Author flex Posted July 11, 2007 Author Posted July 11, 2007 Lots of good words here. Thanks everyone for taking the time to listen to my rant This kind of thing sucks because its not something you really want to share with friends and family, at least I don't. So that kind of leaves one to sort of deal with all this internally. The hardest part now I guess is transition from thinking every possible bad scenario you can about the person you are supposed to trust and get back to where you were before. Right now that is what I am struggling with. Even if she was just emailing like she said, it was just so inapropriate. YES I want to get past it, We have been dealing with the real issues the last few weeks which has had a very positive impact on things. She seems completely sincere on wanting to repair the damage. I do take some blame in letting our relationship get to the point where we were not communicating like we should be. But she could have spoken up as well instead of looking for another source for emotional support. TO answer another Q here, I have tried to get the full extent of this relationship out there. She claims she is telling me everything, they worked on projects together would go to lunch 1-2 times a week and mostly talked about the goings on in his life or her life and she claims it was just a normal friendship. She realizes her emails were inappropriate but says that was the exception not the norm and just joking around office humor. Whatever. I am telling you if this is really the way her office behaves like she says, there is a major lawsuit waiting to happen there. I am seriously thinking of having her look at changing jobs. Unfortunatley she has a good job, makes good money and has been there 10 years. She is also in a pretty competitive market so finding something equal would not be easy. But at this point our relationship is more inportant than a few bucks and we could figure something out. BUT if she does not change her attitude towards relationship boundaries with the opposite sex I guess it does not really matter anyway now does it?? Day by Day at this point I guess thats the best I can do. For the sake of our time together and our kids I will try and get past it, of course as long as she keeps her world with everything as well. I am sure people have come back stronger from much worse and maybe I nipped this thing before it really turned into anything more. I hope so anyway. I mean I think as bad is it is and as much as it hurts maybe we needed a real jolt of reality to get things back on track anyway.
Lynna Posted July 11, 2007 Posted July 11, 2007 Seriously consider MC. A neutral party might be able to help your wife understand the inappropriate boundary crossing that is going on in that office. She definitely needs to understand what is appropriate and what is not, no matter what everyone else in the office is doing. If they all jumped off a bridge, would she follow like a lemming? Yes, it is entirely possible that there will be trouble for the whole office down the line. Before I was married, my office got into that kind of trouble for the same kind of inappropriate email behavior. There was no physical activity going on between anyone, but the emails were VERY inappropriate, and the entire group participated in them. Everyone thought it was just friendly banter, nothing was meant seriously. But we ended up having our corporate office monitoring everyone's entire computer activity carefully for some time, no one lost their jobs over it, but they could have. I think it is very difficult for women and men to be just friends with no innuendo or flirting going on, not impossible, but very difficult. There seems to always be an underlying sexual tension there. I don't know why. Granted, I have only ever had a few really close male friends, and that tension was there with them, and caused problems eventually. Now that I am married, I don't have any close male friends, it just feels strange to me when a man tries to become close, it does not feel right. When you are married, your spouse should be your closest friend. The friends of the same sex, only then friends of the opposite sex. And any friends of the opposite sex should also know your spouse. Even work friends should have the chance to occasionally meet and get to know the spouse. That can help allieviate things as well I think. It shows that you are each involved in each other's lives. Your behavior toward each other around other people shows boundaries, it shows them that you are serious about each other. When you are not, that vibe comes off as well. Good luck to you Flex. You are on the path to rebuilding your marriage I think. It won't be quick or easy but hopefully it will end up stronger than before.
jmargel Posted July 11, 2007 Posted July 11, 2007 You won't get past this by yourself because it has not been dealt with entirely. This is where marriage counseling comes into play and it's something you two need.
Darth Vader Posted July 11, 2007 Posted July 11, 2007 If you do go to the concert, be careful when looking for signs, if she were to pick up on it, she'll nail you on it. But, I say go for it, what do you have to lose?
Sal Paradise Posted July 11, 2007 Posted July 11, 2007 I am seriously thinking of having her look at changing jobs. Unfortunatley she has a good job, makes good money and has been there 10 years. She is also in a pretty competitive market so finding something equal would not be easy. All of that irrelevant and should not even be considered as a deterrent in any way for her changing jobs. If she loves you and wants to fix the marriage it has to happen. She cannot be around this guy because you will NEVER get past it while she works with him. She has to quit her job and find another one or this issue will never go away. It will come back up. Once you let your guard down she will do something to set off your red flags again and you will be right back to square one. Also consider this. Maybe she is telling the truth and she hasn't slept with the guy yet or taken it beyond an emotional attachment. If she continues to work there you can almost guarantee that eventually it will progress further. If she changes jobs now you might be able to prevent this from progressing and destroying the marriage. And as someone else said if you demand that she switches jobs you will call her bluff and will find out how serious she is about fixing the marriage. She may of just told you that because she doesn't think you will make her do it and its a way to ease your worries. In otherwords its a diversion to throw you off and to trust her again. Why not call her on it and make her go through with it? You have nothing to lose by doing but if you don't do it you may lose your marriage.
Cobra_X30 Posted July 11, 2007 Posted July 11, 2007 Too True Sal, Flex may have caught on before anything physical happened, but what about the next time they hit a rough spot in the marriage. Im sure the same guy will be there to provide comfort. Read through some of the posts from wives who cheated often its some guy she knew for years and years. Besides I wouldnt want my wife in an office environment like that.
Author flex Posted July 12, 2007 Author Posted July 12, 2007 Hey guys, thanks for the insight. I agree that at the moment her job and work environment are my biggest hurdles. I am going to really push that home today and see what happens. I kind of brought it up last night and she kind of baulked a little bit. She was surprised I was serious (huh??) and was like well I am at a point where I am supposed to get promoted shortly. This from a woman who had done nothing but bitch about how much she hates where she works for the last 10 years. She almost left last year when they made her go back to the office full time. But now suddenly she wants to get ahead, and be a manager ok. The thought of what she is doing there right now is just killing me so I at least want to see an effort on her side to get her resume together and start an active search. You guys are right that unless he left that would always be out there. We are of course going to have fights and disagreements and other things come up so that could be a really bad crutch for her to fall back on. Its going to be interesting to see how this goes and will prove telling. I am at the point though where I just don't know if I can go forward?? How do you learn to trust someone after they betray you like this?? How will I ever be 100% comfortable with things?? I mean I can't keep going on with all this stress, my stomach is in knots every single day, I am not sleeping well, or eating well. And its not like I am sitting around sulking, I am just so damn angry and torn up about this. How could she do this to us?? How could she NOT realize what she was doing???? Its just so terribly sad.
jmargel Posted July 12, 2007 Posted July 12, 2007 I don't think you will ever be 100% comfortable. Coming from someone who has been through it, it's like emotional murder. It's easy for the cheater to just say 'get over it', it's because they have not felt the deceitfulness that you have. Being betrayed by the person who is suppose to love you the most out of anyone is the worst feeling in the world. However I have to say that by her just leaving her job is not a 100% guarantee that the communication will stop between those two. If she's capable of doing this with him, she's capable of doing this to another guy in the next job she gets. It comes down to trust and the foudation of your trust has been destroyed. It's time for her to come clean, clean up this mess then start to rebuild that foundation. However you two can't build this foundation by yourself even if you wanted to. You need outside help, a counselor for this. They will take this situation and put it into a light that both of you can understand and communicate better. What do you have to lose by doing this? It will also be a test of how serious she is about getting through this. If she is serious about this, she will go.
Darth Vader Posted July 13, 2007 Posted July 13, 2007 Hey guys, thanks for the insight. I agree that at the moment her job and work environment are my biggest hurdles. I am going to really push that home today and see what happens. I kind of brought it up last night and she kind of baulked a little bit. She was surprised I was serious (huh??) and was like well I am at a point where I am supposed to get promoted shortly. This from a woman who had done nothing but bitch about how much she hates where she works for the last 10 years. She almost left last year when they made her go back to the office full time. But now suddenly she wants to get ahead, and be a manager ok. The thought of what she is doing there right now is just killing me so I at least want to see an effort on her side to get her resume together and start an active search. You guys are right that unless he left that would always be out there. We are of course going to have fights and disagreements and other things come up so that could be a really bad crutch for her to fall back on. Its going to be interesting to see how this goes and will prove telling. I am at the point though where I just don't know if I can go forward?? How do you learn to trust someone after they betray you like this?? How will I ever be 100% comfortable with things?? I mean I can't keep going on with all this stress, my stomach is in knots every single day, I am not sleeping well, or eating well. And its not like I am sitting around sulking, I am just so damn angry and torn up about this. How could she do this to us?? How could she NOT realize what she was doing???? Its just so terribly sad. She kinda Baulked? That kinda tells you her intent! Either she's banging the guy, or is fixing to, so she's just trying to tell you to "sit down, shut up, because I'm gonna ride this guy whether you like it or not", "Oh, and you have to stay faithful!" I could be wrong, but that's what it looks like to me!
Melissa277 Posted July 13, 2007 Posted July 13, 2007 How do you learn to trust someone after they betray you like this?? How will I ever be 100% comfortable with things?? I mean I can't keep going on with all this stress, my stomach is in knots every single day, I am not sleeping well, or eating well. And its not like I am sitting around sulking, I am just so damn angry and torn up about this. How could she do this to us?? How could she NOT realize what she was doing???? Its just so terribly sad. I've asked myself those same questions a million times over the past year and a half. I feel for so bad for you. I could just cry reading that. No one deserves this kind of heartbreak. I am so sorry. Melissa
Sal Paradise Posted July 13, 2007 Posted July 13, 2007 I agree that at the moment her job and work environment are my biggest hurdles. I am going to really push that home today and see what happens. I kind of brought it up last night and she kind of baulked a little bit. She was surprised I was serious (huh??) and was like well I am at a point where I am supposed to get promoted shortly. This from a woman who had done nothing but bitch about how much she hates where she works for the last 10 years. She almost left last year when they made her go back to the office full time. But now suddenly she wants to get ahead, and be a manager ok. . As I (and others) suspected. The fact that she baulked makes it all the more important that she leaves that job. Your marriage depends on it. It won’t fix everything (counseling is a must) but nothing can be worked on as long as she remains there. If she is unwilling to leave then issue an ultimatum, either she leaves the job or she leaves the house (she cheated not you she can leave the house). The thought of what she is doing there right now is just killing me so I at least want to see an effort on her side to get her resume together and start an active search. You guys are right that unless he left that would always be out there. We are of course going to have fights and disagreements and other things come up so that could be a really bad crutch for her to fall back on. Its going to be interesting to see how this goes and will prove telling. Which is why leaving the job and cutting all contact with this guy must happen. You guys also need counseling. It might be the only way to get her to open up and understand the ramifications of what she has done. Right now that can’t happen because she is around her addiction every day and is in the fog.
Author flex Posted July 13, 2007 Author Posted July 13, 2007 Well we had another pretty good talk last night. We got into the work thing and she is going to get her resume together and start looking around. She realizes its not making me comfortable and is willing to do whatever she needs to do to prove it. She has always wanted to start her own design company so maybe now is the time to take that leap. We'll see. The one thing that worries me is her resenting or being pissed that she has to do this, but hey I did not create this mess, she did!! She claims to have cut all contact with him during the day, except required work related contact which they somehow minimized. Supposedly after all this they don't talk anymore. She genuinely seems upset by all this, and truly sorry she caused so much trouble. Its killing her that I can barely look her in the eyes and she really seems to regret her actions, whatever they were. I am still not completely satisfied with what I am getting out of her with regards to the extent of the relationship. She completely denies any physical attraction to the guy. Not sure what to believe. See when you do something to break someones trust it makes it hard for them to believe ANYTHING out of your mouth. Maybe she is telling the truth, maybe it was nothing more than a good friendship that went over the line a bit from time to time and nothing more. But having crossed those lines even a little just destroys my ability to believe anything she says right now. Well I was going to try and spy on her today, to see if she was secretly seeing him at lunch still since we are going away this weekend and if she was lying about everything I figured today would be a logical dayfor her to do it. But having given it some thought, I need to try and just move on. SO I am taking her to lunch today. I am going to pick her up and the two of us are going to spend a little time together. Need to start somewhere right??
Cobra_X30 Posted July 13, 2007 Posted July 13, 2007 Flex, I think your going in the right direction. If I were in your shoes, once she shows a commitment to change I would start working on becoming a better husband. You may have to start watching some TV shows you dont like. Lunch dates are the best!
Author flex Posted July 13, 2007 Author Posted July 13, 2007 Yes we have both been making changes. We have been spending a LOT more time together at night. It has really changed our communication. Quite a bit. We really do feel closer to each other and if not for this damn cloud of suspicion things would be going great. We have had some nice dinners toghther the last few Friday nights with some wine and lets led to some fun after We have been texting each other on our phones during the day to keep better in touch. Its progress.
quiet1one1 Posted July 13, 2007 Posted July 13, 2007 Good news (for a change). Hope it stays good for you. Maybe you got to this before things got too far. Be as trusting as your brain (not heart) will allow but remain wary. You asked her to do some things and make a commitment - you need to reach out too. Just don't put the blinders back on. We're pulling for you.
Cobra_X30 Posted July 13, 2007 Posted July 13, 2007 Lord knows this website could use a positive outcome story.
Darth Vader Posted July 14, 2007 Posted July 14, 2007 Well we had another pretty good talk last night. We got into the work thing and she is going to get her resume together and start looking around. She realizes its not making me comfortable and is willing to do whatever she needs to do to prove it. She has always wanted to start her own design company so maybe now is the time to take that leap. We'll see. The one thing that worries me is her resenting or being pissed that she has to do this, but hey I did not create this mess, she did!! She claims to have cut all contact with him during the day, except required work related contact which they somehow minimized. Supposedly after all this they don't talk anymore. She genuinely seems upset by all this, and truly sorry she caused so much trouble. Its killing her that I can barely look her in the eyes and she really seems to regret her actions, whatever they were. I am still not completely satisfied with what I am getting out of her with regards to the extent of the relationship. She completely denies any physical attraction to the guy. Not sure what to believe. See when you do something to break someones trust it makes it hard for them to believe ANYTHING out of your mouth. Maybe she is telling the truth, maybe it was nothing more than a good friendship that went over the line a bit from time to time and nothing more. But having crossed those lines even a little just destroys my ability to believe anything she says right now. Well I was going to try and spy on her today, to see if she was secretly seeing him at lunch still since we are going away this weekend and if she was lying about everything I figured today would be a logical dayfor her to do it. But having given it some thought, I need to try and just move on. SO I am taking her to lunch today. I am going to pick her up and the two of us are going to spend a little time together. Need to start somewhere right?? She's pissed? That ought to tell you something right there IMO, she should be more willing to understand what you're going through. She may be pissed that she can't have her fix at work............. Be prepared, she may try to drag her feet on quiting her job, and getting another.
Epyphany Posted July 14, 2007 Posted July 14, 2007 Wow, I just finished reading your whole thread. Dude, you are getting some really bad advice here. The scary thing about it though is that you seem to be so open to it. You said you told your wife that "...despite her assurances this was just pure friendship that I do not and will not believe it." Then what is the issue? That she can't provide proof? Well, ****... she can't provide proof that she loves you either but I think you still believe that, why else would she stay? Why would you stay if you didn't at least believe that a little? The kids?! You guys are probably doing more damage to them now with this hanging over them then either of you are willing to admit to also. You can deny that, but I bet if I ask one of their friends if they have noticed a difference in Mommy and Daddy... well, you get my point, right? At some point, you are going to have to decide without all this espionage crap whether you TRUST her or not. It's not about proof otherwise we would be talking about evidence and crime, not trust and betrayal. If you decide you have to take a leap of faith and make a deal with her to act respectfully toward each other and to acknowledge that from THIS day forward you will both behave with trustworthy care and basic human respect then you have to jump in with both feet! If either of you then breaches that pact, at least one of you will know you upheld your end of the bargain and can keep your sense of integrity even while walking away. This thread had some really good points from what looked like good caring people but ... there was a ton that just sounded like sour grapes and a few that sounded like those folks just want you to be as unhappy as they are. I think you are probably a fairly level-headed guy in the rest of your life, but seriously... you sort of sound like you are veering off the sane and sensible path. Plus, bottom-line... what do you want more? Vindication? Or a loving safe harbor that you call home? Even if you don't go to marriage counseling, you should think about talking to someone about this change in your personality. Even if the change was caused by this turn of events. Not healthy for you or your kids -- they are sponges remember. What they don't understand they will assimilate anyway. Who knows how they will perceive this time and the effect it will have on them when they go out into the world. Just wanted to give you my 2 cents but looks like I gave you a fiver and some change. May not seem like it but I do hate that you are suffering so badly. I just can't help but think that if you could talk to someone unbiased, you would have a better chance of recovering from this.
quiet1one1 Posted July 16, 2007 Posted July 16, 2007 Sour grapes? You betcha. 8 months ago I was right where Flex is now - his story mirrors mine almost to a T. I trusted, justified, rationalized, believed, even beat myself up, and all I got were sore ba!!z. I hope it's different for him - I really do but he needs to keep his eyes open. Cheaters will do/say absolutely anything to throw you off their trail.
Lynna Posted July 16, 2007 Posted July 16, 2007 Flex, look at the book recommendation on another thread from quietone. I have just finished the first chapter of After the Affair and a lot of what you are experiencing is described there. It is really giving me some perspective. I am also finding How Can I Forgive You to be helpful in getting beyond the A. Good luck!
Author flex Posted July 16, 2007 Author Posted July 16, 2007 Hey guys its been a few days so I figured I would let you know how things are going. I appreciate ALL the comments here and will look into some of the recommended reading material. Having a place to throw this stuff out there is really a great help. Well we had a great weekend. We went out for lunch Friday, I picked her up at work, and we really talked and it was nice. We went away over the weekend to visit family and Saturday was probably the best day we have had in years. We are really communicating and spent a romantic evening at the beach that night, something we have not done since before we were married and it was great. She is honestly really making an effort, there is no way to deny it at this point. She has been going above and beyond where she would need to, to just try and throw me off the track or something. Things are feeling nice. For the first time in a few weeks I don't have that sick feeling in my stomach right now. I am not saying that overnight all is healed but we are both trying. She really knows this is hurt me and our relationship, and honestly seems to understand what she has done. IN some ways though I am seeing we needed a wake up call. I think we both realize now that things just were not going well and we are both sad that it took this long and something like this to wake us up to that fact. I still am struggling with things, I will admit that. Still not sure I can truly trust her right now, but I do not think that at this point she is or would do anything to ruin the rebuilding we have started. We have really broken down the walls we have built up over the years and really are enjoying talking and playing around with each other. We are looking back and starting to realize why we fell in love in the first place years ago. So honestly at this point, whatever happened looks like it could have been a blessing in disguise. I know there are some comments here about the kids and whatnot and how our actions the last couple weeks have effected them. Honestly if we turn things around and continue on the path we are on, they will be all the better off for that, trust me. Its not like were getting along great all this time. They are actually seeing mommy and daddy hold hands, and hug each other and talking to each other. So I think those are all positives. Well hopefully I will not be back in two weeks saying, crap it was all lies!!! but I am encouraged and hope others stories work out as well.
Darth Vader Posted July 16, 2007 Posted July 16, 2007 I think I can say for most everyone here, we hope we are wrong about your wife.
Cobra_X30 Posted July 17, 2007 Posted July 17, 2007 Vader, I dont think Flex's wife got physical with this OM. Based on all the information posted here it seems like a budding EA. Just my thoughts.
whichwayisup Posted July 17, 2007 Posted July 17, 2007 If they spent time alone together, they may not have had 'sex' but you can bet that they fooled around abit, cuddled and kissed. Flex, all I can say is, time will tell. Don't let your guard down completely...
Recommended Posts