AtAGlance Posted June 1, 2007 Posted June 1, 2007 My partner and I have been together for over 20 years. During that time we have been very much a 24/7 couple - we even worked together for a while. We both travelled for our work so we regularly had times (perhaps once every two weeks) where we were apart either at home or abroad. I would say that generally we were happy despite the usual rough and tumble of life. Recently two things have happened that have changed thigs a bit (1) we don't travel so much and seem to spend more time in the house together (although we no longer work together) (2) We met some new people (mostly couples in the 40+ age range) and they ALL go out socially with their own friends from time to time. Some even go on holiday without their partners. They all seemed so happy and so well rounded that I suggested that maybe I could go out "with the girls" now and then as it would give me a bit of space. (I have only done this 4 times since I met him 20 years ago) He went APE. The row still rears its head 2 years on. During the row I made the mistake of saying that it is only what normal people do. He says that I have no idea what is "normal". "Normal" people don't want to socialise in single sex groups. "Normal" people don't want to socialise or shop or visit their family without their partners. He truly believes that people who go out socially without their parners are either weirdos or on the pull. When I write this out it almost seems laughable - but it has almost destroyed our relationship. He brings it up EVERY argument ".......you and your normal people....." or "......you the great authority on "Normal"........." Am I really so wrong to want a few girl friends? Am I really so strange in wanting the occassional evening with a girlfriend? (and by occassional I mean once or twice a year). Am I really so far away from being "Normal"? AtA
2sunny Posted June 1, 2007 Posted June 1, 2007 it is perfectly normal in my world. you can't be everything to anyone. it is healthy to have a few separate interests from your spouse... as long as you stay connected with the common threads that brought you together. he sounds excessively controlling to me... i would feel suffocated. but i know my H never worried about me cheating - maybe that is what he is worried about... hmmmmm
Author AtAGlance Posted June 1, 2007 Author Posted June 1, 2007 but i know my H never worried about me cheating - maybe that is what he is worried about... hmmmmm I guess that is an issue - we were both married to other people when we met so he knows we are both capable of deception and cheating. But I don't think that's all of it - I think you're right - there is a control issue too. For example if he's free then we have to go shopping together, if he has something to do then I have to go on my own because he's "too busy to shop." BUT if he's free and I go on my own he makes a fuss about me "sneaking off". AtA
quankanne Posted June 1, 2007 Posted June 1, 2007 Am I really so wrong to want a few girl friends? Am I really so strange in wanting the occassional evening with a girlfriend? (and by occassional I mean once or twice a year). Am I really so far away from being "Normal"? no, no and no – it's healthy to have friends and interests that aren't necessarily your spouse's (that is, those that aren't cultivating an environment for an affair). However, it sounds like your husband feels threatened by the idea because he things something is going to change, or maybe even that if you have your own girlfriends or activities you're going to leave him, the way so and so left her husband after she started hanging out with X or took up X as a hobby ... the best thing to do is to get to the heart of the matter and ask him in a non-threatening way what he feels it means when spouses have friendships or hobbies of their own, then work from there. should you get him to understand that it's good for a marriage when partners have some of their own interests and he agrees, don't hesitate to make him feel like he's included. It's the one thing I've made sure of when I married, because a couple of dear friends of mine are men – I let DH know what's going on in my friends' lives as I learn it, so that he feels a part of the relationship even if he doesn't see them as often as I do (guy friends or girl friends). Same thing with the stuff I like to do – I keep him updated and make him feel a part of it by talking about people from my water aerobics class, about my coworkers, etc. I think that helps to build up a bit of trust so that a spouse doesn't necessarily feel left out or think you're "up to something no good."
Mustang Sally Posted June 1, 2007 Posted June 1, 2007 But I don't think that's all of it - I think you're right - there is a control issue too. For example if he's free then we have to go shopping together, if he has something to do then I have to go on my own because he's "too busy to shop." BUT if he's free and I go on my own he makes a fuss about me "sneaking off".This definitely sounds like extreme (controlling) behaviour, on your SO's part, to me. Have you talked to him about your feelings on this (meaning the fear/controlling-part)? I don't see any problem in having an occasional "night out" with the gals or my H having a night (or golf game, or whatever) with the guys. In fact we each do this a few times a year. As long as it is an activity that both agree on (i.e. no lap-dancing strippers if that bothers one of you). We've been married 13 yrs, FWIW. Now vacationing separate, well that would be a bit much for me. But we do take business trips apart.
quankanne Posted June 1, 2007 Posted June 1, 2007 Now vacationing separate, well that would be a bit much for me. really? That's one of the things we've agreed upon, after him getting dragged home one too many times! :laugh: but, I think it's because that I don't make him feel left out when I talk about going to visit/having visited friends – he gets to keep up with them, too, in his own way, but isn't stuck having to make the long drive to go see them. And I think that's prolly what makes our marriage work as well as it does – neither of us feel like we've *got* to do what the other wants to do
Author AtAGlance Posted June 1, 2007 Author Posted June 1, 2007 Wow thanks for all the speedy replies. One common thread - I need to talk to him. This is something I'm REALLY bad at. I've probably got into this situation by agreeing with him all along the line because I'd rather put myself out than make a fuss. Now he thinks I agree with all his opinions. This is going to take some working on - I have two ways of operating (1) I slip into child mode and ask his permission which automatically destroys the sharing equal relationship that partners are supposed to have or (2) I just blurt out what I want and it sounds like I've been scheming for days and I'm going to do it whatever. I need to learn how to communicate on an equal footing. Anyone know any good books?
2sunny Posted June 1, 2007 Posted June 1, 2007 just state what your wants or needs are in a very direct (no baby talk) and veeeeery caaaaalm voice. do not try to present it as an argumentative conversation. what you are going to say should not leave the window open for an argument... just state clearly what will make you happy... ask him to be supportive. most "normal" men want their wives to be happy - and try to do anything to acheive it... okay that's a generalization - i know.... oh well....
Mustang Sally Posted June 1, 2007 Posted June 1, 2007 Now vacationing separate, well that would be a bit much for me. really? That's one of the things we've agreed upon, after him getting dragged home one too many times! :laugh: but, I think it's because that I don't make him feel left out when I talk about going to visit/having visited friends – he gets to keep up with them, too, in his own way, but isn't stuck having to make the long drive to go see them. And I think that's prolly what makes our marriage work as well as it does – neither of us feel like we've *got* to do what the other wants to do I think that's great! And maybe in the future, this will work for my H and I, too. But for now, with school-aged children, our vactions are always family events. And we do things llike boating, camping, hiking, and skiing. So we all go together. I (and he) like it that way. I do get some "me" time when I travel for business. I get to take in museums, etc in the cities I'm in.
quankanne Posted June 1, 2007 Posted June 1, 2007 marriage builders website has been a popular suggestion by Love Shackers, not sure of the marriage enrichment books though ... Liguori Publications has a wonderful book called 9 ways to nurture your marriage, which touches on a lot of the same issues that a Marriage Encounter retreat does – however, it's a faith-based publication, not sure if you'd be interested in that. Other suggestion is to look into a marriage enrichment course offered by a church or even the local counselling center – I know the city next to the one I live in has started a campaign for couples wanting to build stronger marriages, not sure who offers it but it looks interesting ... after him getting dragged home one too many times! meant to say "dragged FROM home" !!!
quankanne Posted June 1, 2007 Posted June 1, 2007 But for now, with school-aged children, our vactions are always family events. And we do things llike boating, camping, hiking, and skiing. So we all go together. we don't have kids, so we've not had to figure out how to be together as a family past the couple thing. However, it sounds like you're doing a great job at giving your kids an adventure-filled and fun life while also keeping it fun for you and your husband ... will you adopt me? I'm potty trained and can entertain myself when the need arises ...
Curmudgeon Posted June 2, 2007 Posted June 2, 2007 Am I really so wrong to want a few girl friends? Am I really so strange in wanting the occassional evening with a girlfriend? (and by occassional I mean once or twice a year). Am I really so far away from being "Normal"? ...no, no and no – it's healthy to have friends and interests that aren't necessarily your spouse's. ...to go visit her girlfriends in other states. They've shared experiences and lifestyles in the past that I can't even begin to connect with so while I don't wish to spend a lot of time with them, I know it's important to my wife to do so occasionally. What's the harm? I know them all and they like me because I make my wife happy. I like them too but can take just so much of being around them.
RecordProducer Posted June 2, 2007 Posted June 2, 2007 I can see myself being jealous if my husband would like to go out in the evening to night clubs with his buddies, but I don't have a problem with him taking a whole day trip with a friend (he flies small airplanes as a hobby). Actually I am "jealous" of his twin brother, because they are too close and his brother hates me and is trying to squeeze me out of his life. When hubby's cell phone rings and I hear a female voice on the other side, I am always relieved , because it pisses me off that his brother calls him 26 times a day. So everything depends on your situation. If your husband is insecure in your relationship for a legitimate (in his mind) reason, the question is not whther it's normal or not to go out with girlfriends. If I asked you if it's normal for a man to have coffee with his brother, you would say YES. But if I told you that my husband's brother used to wake me up every single morning at 7 AM (even on weekends, even after I asked him NOT to) and showed me openly that I was not welcome in his house, then would you still say that it was OK that my husband would leave me alone every morning and go have coffee with his brother who lives next door? How about if I told you that I moved to the US last year and had absolutely no one to have coffee with here? And even after I argued so many times, I was still left alone... Well finally things changed in my favor... But my point was that things are not black or white. If your husband feels like you would be able to flirt or dance with other men or even cheat, then nothing will convince him that it's OK if you go out without him. Of course, he shouldn't make a problem if you want to go shopping or to the theater with a friend. He also might be afraid that you would complain about him to your friends and discover that he is not such a great husband. I would bet on this one.
Author AtAGlance Posted June 4, 2007 Author Posted June 4, 2007 Thanks for all your replies. I have been thinking over the weekend that I really need to sort this out. His parents are thinking of moving house and, as he was away on a business trip, I spent Saturday driving them around looking at apartments. I got home much later than planned and then started to feel guilty in case I hadn't been in the house when he phoned from the airport. Guilty isn't exactly the right word - but I have been "trained" over the years to expect a row if he calls the house and I'm not there - yes I have a cell phone, but if he calls that then I he knows I must be out somewhere and not sitting at home like a good girl. In the end it turned out he didn't even try to get in touch with me. But then I thought - how stupid is this - I am bothering about his parents and feeling bad about it. (Actually they spent the whole afternoon telling me to stop letting him treat me like a doormat, they said I should answer back more). This is a stupid situation and has to stop. There will be many rows to come, but he has to understand I am not his lapdog that runs at his every whistle and call. I have an opinion too, and it is just as valid as his.
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