their marriage. He has never loved her nor can he ever love her apparently because she's a really cold person and some of her behaviour are intolerable. However, that's not my business really.

 

If she was that bad, then why did they get married and have children? Why is he still married to her?

 

He is telling you what you want to hear, so you'll stick around. I mean, he isn't going to tell ya, yeah I love my wife, we have incredible sex....Because if he told you that, it would upset you and then inturn, would make you feel jealous and hurt, so he's neglecting to tell you the truth.

 

They do not sleep together nor have they ever slept together in the same bedroom after the initial 2years of their marriage. They each have their separate rooms and they have not had sex for 3years now.

Do I believe him? Yes, I do actually. Why? Because from a lot of the conversations etc and mutual friends that we have in common with.

We don't meet up every often, a fortnight once every 6months or so. We live in different continents.

 

Again, he is telling you what you want to hear. You don't know what goes on behind closed doors, and neither do those mutual friends. NOONE knows except him and his wife.

 

You're fooling yourself if you believe what he is telling you. Remember, this man is lying to his wife, so don't ya think he's capable of lying to you as well? Please, go read some threas in this section so you can see that what you're believing is a line that many OW have been told by their MM.

 

I will be moving closer if not to the country that I have always wanted to live the rest of my life and he would like to eventually retire there too but unlike me he only wants to live there part of the time only not 24/7.

Do I mind him not leaving his wife? Yes and No. Why is that you may ask? Mainly because I don't really want to be married to him or to anyone else. I merely want him to spend more time with me.

 

SO, you're happy being the OW and don't feel that you deserve the full attention and complete love from a man? You're settling for less. Be aware you'll get less because his family comes first.

 

We do love each other deeply, but I hate these roller coaster of emotions, with me feeling guilty etc etc. But I don't know how to end the A either. There are days that I do want to end things desparately and there are days that I don't.

 

If and when you get fed up of feeling so up and down, you'll end it. When you realize you deserve a single man who can give ALL of himself to you, you'll end it. Seek some counselling to help you if possible.

 

I sound like a headcase, don't I

 

No, you sound like a woman who has fallen for a married man who is unavailable to give you the happiness you really want. You need to keep your eyes open, take the blinders off and LOOK at things with a more objective view, and a realistic mind, instead of with your emotions and your heart. Imagine your bestfriend in your shoes, what advice would you be giving her?

[lonelybird]

He has never loved her nor can he ever love her apparently because she's a really cold person and some of her behaviour are intolerable.

She is cold, probably he cheated on her too many times. Think about as a woman, who won't want to be loved and love? If not harsh reality made her become cold, then what was it? Measure other's pain just like measure your own, you will get the picture

 

Actually you are living under bondage, that the price you cannot afford. Free youself from this bondage, stop your relationship with him.

[Lizzie60]

Do I mind him not leaving his wife? Yes and No. Why is that you may ask? Mainly because I don't really want to be married to him or to anyone else. I merely want him to spend more time with me.

 

I know how you feel... you just want to see him more often... I don't want to get married either... but unlike you, I like my space and I am not in love with anyone... At least, we don't ask those MMs to leave their wife.

 

We do love each other deeply, but I hate these roller coaster of emotions, with me feeling guilty etc etc. But I don't know how to end the A either.

 

Only YOU know what's best for you. If you think this relationship is unhealthy for you, then go 'No Contact'. Tell him, be honest, that you don't want anything to do with him anymore...

 

You might be surprised by his response...

[mopar crazy]

LOL! I didn't even need to read your whole thread to say: Do you honestly believe all the BS he is telling you? He is only saying this crap so it wont make you feel guilty, that you'll sleep w/ him, blah, blah, blah. If she is such a cold hearted bitch he would get a D. He is full of *****!

 

And I noticed that WWIU replied but didn't read what she wrote, listen to her, she has great advice.

[CAMAYPARK]

I like my own space too, Lizzie which is why I only want max 9months out of a pa with him. I doubt that he can give me that time.

 

I maybe naive here - but I do know that he has never cheated on his wife before, she is cold, because that's the way she is. She is also ultra dependent upon him. Maybe all of you are right in the sense that he's feeding me lines.

 

My biggest problem isn't so much that he's feeding me lines. My biggest problem is knowing that I am at bottom of his priority list. His wife and kids will always comes first in his life. Also my guilt, knowing how his wife and kids would feel if they were found out. I want more time, something that he can't give me. I also know that I deserve more and I am not gonna accept crumbs either from him or anyone.

 

He shall be over here in a few weeks time, so I will have a serious talk with him, not asking him to choose but merely telling him what I want and need. I know that I won't be chosen, I am not that delusional, so I will have this chat and then NC. I have tried to talk to him before but this is something that I need to do face to face.

[whichwayisup]

I maybe naive here - but I do know that he has never cheated on his wife before, she is cold, because that's the way she is. She is also ultra dependent upon him. Maybe all of you are right in the sense that he's feeding me lines.

 

HOW do you know that for sure? That he has never cheated on her before...If she is such a cold and awful person, do you think that you've been the only person he's had an affair with? The man has been lying to his wife, so why do you think he wouldn't ever lie to you as well???

 

I am glad that you're open to the idea that he may not be truthful with you, and he more than likely IS feeding you afew lines...Not in a mean or malcious way, more in a selfish and self serving way...

 

My biggest problem is knowing that I am at bottom of his priority list.

Yes, and if you would like to continue being the OW, that is how it goes. Not being important enough to him....Family, work and friends will come first before your needs and wants. You deserve MORE than that, so I do hope when you talk to him, you're actually ready to put into action what you've posted. TO end it and go NC.

 

His wife and kids will always comes first in his life. Also my guilt, knowing how his wife and kids would feel if they were found out. I want more time, something that he can't give me. I also know that I deserve more and I am not gonna accept crumbs either from him or anyone.

 

Good for you and I'm glad that you're seeing things from a different angle, or you've just reached your ENOUGH point and figured out no matter how much you are into him, it's not good enough for you anymore...

 

And, it's good that you're feeling some guilt, realizing that if you two did get caught, you'd be facing his wife (probably finding out too, that most of what he's told you about her were lies and she more than likely isn't the evil beyotch he's made her look like in your eyes), and alot of drama.

 

He shall be over here in a few weeks time, so I will have a serious talk with him, not asking him to choose but merely telling him what I want and need. I know that I won't be chosen, I am not that delusional, so I will have this chat and then NC. I have tried to talk to him before but this is something that I need to do face to face.

 

You don't "owe" him much, keep that in mind. Take control, don't let him suck you back in by feeding you more lines.

 

Bottomline is this - If he really wants to be with you, he'll move heaven and earth to make that happen. He hasn't, he has no intention of leaving his wife and children. Which would mean if you chose to stick with him - You'd still be the OW.

 

Good luck, stay strong and definately do more reading in this section so you won't let him pull a fast one on you.

[Lizzie60]

I like my own space too, Lizzie which is why I only want max 9months out of a pa with him. I doubt that he can give me that time.

 

I maybe naive here - but I do know that he has never cheated on his wife before, she is cold, because that's the way she is. She is also ultra dependent upon him. Maybe all of you are right in the sense that he's feeding me lines.

 

My biggest problem isn't so much that he's feeding me lines. My biggest problem is knowing that I am at bottom of his priority list. His wife and kids will always comes first in his life. Also my guilt, knowing how his wife and kids would feel if they were found out. I want more time, something that he can't give me. I also know that I deserve more and I am not gonna accept crumbs either from him or anyone.

 

He shall be over here in a few weeks time, so I will have a serious talk with him, not asking him to choose but merely telling him what I want and need. I know that I won't be chosen, I am not that delusional, so I will have this chat and then NC. I have tried to talk to him before but this is something that I need to do face to face.

 

If you can't cope with the situation, you better move on... forget about him. He will probably choose his family...not necessarily for his wife, but for his kids, and his comfortable life.

 

If you want more, you'll be hurt in the end... so better to leave him now before you loose years and years of your life and chances to find someone available.

[CAMAYPARK]

Chances of his W finding out is pretty slim as we only meet up once a fortnight every 6months or so. He lives apprx 10,000miles away from each other.

 

But that's a side issue.

 

As I said, he will be over in a few weeks time, I will have have a talk with him at the end of his stay and I will go NC. The end is nigh.

 

Thank you so much for your kind advice and I will keep you in touch with what's happening after the talk

[cbl]

your story sounds so much like mine. only that my xMM is a serial cheater and we ended the affair a few months ago.

 

the fact that he only met up with you once a fortnight every 6 months speaks volume.... you are not a priority in his life like you have acknowledged. i know it hurts but please just walk away. i don't even think the talk is necessary - what do you expect out of the talk, knowing that his choice will not be you? not knowing what the result will come out is so much better than getting the rejection, and feeling low self-esteemed. i know it because i was there. sometimes not seeking closure is the best closure.

[CAMAYPARK]

We meet up once a fortnight every 6months because I live in Europe and he lives in Oz.

 

I do think a talk and explanation would be nice, a chance for me to air my views. I wouldn't ask him to choose but to just walk away like that would be nasty, IMO

[whichwayisup]

Does he travel that far just to see you, or is it business related as well? I just ask this because that's a long way to travel, to be dumped.

 

I do think a talk and explanation would be nice, a chance for me to air my views. I wouldn't ask him to choose but to just walk away like that would be nasty, IMO

 

That can be done in a phone call, and he can save the $$.

[CAMAYPARK]

Does he travel that far just to see you, or is it business related as well? I just ask this because that's a long way to travel, to be dumped.

That can be done in a phone call, and he can save the $$.

 

He's coming to see me, this time round. Usually we meet halfway, Thailand, Indonesia etc.

 

I have forewarned him months ago that we will be having a "talk". I think he does have an inkling about the chat. He's rather hoping that either I would forget about it - highly unlikely or postpone this chat until I have relocated back to Asia.

 

I have told him that he doesn't have to come over here and save $$ as WWIU said, but he insisted, I think it is his way of demonstrated how much he cares or loves me. He had said constantly that if it is all just sex why travel all these way?..... He does have a point but.......

 

Phone call or email seems rather cruel and cold. I suppose dumping him after his hols too seemed rather cruel but I've ran out of suggestion unless I fly out to Oz and meet up with him face to face and break it off that way

[whichwayisup]

The thing is, are you strong enough to decide for yourself and STICK to your decision, once you see and talk to him? That's why I suggested you do it over the phone, it's easier for YOU.

 

Just remember, you need to make your own closure, so don't rely on him to give you that.

[CAMAYPARK]

The thing is, are you strong enough to decide for yourself and STICK to your decision, once you see and talk to him? That's why I suggested you do it over the phone, it's easier for YOU.

 

Just remember, you need to make your own closure, so don't rely on him to give you that.

 

Yes, WWIU, I do think I am strong enough to stick to my decision face to face. In actual fact, in a weird sort of way, I NEED to see his face when I do it.

 

I have tried ending it on the phone and inevitably ended up going back and doing it on the phone doesn't seem real to me.

 

I will try my very very best to stick to my decision. I need to.

[cbl]

just an idea... if you feel you are strong enough to do it face to face, maybe do the talk at the beginning of the trip rather than the end of the trip. that puts you in a better position to negotiate. i don't care what other people say about being manipulative, power struggling, game playing, etc. truth is the dating world is cruel and you need to do what's best for "yourself".

[CAMAYPARK]

just an idea... if you feel you are strong enough to do it face to face, maybe do the talk at the beginning of the trip rather than the end of the trip. that puts you in a better position to negotiate. i don't care what other people say about being manipulative, power struggling, game playing, etc. truth is the dating world is cruel and you need to do what's best for "yourself".

 

I thought about doing it at the end of his trip, cause I didn't want to spoil his hols. But you may have a point there, cbl, but surely that will put a huge damper on his hols?

[GreenEyedLady]

I thought about doing it at the end of his trip, cause I didn't want to spoil his hols. But you may have a point there, cbl, but surely that will put a huge damper on his hols?

 

Not to be rude, but WHO CARES if it puts a damper on his holidays, that's not your problem...

[cbl]

I don't have to meet you in person to know that you are a great woman - so thoughtful and so caring. I can see those in you from reading your words. And just because you are a good woman, you deserve someone much better than your MM.

 

Judging from your previous posts, your MM should be ready for the talk, since he decided to come see you in a few weeks. If he's not, he probably thought that you will never initiate the talk or at least you make him think it that way. Chatting about the issue at the end of the trip is just making things too easy for him - men are hunters and you just have to make them do the work. If you care about him too much to lose him, then you are right for not doing it over the phone call because chances are he would not even show up for the vacation.

 

But be ready. The biggest challenge is not about you two having the chat. It's about him either not being able to carry out his promises to you (like most OWs have encountered), or you feeling regret and wondering what has happened to yourself when he chooses to be with his wife. When this happens, remember, there's nothing wrong with you and you are a great woman - but situations do not allow you two to be together because he HAS CHOSEN to be unavailable to YOU. Always prepare for the worst - have your backup vacation plan ready so that he will not ruin "your holidays"

 

On a sidenote... I still think it's the best that you just let everything fade out between you two. My xMM had two grown-ups (23 and 25) and we started out telling each other that we will not be together. His reasons being that he can't leave his children (yeah right they don't even live in the same country) but my take is that he just wants to get retired in the next few years, and spend the rest of his life in his own country where his wife has been apparently waiting for the day to come for 26 years. I, as well as his other gfs, were just someone who helped him through those lonely nights when he's away from home. If you can't see you two together in the future, it's better that you just let it go, then having to go through the heartaches ALONE. Our affair ended quite a few months back and now I am seeing a great guy who has everything I've wanted in a man and we are planning a future together. I am extremely happy and I am sure you will be... as long as you free yourself from your MM.

[CAMAYPARK]

cbl, thank you for all your kind words. What do you mean let things fade away?

[PoshPrincess]

NOONE knows except him and his wife.

 

Precisely. So it doesn't mean that he IS lying about his M either. Lots of people, from what I've heard, have loveless Ms and DO stay for the sake of their kids. However, in this case that is pretty irrelevant as you, Camay, say you don't want him on a permanent basis anyway. If you're honest with yourself is that really true or do you just tell yourself this because you can't have him? Sorry, I am not having a dig at you here - just trying to look at things from a different angle.

 

All the advice you are getting on here is great, from WWIU, GEL, etc, they all know what they are talking about in one way or another. The way I see it, Camay, is what is the point in you continuing this R anyway if you don't want him to leave his W? Is it really worth all the heartache and grief you might get if she were to find out. I loved my exMM like crazy and it hurt like hell when things ended. Don't put yourself through this for someone you don't totally want to be with!

 

I can understand you wanting to finish things face to face and as GEL said, why give a f*ck about ruining his hols? He is married to someone else and didn't give a f*ck about her when he was seeing you, whatever their relationship. I know you care about him but he is NOT your problem. Do what is best for you!

[CAMAYPARK]

PP, do I want him on a permanent basis? What, if he can give me that? TBH, I have never entertain that idea mainly because he's told me from day 1 that he won't leave his wife, got to maintain that family/kids etc even though the kids are now 16 &18. So, permanency has never crossed my mind. I do sometimes like my own space too and am comfortable in my own skin and do not need MM to define me as a woman.

 

Whether his W finds out or not is not an issue here. I know if that ever happens what the outcome will be anyway or even if his kids were to find out. I know what will happen already, I know I won't be chosen. He's really close to his kids and they to him, if they were to find out they will be pretty heartbroken even though they do know that mom and dad do not get along. Furthermore, he won't leave his W, he can't she is really dependent upon him, can't even change a lightbulb herself:cool:

 

But seriously, I see no light at the end of the tunnel and I can't keep putting myself through this pain and heartache. All these constant waiting around for phone calls, IM etc. It is all just too much, too consuming. I do understand that it will be really painful, because I do love him very very much but I rather end it now than get dragged deeper and deeper into this R and end up absolutely embittered.

 

Does it makes sense? You have all given me some fantastic advice and given me strength and comviction in what I have got to do.

[cbl]

What do you mean let things fade away?

 

If I am not mistaken, you are in a long distance relationship for two years with a MM who you meet for two weeks every six months. I don't know how many common friends you two have but I can only imagine that rest of the year you two can only contact with each others through phone calls, emails, text messages as you are 10000 miles away and plus the time difference, which is supposedly 7-9 hours, I wonder how much time you really have to get to know this man and if you fall in love with the real him not the person who you picture him to be. Of course I am assuming you two did not really socialize with each other's friends and family and I am sorry if the assumption is wrong.

 

Even though a woman can be very independent - trust me I am very much like you in that sense; financially independent, working and living overseas alone (was; now I am back to where my family is) - that doesn't mean an independent woman does not want or need a man in her life. On the contrary, the fact that you are going through emotional roller coaster shows that you do desire to have a man to be there for you. Even though not physically. You just yet find a man who can provide you the freedom that you need, at the same time who's able to be there for you emotionally when you need him.

 

As you have probably read through a few threads in this forum... while your MM's away most of the time, why not try to open your heart to other people close by? Try not to get in contact with him for one day, two days, and the next time one week, then one month.... will this be an option for you? That was how my first xMM and I ended. We were together for six years and I moved 6000 miles away as I knew well he was not who I've wanted, although I was deeply in love with him (Still am) If that's not an option for you, then stick to your plan. I would do it in the beginning of the trip and then have the backup trip plan ready. Life is too short to put on hold for someone who can not commit exclusively to you.

 

I wish you all the best.

[CAMAYPARK]

cbl, there's 10hours time difference. We sms each other a few times daily, IM everyday and phone calls too daily. I have known him as a friend for a while before all these, so I do know him pretty well. We have friends in common and we socialise together but we have not told many of our friends that we are involved. I have met up with most of his friends actually and some of his friends knows that he's involved with me. Family - since we have been good friends before, I do know about his family life and situation at home.

 

cbl, even with the best intentions, weening off him the way you suggest, I think is more painful for me than going completely cold turkey. I have decided after listening to everyones' view and advice. I will have a talk begining of his hols when he's over; begining of Aug. I am going to lay all my cards on the table or all my ducks in a roll. I am going to tell him that I mean serious business; I want at least 9months pa when I move back to Asia but I don't think that it is something he can give me. I am going to tell him how I hate the roller coaster of emotion and how I hate the hurt that I cost his W and kids if they were to find out. I won't ask him to choose; mainly (a) I don't think it is fair and (b) I don't think that I can stand/bear to hear the answer.

At the end of the talk, I am going to suggest to him that we enjoy this time together and when his trip ends, the relationship will end too. I really cannot and do not want to spend the rest of my life waiting for someone that can only be with me; whenever he's free from his obligations.

 

I'm sure that he will use his kids as an execuse; sorry but that will only work for a time with me. That time has ended, the fact that his kids are 16 & 18 means that they are reasonably grown up and adult enough to understand. I don't want another set of execuse; sort of wait till my daughter finishes college or wait till my son has gone to college. Once I put myself in this position, I have a feeling that the deadline will keep being put back.

 

Whether he still have sex with his wife, whether or not he's a serial cheater or whether he loves but not in love with his wife and all that malarky, I really don't want to know, nor debating about this to its finite detail will ever produce the desire effect, so all these I leave it up to him.

 

I don't think I can do what PP did, by keeping contact still with her xMM. I will need sometime on my own. I am sure that I will bump into him again as we have a lot of mutual friends that we socialise together when we are in Asia. I am hoping that with some time on my own, I would be able to get myself sorted and then better at coping if I happen to bump into him in the future.

 

You reckon this work out as a plan of action?