kimba Posted June 7, 2007 Posted June 7, 2007 In the last 10 months I've had my father die, lost my friends and my mother was diagnosed with cancer. This is how I lost my friends, starting with Mark in december: 1. Have been best friends with this guy for 4 years.(i'm female) He's gay. We got together once at the beginning if our friendship but nothing after that. 2. had a really intense, close friendship, did everything together. 3. he started going out with a guy at one stage 2 years ago for a few months- we had a bit of a bust up then , but stayed friends. i realised then how attached i was. 4. has a female gay friend who he adores, and he often tried create situations to make me jealous, treated me very differently when she was around. 5. Throughout our friendship he'd call me every day, he loved me very much as a friend. 6. him and some other of my friends arranged for us to go on holiday together just before christmas. I was looking forward to it alot because this was the first christmas without my dad and i was really wanting the distraction and the sense that my life would go on. 7. One of my friends (Jill)cancelled it because she was worried about getting all the christmas shopping and crap done before christmas and this trip was to end about 4 days before "the big day" and she was one of the main drivers and so the whole thing was cancelled. I had a big argument with her because the trip was organised 3 months earlier and then she goes and cancels it 5 days before. So I had a falling out with her. 8. I tried to organise Mark and the others another lift and he didn't want to and so i got really pissed off and hung up on him. I wish I didn't but thats how i felt at the time. 9. A week later he rings and cancels our other holiday on an island for new years because he is angry at me for being angry at him. 10. So then i have no friends 11. In that same conversation he indicates that he might be ending the friendship 12 Around this time me and Jill make up. 13 two weeks later (january 4th) Mark rings and says "I don't think we should see each other anymore. I still like you though and I'm not angry". 14. i was stunned. In the 5 minute converstion we had he said that we were too co-dependent and he relies to much on me and i rely too much on him and that our friendship was obsessive. I was lost for words. 15 I phoned him back 20 minutes later and there was no answer and i left about 4 messages over the next day. 16. he wouldn't return any calls. Caroline who's day job is a social worker told me to write a letter to him just so i have the chance to have my say. So i wrote a letter telling him how i'll miss his friendship and that i wish he'd given me more of an explanation. I wasn't angry in the letter. (the above stuff you just read was cut and pasted from an earlier post i did in feb when it first happened) In my group of friends there was mainly me and mark, Jill, caroline, bryan alecia and shantille. There were other people that we'd invite to stuff but it was mainly us. Jill hardly ever spoke to mark before and now they are in contact. her and mark and caroline and bryan go rockclimbing, see bands - do all this stuff - things i would be normally invited to but now , because of mark, i am totally cut out. I introduced him in the first place 4 years ago to Jill, caroline and Bryan and now i feel like he is using them against me. Bryan became great mates with Mark when he broke up with caroline- caroline and bryan have gradually became friends again and because of her loyalty to Bryan she has shunned me. She is one of this girls who don't realy value female friends (she had none apart from me) - he mum always taught her that men are more important. Really- i am not kidding. Even knowing this - I still feel really betrayed by her. As for JILL- we've been best friends for 18 years- went to uni together- travelled overseas- she tells me things that she has never divulged to anyone. And what she is doing to me now is just awful. So suddenly mark starts inviting her to things a couple of months ago (previously they were just acquaintances really- not in phone contact). So Jill gets invited and I don't and ofcourse she tells me about all their adventures and crap. She KNOWS how close me and mark were- and she doesn't even GET how hurtful this is and how betrayed i feel by her. (she's never ever had a significant friendship or relationship with a guy and doesn't realise how it makes me feel). i think she was always a bit jealous of me and mark and now i almost feel like she;s trying to get back at me or something. Alecia and Shantille are a couple. Alecia has known mark longer than i have. She's the only friend of mine that is not rubbing it all in my face. She is though in contact with mark and is still keeping her distance a bit in that we wouldn't do anything socially now because of her loyalty to mark. So there you go. Its all ****. So anyone- how do i go about totally rebuilding my life and making new friends? This has been catastrophic to me because i usually keep my friends for years. I've never had a friend bust up. I have a couple of other friends who live away from here who are also my best friends of 20 years. They have been great. But they don't live here. I guess I am being depressed. Its a long weekend here on saturday and I've worked hard all week. (special school teacher relief) Was looking in the paper at lunch at the bands on the weekend and could pretty much pick exactly what they'd all be seeing. I still can't believe all this is happening.
dropdeadlegs Posted June 7, 2007 Posted June 7, 2007 Make Mark a straight man, and you his wife, and the breakup now refers to a divorce, and voila! You have the end of my first marriage.... He kept all the friends, I made new ones. One friend at a time. I hit the jackpot when one friend was on a softball team and I am still friends with many from that team 14 years later. I haven't seen the introducing friend in years - he moved to Idaho (although I think he might be back.) Even if Mark needed some distancing of the codependent relationship, I don't really see why you couldn't be involved in large group outings now, months later. Does ending the "closeness" have to be "cutting off" completely? I can see needing some space on a permanent basis, but complete disengagement? Seems like there has to be something major missing although I specifically remember your plight from months ago. I don't think Mark has been completely honest about his reasons. Have you tried contacting Mark and talking about this complete break later, after it all happened? Time either festers or heals wounds. The whole business sounds kind of childish and grownups should be able to make some compromise. Friends have highs and lows, but unless the lows are becoming too ridiculous to endure real friends can work things out. I hope you all can!
dropdeadlegs Posted June 7, 2007 Posted June 7, 2007 Hey, I'm sorry about your Dad and I hope your Mom recovers.
Author kimba Posted June 7, 2007 Author Posted June 7, 2007 Make Mark a straight man, and you his wife, and the breakup now refers to a divorce, and voila! You have the end of my first marriage....! I know, It is exactly like that. it is ridiculous. Even if Mark needed some distancing of the codependent relationship, I don't really see why you couldn't be involved in large group outings now, months later. Does ending the "closeness" have to be "cutting off" completely? I can see needing some space on a permanent basis, but complete disengagement? Seems like there has to be something major missing although I specifically remember your plight from months ago. I don't think Mark has been completely honest about his reasons. Have you tried contacting Mark and talking about this complete break later, after it all happened? Time either festers or heals wounds.! About 6 weeks ago, Jill asked Mark if she could invite me along to something. He said no, because of everything that happened. Like she has to have HIS permission. That really hurt me. She didn't tell me this until about 2 weeks ago (because i've been away from town looking after mum). Before she told me this I rang mark and left a message for him to call me back. I rang on about 3 separate occasions over a couple of weeks. He eventually rang me back and left a message saying he didn't want me to call him. I wrote him a letter about a week ago telling him exactly how ****ed my last year has been and how he has involved my friends. I still do not understand why it was impossible for us to be acquaintances. And this has happened at a time of my life when I NEED MY FRIENDS. Honestly it couldn't be anymore horrific. The whole business sounds kind of childish and grownups should be able to make some compromise. Friends have highs and lows, but unless the lows are becoming too ridiculous to endure real friends can work things out/quote] I know, it does sound childish the whole thing is childish. Do i have a right to feel betrayed by Jill. the whole thing has left such a bad taste in my mouth that i don't even want to talk to her - for fear that she'll say she's going out with them omn the weekend. My immunity is pretty low for this kind of crap since i've had so much personal tragedy. I just feel like curling up in a ball and hiding.
Author kimba Posted June 7, 2007 Author Posted June 7, 2007 Seems like there has to be something major missing although I specifically remember your plight from months ago. I don't think Mark has been completely honest about his reasons. I know- its like there is a big chunk missing because his decision was so extreme. Other people were shocked too. I guess I'm struggling with this feeling that I failed. And the feeling that I have lost friends and I"M IN MY 30's. I just feel ashamed that this has happened to me.
dropdeadlegs Posted June 7, 2007 Posted June 7, 2007 kimba, I'm sorry that you are still dealing with this at a time when you do need friends more than ever. Unfortunately some cliquish groups have the ability to dismiss a member without valid, sound reasoning. As for Mark, as painful as it may be, I would respect his wishes and not contact him further. You have attempted to salvage the many years of friendship, and for whatever reason he is not interested. His loss. As for Jill, in a perfect world she would be making attempts to share in your life as much as in the circle of friends. It is hard to do at times in "divorce" situations. It's hard to be unbiased. It also sounds like this circle of friends leads an active, fun lifestyle. Also, sometimes people don't know how to comfort others in times of loss and stress. It makes them uncomfortable to see you sad and hurting. that's no excuse for exclusional behavior, but it does happen. Are you up to having fun? Does your Mum's condition restrict your time and your ability to have fun? I think it would have an impact on me that might not make me much fun to be around is why I ask. Keep your chin up as best as you can. You have a lot on your plate and I wish you had a better support system. There may come a time when these "friends" feel pretty rotten about abandoning you and you will need to decide how to handle that while retaining your own sense of dignity. Again, best wishes for a full recovery for your Mum, and I hope you are holding up. Take care of yourself, too!
curiousnycgirl Posted June 7, 2007 Posted June 7, 2007 WOW DDL said everything I was thinking! My heart goes out to you - what a horrible time you are having. Further to what DDL said about taking care of yourself, what are your interests? Do you enjoy the gymn? Swimming? Museums? You can do any of these on your own and meet new people. I've even found new girl friends while at singles events and while getting a manicure. Just think about yourself a bit now too, while taking care of your mother of course, and do things purely for YOU - the firends will follow.
curiousnycgirl Posted June 7, 2007 Posted June 7, 2007 Oops I forgot to mention - I would not aggressively pursue the group - they know what you have been through and are going through and have continued to not be there for you. If they call, and want to do something you are interested in, fine - go for it. But I see no reason for you to initiate anything with them - I think they've shown their true colors.
dropdeadlegs Posted June 7, 2007 Posted June 7, 2007 About Jill asking Mark's permission to invite you along - I do understand her doing that. Really, I am constantly comparing this to a divorce situation in my mind. In my second divorce, one couple remained very friendly with me as they were my friends years before the husband entered my life. My H had very little to do with this couple during the marriage other than cordial greetings when we were all out and about. When I latched on to them pretty fiercely, he suddenly began showing lots of interest in them. I also felt a bit hurt and betrayed, but I tried to understand their neutrality. They didn't want to be in the middle of things/drama. More than once they defended me and stood up to him in certain situations. Once they had to turn the tables and I got that end of the stick. Of course I would have preferred that they dump him completely, but I never insisted and we are still friends and the H is not in the picture at all. Try to be understanding. I know Jill was your friend, but it's pretty common for a petty person to try to divide and conquer, making themselves feel like some kind of "winner." I think Mark is doing just that, being very petty. At this point no matter how long our past history, I think he is showing his true colors. Think back and I bet you will see that he has done this to someone else in the past, it just didn't affect you then. Some new friends are in order, but don't count Jill out just yet or you may cut off your nose to spite your face.
Author kimba Posted June 25, 2007 Author Posted June 25, 2007 Mum died on the 8th of June. Very sudden. The cancer was very aggressive - her heart gave out after a combination of complications involving a blood transfusion and fluid on the lungs and they couldn't stabilise her blood pressure. Mum and my sister live 500kms away - so i was on my way driving and i got to the emergency ward an hour after she died. The most horrific experience of my life. i still can't believe it.
dropdeadlegs Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 Oh kimba, I'm so sorry for your loss. You're much too young to lose both parents. I hope your friends have resurfaced. If not, you have friends here on LS.
Star Gazer Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 Kimba, I'm so sorry for your loss. ((((HUG)))) I echo all of DDL's comments. I'm going to think this over and hopefully come back and provide you with some more help. ((((HUG)))) Hang in there, chickie.
doiask42much Posted June 27, 2007 Posted June 27, 2007 Oh, Kimba. I'm not much good with hugs, especially online ones, but your last post made my heart drop. I feel so sorry and sad for you and wish I could help in some way. Where in Australia do you live? My stepcousin and his wife and their bunch of friends live just outside Sydney and are cool peeps. They're in their late 20s and seem to do lots of active things. I'd be happy to introduce you to them if I can locate their contact info. And it goes without saying that we're all here to support you and chat about whatever you want to talk about.
Author kimba Posted June 27, 2007 Author Posted June 27, 2007 Oh kimba, I'm so sorry for your loss. You're much too young to lose both parents. I hope your friends have resurfaced. If not, you have friends here on LS. Thankyou very much, I think any age is too young to lose your parents. I am glad that i wasn't a child or teenager when it happened though. I don't know how i got through the funeral. I organised a powerpoint presentation slide show thingy on the computer which went up on the screen at the funeral. I don't even know how I did that. When the minister suggested to me I just went "oh my god (blasphemed!) You've got to be kidding" It was like a double funeral even though dad had his own. They were married 40 years. People said that the funeral was like a big lovestory. Its sort of hit me because i cried for the first two weeks but I still don't really believe it.(on friday it will be 3 weeks since she died). Now I've come back home to brisbane. I know that with dad it really gets bad a few months after the fact. I think that i could pretty much get through anything after this. I sort of started thinking well what else can happen? Maybe get bitten by a redback and kark it?? No I reckon I'm well deserved to receive something good from the world.
Author kimba Posted June 27, 2007 Author Posted June 27, 2007 Kimba, I'm so sorry for your loss. ((((HUG)))) I echo all of DDL's comments. I'm going to think this over and hopefully come back and provide you with some more help. ((((HUG)))) Hang in there, chickie. thanyou heaps for thinking of me. I does mean a lot that there are people out there like you:)
Author kimba Posted June 27, 2007 Author Posted June 27, 2007 Oh, Kimba. I'm not much good with hugs, especially online ones, but your last post made my heart drop. I feel so sorry and sad for you and wish I could help in some way. Where in Australia do you live? My stepcousin and his wife and their bunch of friends live just outside Sydney and are cool peeps. They're in their late 20s and seem to do lots of active things. I'd be happy to introduce you to them if I can locate their contact info. And it goes without saying that we're all here to support you and chat about whatever you want to talk about. That is by far one of the sweetest gestures i have had in a long time. I live in brisbane which is a city also but it is 12 hours drive from Sydney. Thankyou anyway. my karma is changing. Last week Glenys- mutual friend of mine and marks rang and invited me to a picnic. I asked jill if she was going and she said no, and "failed " to tell me that mark was going. I went along and saw him when i parked my car. he was looking for the picnic. he waves at me and comes over. he said oh i was waving at you from the bus but you didn't see me. I saw you walking along the street. he seemed to know i was going to be there. he laughed and joked with me. It was a little awkward but at the same time like nothing had happened. (last contact i had from him was him a month ago telling me not to call him) He had sent me a sympathy card which was unexpected. We chatted easily at the picnic and he came with me in my car after the picnic back to our friends house where we drank etc. I've been having renovations and i told him i was having a deckwarming party at some stage and would he come. he said yes. he went home later and said "hope you enjoy the rest of your holidays" (i'm a special ed teacher and its school hols) I was wondering whether this sudden friendliness is due to a guilty conscience or due to pity over my mothers death or whether he might want to put the friendship back together again???????????????????? I've been in contact with a couple of old friends (20 years) one that lives 45 mins away (Amy) that i lost contact with for 2 years (moved ). I saw her today- she's broken up with long term boyfriend of 16 years back in NOvember so she;s been a great person to compare misery notes with) She;'s really funny. and another old friend of the same era who used to live here (julie) who now lives in sydney who has been an amazing phone and email support. These girls used to be ( and still are really ) my best friends and i don't know what i would have done without them lately. I'm still friends with Jill (although it is a bit strained). Alecia (marks best friend) has been great and i see her and talk to her a bit. Caroline and bryan did nothing in the way of a card and a phone call regarding mum. That is totally disgusting. I would have thought they would have done that rather than mark. I did absolutely nothing to them- no fall out.
McFadden Posted July 19, 2007 Posted July 19, 2007 I just looked over this thread because Kimba mentioned its similar to what's going on with me. I'm sorry to hear about all of it, I don't understand why your ex guy friend decided to break things off. It doesn't seem like you did anything wrong, and it sounds like he was petty from the beginning. There's no reason for someone trying to make thier friend jealous. It also sounds like you should drop your friend(s) who seem to have sided with him, there's no reason for them to be coy and petty. This is the same conclusion I reached in my situation.
Author kimba Posted July 20, 2007 Author Posted July 20, 2007 I think it is inevitable that i will drop them. I wrote a letter to caroline this week explaining how i felt. She didn't even cintact me about mum , and i have always been there for her, and when her mum was mentally ill etc. The letter was quite scathing , but now days later i still feel it was justified. She took sides and did it really badly. As for Jill, I just feel completely betrayed. I don't want any contact with er, but I am not going to say it, just do it. This is an 18 yr friendship. Last weekend was his bday and they were all invited, and ofcourse not me. Its just horrible, losing so much.
McFadden Posted July 20, 2007 Posted July 20, 2007 I think it is inevitable that i will drop them. I wrote a letter to caroline this week explaining how i felt. She didn't even cintact me about mum , and i have always been there for her, and when her mum was mentally ill etc. The letter was quite scathing , but now days later i still feel it was justified. She took sides and did it really badly. As for Jill, I just feel completely betrayed. I don't want any contact with er, but I am not going to say it, just do it. This is an 18 yr friendship. Last weekend was his bday and they were all invited, and ofcourse not me. Its just horrible, losing so much. It is, if my friendships are only of several months to a few years and I feel this upset, I can't imagine how it is after that many years. I don't know why they would do that, but if you've been friends for so long it seems like they would come to their senses. But you can always make new friends. Some of the people I've met in the last 6 months after having a fall out with my old group of friends have been the greatest so far. Of course it will take time to see how it plays out.
Author kimba Posted July 20, 2007 Author Posted July 20, 2007 It is, if my friendships are only of several months to a few years and I feel this upset, I can't imagine how it is after that many years. I don't know why they would do that, but if you've been friends for so long it seems like they would come to their senses. But you can always make new friends. Some of the people I've met in the last 6 months after having a fall out with my old group of friends have been the greatest so far. Of course it will take time to see how it plays out. Yes it is devastating. i've come to the conclusion that the reason why jill is doing it i think is because: 1. she likes a bit of politics and drama (is a teacher and always gets involved in politics and drama) 2. she has a bit of school girl bully in her which i have noticed over the last 18 years 3. like i said b4, was always a bit jealous of me and marks bond - our sleepovers, weekends away, mutual interests and activities. She has never had close male friend or bf (?!! but thats another thread) > so i think theres a bit of payback there. 4. Like your friend, she is simply thinking about herself and her own social life. I've come to the conclusion as to why caroline did it is because: 1. she is Bryans ex , and when she and bryan broke up last year after 7 yr relship, Bryan became much closer/ reliant on mark. Gradually, Caroline and Bryan became friends again. At that point me and mark "broke up" and so, Caroline was faced with a choice. 2. her mother has always taught her that having men in your life is more important than women (by the way she lived her own life) (and so caroline never really invested in female friends- I would say apart from her sister, i was her only female friend apart from the occasional loose acquaintance over the past 8 years). 3. So in effect, because Bryan was obviously going to side with mark, that left her to decide really between me and Bryan. (because Mark wanted NC with me) 4. so she chose Bryan / Mark over me, because it was "easier" for her i guess, and Bryan always came first. so basically they can all get stuffed. It sounds like your "minuses" definately outweigh the pluses. I've been doing a few of those lists in my head with regard to jill.
McFadden Posted July 20, 2007 Posted July 20, 2007 With Caroline it sounds the exact same as my situation- she saw fit to choose her relationship over the friendship and isn't even being sensitive about it. I guess there's nothing to be done about it when people make that choice. With Jill, it just sounds like she isn't a good person to be friends with in the first place (assuming you don't like drama.) I enjoy some controversy among friends, but at the point that they are doing something really destructive it is just beyond that.
Author kimba Posted July 20, 2007 Author Posted July 20, 2007 I don't mind a bit of controversy, but really , this is beyond that, its just plain hurtful. Horrible. See its not just the loss of friendship with mark - its that Jill and caroline in effect acted like they agreed with it simply by the fact that they responded to his social invitations (because he was trying to replace me). And in responding to these social invitations, it meant that I was excluded from my own social group. It was like they became party to it all. I introduced him to all of those people. So if i said to them hey want to do something sat night it'd be like "er...well...um ...its marks party...."
Author kimba Posted July 22, 2007 Author Posted July 22, 2007 sometimes i think about all that has happened to me and i startle myself because i think "How on earth is it that i am still breathing?
Lynz Posted August 8, 2007 Posted August 8, 2007 And in responding to these social invitations, it meant that I was excluded from my own social group. It was like they became party to it all. I introduced him to all of those people. That sounds very similar to the situation I am in at the moment. I have been friends with this girl for just over 10 years now. Recently we fell out over something stupid and have not really spoken since. But because of that it feels like I have been excluded from my group because everybody else seems to have taken her side, and now I don't get invited to any parties or anything anymore. And it was me that introduced her to all my friends years ago, before I introduced her she had absolutely no friends at all besides me. It is just so upsetting. I am trying my best to patch things up at the moment so I just hope this is something that I can fix.
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