ehead Posted June 12, 2007 Posted June 12, 2007 My girlfriend has to go in and have surgery on a hernia soon, and she has sort of implied (but not demanded) that she would appreciate me being there. This will require me to take off work (I don't get paid when I'm not there) and make the 1 hour drive up and back (she splits her time between there and here). Not to mention she is going to be in surgery and then knocked out cold for most of the day afterwards, which means I'll be sitting in the hospital reading and chit chatting with her mom. The surgery is supposedly very routine. She leaves the hospital the same day. I have a tendency to be really emotionally self-sufficient and very pracital. There is no rational or logical reason for me to be there, and I wouldn't expect her to be with me under similiar circumstances, but I know this kind of thing is important to her. Anyway, what is the right balance between expectations and responsibilities here?
Apple Blossom Posted June 12, 2007 Posted June 12, 2007 I think it is a difficult situation. She obviously would like you there, because she's metioned it to you. Even if its routine, she's probably fairly aprehensive about the surgery, it can be pretty scary, and she is probably just in need of reassurance. How impractical is it for you to take the time off? Would it be possible for you to finish work early - say take your lunch hour at the end of the day - so that you could get down and be at her house when she returns from surgery? If you can't be there when she goes in, then she would probably appriciate you being there when she gets out. I would ask you how long have you guys been together? And as you say, you know this kind of thing is important to her. It sounds to me as though you feel like you should go and be there with her, but you're trying to justify not being there? If it really is impractical to get the time off work, then i would say send her flowers to the hospital, so they're there when she arrives - so she knows you're thinking of her. And drive to see her after the operation, just to give her a bit of TLC. Anywhos, I know thats been a bit of a jumbled response, but hope it helps a bit.
Author ehead Posted June 12, 2007 Author Posted June 12, 2007 It wouldn't be too difficult to get off work, though I could really use the pay. I think my hesitation is more about the time factor to be honest... the sitting around in the waiting room, the inevitable banal conversation with the relatives. Not to mention hospitals just generally creep me out. When it comes to places I'd rather not be, I'd have to put them up there with banks, church, and the DMV. My mom is a crusty old woman and she thinks my girlfriend is being ridiculous. But then, she's the one who drilled dogged self-sufficiency into me to begin with. I think your idea about taking off early and visiting her after surgery may be a good compromise. She'll likely be sleeping, but I can drop off some flowers, talk with her mom for a bit, and give everybody a good impression.
frygirl Posted June 12, 2007 Posted June 12, 2007 Go to the hosptial. Being a very practical and self sufficient person, I understand your hesitations about taking a whole day of to just sit around the hospital but I think if it is something she would like you to do you should do it. Even if the surgery is routine, she will be in a lot of pain afterwards and probably wants you there to make her feel better. At times like that when you are feeling that bad, a person usually wants the person they love the most to be there. I know that may sound sappy but its true. As a woman that was once married to a man who made her drive herself to the emergency room when her lung ruptured, I am recommending you do this for her. It may be a long dull day at the hospital for you, but it will mean everything to her.
stace79 Posted June 12, 2007 Posted June 12, 2007 I think you should go, too, even if only for the latter part of the day when she is recovering. The excuse that you don't want to have boring convo with her family or sit around in a hospital doing nothing is pretty selfish. What if you guys got married and she was in labor with your kid? What if she had to have surgery sometime or was in a car accident? If my boyfriend doesn't want to come support me in the hospital, like FAMILY SHOULD DO, then forget him. I'm not wasting MY time on him anymore. Sending flowers would not alone be enough. You should show up with the flowers in hand. Stop being selfish....I'm sure if she had her choice she wouldn't be in the hospital for surgery in the first place.
Author ehead Posted June 12, 2007 Author Posted June 12, 2007 I don't really appreciate you calling me selfish, and I think your accessment is complete BS. Apparently you've never been a relationship with a "needy" person. Needy people will ask virtually anything of the people in their lives, and they have a tendency to make us all look selfish. In fact, it's the needy person themselves that is being selfish, by constantly expecting the world of you and imposing one demand after another. Anyway, I am a person that asks very little of others, as I've always found it terribly SELFISH and rude to impose on others. I took the bus to the hospital (while in extreme pain) after seperating the AC joint in my shoulder rather than impose on a friend. I slept in my car for the night once when I broke down an hour from home, just because I didn't want to trouble anyone late at night. My girlfriend is sort of at the opposite extreme with regards to this. I've already missed a few days of work because she is having "emotional" problems and needed someone to talk to. This is something I finally had to put a stop to, or else face the possibility of loosing my job. It also took a while for me to realize what she considered an "emergency" and what I considered one were vastly different. Anyway, this is an extremely routine surgery, and she will be out of the hospital within a few hours. It's ridiculous of you to extrapolate from this to child bearing. You're being like those crazy news pundits on TV, always jumping to the extreme. I'm going to have to take a day off from work (if I can get the day off), without pay, and make the 80 minute drive around 6:30 in the morning. All so I can give her a hug before she goes in. Also, she knows I don't have a lot of money and things are kind of dicey at work right now. So now tell me, who's being selfish again here?
frygirl Posted June 12, 2007 Posted June 12, 2007 Go to the hospital. I don't condone her expecting you to take time off for her "emotional issues" unless it was something like a family crisis or death. That would be needy behavior. Asking you to be at the hospital while she has surgery is just what boyfriend's and girlfriend's do. It's not needy at all. I can see that from your post that you think asking for help is an "impostion." Do you feel this way when people ask you for help? Do you think anyone that asks for help is needy?
Author ehead Posted June 12, 2007 Author Posted June 12, 2007 I don't condone her expecting you to take time off for her "emotional issues" unless it was something like a family crisis or death. That would be needy behavior. Once it was because of anxiety about a test, another time because she was just generally depressed and feeling down about school and work. Both times she sort of made things sound like a critical emergency though. Needless to say, I've wised up. I can see that from your post that you think asking for help is an "impostion." Do you feel this way when people ask you for help? Do you think anyone that asks for help is needy? No, no, not at all. It all depends on how often they ask for help, and how much help they are asking for. I just personally don't ask a lot of favors from people unless I really need to. It's just the way I've always been. I have been in relationships with needy people though, including friends and girlfriends, and been absolutely astounded at some of the things people will ask of you, or even "expect" of you. I once had a friend ask me to drive him to update New York and back on the weekend, a one way drive of some 9 or 10 hours for me. He snuck the request in on me by asking me first if I had anything to do that weekend (I said no). He wanted to go up there so he could pick up some used furniture from his grandmother. My girlfriend is (by my estimate) a touch needy from time to time (and selfish, now that I think about it... as I've said, being needy is just another form of selfishness). She uses me for transportation all the time. Recently she attempted to disrupt my Saturday plans by getting me to drive her home Saturday afternoon (all so she could go out with her friends Friday night). She also had little regard for my family on holidays, seemingly expecting me to be there with her and her family at the expense of spending time with my own. Anyway, it's an issue that's come up, as you can see, which probably explains why I'm a little defensive about it. People that are constantly demanding and asking favors of you eventually wear you out, then you end up resenting every little favor they ask. In case you havn't figured it out, I'm one of those "pleasers" too, so needy/demanding people have been taking advantage of me my whole life. I've had to learn the hard way that you just have to say "no" sometimes. Anyhow... I'm beginning to think I'm probably going to head up there though, even though I wouldn't expect the same of her. I'm one of those people that would probably even insist on her "not bothering, I'll be fine. It's totally routine! It's a long drive for you, and besides, you could use the money. All you'll be doing is sitting there bored anyway." That's precisely what I'd say in fact. I think that's very un-selfish of me, now that I think about it. Hopefully we'll learn to meet somewhere in the middle on this neediness thing. Come to think of it, I "need" her help with the rent, and with cleaning up around the place, heehee. Something she doesn't seem too keen on. She's lived with me for about a year now and never taken the trash out once.
Star Gazer Posted June 12, 2007 Posted June 12, 2007 There is no rational or logical reason for me to be there, and I wouldn't expect her to be with me under similiar circumstances, but I know this kind of thing is important to her. Huh???? Being not only physically present but emotionally supportive of your SO while she undergoes surgery (however "routine" you think it is, it is still SURGERY) is neither irrational or illogical. Quite frankly, she shouldn't have even had to tell you that she'd like you to be there. I'd personally expect it. Go to the hospital. I don't condone her expecting you to take time off for her "emotional issues" unless it was something like a family crisis or death. That would be needy behavior. Asking you to be at the hospital while she has surgery is just what boyfriend's and girlfriend's do. It's not needy at all. I can see that from your post that you think asking for help is an "impostion." Her request is not an imposition. Be a good boyfriend. Go to the hospital.
Author ehead Posted June 12, 2007 Author Posted June 12, 2007 Man, my mom must be a really crusty ole Lady. She's clearly out of touch with today's woman, so I better not ask her advice anymore. I wonder if this might not partially be a guy/girl thing? When I got my wisdom teeth taken out I just wanted someone to pick me up from the hospital because I knew I'd be too doped up to drive. It never even occured to me to ask my girlfriend to take off from work. It's not like nobody is going to be there! Her mom, aunt, sister, and brother are all going to be there, as far as I can tell. None of them have jobs and they don't have to drive an hour and a half. Should her dad take off from work to be there too? I just really don't see it as clear cut as you all do.
stace79 Posted June 12, 2007 Posted June 12, 2007 Just because you never ask for help does not put you in "the right" and your gf in "the wrong." I don't think you should have taken off work just because she was anxious about a test or something. However, being in the hospital for ANY reason -- routine surgery or catastrophic accident -- is traumatic and unpleasant. If my bf wasn't automatically asking me if he could be there for me, I'd know he wasn't for me. You have some warped views of friendships. My bf or best friend would be the FIRST person I called if I needed a ride to the airport or something like that. And they wouldn't mind doing that for me because they know I would do it for them. As for your reference to someone asking for a 9-hour drive to NY, that is definitely over the top. If this is such a huge inconvenience for you, I might recommend you break up with her after her surgery, because clearly you aren't willing to compromise between your needs and hers. And you really might want to take a close look at your friendships -- either you just associate with a lot of moochers or you don't understand how real friendships should work. I would never be "put off" by my best friend asking for a ride to the airport or something like that. And anyone who's close to me could count on me being at the hospital for them if they're having ANY kind of surgery. I don't really appreciate you calling me selfish, and I think your accessment is complete BS. Apparently you've never been a relationship with a "needy" person. Needy people will ask virtually anything of the people in their lives, and they have a tendency to make us all look selfish. In fact, it's the needy person themselves that is being selfish, by constantly expecting the world of you and imposing one demand after another. Anyway, I am a person that asks very little of others, as I've always found it terribly SELFISH and rude to impose on others. I took the bus to the hospital (while in extreme pain) after seperating the AC joint in my shoulder rather than impose on a friend. I slept in my car for the night once when I broke down an hour from home, just because I didn't want to trouble anyone late at night. My girlfriend is sort of at the opposite extreme with regards to this. I've already missed a few days of work because she is having "emotional" problems and needed someone to talk to. This is something I finally had to put a stop to, or else face the possibility of loosing my job. It also took a while for me to realize what she considered an "emergency" and what I considered one were vastly different. Anyway, this is an extremely routine surgery, and she will be out of the hospital within a few hours. It's ridiculous of you to extrapolate from this to child bearing. You're being like those crazy news pundits on TV, always jumping to the extreme. I'm going to have to take a day off from work (if I can get the day off), without pay, and make the 80 minute drive around 6:30 in the morning. All so I can give her a hug before she goes in. Also, she knows I don't have a lot of money and things are kind of dicey at work right now. So now tell me, who's being selfish again here?
frygirl Posted June 12, 2007 Posted June 12, 2007 Once it was because of anxiety about a test, another time because she was just generally depressed and feeling down about school and work. Both times she sort of made things sound like a critical emergency though. Needless to say, I've wised up. No, no, not at all. It all depends on how often they ask for help, and how much help they are asking for. I just personally don't ask a lot of favors from people unless I really need to. It's just the way I've always been. I have been in relationships with needy people though, including friends and girlfriends, and been absolutely astounded at some of the things people will ask of you, or even "expect" of you. I once had a friend ask me to drive him to update New York and back on the weekend, a one way drive of some 9 or 10 hours for me. He snuck the request in on me by asking me first if I had anything to do that weekend (I said no). He wanted to go up there so he could pick up some used furniture from his grandmother. My girlfriend is (by my estimate) a touch needy from time to time (and selfish, now that I think about it... as I've said, being needy is just another form of selfishness). She uses me for transportation all the time. Recently she attempted to disrupt my Saturday plans by getting me to drive her home Saturday afternoon (all so she could go out with her friends Friday night). She also had little regard for my family on holidays, seemingly expecting me to be there with her and her family at the expense of spending time with my own. Anyway, it's an issue that's come up, as you can see, which probably explains why I'm a little defensive about it. People that are constantly demanding and asking favors of you eventually wear you out, then you end up resenting every little favor they ask. In case you havn't figured it out, I'm one of those "pleasers" too, so needy/demanding people have been taking advantage of me my whole life. I've had to learn the hard way that you just have to say "no" sometimes. Anyhow... I'm beginning to think I'm probably going to head up there though, even though I wouldn't expect the same of her. I'm one of those people that would probably even insist on her "not bothering, I'll be fine. It's totally routine! It's a long drive for you, and besides, you could use the money. All you'll be doing is sitting there bored anyway." That's precisely what I'd say in fact. I think that's very un-selfish of me, now that I think about it. Hopefully we'll learn to meet somewhere in the middle on this neediness thing. Come to think of it, I "need" her help with the rent, and with cleaning up around the place, heehee. Something she doesn't seem too keen on. She's lived with me for about a year now and never taken the trash out once. I understand what you are saying because I think I am alot like you or at least I use to be. As I have gotten older I have learned to say "no". People can only impose on you when you let them. I've also learned to look at every situation individually and not just refuse to do something becasue I feel the person is always asking for help. I think in your particular sitaution, going to the hospital isn't an unreasonable request, but after feeling put upon so often its hard to see the difference. Don't be afraid to say "no" and put your foot down, but also stop to think if her request is reasonable. I don't think your selfish. I think you are just a little sick of people trying to use you. I totally understand.
Author ehead Posted June 12, 2007 Author Posted June 12, 2007 I would never be "put off" by my best friend asking for a ride to the airport or something like that. And anyone who's close to me could count on me being at the hospital for them if they're having ANY kind of surgery. Ahh, but it's not that first ride to the airport that is such an inconvience. It's the ride to the grocery store next week, and the ride to the doctors office a couple of days after that. If you've ever had friends without cars you'd know what I mean. Of course, a true friend (in my opinion) would stop expecting you to drive them all over the place. Another annoying thing about a lot of "needy" people... why is it they usually don't take the subtle hint as a "no"? I think they get it, but they just want their way.
Author ehead Posted June 12, 2007 Author Posted June 12, 2007 I've also learned to look at every situation individually and not just refuse to do something becasue I feel the person is always asking for help. I think in your particular sitaution, going to the hospital isn't an unreasonable request, but after feeling put upon so often its hard to see the difference. Thanks for the understanding. I think you are dead on. If she were more like me (with regards to needs) I'd probably be fighting to get up there to support her as quickly as possible. I hadn't realized just how much resentment is brewing beneath the surface. There is no doubt our relationship is like 80/20 when it comes to give and take, and I think that has just started to exhaust me, and caused a little backlash.
frygirl Posted June 12, 2007 Posted June 12, 2007 I’m sure you probably haven’t realized how resentful you’re getting. You often don’t see it until one day you just loose it over something that other people think is no big deal. I am extremely self sufficient. I’m like “Super Independent Girl.” I can do everything for myself … you … even that. My sister on the other hand is the most needy helpless person I have ever met. After countless years of her constant needy requests and always expecting everyone to drop what they are doing whenever she wants their attention, I can hardly have a conversation with her with out just wanting to scream. I have loads of resentment towards her. I also resent my parents and everyone else that enables and encourages it. In the last few years I have begun letting it go though. There is nothing I can do to change her and I know that. All I can do is not enable her and go about living my life. Life is too short to be that frustrated and resentful. In your situation you obviously love your girlfriend and haven’t felt it was enough of a problem to break up with her, but at some point you will need to talk to her about it. It’s not healthy to continue on a relationship with those kind of feelings. Maybe if she understands how you feel she’ll make an effort to not impose upon you as much. But I do suggest you wait until after her surgery and recovery.
Walk Posted June 12, 2007 Posted June 12, 2007 Thanks for the understanding. I think you are dead on. If she were more like me (with regards to needs) I'd probably be fighting to get up there to support her as quickly as possible. I think part of you likes feeling "needed", but you haven't developed firm lines yet. (ergo the trip to NY. You should've told the guy to F'off. Especially because he couldn't ask you without trying to trick you first.) I'm a lot like you too, and I end up feeling people are always getting 80% more from me then I get in return. But honestly man... you've gotta learn where your boundaries are... you've gotten to the point where something legitimate seems irrational. Any person I'm dating would never even have to ask me to go with them to the hospital... even if it meant I had to do some fast talking with the boss, and juggle some bills around for a couple months, I'd be there even for the "routine" boring crap.
che_jesse Posted June 13, 2007 Posted June 13, 2007 Go to the hospital, you are such a giant ******* if you don't thats its almost reason enough to leave you. Just go and don't bitch about who gets what emotionally. Edit: reading your posts over again I have to wonder if you got enough hugs as a kid. How do you grow up not knowing that people help each other and that a mark of friendship is to be there for other people no matter how stupid you think their requests are.
IfWishesWereHorses Posted June 13, 2007 Posted June 13, 2007 I have some guy friends and I've always been the one that they come to with R problems. I am so amazed at how often this comes up. They are happy dating and being affectionate until something is asked of them. They do what is asked of them then they would complain. Her AC went out at 8 pm and can you believe she called me to fix it!!! I was tired, going out with the boys. Ahem... but you didn't complain on Friday night when the kids got asked to spend the night out and you got a call at 8 pm to come over. I don't know the answer, it just has always made me feel like I hope someone never does anything for me that they are not personally inclined to, because my guess is that if the GF knew what they were thinking they wouldn't have received either call. Don't do anything that will cause you to resent her, that's unfair to her. Stick to your decisions and do only what you want, if that's not enough for her then she can make her own decisions from there.
electric_sheep Posted June 13, 2007 Posted June 13, 2007 How do you grow up not knowing that people help each other and that a mark of friendship is to be there for other people no matter how stupid you think their requests are. That's not necessarily a mark of friendship, it could be the mark of an unhealthy relationship. And often you have people pulling on you in different directions. I've had to cancel plans with my friends before numerous times because of her emotional needs. She would suspiciously become sick or upset the one night of the week I was going out with my friends. At some point you just have to say enough is enough. In my book a mark of friendship is when two people have respect for each other, and treat each other fairly and responsibly. A friend doesn't constantly make requests of you... unless it's absolutely necessary. They don't "test" your friendship either, by trying to see how much you will sacrifice for them. A true friend is just as concerned with you as they are with themselves. They recognize that you have your own goals too. They are respectful of your time, realizing that it is limited and that others may be vying for it too. A true friend doesn't let their insecurity get the best of them, and lean on you too often and too much. They understand this takes a toll on you, and because your well being is just as important to them as their own, they realize you can only take so much, and hence only ask for support when they really need it. That's not to say they don't open up and confide, because that is something friends definitely do... but they don't dump either (except rarely, of course, or if invited to dump). Simply put... a friend is someone who is willing to give (and does, if they can) as much as receive. I'd be wary of anyone who seems to be doing nothing but taking. They are out there. Anyway, I'm going to put past resentments behind and go. If I were to ignore the past, there is no doubt it is the right thing to do. Then I'm going to set up clear boundaries and not allow myself to be dumped on and manipulated anymore. It's just as much my fault as her's that I've reached this boiling point, because I've allowed it.
StartingOver07 Posted June 13, 2007 Posted June 13, 2007 sheep, are you the op? Anyway, it seems to me that there are two separate issues here. First is whether it is reasonable for a gf to expect her bf to be at the hospital when she is having surgery. I'd say the answer is yes, even if it is routine surgery. (Never mind that what most often goes wrong is something with the anesthesia, so the routineness of the surgery has no bearing.) Second and more important is whether you have a healthy r/s with your gf or if her neediness is indeed extreme and indicative of selfishness. This is something for you to sort out -- perhaps during the long drive to or from the hospital.
mymatchmaker Posted June 13, 2007 Posted June 13, 2007 Hi Apple Blossom, In my personal opinion, I think that you should be there even though it means that you won't get paid for that half day. Different people have different value/expectation on certain things. Things that matter to your friend may not be as important to you, and things that matter to you may not be as important to your friend. But doing things that matter the most to your friend is what friendship is all about. Take care. Mymatchmaker
stace79 Posted June 13, 2007 Posted June 13, 2007 Agreed....maybe you should just start looking for some not-so-much-moocher friends! I don't mind giving someone a ride to the airport every few months or so, but if it's a regular thing because they can't or won't find their own means of transportation, then start asking for gas money or say you're too busy. I guess I have pretty respectful friends who won't ask more than they'd give for me, and won't ask to the point of exhaustion. I can see your point a little better now, however I still think any time someone real close to you is in the hospital you should be there... Ahh, but it's not that first ride to the airport that is such an inconvience. It's the ride to the grocery store next week, and the ride to the doctors office a couple of days after that. If you've ever had friends without cars you'd know what I mean. Of course, a true friend (in my opinion) would stop expecting you to drive them all over the place. Another annoying thing about a lot of "needy" people... why is it they usually don't take the subtle hint as a "no"? I think they get it, but they just want their way.
Art_Critic Posted June 13, 2007 Posted June 13, 2007 There is no rational or logical reason for me to be there, Oh yes there is... she is your GF.. Choose to not go and you will hurt her feelings and rightfully so.. If you care about someone and they need you there then you go.. no questions asked.. If you hesitate then you are being/acting selfish and really are not being a good friend to your GF..
directx Posted June 13, 2007 Posted June 13, 2007 Geez, take the day off from work. Its scary going under the knife. Its only one day and you can only look good being there. Then you might want to do this girl a favor and leave her so she can find somone that cares enough about her to make the sacrafice of one day's work.
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