Since I seem to have hijacked a thread on another forum...

[AriaIncognito]

Since I seemed to hijack a thread over in second chances I figured I'd move it to over here where people can try to beat sense into me on my own thread.

 

I'm sure many of you know the story. Ex and I got together a year ago. Broke up first time in June 2006 (he did it), got back in August 2006. Broke up October 2006 (I did it) got back November 2006, broke up January 2007 (I did it). Originally we broke up because of him not knowing if he could be with me due to his being jewish and my not. That later became a non issue.

 

Throughout the course of all this, we had a great friendship. He was someone I felt connected to on many levels, and it's something I've not come across often in life. He had said the same about me. However, he was never able to commit to being with me. He would come back, and we'd play the roles of bf/gf but he never gave us the label. Both times i broke it off, was because I wanted the full commitment and he was seemingly unable to give me that.

 

The last time we broke up he said he didn't "feel the relationship growing romantically" to which I said "well how could it if you never commited to it" and well there was no good answer he could give there he knew I had a point. We broke up on 1/30 but then by the next day we were already speaking again. We didn't see eachother for a whole month, but we did text/IM/email a lot. Finally we saw eachother again, nothing serious, not as a couple. We didn't kiss or do anything inappropriate (mild flirtatious touching aside). 3 weeks later we had continued to see eachother once or twice a week and one of those times I ended up staying at his house and we ended up messing around but not all the way. He didn't want to at first because he didnt' want to set any "expectations" for me to assume that would keep happening.

 

Sometime after that occurred, or maybe right before it, I can't remember now, I mentioned to him that I'd not be able to remain friends with him once I knew he was dating someone, as it would be too much for me to bear. My original thought was maybe he'd not tell me when he met someone, but that maybe if they got serious, he'd tell me, or i'd notice it. He didn't seem to like the fact that I was drawing the line in the sand and saying when that happens, I'm gone, but well, he went out today with someone on a first date. I just knew it. He said he "met up with someone for a few hours" and i was like oh a date. I asked him if he'd have a second date with her and he said maybe.

 

So, I guess I have some leaving to do. I can't handle it. I dont want to cut him out of my life, but I can't stand my being in love with him while he's out trying other women on for size while he keeps me in his pocket. I know that I should "let him go" and "move on" and whatnot, but my heart doesn't want to keep up. I blocked the domain of the dating site he uses because I kept checking to see if he was looking (and he was - heck he was looking even before we broke up the 1st time). I removed him from my IM list. I don't know if I'll keep up with it or just get weak and reinstate it all but it's my lame attempt at stopping the hurt of myself. I guess it's like any other addiction, you know you shouldn't do it, but you feel compelled. Then you feel like sh*t afterwards.

 

I wish I could believe that all this is happening for a reason, and that i'll meet the love of my life one day and see why all these relationships have gone wrong, but I just dont believe it anymore. I'm sick of going out and coming home and being alone all the time and not being able to move onto the next phase of my life. The happily married, having a family phase. I want that so badly that I feel like I'll be miserable forever without it.

 

I dont know what I'm asking here. I guess I'm just venting as I sit here and cry. I don't understand why I want him so much, why I still to this very minute love him with all my heart and being. He should be so lucky as to have me, and yet, I'm the one crying.

[Trialbyfire]

Hey, it's okay to feel these emotions. You've had a rough time with someone who doesn't appear to understand or appreciate you. You don't stop loving someone by turning around three times and saying "I don't love you". Wish we could though.

 

Take care of yourself and don't be afraid to cry.

[AriaIncognito]

Crying is all I seem to be good at these days, which is what makes me let him win me over each time. I'm sick of being the diveling idiot pining over some guy that can't see how great he had it with me. I'm a freaking moron for wanting to be with someone who has never had the decency to want to be with me. It makes me mad that he knows I love him, yet continues to throw mixed messages at me, all the while I'm supposed to be all "oh we are just friends" even though he's massaging my shoulders, or meeting up with me 2 times a week to go on non-dates. I mean, what exactly did he think, that I was able to turn my feelings off like a freaking spiggot? Not like they magically left me just because I decided I deserved more than what he was giving. I'd often hoped that my leaving would cause him to realize what I meant to him, but I guess I didn't mean much (or maybe i did since he always came back just in the wrong capacity) or not enough for him to ever commit to a relationship with me.

 

I'm just so hurt and upset and angry. At myself. At him. At the world. Mostly at myself for allowing this to occur, when I know for damned sure that eventually, it would pass and I'd find someone that was willing to give me what I deserve, rather than just throw me scraps of attention just enough to keep me around and guessing.

 

How can he do that to me, when he claims he cares about me and doesn't want me to be hurt? Honestly? Is he that dumb as to not see what this contact has meant to me? Is he that dumb to think that he can show me affection and I wouldn't take it to mean he could possibly care for me? Could he actually have genuine feelings for me that he's just afraid to admit to? I just dont get it anymore.

 

If i were the drinking kind, i'd be hammered by now. If i were the suicidal kind, my body would be splattered on the ground somewhere. Unfortunately I'm the torture oneself forever kind, so here i sit, crying, miserable, and alone.

 

That certainly doesn't make me sound attractive.

 

Sigh.

[Trialbyfire]

You're not alone. We're here.

 

Think about it this way. Here's a guy who kept you around while moving onto someone else in a rebound situation. Do you really want someone like this? Someone so needy? Wouldn't you prefer someone who fully appreciates what you have to offer, giving back as much as you give, to the depth that you give?

[ringside]

Ditch him. Seriously. He knows you love him and yet continues to keep you around and treating you like a girlfriend without acknowledging you as such - smacks of selfish and irresponsible and jerk-ish to me. If he doesn't want to commit, if he didn't even try, it's not worth it. He's not worth it.

 

I know the thing about how you know you should move on but your heart doesn't want to keep up though. Happened to me too, is still happening to me in some limited degree. All I can say is, give it time. Allow yourself to sit around and mope, pig out on ice-cream if that's your thing, cry your eyes out, whatever. Eventually your heart WILL catch up with your head and you will be better poised to move on.

[AriaIncognito]

You're not alone. We're here.

 

Think about it this way. Here's a guy who kept you around while moving onto someone else in a rebound situation. Do you really want someone like this? Someone so needy? Wouldn't you prefer someone who fully appreciates what you have to offer, giving back as much as you give, to the depth that you give?

 

I know I shouldn't want someone like this. I guess my heart tells me he wouldn't always be this way, "if" he'd commit. If he'd realize what he had. Etc. I know, the if's are way too big and I shouldn't be thinking them, but that's what my heart is doing to me.

 

Today, I'm still upset because of this, plus he and I were supposed to go out together today to a movie. Now, I know I shouldn't go, but it's pissing me off that I called yesterday and left him a message to call me so we could plan when, and he never responded to that. He did respond via text about the date thing, but not about the movie. So what, so now I wait and see if he contacts me today to even considering honoring the commitment he had to do something with me today? I dont even know what to do. When (if) he calls I should tell him to go to you know where because of how he's treating me. But i'm a huge p*ssy and I'll hear his voice and I'll lose control as always.

 

I HATE this. I feel like a wreck. Emotionally and physically drained. If i leave him for good, I know i'm going to feel even worse, and that doesn't make me want to do it. Last night was the first night that I didn't leave IM up to see if he came online, though. It also was the first night i didn't check his dating site to see if he'd logged in. I know it seems dumb, but really, those are pretty big deals for me as of lately.

 

I just want to cry forever.

[Teacher's Pet]

I have the wonderful distinction of knowing Ariawoman in real life, and with that, knowing her "man".

 

Again, like in my other thread, I use "man", because this guy doesn't know what it's like to be a REAL one.

 

A real man appreciates a real woman. You don't get anymore real than this lovely one right here.

 

AW is sweet, fun, cute as hell, and just a wonderful friend. She's been there for me since practically day 1 of my "healing", and has NEVER once let up in supporting me emotionally (and physically, since she let me break down on her shoulder on New Year's Eve when I was drunk off my fat ass). She's a Godsend to my life, and she extends that sort of treatment to everyone around her.

 

HE is a confused, immature child that needs to start learning how to appreciate what he has in life, because in life, friendships/relationships can't afford to be taken for granted. A good partner is hard to find, and a GREAT partner is nearly impossible. He had a chance at a GREAT one.

 

I love AW with all my heart, and it breaks my heart to see her hurt by all of this. She has so many great friends who adore her, so she NEVER needs to feel like she'll be alone....EVER.

 

Besides, someone as amazing as her won't stay single long. That much I KNOW.

 

So, AW... You came here so we can "beat some sense into you", so I'm doing it.

 

You ROCK, and I don't know how else to beat that little tidbit of info into your head.

 

Now do me a favor and learn to play poker so we can spend Sunday afternoons together?

 

-tp

loves his FW.

[AriaIncognito]

Who said I dont know how to play poker?

 

Anyway.

 

I just told him off via text message. I realize that's in poor form but he texted me asking if we were still getting together today, that he assumed we weren't. I basically said that since he didn't have the decency to call me back yesterday to make the plans as I'd asked, no, we wouldn't be. I basically said I hope he's happy with his choice and that I hope his date is willing to be his new best friend. That I am no longer willing to be his consolation prize. Etc etc. he said "i dont know how to be good to you and explore my needs at the same time" and i said "well obviously i am not what you want or need so man up and let me go so i can let my heart heal so another man can love me".

 

This really sucks. I don't want to say any of this. I want him to say "well you are what i want i'm just scared" or anything that would clue me into how he's actually felt about me, if anything.

 

There was more said but i dont feel like posting the whole thing verbatim. Basically it was me being really upset that he'd so easily toss me and him saying he didn't toss me and doesn't know how to handle it since now I'm basically saying see ya later I can't do this anymore.

 

I truly can't do this anymore. Everything hurts. I dont know how I still have tears left.

[Teacher's Pet]

Who said I dont know how to play poker?

 

Well, get here by 2:30 and be prepared to lose some clothing! hahaha

 

Chin up.....

 

You did the right thing. He needs a good kick in the ass, and you gave it to him.

 

One day, he'll wake up next to some smelly old ho-bag (you know, like B in 10 years), and wonder "Whatever happened to that gorgeous blonde that was so crazy about me?"

 

.....and that gorgeous blonde will be nowhere to be found, because she'll be off living it up with her awesome guy and her really great friends (especially the very sexy, though slightly chunky bartender guy)

 

Open your eyes, my beautiful friend (I love calling you that, for some reason), life is calling.

 

-tp

sexy, slightly chunky bartender guy

[Ariadne]

Oh,

 

It's never easy, is it?

 

I'd suggest that you read the "He's not that into you" cheesy book.

 

It may not be the best book out there for relationships, since there are different shades of gray it doesn't cover.

 

But... at times like these it makes for a great read. It makes you calm down and feel more in charge of your feelings.

 

I wish I could believe that all this is happening for a reason, and that i'll meet the love of my life one day and see why all these relationships have gone wrong, but I just dont believe it anymore.

 

Same here. It's all getting old, I'm getting old, and I don't believe it anymore either.

 

Hope you feel better soon and as they say, maybe it was all for the best.

 

Ariadne

[AriaIncognito]

I've read that book, and yeah, he's "just not that into you" if he's not committing. And I've known that all along. But his actions outside of that non-committal state, pointed otherwise.

 

It's terribly confusing. I'm doing the best I can. Sitting here, bawling my eyes out. I last texted him about 40 minutes ago telling him to man up and let me go if i'm not what he wants or needs. i guess he's manning up. I'm going to miss him. I can only hope he misses me anywhere near as much as I deserve to be missed.

[Kamille]

Hi Ariawoman,

 

Good show on telling him off and cancelling the date. I tried showing an ex of mine that we could be great together 'if' he decided to commit and I really truly only started the very long process of getting over him once I started telling him exactly what was on my mind. That was when I started realizing I really didn't have much to lose in the first place.

 

By now I no longer even want to talk to the guy. I mean I'm polite to him when I run into him, but that's it. I really no longer feel the need to 'impress' him and that is incredibly liberating.

 

I really have no word of advice other then I think today might be a turning point for you. It was a long road for me. It took me months, from the day I started telling him what was on my mind, before I was ready to do NC. Months of good days-bad days where I would sometime let myself go into fantasizing that he would come back. I couldn't let go of the belief that we were meant to be. After NC, it took me a few other months before I no longer thought about him.

 

My point is healing just happens. You have a lot of yourself invested in the potential you see between you and this "man" (thanks TP) so it will likely take quite some time. Feeling guilty about not healing fast enough or not letting go are not productive. Write here, turn to friends (if they still want to listen) and accept that healing will take time - but also know that it will happen.

[Teacher's Pet]

turn to friends (if they still want to listen)

 

Trust me, her friends do.

 

She has awesome friends.

 

I should know.

 

-tp

awesome friend

[AriaIncognito]

To be honest I had stopped talking to my friends about it, with the exception of TP and maybe one or two others. I had them fooled too, they just assumed I was over him. Little did they know. Now they feel blindsided because they didnt' know anything was wrong, but I didn't feel like burdening them with the same "woe is me" crap day after day so I just stopped.

 

I sitll dont want to burden them with it, so more than likely, I'll dwell in this on my own with the occasional rant here.

[Teacher's Pet]

"woe is me".....

 

I sitll dont want to burden them with it, so more than likely, I'll dwell in this on my own with the occasional rant here.

 

Burden us. Burden me.

 

I'm not giving up on helping you get through this. Not by a long shot.

 

We're partners in our combined "messes". I've given you good advice, you've given me good advice. We need to learn to take our OWN advice sometimes, too!

 

Love you, chicky. Talk to you tonight after poker.

 

-tp

woe is us!

[Kamille]

LS is very reliable when it comes to letting out some of the uncertainties that come with coping. Thank you guys for a great community. Don't forget that you have Teacher's Pet to turn too. I really only had one good friend I would turn to when I felt I needed to overanalyze the situation with my ex. She was very patient and very understanding. I should send her a thank you card ... if she doesn't read this thread first as she's uncovered my identity on LS.

[AriaIncognito]

I plan on returning here often. I've done "ok" so far. I've not been doing the obsessive things I was doing as often. I blocked myself from his dating site (which I know how to get around) and took his IM name off my list and haven't added it back. This isn't going to be easy. Already this morning I was thinking about contacting him. I know I shouldn't. Hopefully I can convince myself not to do it. That everythign I would have to say, he would already know.

 

Ugh.

 

Here's to the start of another week without being in a couple.

[Teacher's Pet]

Here's to the start of another week without being in a couple.

 

Hey, we're a couple!

 

A couple of people with not the best of luck in romance.

 

-tp

snuggling his pillow

[jaycie724]

I've read that book, and yeah, he's "just not that into you" if he's not committing. And I've known that all along. But his actions outside of that non-committal state, pointed otherwise.

 

It's terribly confusing. I'm doing the best I can. Sitting here, bawling my eyes out. I last texted him about 40 minutes ago telling him to man up and let me go if i'm not what he wants or needs. i guess he's manning up. I'm going to miss him. I can only hope he misses me anywhere near as much as I deserve to be missed.

 

Wow! I can definately relate to that. I'm going through the same thing with Doug. He moved out on Friday and I desperately miss him, almost died watching him go. And I know that he misses me but I know that it is nowhere to the degree that I miss him. And I deserve to be missed just as desperately as I'm missing him. However, I know that it won't happen...not with him. He has someone else in his life now (someone who will never compare to me, isn't even in the same field as me) who he depends on now to be his rebound. It's a sad situation and it makes it so much worse on me because I feel like I'm not even good enough to be missed. But, in my head, I KNOW that I'm too good for him..I'm just waiting on my heart to catch up.

 

I don't know that I can say anything to help you out because I'm right there with you. But know that you aren't alone. Besides, misery loves company

 

Hang in there!

[allina]

I hope you don't take offense at this, though I'm afraid you might.

 

I remember the first breakup that you had with this person, it was around the same time I went through a breakup after a 3 month relationship. It seriously pains me to see what you've done for this entire year, had you just let it go and accepted the breakup after the 4 months you would be so over him by now and possible with a man who actually wanted you.

 

This guy has made it clear, told you that he did not love you, and didn't think he ever would love you, and that he didn't think you would ever be together. Each time you've gone back to hang out/talk "just as friends" you'd say, and ended up in the same place. He's wasted an entire year of our life. What else can he say to make you understand that although he may enjoy you once in a while he is actively pursuing a relationship with someone else, not you.

 

Good luck, and may you let this go and find a true real relationship.

[stace79]

I'm there with you. Today I said "Okay self, no more checking his myspace, no adding his name to AIM to see if he's away or whatever, no listening to his radio show to see if he's in town for the weekend or gone to see his hooker ex...." (Sorry, lots of anger today)

 

I know how hard it is...you just want any contact you can get because you miss him so much, and all you can see are the good things about how you felt around him. Yes, it sucks. I'm going to a counselor Thursday to try and figure out WHY I feel so needy for him. Like your situation, this guy is an alright guy and he's been a decent friend, but he's definitely NOT the be all-end all of my romantic life. What is wrong with us ladies??

 

I've not been doing the obsessive things I was doing as often. I blocked myself from his dating site (which I know how to get around) and took his IM name off my list and haven't added it back. This isn't going to be easy. Already this morning I was thinking about contacting him. I know I shouldn't. Hopefully I can convince myself not to do it. That everythign I would have to say, he would already know.

 

Ugh.

 

Here's to the start of another week without being in a couple.

[AriaIncognito]

I don't take offense to what you've written, and you have some valid points. I went back, not as friends, after the first 2 breakups. This last one was the only time that we were "just friends". The other two, we were indeed seeing eachother. So, there might be a little bit of difference there. It's not like I went back each time to him saying "we are just friends, not seeing eachother" etc. I went back those times because he didn't seem to know what he wanted and yes I had hoped he'd catch up to me.

 

This time, well we weren't back together, and that point was never foggy in my mind. Did he lead me on? In ways, sure. Did I know we werent' together despite this fact, yes, I did. It's easy for any of us not in the situation to sit back and say "gee, you wasted an entire year on nothing, you idiot" but we also have to realize that the people that are wasting their time, are people who believe (for whatever reason) they are in love with someone/meant to be with someone/whatever. Those people aren't governed by logic, typically, as those of you in happy relationships probably are. And believe me, it would be really easy for me to sit outside of my situation, and say the exact same things to me that you just did. I totally get it, I do, however, that doesn't change the fact that I am where I am now, because I chose to take a chance on love. Whether or not I should have taken that chance, at this point, is moot. I did, it happened, and now I am where I am.

 

The thing I'm dealing with now, is how to keep myself from ending up back here for the 4th time due to this same person. I'm not saying I didn't make mistakes. I most certainly did. I gave him shot after shot. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice (three times) shame on me. I get that. I just now need to figure out how to convince myself that this will never be, and I have to move on, come hell or high water.

[AriaIncognito]

I What else can he say to make you understand that although he may enjoy you once in a while he is actively pursuing a relationship with someone else, not you.

 

To this, well, he could have not been contacting me all day every day. He could have not been hanging out with me and making plans with me. That might have helped me see he had no interest in me.

 

Not to say I lay all the blame on him. It obviously goes both ways. I accepted things on his bad terms, which I shouldn't have. But the point I'm making here is, it's not like i was running around blind and making up the fact that he was indeed doing the chasing. Heck, at the end I had him initiate everything just so that i knew it was him chasing and not me. So, while he might not "know" he wants to be with me, his actions were always leaning me in that direction. If you dont want to be with someone, where i'm from anyway, you let them go, and move on. You dont string them along.

 

Well, maybe that's my flaw, in assuming every human is decent enough to do that. Apparently, either he's not decent, or he had feelings.

 

I don't know which to side with there.

[allina]

 

The thing I'm dealing with now, is how to keep myself from ending up back here for the 4th time due to this same person. I'm not saying I didn't make mistakes. I most certainly did. I gave him shot after shot. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice (three times) shame on me. I get that. I just now need to figure out how to convince myself that this will never be, and I have to move on, come hell or high water.

 

I understand what you're saying and it was in part his fault, I think he completely played the "poor confused me" card, knowing what an open heart you had.

 

As for convincing yourself to not be there again and just let it go, keep telling yourself no more, not another year wasted, no more chances at real love passed by. Also, sometimes we can't "just be friends" it's a nice way to close things and be able to be friends but that isn't always possible and that should be okay.

[bendit]

I hope you don't take offense at this, though I'm afraid you might.

 

I remember the first breakup that you had with this person, it was around the same time I went through a breakup after a 3 month relationship. It seriously pains me to see what you've done for this entire year, had you just let it go and accepted the breakup after the 4 months you would be so over him by now and possible with a man who actually wanted you.

 

This guy has made it clear, told you that he did not love you, and didn't think he ever would love you, and that he didn't think you would ever be together. Each time you've gone back to hang out/talk "just as friends" you'd say, and ended up in the same place. He's wasted an entire year of our life. What else can he say to make you understand that although he may enjoy you once in a while he is actively pursuing a relationship with someone else, not you.

 

Good luck, and may you let this go and find a true real relationship.

 

 

 

Good post. I wrote a post to Ariawoman about six months ago on an eerily familiar thread (it was almost identical to this one). And needless to say, she took great offense at what I had to tell her. I reread that post and I am kind of surprised at how just on the mark it was. I expect she will come back with an accusatory post telling me that I am a heartless fool and to bug out of her threads. So be it.

 

Unfortunately I could essentially cut and paste that post here, and it would still apply after six long months. This is a case of addiction. Yep I said the A word!

You will continue to grovel for this guy as long as you remain in contact, even as his friend. He has always understood this. He knows that he can get away with virtually anything in your "relationship". He is already devaluing you by dating others (doesn't care what you think), and I suspect he could get away with cheating on you. And you will still be his friend and confidant, if not his lover, because well gosh, he is just soooo "perfect".

 

He understands the dynamic of your relationship very well and holds all the cards here. Every last one of them. He knows he has a doormat on his hands. Guys know this just as women know this. And believe me, he knows it. He uses you. And you allow it, because he is soooo "perfect".

 

Here is how his mind works. When you guys are out together, he knows he is out with a woman who simply worships the very ground he walks on. He just has to be his perfect self. And he knows he is indifferent to you, and you are okay with that. He knows that he is dating (with no consequences), and you aren't. He knows you Can't because you're too broken up about things to date anyone but him. He also knows that you know he is dating, so he doesn't feel guilty about sneaking around. He told you he would date and you reluctantly accepted it.

 

He knows there is always always the possibility (not probability) of NSA sex with you, and that's exciting. Every interaction when you two meet-up is influenced by these power dynamics, his dominant power position. This feels really good for him, although awful for you because you know he has the upper hand (the one who loves the Least controls the relationship). It feels good because its a secure feeling to know he has a "back up" in place. When something feels good like this, you do it till you can't do it anymore. So far he still can.

 

The only way you are going to get past this episode is 100% no contact with Mr. Perfect. But I don't see any signs that you've accepted this fact, which is, unfortunately, why I predict more rants, more tears, more pain, more breakups (with him), and more blaming Him. I usually feel sorry for folks in pain. But I have learned to feel something different when that pain is entirely self inflicted. I wish you enlightenment and freedom from ignorance.

 

regards