Woggle Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 I was on another board and I kept hearing about how women do all the emotional work in a marriage. To me it sounded like another excuse to bash men but I would like to ask the women here. I have my own theories about what it means but I will explain that later.
johan Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 I was on another board and I kept hearing about how women do all the emotional work in a marriage. To me it sounded like another excuse to bash men but I would like to ask the women here. I have my own theories about what it means but I will explain that later. Thanks for looking out for us, bro! It's amazing how many of those little shots would get through if you weren't there to stop them. I could be wearing a skirt and scrubbing toilets right now, if it weren't for you. I assume that it means that women are more communicative and willing to engage on an emotional level than men are. Men are more rational in the way that they ignore emotions as much as possible. Women force the emotional engagements and try to work things out. All in an effort to bring us to our sorry knees, of course.
Mustang Sally Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 Now, where did I put that soapbox.....Oh! there it is, Woggle's standing on it! But seriously - I'm just kidding, dude! I think Johan did a pretty good job with it, above. Just a gender generalization, of course. And I'd like to see you in that skirt, mister, scrubbing a toilet! And call me "Mistress" when you speak to me! {**whacks leather whip against bathroom sink a few times whilst pacing in leather corset and thigh-high black patent stilletto boots**}
Author Woggle Posted April 5, 2007 Author Posted April 5, 2007 Really I think that some women like to create drama and nag then call it emotional work. Many of the problems in marriages would solve themselves if women would just learn to relax and enjoy the moment
johan Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 And I'd like to see you in that skirt, mister, scrubbing a toilet! And call me "Mistress" when you speak to me! {**whacks leather whip against bathroom sink a few times whilst pacing in leather corset and thigh-high black patent stilletto boots**} WOGGLE, WOGGLE, WOGGLE!!! HELP, HELP, HELP!!! I knew this would happen sooner or later, but I never thought it would be on one of your threads!!
Mustang Sally Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 You may have a point there, Woggle. But any time one makes stereotypical generalizations (how's that for redundancy?) about a large, heterogeneous group of people - such as an entire race or gender - there will be many individuals for whom it absolutely doesn't apply. Why not just be happy about the wonderful ways in which men and women differ and thus complement each other?
Mustang Sally Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 Don't you disobey me, Johan! I didn't give you permission to speak! {**whacks whip again**} :laugh: :D Seriously, guys, it feels good to break out of that sh*t-for-serious mood I've been in the last several weeks!
Author Woggle Posted April 5, 2007 Author Posted April 5, 2007 You may have a point there, Woggle. But any time one makes stereotypical generalizations (how's that for redundancy?) about a large, heterogeneous group of people - such as an entire race or gender - there will be many individuals for whom it absolutely doesn't apply. Why not just be happy about the wonderful ways in which men and women differ and thus complement each other? I will fully admit there are exceptions but I think that some women don't allow themselves to live in the moment. Increasingly men are startng to display these qualitites as well and most of the time they drive women up the wall. Men and women do complement each other but it seems that lately men and women are creating nothing but friction.
Mustang Sally Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 Yeah, I know what you mean. Lots of friction in my own M (and I don't mean the pounding penis-vagina kind! ) But, oy vey! Ach de liebe! It is ever thus! (pick your favorite ethnic saying....) It's hard to find representation of things right in the world on internet message boards, no? I am certainly here to b*tch about my problems from time to time (just not tonight - I'm taking a paid leave on that one). You have a good, non-nagging woman, don't you?
Author Woggle Posted April 5, 2007 Author Posted April 5, 2007 Yeah, I know what you mean. Lots of friction in my own M (and I don't mean the pounding penis-vagina kind! ) But, oy vey! Ach de liebe! It is ever thus! (pick your favorite ethnic saying....) It's hard to find representation of things right in the world on internet message boards, no? I am certainly here to b*tch about my problems from time to time (just not tonight - I'm taking a paid leave on that one). You have a good, non-nagging woman, don't you? Of course I do and I think it is because she knows I won't put up with it. The key to having a good marriage is having a backbone and many men have no backbone. Their wives cheat on them and they are the ones to apologize and promise to change.
johan Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 Don't you disobey me, Johan! I didn't give you permission to speak! {**whacks whip again**} Sorry! Sorry! i won't do that anymore... sorry.
Mustang Sally Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 Oh, come on! Don't lure me here to play and then pull that old one on me! (Remember, I'm packing a whip, and I have a bunch of silk cord in my office desk drawer, the better to tie you up with !) Isn't it because you don't alienate her in the relationship and make her feel like she's the only one doing the emotional work? You surely have to be giving her something in her love-bucket (and I mean that in a marriage-builders kind of way, not an innuendo way this time) or she wouldn't stay for the cave-man act...Am I right?
Author Woggle Posted April 5, 2007 Author Posted April 5, 2007 Oh, come on! Don't lure me here to play and then pull that old one on me! (Remember, I'm packing a whip, and I have a bunch of silk cord in my office desk drawer, the better to tie you up with !) Isn't it because you don't alienate her in the relationship and make her feel like she's the only one doing the emotional work? You surely have to be giving her something in her love-bucket (and I mean that in a marriage-builders kind of way, not an innuendo way this time) or she wouldn't stay for the cave-man act...Am I right? Of course I treat her right but that is because she treats me right. She ever starts pulling some of the crap that some other women pull and I will be out the door.
Mustang Sally Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 Well, then. I think that is only fair. I'm sure you two have defined your "limits" in the relationship, and it sounds like you are each giving (and getting) exactly what is needed. That is truly inspirational, given how many f*cked up M's are out there...mine included. I'm actually being serious here. Congratulations, man. Just let the other nagging gold-digger women to their own demise. Not worth either of our time. Right? Now where did he go...Johan! Where are you ? I need a thigh-rubbing! {**whack, whack**}
whichwayisup Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 She ever starts pulling some of the crap that some other women pull and I will be out the door. I hope you mean the big stuff and not the little things Woggle. I hate to say it, but couples nag eachother - The longer you're married, it just happens. And ya know what? It's not always a bad thing to have someone do that once in a while. I nag my H about certain things, he nags me about certain things, sure it's irritating at times, but it's part of being a couple. The good, the bad and the ugly! Anyway, I would hope that if you and your wife started having problems, or had some heated arguements that led to hurt feelings, sharing 'emotions' and 'communicating' would be working out and not just sucking it up, farting and sharing a beer, pretending ALL is OK because "men" don't like to share emotions.
luvstarved Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 Really I think that some women like to create drama and nag then call it emotional work. Many of the problems in marriages would solve themselves if women would just learn to relax and enjoy the moment Woggle, you are right. Some women do. Some men do, too. But I think the term is valid for many women who are in relationships in which the man tries to stick to old roles in new times. I am in that boat and I do feel that the "emotional work" is done largely by me and it is part of what we are trying to work out in counseling. My H would say "hear hear" to the "relax and enjoy the moment" comment. He would be content to just come home, read the paper, hang out, indulge his many hobbies and not feel compelled to talk about things like intimacy, etc. He is happy to do what he wants to do and just have a peaceful household. We took a relationship assessment - he scored a 35 (things are great!) and I scored an 18 (danger! danger!) because I am not satisfied with the way things are. I do the vast majority of domestic work (including maintenance and repair, finances and other "male" jobs) even though I work more hours and make more money. When I try to give him small responsibilities to lighten my load, he agrees to do them and then just doesn't. Meanwhile, he feels free to complain when things don't get done. He doesn't like to talk about feelings and emotions and characterizes my desires to be closer as me being needy, aggressive and demanding. He has anger issues but characterizes his anger as justifiable based on what other people do, while my anger is an emotional issue that I must work on. A double standard hangs over most every topic we discuss. We have sexual issues that we are working on physically (ie we were not having sex but now we are) but not working on injecting the intimacy. When I try to talk about it, he claims to be an open book but his demeanor is "sex life is fine and if you think otherwise you have an emotional problem" or "bringing that up again? There you go being aggressive and demanding again". (for the record, our sex life consists of 1-3 times a week we use a 10 minute window at 6am to engage in no foreplay, no afterglow, 5-10 minute sex with no non-essential touching; this occurs when he wants it to, and any attempts I make to initiate are rebuffed, so I don't think I am making a big stink over nothing). We fight a lot, usually because of his anger and impatience over people failing to comply with his wishes. By Wednesday of each week, he has independently planned his weekend with fun activities that I am free to come along on or not, but if I don't (because there is housework to be done, for example) then I am no fun. When I say that I want more from this relationship, a true partnership based on respect and intimacy, he says we are living the American dream and my demands render me very difficult to live with. He says vicious hurtful things and I am up all night reading books on relationships or writing him long letters to get it out of my system. He happily snoozes. When I tell him I wrote a letter, he never asks to read it, just says I should have gotten some sleep. When a counselor gave us a book to each read, I devoured it. He reads 10-15 pages at a time then puts it aside to read something else. So this type of emotional "clod" is what frustrates women. My husband doesn't want to be a clod and he tries very hard. When I objecting to him looking at porn (not that I have anything against it, it was just that he was using it as a substitute) he stopped; when I complained about the lack of sex, he "rose to the occasion" as it were. But the bottom line for a lot of women who reasonably use the term "emotional work" is that they are with guys who just want to do their own things, have their own way, leave the work to the women, complain when it isn't done, and not engage emotionally as a best friend and lover... I will be only too happy to relax and enjoy the moment when I have a fully engaged partner to do it with. Some guys refuse to show up and grow up and this is where women resent doing all the "emotional work". ESPECIALLY when these clods try to turn the tables and assert that the problem is not that they are selfish, lazy, emotionally unavailable pricks but that women are just too "emotionally needy" and say that "emotional work" just means "the right to be a nagging bitch". The irony to me is that I truly believe that if guys would open up to the idea of reaching for a best friend and lover, they would be much happier, too. Gawd, I don't want to have touchy feely deep discussion love talks and an unending stream of romantic gestures. I just want to be living with someone that I can trust to say anything to, that I really, truly know intimately, and laugh and have fun with in a fully respectful relationship! But there is something scary in that for my H and a lot of men. Fear, insecurity, whatever. I know that my H thinks that I want more than I actually do. He thinks this because he avoids the situation and has not really listened as of yet. I realize that there is a lot of truth in that men just don't quite care about this stuff. They just want to cruise through without all this emotional crap that they find difficult to deal with. But, for me, if I am going to give what I give to this relationship, he's gotta give a little too. He scored high on that assessment because his needs are being met. I scored low because my needs are not. Does that make me too needy? I don't think so. What it means is that I have taken the time to try to give him what he needs from a relationship (yes yes we are all responsible for our own happiness in the end but you know what I mean) while he has been content to have me do that and not even really think about my needs. Sorry. Unfair. There are plenty of guys that ARE living in the 21st century. There need to be more.
Citizen Erased Posted April 5, 2007 Posted April 5, 2007 Seriously, Woggle honey enough. If your marriage is great then that is wonderful and I wish you the best of luck. But there will be times when it is bad. You need to learn how to deal with them. Instead of worrying about other peoples marriages, and who is responsible for it working, look towards making your marriage stronger so you don't have to worry about it turning out as badly as your last. It takes two and as long as both people realise that then the marriage can work.
boshemia Posted April 6, 2007 Posted April 6, 2007 While the roles can be reversed, the reason they say Women do most of the emotional work doesn't always been men are bad... One of the books I was just reading explained it more as the women tend to take on the emotional roles for both partners whether he wants her to or not... In marriage when any one partner tends to overfunction in one area, the other person tends to underfunction... As a woman I tend to say things like "I can't believe you aren't more upset about..." and then I get upset because he just waves it off. Emotionally I overfunction in our relationship, I FEEL enough for both of us... He has his areas of overfunctioning as well, my husband is the responsible one. He goes to work not matter how lousy he feels, he wouldn't even consider taking his own birthday off let alone something important for me... He always does a job to the best of his perfectionistic abilities. so you guessed it, I am the underfunctioner there. I drag my feet, I get things done in my own sweet time if it gets done at all. I'm cool with good enough, and it drives him nuts. My counselor pointed out that I have to stop emotionally overfunctioning for him and let him sort out his own emotions. Saying things like "How do you feel about it"... and shutting up and letting him feel it : ) So it's not necessarily a bad thing for men, in a way I guess it is our problem... and men get the consequences. If that makes you feel better If not... then "How do you feel about it?"
mental_traveller Posted April 6, 2007 Posted April 6, 2007 I was on another board and I kept hearing about how women do all the emotional work in a marriage. To me it sounded like another excuse to bash men but I would like to ask the women here. I have my own theories about what it means but I will explain that later. It means they spend excessive amounts of time pondering trivial and pointless emotional questions, like "He's 5 minutes later from work than usual - does this mean he doesn't love me?"
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