Even the nice girls?

[champagne]

Does it really matter? Why mess with so many threads and create all this negativity, for nothing? Life's too short to be so "in your face" and "must be right" for ever...single...little...thing.

 

Ok, he started with the negativity. I fail to see how my simple comment of "none of my healthy relationships have involved tactics like that" would cause his reaction of totally disregarding my argument and basically told me I had nothing worthy to add, and that my comment, which WAS related to the question, wasn't worthy. If he had made a comment which COMPLETELY disregarded what you said, when you were being polite and simply answering his question, you wouldn't like it either. I was making a simple comment in response to his post, and then he immediately states that my statement had NOTHING to do with the argument, when I was pretty much stating what other people had already stated. That was rude.

As far as the negativity on the thread, do you feel that Woggle and Alphamale's comments have all been positive and related to the topic?

[Storyrider]

I'm wondering if this discussion is getting too polarized and black and white. I think I understand what K. was originally getting at, although the examples he gave might possibly be misleading. I think not emailing or calling on purpose just to create a chase would be manipulative. But there are much more subtle ways of lovingly allowing your partner to chase and be chased.

 

If I can pose an analogy, it is kind of like kissing. If you are always full on aggressive with your kissing, then your partner never gets the chance to be the kisser, rather than the kissee. And great kissing involves lots of different styles, including, from time to time, coy little kisses that don't allow the tongue in, a "teasing" kind of kiss if you will. But it doesn't last long, and it is not unloving, just a break in the pattern to keep things interesting, and make the kisser a bit hungrier.

 

I don't know exactly how this would translate into a relationship, but I don't think it can be contrived. It would have to be organic. For example, if the wife is on her period and the couple waits for sex until that is over, it can create a natural tension that allows the guy to feel he is chasing, especially if they are a bit more ritualistic about it or make a game out of it.

 

Or, if the man has a meeting or conference he must go to, he can build up anticipation in the woman, not through manipulation, but simply by focusing more on his work, which probably needs his focus anyway.

 

I think couples can also play little games together that help foster a bit of "hunger" for one another, like people watching and asking each other which passers by are attractive, etc.

 

I don't know how great these examples are, but I guess what I'm saying is that some of the chase and be chased can be naturally worked into things without manipulation or cruelty, just with a more playful attitude.

 

I think all this takes subtlety and skill but could contribute to a healthier relationship where both partners crave each other with a bit more hunger. Game playing is negative, but playing together, when both partners understand the rules, that can be fun.

[Storyrider]

Ok, he started with the negativity. I fail to see how my simple comment of "none of my healthy relationships have involved tactics like that" would cause his reaction of totally disregarding my argument and basically told me I had nothing worthy to add, and that my comment, which WAS related to the question, wasn't worthy. If he had made a comment which COMPLETELY disregarded what you said, when you were being polite and simply answering his question, you wouldn't like it either. I was making a simple comment in response to his post, and then he immediately states that my statement had NOTHING to do with the argument, when I was pretty much stating what other people had already stated. That was rude.

As far as the negativity on the thread, do you feel that Woggle and Alphamale's comments have all been positive and related to the topic?

But when you do this, you make the thread about bruised egos and not about the original topic. And this is a pattern.

[champagne]

That is a very great way of expressing it.

[Touche]

Yes, great post Story. It goes back to "wooing" each other. And that's what it really takes to keep a good relationship going.

[Trialbyfire]

Ok, he started with the negativity. I fail to see how my simple comment of "none of my healthy relationships have involved tactics like that" would cause his reaction of totally disregarding my argument and basically told me I had nothing worthy to add, and that my comment, which WAS related to the question, wasn't worthy. If he had made a comment which COMPLETELY disregarded what you said, when you were being polite and simply answering his question, you wouldn't like it either. I was making a simple comment in response to his post, and then he immediately states that my statement had NOTHING to do with the argument, when I was pretty much stating what other people had already stated. That was rude.

As far as the negativity on the thread, do you feel that Woggle and Alphamale's comments have all been positive and related to the topic?

Why this constant need for external validation of rightness? Why not just drop it? I've seen this behaviour pattern from you consistently in dozens and dozens of threads. It's one thing to have a strong opinion about certain things and a whole 'nother thing to constantly interrupt the flow of threads. For your own good, review your behaviour and stop using the threat of Tony to back up every new s/n. If anything I feel bad for Tony. He's got better things to do than to keep cleaning up your messes.

[Trialbyfire]

Love it Storyrider. You hit the nail on the head.

[champagne]

Why this constant need for external validation of rightness? Why not just drop it? I've seen this behaviour pattern from you consistently in dozens and dozens of threads. It's one thing to have a strong opinion about certain things and a whole 'nother thing to constantly interrupt the flow of threads. For your own good, review your behaviour and stop using the threat of Tony to back up every new s/n. If anything I feel bad for Tony. He's got better things to do than to keep cleaning up your messes.

 

Well...Touche started problems in the thread below by pretty much dissing my topic, and Tony called her on it.

In this particular thread, I didn't have a "strong opinion" about it, I was just giving a standard answer, very similar to many other posters, and I do stress many, yet was told immediately that my opinion was not valid by the poster producing the question.

Alphamale and Woggle have stated strong, way-off opinions, yet they are not called out on their behavior. This whole thread has become another field for women-bashing and I seriously wonder why those posters just don't go gay since they hate every aspect of the female gender.

[Touche]

Well...Touche started problems in the thread below by pretty much dissing my topic, and Tony called her on it.

In this particular thread, I didn't have a "strong opinion" about it, I was just giving a standard answer, very similar to many other posters, and I do stress many, yet was told immediately that my opinion was not valid by the poster producing the question.

Alphamale and Woggle have stated strong, way-off opinions, yet they are not called out on their behavior. This whole thread has become another field for women-bashing and I seriously wonder why those posters just don't go gay since they hate every aspect of the female gender.

 

What thread below? I haven't been called out on anything! This is crazy.

 

Anyway, everyone on here is trying to stay on topic except for YOU. Telling these guys that they should "go gay" (as if one can even do such a thing) is insulting. They've been on topic. You haven't. It's that simple.

 

Can we PLEASE get back on topic! Just ignore those who don't stay on topic and they will go away eventually. They always do.

 

This is an interesting topic and it's being ruined, yet again by mindless off -topic nonsense.

 

So, Kryt...have you gotten your answers do you think? Have any of your views changed since you first started this thread?

[Trialbyfire]

Well...Touche started problems in the thread below by pretty much dissing my topic, and Tony called her on it.

In this particular thread, I didn't have a "strong opinion" about it, I was just giving a standard answer, very similar to many other posters, and I do stress many, yet was told immediately that my opinion was not valid by the poster producing the question.

Alphamale and Woggle have stated strong, way-off opinions, yet they are not called out on their behavior. This whole thread has become another field for women-bashing and I seriously wonder why those posters just don't go gay since they hate every aspect of the female gender.

Why does it matter what others do, not saying anyone is in the right or wrong? More importantly, what about you? What's inside you to cause this need for constant external validation? Wouldn't it be better to sometimes be a bigger person and walk away? This is the beauty of LS. Different opinions expressed different ways, can sometimes get through to different people more effectively.

 

Aren't we here to help ourselves and each other?

 

This will be my last post in this thread. I really want you to take some of my thoughts away and seriously think about it. Personally I think it would help you to be self-responsible, perhaps not always because everyone has downtime, but most of the time.

[hardcase]

Nope, I don't hate men. I love men. I've always gotten along better with men than with women in fact. And nope, I've never cheated on my H of 12 years nor the ex.

 

And sorry, but again..if you were honest with yourself you would have seen the signs. But you chose to ignore them.

 

Thats the most assinine statement I have ever heard. Why in the hell would I ignore any signs of cheating? If I had known...I'd have jumped her shi!t immediately and the wedding would have been called off.

 

So I stand by my statements. YOUR fault. Not your fault that someone cheated on you...see the subtle difference there? But your fault for not recognizing the signs of that person's bad character before you married them.

 

Well tell me..what were the signs...and I'll tell you if I recognized them or not.

 

And you need to stop with the insults.

 

And what insults would that be? Calling it like I see it? Saying you are a man hater isn't an insult...its an adjective.

 

And who is insulting who exactly? You are the one rubbing betrayed peoples' nose in shi!t saying its their fault. Get real.

[Storyrider]

Well...Touche started problems in the thread below by pretty much dissing my topic, and Tony called her on it.

In this particular thread, I didn't have a "strong opinion" about it, I was just giving a standard answer, very similar to many other posters, and I do stress many, yet was told immediately that my opinion was not valid by the poster producing the question.

Alphamale and Woggle have stated strong, way-off opinions, yet they are not called out on their behavior. This whole thread has become another field for women-bashing and I seriously wonder why those posters just don't go gay since they hate every aspect of the female gender.

 

This post, like your several previous posts, is about you, not the topic at hand. This thread is about game playing in relationships, not about whether or not you're being treated fairly or about whether anyone is gay.

[champagne]

What thread below? I haven't been called out on anything! This is crazy.

 

Anyway, everyone on here is trying to stay on topic except for YOU. Telling these guys that they should "go gay" (as if one can even do such a thing) is insulting. They've been on topic. You haven't. It's that simple.

 

Can we PLEASE get back on topic! Just ignore those who don't stay on topic and they will go away eventually. They always do.

 

This is an interesting topic and it's being ruined, yet again by mindless off -topic nonsense.

 

So, Kryt...have you gotten your answers do you think? Have any of your views changed since you first started this thread?

 

When I posted about where were men getting the statistics that there is a "trend" last night and you proceded by insulting me by asking if I was a native-English speaker, my choice of TV viewing, which had NOTHING to do with the thread, etc. etc. when you could have just ignored the topic if you didn't like it.

tony commented on it, but I'm sure you're aware of it from your account.

[Touche]

Thats the most assinine statement I have ever heard. Why in the hell would I ignore any signs of cheating? If I had known...I'd have jumped her shi!t immediately and the wedding would have been called off.

 

 

 

Well tell me..what were the signs...and I'll tell you if I recognized them or not.

 

 

 

And what insults would that be? Calling it like I see it? Saying you are a man hater isn't an insult...its an adjective.

 

And who is insulting who exactly? You are the one rubbing betrayed peoples' nose in shi!t saying its their fault. Get real.

 

 

Yes, man-hater and that apple butter comment. Fact, is I DO know what I'm talking about. And fact is there WERE signs that you were obviously blind to.

 

So you're saying that you saw NOTHING, nothing at all that would alert you to the fact that she would cheat on you? You still think she was perfect before the cheating?

 

I'm not rubbing anyone's nose into anything...HELL, I called MYSELF a retard for not heeding the warning signs of my own impending hell of a first marriage . I rub my OWN nose in it. You don't get me do you?

 

Why should I bother telling you about the "signs" when you're not even open to hearing them? You are indeed being a "hardcase."

 

I'll direct my comments to those who are open to hearing them. Besides I don't know my ass from apple-butter remember? So why listen to me?

 

And remember, keep doing what you've been doing and you'll keep getting what you've been getting in life.

[hardcase]

Yes, man-hater and that apple butter comment.

 

LOL...offended by apple butter...LMFAO.

 

So you're saying that you saw NOTHING, nothing at all that would alert you to the fact that she would cheat on you? You still think she was perfect before the cheating?

 

Nobody is perfect. and if that is your argument..that imperfections are the "signs"...then nobody would ever hook up and make it for the long haul.

But there were no signs such as lack of attention from either of us..no being distant...she never went out with friends back then and stayed out til 4 in the morning...the 2 times I am aware of that I learned 7 years into our marriage is she went to spend the night with a friend which she did in fact do.

 

I didn't care she wanted to stay the night with a friend..I trusted her and each time she came back...she acted like nothing was wrong and we pretty much jumped in the sack all night like 2 hyperactive weasels.

 

I'm not rubbing anyone's nose into anything

 

Yes...you are.

 

...HELL, I called MYSELF a retard for not heeding the warning signs of my own impending hell of a first marriage . I rub my OWN nose in it. You don't get me do you?

 

There is a difference in not recognizing the "signs", which you still haven't made clear what they are...and ignoring the "signs"....why in the hell would I IGNORE any signs if I saw them? Thats what you said that I IGNORED them. And that is just plain ridiculous.

 

Why should I bother telling you about the "signs" when you're not even open to hearing them?

 

Because you are talking out of your rear-end and can't tell me what the signs are. That or you are just afraid that none of those signs were ever present in my situation and you don't wanna have to say..."well my apologies then...it doesn't apply to you"

 

I'll direct my comments to those who are open to hearing them. Besides I don't know my ass from apple-butter remember? So why listen to me?

 

good point.

 

And remember, keep doing what you've been doing and you'll keep getting what you've been getting in life.

 

Theres that rubbing the nose in shi!t to the betrayed again. Do keep it up...you are starting to make cheaters look like saints.

[halfarock]

Why do men marry women like this and then complain when these women screw them over later? Because they think with their peckers and not with their brains that's why. So they only have themselves to blame.

A woman can be a nice girl one day and a castrating witch the next.

…I guess what I'm saying is that some of the chase and be chased can be naturally worked into things without manipulation or cruelty, just with a more playful attitude.

 

I think all this takes subtlety and skill but could contribute to a healthier relationship where both partners crave each other with a bit more hunger. Game playing is negative, but playing together, when both partners understand the rules, that can be fun.

 

I don’t really understand this battle that goes on between the sexes. I see couples fighting all the time and I wonder why. Why don’t they just go find someone that they don’t have to fight with. Guys are always saying that they have to control their women and women saying that they have to have control over their men. When I hear guys talk about strategies to get women there is always this element that to me seems like trickery - as if a guy can only get a girl if he tricks her into liking him.

 

Over the years I’ve had lots and lots of girlfriends and not once have I been manipulative or made a conscious effort to gain the upper hand. Always it is like, hey this girl is cool, I wonder if she wants to play. It’s always this big adventure to discover what she is like. It’s the playful interaction that draws me to one woman or another and what, I’m sure, draws them to me. Everything just kind of comes naturally. The ones I keep around, the ones I fall for are always the ones where we achieve this comfortable communication. Like when we’re in some chaotic situation and we just kind of look at each other and just know.

[halfarock]

Unless you're dating Sybill, no one's true personality stays hidden for long. No one's.

Some time back I dated a woman who had a serious mental dysfunction. Her personality would on occasion make abrupt changes and she regularly interrupted our disjointed conversations to consult with her “friend” who I never saw. In spite of her problems, I really liked her, to the point of falling in love. She was very interesting.

[Krytellan]

You all are seriously cracking me up.

 

So, Kryt...have you gotten your answers do you think? Have any of your views changed since you first started this thread?

 

I'm not sure. I think what I have found to be more surprising than anything so far is that not one woman has come out and said that they agree with my proposition, and come one, it's not exactly an incredibly far off proposition. It's because no woman has agreed with it that I still feel like they're not being honest with us. My disbelief has less to do with my own opinion and more to do with basic statistics. There isn't even a hint of a "bell curve" in the responses, which leads me to believe that not all people are responding honestly.

 

Either that, or the sample of women on this site is skewed toward disagreement. With anything, there are always at least some that would agree... it's the law of statistics.

 

So there's really no such thing as a woman in a relationship with a very nice man just sometimes feeling that it's too easy? Never? You can yell at me and call me a woman hater or whatever, but I absolutely refuse to believe that not one female has agreed. As I said, not because of my opinion, but because it just doesn't make mathematical sense.

 

 

As I said before, I really would like to believe you. And I hope that in 10 years when I'm living happily with the wonderful woman I eventually settle down with, and treating her like I do, that you weren't all lying to me.

[champagne]

You have made this into a gender-specific issue and it's really not. Everyone wants attention and love from their partner. It's not an unfair thing to ask. All of us, men and women, have been in unsatisfying relationships where emotional needs weren't met. The key is to find the right person who makes you feel the best you've ever felt, and vice versa. It has nothing to do with gender.

[Krytellan]

You have made this into a gender-specific issue and it's really not. Everyone wants attention and love from their partner. It's not an unfair thing to ask. All of us, men and women, have been in unsatisfying relationships where emotional needs weren't met. The key is to find the right person who makes you feel the best you've ever felt, and vice versa. It has nothing to do with gender.

 

I disagree. Anyone here will agree that at least 90% of men are very low-maintenance in the "emotional needs" category. Women need so much more (generally) emotionally than men. Just look at sex. For most men it is very little about emotion, not so for women.

[IpAncA]

So what are you exactly saying no one is agreeing with? That when things get boring they leave?

[Krytellan]

So what are you exactly saying no one is agreeing with? That when things get boring they leave?

 

Not necessarily leave, but just lose interest when they haven't had to put forth any effort in a while.

[IpAncA]

Not necessarily leave, but just lose interest when they haven't had to put forth any effort in a while.

 

Okay I'll agree that some will lose interest. Not everyone but yeah there will be ones that do.

[Touche]

Some time back I dated a woman who had a serious mental dysfunction. Her personality would on occasion make abrupt changes and she regularly interrupted our disjointed conversations to consult with her “friend” who I never saw. In spite of her problems, I really liked her, to the point of falling in love. She was very interesting.

 

:lmao: Hey, thanks for the laugh!

 

And kryt, you've never been with a man have you? They can be pretty damn demanding if you ask me. Perhaps not in the same ways, but still..pretty damn demanding. Don't fool yourself into thinkng otherwise.

[Trialbyfire]

I disagree. Anyone here will agree that at least 90% of men are very low-maintenance in the "emotional needs" category. Women need so much more (generally) emotionally than men. Just look at sex. For most men it is very little about emotion, not so for women.

Beyond the mechanical component of sex, which I don't have the right equipment to respond to, I'll have to completely disagree that 90% of men are low-maintenance in the "emotional needs" department. Ego, dominance, competitiveness, affection, confirmation, validation, are just a few examples of male requirements.