So it's D-Day

[Tomcat33]

TC

 

You don't know when to stop do you. Your responses to OOD are bordering on cruel and unnecessary. You seem to derive some sort of sick pleasure (sp?) by implying that she's stupid for staying with her H (her M, her choice - no one elses). You aren't getting any points for kicking one of the nicest people here. None of these "Yous" are general. They are all directed at YOU.

 

P.S. I know its trivial to some degree but the word is spelled D-E-N-I-A-L.

 

I suppose it's the same kind of "sick pleasure"she derives from the implications she makes about me. Or you could just ignore my posts...

We're all adults here, if you are going to throw punches expect punches back.

 

But what I do find extemely interesting though is how all you BSs need a team of cheerleaders to back up all your attacks.

[whichwayisup]

We're all adults here, if you are going to throw punches expect punches back

 

Exactly, but you're the one who is starting it all. SC, HN, OOD, me, BB, to name afew...and soon it will be NID too...It seems just about every poster you manage to piss off and cause a chain reaction...Then you complain about it, and once again throw it someone else's way so they can take the heat off of you.

 

Great post NID!

[Salicious Crumb]

Regarding your last comment about what I told that woman who posted that she is going to engage in an A for the rest of her life, it's so ridiculous to see someone that convinced of what they are doing that they feel the need to publicly make a statement about it and let's not forget it's HER life and she is making that choice, it doesn't matter what I say my comment is not going to stop her from doing what she already has chosen for herself. Regardless of whether I may think it's right or wrong it's her life and her decision, if she does not feel it's wrong I can't change how she feels, or her moral fiber for that matter. So my comment was ""If you think it will make you happy go for it, though I have serious doubts about the longevity of your situation. But who are we to judge?"

 

 

You told someone to go for it if it makes them happy....therefore....if it makes this other woman happy to f#ck another woman's husband and play a part in the potential destruction and hurt of a family.....then "go for it"??

If it makes her happy no matter who she hurts in the process "go for it"??

It doesn't matter that it is her decision...this is the shi!t you told her.

 

What if someone really does feel good about living in an Affair, it's two concenting adults, if that's what makes them feel good, well good for them.

 

That would be all fine and dandy if they weren't hurting someone else in the process...especially when they hurt the kids in the process.

 

The 2 "consenting adults" should think about other people other than their selfish desire to simply and nothing more than f#ck each other on the side.

 

It takes two to play if they can look in the mirror at the end of the day and not care about hurting an innocent by-stander then that's their prerogative.

 

Let just say those two people were my wife and another person...and you had to look into my sweet little boys' eyes and tell them..."sorry sweeties...you don't matter that much...what matters is your mother getting her rocks off with someone other than your father...but you'll get over it someday"

 

When something feels good it's hard to see the harm you are doing to those that don't are being hurt by your actions.

 

LMFAO...this is being said by you about people who don't give 2 squirts of p!ss who they hurt in the process of getting their selfish desires fulfilled.

[NoIDidn't]

I suppose it's the same kind of "sick pleasure"she derives from the implications she makes about me. Or you could just ignore my posts...

We're all adults here, if you are going to throw punches expect punches back.

 

But what I do find extemely interesting though is how all you BSs need a team of cheerleaders to back up all your attacks.

 

 

TC

 

There is no TEAM of BSs here, anymore than there is a team of OPs. I am quite comfortable disagreeing with ANYONE on this site, BS or otherwise. This was just your plea to get the other OW to come to your aid. OOD will probably tell me not to defend her, but you are really being hurtful and anyone with half a heart can see that.

 

I doubt very seriously that OOD enjoys having to defend herself from your onslaughts. Argue all the points that you want, but the hurtful jabs have to stop.

[Tomcat33]

You told someone to go for it if it makes them happy....therefore....if it makes this other woman happy to f#ck another woman's husband and play a part in the potential destruction and hurt of a family.....then "go for it"??

If it makes her happy no matter who she hurts in the process "go for it"??

It doesn't matter that it is her decision...this is the shi!t you told her.

 

.

 

SC: you seem like a smart man, let's see if this hits home.

 

my point is IT DOESN'T matter what I say to that woman, or anyone who is posting here not really asking for help but just putting their situation out there...my words don't have that kind of power to persuade someone to do what they are already determined in their own head to do. That's the point.

 

Everyone has their own boiling point and it's not until they hit that point

from within that the flick of the switch will go into ON and they will react with their better judgement. For some people unfortunately that switch will never turn on and it's for those very people that no matter what we say to them they will not do anything differently.

 

The point is WE don't have that kind of power over people, people have that kind of power over themselves. I think it's pretty egocentric to think that a few words posted here annonymously will make someone change the course of action of what they intend to do.

 

If you think I am way off base...read all the forums...there are a few threads going right now pages and pages of DON'T DO IT ÍT'S WRONG YOU'LL REGRET IT, and all the OP does is fight the advice every step of the way. It's pointless, it's useless. I only give advice to those that look like they have hit their rock bottom and are truly willing to make a change, because those are the only people that will be open to any positive feedback. Capiche?

 

You can't change someone who doesn't want to change.

[Salicious Crumb]

SC: you seem like a smart man, let's see if this hits home.

 

my point is IT DOESN'T matter what I say to that woman, or anyone who is posting here not really asking for help but just putting their situation out there...my words don't have that kind of power to persuade someone to do what they are already determined in their own head to do. That's the point.

 

It doesn't matter if you have power of persuasion...point is, you openly condoned her satsifying her own selfishness in keeping an affair alive and hurting people that don't deserve it.

 

And this says alot about you.

 

You can't change someone who doesn't want to change.

 

So you openly condone homewrecking? Again...it doesn't matter if she would take your words and say, "your right, I will keep f#cking her husband"

 

You openly condoned it which sheds alot of light on why you defend this kind of behavior in OM/OW....and probably

[Salicious Crumb]

SC: you seem like a smart man, let's see if this hits home.

 

my point is IT DOESN'T matter what I say to that woman, or anyone who is posting here not really asking for help but just putting their situation out there...my words don't have that kind of power to persuade someone to do what they are already determined in their own head to do. That's the point.

 

It doesn't matter if you have power of persuasion...point is, you openly condoned her satsifying her own selfishness in keeping an affair alive and hurting people that don't deserve it.

 

And this says alot about you.

 

You can't change someone who doesn't want to change.

 

So you openly condone homewrecking? Again...it doesn't matter if she would take your words and say, "your right, I will keep f#cking her husband"

 

You openly condoned it which sheds alot of light on why you defend this kind of behavior in OM/OW....and probably justifying your own behavior....you are/were an OW right? If so...then your sympathy for the destruction of a family makes all too much sense.

[Tomcat33]

TC

 

There is no TEAM of BSs here, anymore than there is a team of OPs. I am quite comfortable disagreeing with ANYONE on this site, BS or otherwise. This was just your plea to get the other OW to come to your aid. OOD will probably tell me not to defend her, but you are really being hurtful and anyone with half a heart can see that.

 

I doubt very seriously that OOD enjoys having to defend herself from your onslaughts. Argue all the points that you want, but the hurtful jabs have to stop.

 

Listen OOD is a grown woman if she does not want to engage in any sort of argument or discussion with me why don't you let her decide that herself? I don't see her backing down from her attacks toward me but because she is a BS we should all have sympathy right?

LOOOVE the hypocricy!!!

 

If you don't like my posts too bad. But if you direct comments at me and I choose to respond then I will.

 

We all have the IGNORE feature on our profiles use it! Problem solved. I'm using it and it's working out JUST FINE.

[Tomcat33]

It doesn't matter if you have power of persuasion...point is, you openly condoned her satsifying her own selfishness in keeping an affair alive and hurting people that don't deserve it.

 

And this says alot about you.

 

 

 

So you openly condone homewrecking? Again...it doesn't matter if she would take your words and say, "your right, I will keep f#cking her husband"

 

You openly condoned it which sheds alot of light on why you defend this kind of behavior in OM/OW....and probably justifying your own behavior....you are/were an OW right? If so...then your sympathy for the destruction of a family makes all too much sense.

 

 

NO I openly condone personal choice. My sympathy is not going to change ****, it might make you feel better but it's not going to change **** because that change has to come from you.

[Salicious Crumb]

I do agree that no R is perfect and there had to be something missing in the M for the person to wonder besides the desire for sex. That is NOT placing blame on the BS. It is saying as a couple there could've been something wrong that BS didn't notice. Even now BS can refuse to see that there was something wrong, missing, whatever you want to call it and that is probably the reason that MP strayed. IT IS NOT THE BS' FAULT. It can be the cheaters fault first and foremost, and 'as a couple' the second spot in line.

 

Whether you think you are not placing the blame on the BS, you are.

 

By saying there was something missing in the marriage is to say that when a spouse bends over backwards to make their "SO" happy....it isn't enough...you have to break your back to stave off cheating....and then..you have to cut off your right arm.

 

And if a M not being perfect is a reason to cheat...well hell...I should have went out and dipped my wick....but never did I ...never would I.

 

some people just don't have to have EVERYTHING absolutely perfect to be happy

[Salicious Crumb]

NO I openly condone personal choice.

 

Well shi!t...then I'm sure glad that woman you told to "go for it" didn't make it her personal choice to murder someone....about which would be one of only a small handful of things that are worse than what she is doing.

 

If it was my personal choice to slap my wife in the face every day, would you condone THAT personal choice?

[NoIDidn't]

Its H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-S-Y.

 

I'm not asking you to have sympathy for her. I am asking you to leave her alone. Yes, OOD is capable of defending herself. But like GEL once told me, if I reserve the right to come to the aid of whomever I want to. Its true, OOD is NO underdog. I have great admiration for her strength in the line of fire. But that's also why I defend her. You try to diminish her to make yourself feel superior.

 

And she has NEVER attacked you. She doesn't agree with your stance on your sitch, but she has NEVER attacked you. She has NEVER called you names. She has NEVER implied you were worthless or devoid of common sense as you have been towards her.

 

Ignore me if you must. At the rate you are going, you'll be posting to yourself and the Guests pretty soon.

[Tomcat33]

Well shi!t...then I'm sure glad that woman you told to "go for it" didn't make it her personal choice to murder someone....about which would be one of only a small handful of things that are worse than what she is doing.

 

If it was my personal choice to slap my wife in the face every day, would you condone THAT personal choice?

 

No but nothing I could say would stop you if that's what you were determined to do. That woman said in her post she was determined to go into a LIFELONG A. It's so preposterous, you can't but chase her back with just a ridiculous response. If it's her personal choice to engage in that she will only really hurt herself. And when people make that kind of a choice they are ONLY thinking of themselves. She will end up hurting what matters most to her.

[Tomcat33]

Its H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-S-Y.

 

I'm not asking you to have sympathy for her. I am asking you to leave her alone. Yes, OOD is capable of defending herself. But like GEL once told me, if I reserve the right to come to the aid of whomever I want to. Its true, OOD is NO underdog. I have great admiration for her strength in the line of fire. But that's also why I defend her. You try to diminish her to make yourself feel superior.

 

And she has NEVER attacked you. She doesn't agree with your stance on your sitch, but she has NEVER attacked you. She has NEVER called you names. She has NEVER implied you were worthless or devoid of common sense as you have been towards her.

 

Ignore me if you must. At the rate you are going, you'll be posting to yourself and the Guests pretty soon.

 

And I disagree with her stance what's your point? Since when is my disagreeing with her calling her names. YOU called her stupid, I didn't.

 

point out one name I called her, it's all here in writing.

[Tomcat33]

Yes, I totally agree w/ you and her need for attention is something that has popped into my head at times. Everyone needs attention, but when the attention the person is seeking comes in the form of engaging and baiting others, no one's needs will be met and it becomes annoying.

 

that's not a personal attack? what does that have to do with what we are discussing?

 

If you feel I am baiting you, then why even respond to me?

OR is it more a matter of when the response doesn't agree with you cry, "attack, attack"!

[outofdarkness]

Yes, I totally agree w/ you and her need for attention is something that has popped into my head at times. Everyone needs attention, but when the attention the person is seeking comes in the form of engaging and baiting others, no one's needs will be met and it becomes annoying.

 

that's not a personal attack? what does that have to do with what we are discussing?

 

If you feel I am baiting you, then why even respond to me?

OR is it more a matter of when the response doesn't agree with you cry, "attack, attack"!

NOOO, I don't believe that's an attack sweetie...It's simply my take on things...

[outofdarkness]

OOD let me make it very clear to you that I don't need to justify myself to you or to anyone that chooses to judge me here. I have come to terms with my actions and have examined what I did wrong and how I could do things differently next time. I am not looking for sympathy or empathy or anything of the sort. The people that matter most to me who's opinions also matter most are my family and close friends, they know me well they know my character and they don't judge me, they love me and understand that my situation was a freak situation, a moment of fogginess if you will...given my character and my personal inclinations, quite frankly I could care less if some people here (that being you or whom ever else chooses to judge me does not accept my situation) I really don't care because quite frankly you don't mold my life in any way or form. Yes I turned to this forum for help in my lowest moment of distress and it helped immensely to know that there were thousands of people in my same shoes, and who in varying degress had experienced the same amount of pain and deceit as I had experieced, so in that respect I do feel like I got what I needed from this site.

 

I know who I am, and I also know that a weak moment does not make many less than any one else, I don't feel superior to anyone but most importantly I don't feel any less.

 

It doesn't matter that you will never agree that I had nothing to do with my ex seperated MM's demise of his marriage. I know what I did and what I didn't do and it doesn't matter that you don't see it the same. I know that I pulled away when things felt wrong and I know that I ended things when things were not as they appeared to be. I also know that when I met him his marriage was already over, which is why he moved out took all his stuff and proceeded to get the seperation. He assured me he was not doing this to be with me, that he was doing this because he needed to end a relationship that was on the rocks for a very long time and had been a mistake. Call me naive but I believed him so I let the dust settle for a while and proceeded to date him. Had I been the OW while he was at home lying to his wife to be with me and sneaking around to talk to me or dissapearing after being with me, I don't think I would have lasted even a week I juts not OW material (no offence OW but I just don't know how you do this part time love thing). In my case it was not like that. We lived our rel out in the open no sneaking around no nothing that EVER made me feel like the other woman, he was with me 100% of the time and slept at my house and I at his. I met his friends, family and coworkers everything was out in the open, why he chose to hide it from his W is HIS problem and I'll never fully understand. But our rel was not that of a CS and his mistress regardless of that fact that he was still married.

 

 

I don't feel what you WANT me to feel because YOUR H has lied to you numerous times and you choose to keep accepting him back, but my situation is completely different than yours and I don't feel in the least responsible for my exguy's marital breakdown, because I didn't go after him at all HE went after me. In your case all the women that your H seeks out are like jokers in a deck of cards they take on the trump of whatever he needs to have a winning hand, and so if you feel that the jokers are what is destroyng your chance at happiness with this man that you claim to SO love (don't know how you could love someone that has purposely hurt you so many times but that's your issue) then you really fail to see the reality of your situation. you claim that you wish your H was more honest with you in order to give you a choice? C'MON!

he has betrayed you 1, 2, three times or more and you keep taking him back hoping to cure his addiction simply because you love him? HOw much more honesty do you need? These women are no more to blame for his addiction than you are for it. HE is the one with the problem, and if you choose to accept him broken as he is then you have to either stop expecting to get apple juice from an orange or do something to change what is doing you harm. Trying to find jokers to blame for the failure of your marriage is not going to work, you have the proof time and time again that no matter how many jokers he gets rid of he will always find another to have his winning hand.

 

On a last note if you think I am in denyal then what are you?

 

And don't tell me you have no choice, you ABSOLUTELY have a choice.

Nooo.,, I said I would have loved; past tense, to have been given the chance years ago when the main 10 year a started, when I was young and better able to start over. THAT is what I said if you re read my post...I have only taken him back once, after 2 separations and lots of MC...These other things that I've discussed are suspicions, some may be legit, some not...I don't have any hard proof...There are many reasons why we choose to stay, and not all of them will seem like good ones to everyone on LS...AND yes, I DO love him. Perhaps it has something to do w/ the fact that I too have an addiction..Recovering Alcoholic...I can see patterns, etc., that others might not be able to relate to...Do I look for advice and occasionally have a pity party here on LS, sure...LOTS of us do..

 

I'm still trying to figure out why you keep posting...Are you trying to help some of the OW/BS on here? I don't see you really trying to help anyone, only defending your own actions...It's puzzling to me.

[Ladyjane14]

What if someone really does feel good about living in an Affair, it's two concenting adults, if that's what makes them feel good, well good for them. It takes two to play if they can look in the mirror at the end of the day and not care about hurting an innocent by-stander then that's their prerogative.

 

But it's not just "two consenting adults". It's two consenting, and one (sometimes two) who don't. Then, we have to factor in whatever children might be involved who haven't consented on the risk to the family dynamic.

 

Look, I'm not going to argue with you about whatever opinion you offer to another poster. That's completely your call.

 

But sometimes you've got to ask yourself, how much "support" are you really willing to offer to a person who 'uses their prerogative to hurt innocent bystanders'. Coming off the back side off this thing, you've got a different perspective than someone who's still in it's grip. And THIS is invaluable information for people who truly need it.

 

All this 'us against them' malarkey becomes nothing more than a huge quagmire. I saw someone refer to it as "sisterhood" last week. But I can't imagine WHY something like this would be a kind of a club that anyone would want membership in.

 

The idea that one needs to somehow protect her 'sisters' from bad press isn't really accomplishing much but adding to that sense of 'us against them' conflict. There are other OW forums where opposing opinions are not even allowed. It reduces the conversation to 'what color thong does your MM like best' and 'tips on giving a good blowjob'.

 

Personally, I don't think of myself as a BS. You can't let something go and then hold onto the label. So, why would somebody who's put all that behind them want to pigeonhole themselves as an ex-OW and limit themselves to the OW sorority?

 

Yeah... there's some crap going on here that's way over the top from time to time. And way too often the thread topic is lost and the conversation once more reduces down to "Extra-Marital Affairs... Right or Wrong?". It's annoying, I'll give you that.

 

But if you're having trouble getting along with members like WWIU and OOD... hey, there's just no way that's not about YOU. You've been fighting like a dog with a bone since you got here, taking things personally.

 

But this is just group discussion with random people. And even though it sometimes gets quite passionate... it's not worth taking offense over. It's not worth all the hard-feelings or high blood pressure. It's not something to even bother "picking your battles" over. In the grand scheme of life... disagreement in an anonymous internet forum shouldn't take ANY skin from one's nose. Know what I mean?

[Tomcat33]

Look, I'm not going to argue with you about whatever opinion you offer to another poster. That's completely your call.

 

But sometimes you've got to ask yourself, how much "support" are you really willing to offer to a person who 'uses their prerogative to hurt innocent bystanders'. Coming off the back side off this thing, you've got a different perspective than someone who's still in it's grip. And THIS is invaluable information for people who truly need it.

 

 

If you have to ask yourself why you would offer so much support to someone who hurts inocent bystanders, then maybe you should ask yourself why am I REALLY offering advice on a forum that is created PURELY AND SPECIFICALLY FOR:

 

The Other Man / Woman The other side of the story: Support and discussion for those who find themselves involved with a committed partner.

 

 

I have offered a LOT of advice for people looking for advice, this thread in particular and the people who you pointed out engaged in the argument with me are simply about blowing off steamn HECK some even admit it and the: WWIU advice to SC: GO AHEAD SC GET ANGRY ALL YOU WANT HERE THAT'S WHAT THIS IS FOR! Ahh NO it's not!

you have unresolved ANGER go to ANGER MANAGEMENT CLASSES don't come here and insult every single person on the site who was an OW/OM because your W cheated on you.

And yeah dam straight it peeves me off. This is not a support group for BS it's a support group for people ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE EQUATION if you don't want to support fine but don't berate people and if you see someone berating don't encourage it IF YOU REALLY WANT TO HELP!

 

In my opinion I don't think BSs should be here at all who have a lot of pent up fresh anger, they have too many unresolved emotions and some are juts not in the frame of mind to offer support or constructive help at all.

 

PS We all have eyes there is no point you sitting there trying to say "ohh we the BSs are only trying to help why do you want to argue"

Puuuuleeeze.

[Ladyjane14]

This is not a support group for BS it's a support group for people ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE EQUATION

 

Perhaps you should take a look at Midori's pinned post at the top to the thread's list. And if you review the forum descriptive again... it's "support AND DISCUSSION". Just because not everyone agrees with YOU on what "support and discussion" really means, doesn't necessarily indicate that THEY are the ones who are wrong.

 

IF you want a board where opposing viewpoints are forbidden... type the words "The Other Woman" into your browser and you will find one.

 

Meantime... my advice to you. Think about one of those "anger management classes" you just recommended. When push comes to shove, you're more in need of it than most of the folks you've lashed out at.

[Impudent Oyster]

I've always found it interesting that the OW/Om can be called classless for getting irritated with and reacting to the constant bashing but the person doing the bashing never finds fault within themselves for the way they behave and treat people. .........So you won't have an A, you never cheated, and people that do are scum. ..........You might just help someone get out of the affair instead of making them feel like sh*t because they are in it.

 

Bottom line, sleeping with someone else's spouse IS scummy behaviour. It doesn't get much lower than that. Lying, cheating, sneaking around in secret, screwing married men and women behind their spouses backs is truly scummy behavior. There is NOTHING to justify an affair, and truly classy people don't engage in them. Why shouldn't you feel like sh*t if you're going to act like a sh*t?

 

You can cover your ears all you want, but being the OP is a choice, having an affair is a choice, you're not an innocent victim. You made that choice so live with the consequences, consequences that include being looked down upon and scorned by others.

 

If you don't want to be judged by decent society then perhaps you ought to behave in a manner that people don't find repulsive. Otherwise, if you can't take the heat stay out of the kitchen.

[Impudent Oyster]

Oh, give it a rest. People stay for all kinds of reasons. Staying does not mean empowering...

 

.

Agree, people stay married for all kinds of reasons, mostly because it's the best decision for them and THEIR CHILDREN. They aren't all selfish and frankly, it's no one's business why a wife and mother chooses to remain married to her husband. Clearly it's the best decision for her and her child(ren) at this point in time, but I guarantee you her reasons are far better than the lame excuses provided for entering into an affair.

[greengoddess]

I do not see myself here as a BS, the labels you love to throw around to make yourself feel better that it is just bs's who have a problem with this behavior. If you really felt it was only bs's who abhor the ow then you would tell everyone you were dating a mm.

 

I see myself here as a WOMAN. A woman who hates, hates, hates the fact that women allow themselves to be used by these pig mm. I do not want to see another woman used and abused. Especially young ones. I think most of these women start out very young and naive and have to learn a hard lesson.

 

Tomcat I would think in your situation you would try extra hard to keep another woman from being hurt like you were. I do not understand how you can cheer on an EMA. I also am here as a woman who can not understand how another woman can justify being with a mm. I would never do that to my fellow women. Never. I would not want to hurt someone.

 

It's funny, when I read a post of a man who is the other man it really doesn't bother me. I actually get the attitude of oh hell let him get used as a sidepiece, who cares but I have so much sympathy for a young girl who will soon be crushed. Don't know why that is. Just the whole I'm here as a woman who does not want women hurt, the bs or the ow and they will both be hurt and so will the most innocent victims in all this. THE CHILDREN. It makes me ill to think about the kids.

[Tomcat33]

Perhaps you should take a look at Midori's pinned post at the top to the thread's list. And if you review the forum descriptive again... it's "support AND DISCUSSION". Just because not everyone agrees with YOU on what "support and discussion" really means, doesn't necessarily indicate that THEY are the ones who are wrong.

 

IF you want a board where opposing viewpoints are forbidden... type the words "The Other Woman" into your browser and you will find one.

 

Meantime... my advice to you. Think about one of those "anger management classes" you just recommended. When push comes to shove, you're more in need of it than most of the folks you've lashed out at.

 

Good so we agree that not everyone agrees on what support and discussion means. You should take a long hard look at what you just wrote because all I see is I'm attacking and the rest are discussing point of views.

 

LOL what a joke.

 

I never said I wanted a board where opposing views are frobidden I say paractice what you preach and mybe then you'll be taken seriously.

 

Lady, you're the one who doesn't fully understand what you are doing here:

But sometimes you've got to ask yourself, how much "support" are you really willing to offer to a person who 'uses their prerogative to hurt innocent bystanders'

 

not me. Your words not mine.

 

That pretty much sums it up very nicely right THERE.

[Tomcat33]

I

Tomcat I would think in your situation you would try extra hard to keep another woman from being hurt like you were. I do not understand how you can cheer on an EMA. I also am here as a woman who can not understand how another woman can justify being with a mm. I would never do that to my fellow women. Never. I would not want to hurt someone.

 

 

what's an EMA?