Does the lenght of marriage and your age have effect on how you deal with PA or EA?

July 9, 2007

I am coming up to 35 years of marriage and I am in my late 50's and I wonder if I was younger and not so long married would I walk away.

Our marriage on the surface seems fine at the moment but is that me just accepting things for a quiet life and not rocking things for our family.

He is being caring and loving towards me but still will not admit that what he had was an EA. I do not bring it up, not because its not on my mind but wonder is there any point. What have I got to gain from doing so?

I have just bought the following books

After the Affair

How can I Forgive You?

I love you but I'm not in love with you.

Have not got around to reading them yet. Anyone think they are worth while?

July 9, 2007

My Aunt and Uncle were married for 33 years and they divorced over an affair that he had..

That was a terrible family tragedy.

I will say this though.. looking back at all the family gatherings throughout all the years a lot of what I saw as a child makes more sense..meaning there were lots of signs that things weren't great at home.

They never really paid a lot of attention to each other when they were in the same room.. that kind of stuff...

July 9, 2007

There are other things to consider than just how long you've been together when you decide whether or not to leave a cheater. One important thing that's troubling about your situation is his refusal to be honest about what happened. I don't think you can truly repair your marriage without honesty.

That being said, I think that how long you've been together CAN be a factor, but not just because of the length of time you've been together. If you've been with someone for a long time you will probably have a better idea of whether or not this is a person who made a mistake and truly regrets it or if it's the act of a selfish person.

July 9, 2007

Have you tried marriage counseling?

July 9, 2007

I am coming up to 35 years of marriage and I am in my late 50's and I wonder if I was younger and not so long married would I walk away.

For me it does. I have 25 years invested and I am not giving up easily - I haven't walked away yet. Should I have? I may never know but I do know that all I'm losing right now is time. I have my doubts periodically but overall I'm pretty comfortable with my decision.

I have just bought the following books

After the Affair

How can I Forgive You?

I love you but I'm not in love with you.

I read After the Affair and it was great for me. There's a recent thread on LS about it. I didn't read the others and would love some feedback on them too.

July 9, 2007

I could have been the one writing your post. We will have been married 27 years this week. H does not think he's done anything wrong with his EA (relatively benign compared to some here).

Our facts are:

1. He has a "friendship" with a 26-year-old who works with one of his consultants.

2. He thinks she is attractive.

3. He would consider dating her if he were not married.

4. She thinks enough of him (and by his permission) to have called him late one evening to cry on his shoulder about her BF (or that is what I was told).

5. He thinks she is very smart and they "have a lot in common" (her schooling and no doubt other things).

6. He continues to make strange comments like "your favorite person gave me a discount coupong" (to a home improvement store).

7. He thinks it would help if I met her (uh, no thanks).

And yes, I have not been discussing it...no more rubbing salt in the wounds as it does no good. Even our MC said he should realize that his EA is damaging our marriage. He has ignored that advice. But he says he can't figure out MY behavior lately.

Luckily, I am still under 50 and if this ever gets worse, or if I ever find out he is lying again...I WILL consider leaving. Hard stuff to admit to oneself. But why live out the rest of your days unhappy, resentful, on eggshells, suspcious.

I'd rather not have to worry about cooking dinner, frankly.

July 10, 2007

...we'd been married 25 years and separated with me thinking we needed to work together to recconcile and that was the purpose of the separation. Then I discovered that the boyfriend she'd met seven months before was now living with her and my two minor daughters.

I filed for divorce the next day! I was 48. It was the best thing I ever did.

July 10, 2007

Whoa! Please slow down! The term "emotional affair" is fraught with peril.

The term EA is a very recent construct that is often used to attempt to "criminalize" previously non "criminal" (for lack of a better term) behavior.

Sometimes an "EA" is actually nothing more than a friend that exhibits emotional resources that have faded, or been ignored or lost in a long term relationship.

Often in extended relationships couples gradually evolve into a state of complete ignorance of each others needs. Or one partner forgets how to fill their partners need.

Many "emotional affairs" are not "cheating" at all. Rather they can be a connection between a person with a problem or problems in their marriage, and a second person gifted with the ability to emote, showing empathy for another persons situation.

Previously "empathy" was considered a valuable personal trait, often connected with great personal character. As of late, it's fallen out of favor, and rather than a positive trait it's become something to be feared.

As each of us grows older, late middle age or older, attributes like empathy, patience, understanding become sharper while other traits that served us well in our youth, hightened sexuality, aggressivness, jealousy loose some of their power.

Please don't ruin a long relationship, that can be revitalized casually. Be SURE that what you see as an "EA" is more than a couple of people, trying to cope with changing lifes and relationship without malice. Sometimes a "friend to talk to" is just that.. a friend.

July 10, 2007

The fact that he's rubbing it in with comments like "Your favorite person...." would be enough for me to see a lawyer and file for divorce that day. How disrespectful and hateful.

July 10, 2007

The fact that he's rubbing it in with comments like "Your favorite person...." would be enough for me to see a lawyer and file for divorce that day. How disrespectful and hateful.

WHOA...Yeah, it's sh***y...but I don't think it's cause for D just yet...

After nearly 3 decades of marriage I am not quite ready to throw in the towel...

And like, Frances, the original poster, he has been loving and caring...and I think he knows that if he pulls this again (this is not the first time), or it were to go any further, into a full blown A, I'd be gone.

So...I wonder...are you, by chance, the OW???

July 10, 2007

The fact that he's rubbing it in with comments like "Your favorite person...." would be enough for me to see a lawyer and file for divorce that day. How disrespectful and hateful.

Have you ever been married before ?..

If the OP had that kind of attitude about marriage they would've never made it to 35 years...

I'm not saying those type of comments are good.. I'm just saying that it takes commitment to make it to 35 years and dumping over comments like that don't coincide with each other

July 10, 2007

Evidently, it is on your mind enough to post here, and to order books.

I wouldn't sweep this under the rug.

The fact that he will not admit to it is also bad news.

It's sounds as if both of you are in denial.

I am coming up to 35 years of marriage and I am in my late 50's and I wonder if I was younger and not so long married would I walk away.
Our marriage on the surface seems fine at the moment but is that me just accepting things for a quiet life and not rocking things for our family.

He is being caring and loving towards me but still will not admit that what he had was an EA. I do not bring it up, not because its not on my mind but wonder is there any point. What have I got to gain from doing so?

I have just bought the following books

After the Affair

How can I Forgive You?

I love you but I'm not in love with you.

Have not got around to reading them yet. Anyone think they are worth while?

July 10, 2007

Evidently, it is on your mind enough to post here, and to order books.

I wouldn't sweep this under the rug.

The fact that he will not admit to it is also bad news.

It's sounds as if both of you are in denial.

I am not the one in denial, I realize he had an EA and I am trying to deal with it in my own way without messing up my family. Reading the books and coming on here is one of my ways of dealing with it. I have had some great support and advice from LS.

It is coming up to 1 year since D day and I have calmed down alot since then. We have a lot of family events to deal with in the coming months and I have no intention of destroying what should be joyful occassions by inflicting my pain on the rest of the family.

I just wonder if I was younger would I have dealt with this in a different way. He really does not believe he has done anything dreadful. His EA started with him being helpfull to her as he has helped lots of other people in the past, the difference is that I knew about them and would have helped them myself at times.

July 10, 2007

I am not the one in denial, I realize he had an EA and I am trying to deal with it in my own way without messing up my family. Reading the books and coming on here is one of my ways of dealing with it. I have had some great support and advice from LS.

It is coming up to 1 year since D day and I have calmed down alot since then. We have a lot of family events to deal with in the coming months and I have no intention of destroying what should be joyful occassions by inflicting my pain on the rest of the family.

I just wonder if I was younger would I have dealt with this in a different way. He really does not believe he has done anything dreadful. His EA started with him being helpfull to her as he has helped lots of other people in the past, the difference is that I knew about them and would have helped them myself at times.

Are you also in IC? This might help you address the affair without the therapist having to focus on the marriage being above the individuals' needs.

In order for your husband to admit he had an EA, he has to admit that he's involved in something that vampires from the primary relationship. He also has to admit he has a problem. Denial is not going to fix your marriage.

I should state that I'm not a strong believer in marriage salvation after an affair, so you understand my biases. If you don't appreciate what you have when you have it, it's gone. Live with it.

July 10, 2007

Whoa! Please slow down! The term "emotional affair" is fraught with peril.

The term EA is a very recent construct that is often used to attempt to "criminalize" previously non "criminal" (for lack of a better term) behavior.

Sometimes an "EA" is actually nothing more than a friend that exhibits emotional resources that have faded, or been ignored or lost in a long term relationship.

Often in extended relationships couples gradually evolve into a state of complete ignorance of each others needs. Or one partner forgets how to fill their partners need.

Many "emotional affairs" are not "cheating" at all. Rather they can be a connection between a person with a problem or problems in their marriage, and a second person gifted with the ability to emote, showing empathy for another persons situation.

Previously "empathy" was considered a valuable personal trait, often connected with great personal character. As of late, it's fallen out of favor, and rather than a positive trait it's become something to be feared.

As each of us grows older, late middle age or older, attributes like empathy, patience, understanding become sharper while other traits that served us well in our youth, hightened sexuality, aggressivness, jealousy loose some of their power.

Please don't ruin a long relationship, that can be revitalized casually. Be SURE that what you see as an "EA" is more than a couple of people, trying to cope with changing lifes and relationship without malice. Sometimes a "friend to talk to" is just that.. a friend.

I agree with a lot of what you say but I think the fact that he kept her a secret and that they developed a very close relationship over all those years to the extent that he thought he maybe falling in love with her before the penny dropped and he dropped her shows that it was in danger of becoming a full blown PA. The fact that they had the Atlantic Ocean between them except for a handfull of occassions I feel stopped the PA. Again, the distance may have made the fantasy more enjoyable without the guilt of a full blown PA.

July 10, 2007

Are you also in IC? This might help you address the affair without the therapist having to focus on the marriage being above the individuals' needs.

No I am not in IC. Very few people are on their own in a long marriage and do have to consider the effects on their family.

In order for your husband to admit he had an EA, he has to admit that he's involved in something that vampires from the primary relationship. He also has to admit he has a problem. Denial is not going to fix your marriage.

He is not involved any more, the EA is over for the past two years. He knows he was wrong but will not admit it was an affair. We married young, had a lot of kids and it was not easy for either one of us. I am not surprised he went into a fantasy world at times.

I should state that I'm not a strong believer in marriage salvation after an affair, so you understand my biases. If you don't appreciate what you have when you have it, it's gone. Live with it.

When I was younger I felt much like you, now I have to look at my options and they are not very many. If he was being horrible to me and making my kids life miserable then I would not have a choice of whether to stay or not.

July 10, 2007

...we'd been married 25 years and separated with me thinking we needed to work together to recconcile and that was the purpose of the separation. Then I discovered that the boyfriend she'd met seven months before was now living with her and my two minor daughters.

I filed for divorce the next day! I was 48. It was the best thing I ever did.

Would you have divorced if it had been an EA and not a PA?

48 is still a number of years younger than I am now.

My h is not a bad person infact he is a very good person which is how he got himself into the mess. He lived a fantasy world of a EA for a number of years due to the stress he put himself and me under.

July 10, 2007

Have you ever been married before ?..
If the OP had that kind of attitude about marriage they would've never made it to 35 years...
I'm not saying those type of comments are good.. I'm just saying that it takes commitment to make it to 35 years and dumping over comments like that don't coincide with each other

Honestly...I have been in serious relationships and have never been talked to like that by my SO.

July 11, 2007

No I am not in IC. Very few people are on their own in a long marriage and do have to consider the effects on their family.

So that you are aware Frances, I am suggesting a combination of IC and MC. I know you want to work on your marriage but for your personal emotional health, due to his denial, it doesn't hurt to invest in self. Good luck.

July 11, 2007

Frances, what you wrote could absolutely be the case! After thinking, I decided to advise a little caution, a 35 year marriage is a huge investment.

Each situation is unique.

July 11, 2007

Frances,

Once again, I think you and I are going thru similar (but of course different) situations.

My H is caring as well. He apparently wanted to be the helper, the one to come to when in trouble, for this young woman (young...but not a child).

My H also expressed himself some while we were going through the muck after D-day and I think he feels he missed out on his father role (we were never able to have kids and did not chose to adopt)...he also stated that after a "near death" auto accident, he feels the need to live life to its fullest (OK...that is a little unsettling...but).

I know my H loves me and does not want to lose me. But, unfortunately, he does not seem to realize what his sometimes stupid thoughtless decisions do to someone like me. He has no idea the emotional and physical effects finding him chatting to this OW that D-night did to me. It's crazy making. And so incredibly shocking after spending nearly three decades married to who I thought...was my soulmate.

Hang in there.

July 14, 2007

LakesideDream, you always had some of the best & most rational advice for me when i needed it & i see you still got it! Nice to know you are still here & helping.

I agree that accusations of an EA are probably running amock right now in our society. It actually is possible for two people to be friends & not be having anything going on or any thoughts of anything going on.

I also agree the comment one poster said her husband made about 'your favorite person' was uncalled for IF he truly truly understands the depth of this womans concern. Maybe the two of them joke with each other about things like that in the past & he's not realizing she does seriously see this woman as a threat. If he realizes it, then it is a bit cold. Perhaps he's trying to make her jealous, to get some attention. Who knows!

Don't throw away a marriage over some thoughts that just perhaps are unfounded. I know it's not what you want to hear, that maybe he is innocent, but who knows, perhaps he is.

bt to answer your original question, yeah, i do think time in a marriage & the obvious, having kids have a whole lot to do with whether one stays or goes. I also think fear of starting over & the unknown have as much to do with it as time invested.

July 14, 2007

InaPanic, I suppose I am the cautious type, having suffered the consequences of a WS during a 25 year now former marriage. I know that regardless of what happens in the future, my life between ages 25-50 will continue to define me. In a perfect world, (without physical affairs) would I still be married? Yes.

During my marriage, I had two "friendship" relationships with women. One, a friend/mentor relationship I have described on LS a couple of times. The other was different, maybe I will describe it if it becomes relevant in another post.

There were MANY other times when friendships, or what now might be "emotional affairs" could have developed, and didn't, because I avoided it. My ex worked in a clerical position for 12 years. I literally got to know quite a few gals quite well during that time. During work related parties, holidays etc. my ex was always one of the organizers (3-400 guests) and was absent for the first couple of hours of the parties. You wouldn't believe some of the stories I heard from my female table mates! Once I remembered actually wanting to hug a gal, and comfort her she was so upset with her husband who who had refused to escort her to the party. Needless to say I didn't, because it wasn't appropriate behavior for me. The best I could offer was a "pat on the back of the hand" and encouragment that things would probably work out.

I've always been a person who listened, and who other people have sought out to listen to their stuff. It's never been a burden to me as I think I have been gifted with the talent of empathy. Clearly I have faced temptation in my life. I believe I have been reasonably successful in resisting it when appropriate.

Some of my close personal friends have told me I wasted "oppertunities"... I'm not unhappy about it though.

July 14, 2007

That must really hurt knowing that you considered your spouse and didn't go there, but, the other spouse didn't care when it was their turn.

July 16, 2007

LakesideDream, you always had some of the best & most rational advice for me when i needed it & i see you still got it! Nice to know you are still here & helping.

I agree that accusations of an EA are probably running amock right now in our society. It actually is possible for two people to be friends & not be having anything going on or any thoughts of anything going on.

I also agree the comment one poster said her husband made about 'your favorite person' was uncalled for IF he truly truly understands the depth of this womans concern. Maybe the two of them joke with each other about things like that in the past & he's not realizing she does seriously see this woman as a threat. If he realizes it, then it is a bit cold. Perhaps he's trying to make her jealous, to get some attention. Who knows!

Don't throw away a marriage over some thoughts that just perhaps are unfounded. I know it's not what you want to hear, that maybe he is innocent, but who knows, perhaps he is.

bt to answer your original question, yeah, i do think time in a marriage & the obvious, having kids have a whole lot to do with whether one stays or goes. I also think fear of starting over & the unknown have as much to do with it as time invested.

I agree that the term "emotional affair" is a bit overused. And I also agree that with my H when he expresses that having friendships should not be considered wrong. As a woman, I enjoy the men I work with or socialize with. I actually prefer them to women who are emotional, catty, bitchy and other things.

However, when my H conducted himself in such a manner where (1) I did not know the woman, (2) he was comforting her via phone after I had gone to bed (in private...secretly), and (3) he was like a deer in the headlights when he was discovered and a jackrabbit with it's tail on fire after he was discovered told me that there was damn good reason for me to be suspcious. If you want me to support your behavior, then behave like an honest, forthright adult.

Does he know the depth of my concern? You'd think so after D-day, the months after D-day with discussions, crying, and the counseling sessions (MC telling him EAs are risky at best because they CAN lead to other things).

And, after all, he SHOULD understand how I feel about such things...he's done it before (when he wanted to take his blonde german intern to SF on our 10th anniversary...to look at architecture...without me). He knows my boundaries and chose to behave outside them. Yes, his comment about "your favorite person" was rude, insulting and disrespectful. Grounds for divorce? After 27 years? Well...probably not.

And when we celebrate and annivesary and he professes that I am his one and only...what do I (or anyone else) do? Believe or not believe? I guess actions will tell the tale.

And...InaPanic,...who knows what is the truth or what will eventually happen. The weird part is my gut is still sitting on a fence about whether he is purely innocent or not. I believe he thinks he is...I still reserve my judgment.

And, facts be told, I have a pretty nice roof over my head, food on the table, and damn good health insurance.

Sometimes when I drive around on my lunch hour I listen to Dr. Laura. She often tells women who have chosen to marry and have a few kids with some louse to stay put until they are old enough to move out and fend for themselves and I think...wow...that's a pretty tall order. To have to live with some jerkwad for years upon years...

I guess we just have to ask ourselves after all these years...would I be better or happier on my own? Or can I find enough happiness here....for the next 40 years.

LakesideDream...yes, thank you for all your insight. It provides a healthy balance for someone like me experiencing all this.

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Does the lenght of marriage and your age have effect on how you deal with PA or EA?

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