So.....my 9 year old baby girl.......

[littlekitty]

Moose where does your wife's comment about all the other 'drama' going on come from? Is there a lot of stuff going on at the moment that you are both trying to cope with? Perhaps she's at a breaking point and you're not seeing that in her? Perhaps she's too scared to admit that to you? That she's not coping?

 

Of course that's just a guess if there is a whole lot of 'drama' going on.

 

Best thing is to just sit down with your wife and calmly discuss like I know you would. Ask her why she's not following your usual methods, and let her know you are disappointed in her.

[sb129]

Already done....in fact, her uncle was at the house in full HP uniform to assist....I'm not upset that she left the decision of punishment up to me, I'm upset that she didn't tell me about the deed when she FIRST found out about it.

 

As far as being a team about discipline, why do you think we, WE insisted on a School with corporal punishment???

 

OK OK Sheesh. Just asking. Don't take it out on me.

WTF is HP uniform?

 

.my older sister is bi-polar and you can never tell what mood she's in, and it's usually a pretty negative one......so when the kids are acting this way, we tell them they must of caught, "ADS" (Aunt D Syndrome)....

 

Oh well thats a GREAT way to teach your children tolerance and acceptance of others. Can't believe you would do that, and still claim to be a christian.

 

Moose.... Happy children do not think to write death threats to other kids. Something serious is going on with your daughter and finding that out needs to be made more important than punishment, IMO. Yes she should be punished and spoken to about this. But the bottom line is, she is probably being picked on or bullied by kids at school, and for whatever reason she didn't feel safe enough to come to you for help. That is a failure on YOUR part as a parent, IMO. I am not trying to be mean, you know I have a great deal of respect for you. But you have two issues more serious than whether she gets a spanking or suspension: what trauma is going on in her life that made her feel her only recourse was writing a DEATH THREAT, and why didn't she feel safe enough to come to her parents for help and support. JMO.

 

Good post Pink Tulip.

 

For what its worth (even tho Moose obviously thinks I have NO credibility despite the fact I was only trying to help) is I think Moose is focusing too much on the slip up of his wife, and NOT why his daughter is doing what she is doing.

 

Spanking her isn't going to deal with the root of the problem.

[JamesM]

I am with Pink Tulip on this one.

 

My first question when I read what your daughter did was ...why did she do this, not what should be done.

 

And then when I read what your wife did, I had the same reaction.

 

I understand your hurt and anger. And I can see why you want to "punish" those who have done wrong. But I think your main focus for the long term is to find out why in an openminded way.

 

When my wife has held out on me regardig a son's disobedience..nothing so radical as what your daughter did, it was to spare my child from my immediate reactionary anger. And she was usually right. Then later she did tell me so that she herself could tell me the whole story. This gave me a better perspective and gave me time to really think through the situation. I find that my first reaction is not always my best.

 

As for corporal punishment for a 9 year old, I am not thinking personally that this is the most effective. "If you write any more notes that you are going to hurt someone, then I am going to hurt you." I know that isn't what is being said, but here I think it sends that message. And Moose, I think you know by now that you and I agree on most everything...including corporal punishment. I think if it was my child, I would choose ISS and some sort of loss punishment (loss punishment meaning she loses privileges for a period of time). She needs to also learn proper handling of difficult situations and anger. I am guessing that she did not just devise the idea to send threatening notes for simple fun.

 

As for Mrs. Moose, she deserves your respect and trust first. This may be the opposite of what you feel, but finding out what her motivation was may be helpful. It may stem back to past incidents or it may be a reaction to avoid conflict with you and/or your daughter. Either way, neither are good. So, talking with her AFTER you have cooled off may be helpful. Your goal is not to punich her, but to prevent future "infractions.' Just as you are not perfect, she is not perfect. She may have made a mistake, but she is still your wife.

[Pink_Tulip]

i would just instill in her head that yuou WILL always find out things she does

 

good point – I think parental pressure should be stronger than peer pressure or the desire to do something boneheaded. It might create a false sense of fear, but if it keeps your kid on the straight and narrow just so she doesn't have to hear her folks complain about bad behavior, it's worth it.

 

Or, maybe... instill in her that no matter what is going on in her life, she can always come to you and be honest without fear of judgement or overly harsh punishment? These are your kids Moose, and I am not going to tell you how to parent, just offer that if this is the way you relate to your kids, it isn't hard to see why she felt she needed to take care of her bully herself rather than go to her parents for help.

 

Another issue I have, while rereading this is... You seem a lot angrier at your wife for not telling you so you could punish your child, rather than being angry at her for not telling you your precious child was going through serious trauma at school. Priorities seem a little out of whack. Moose, I am afraid you are letting issues between you and your wife cloud your judgement. It's like, you are looking for a reason to be pissed at your wife rather than being completely horrified that your daughter is experiencing something this serious. You know what I mean? I am not at all trying to diminish your feelings in all this. I'll just reiterate, please don't let your child get lost in all this.

[prettyprincess]

The question you should be asking her is what are those kids doing to her physically or mentally to provoke such letters to be written? She might be getting harassed on a daily basis and believe me, it will do damage to your psyche.

[whichwayisup]

Our youngest.....has been writing death threats to kids on the bus......

 

This came as a shock to me! What really set me off is that I just found out about it last night after work. That's when Mrs. Moose had told me that I'd be getting an email this morning asking if I want her to get ISS or swats.

 

Mrs. Moose knew about the notes ahead of time, (two days before), and didn't tell me. She knew that if I had found out, I would've lectured the little, "princess", and punished her myself......she said she couldn't put up with all the drama this week, so she kept her mouth shut about it. But now, one of the kids uproached the principal with one of the letters, and it's time to pay the piper.

 

I'm very, VERY upset with Mrs. Moose right now, and of course lil' princess.....

 

I, (of course), am going to tell the principal to spank her, but now.....what should I do about Mrs. Moose and her, "I didn't want to deal with the drama", mentality when it comes to disciplining, or talking to our kids when these things happen? I am so livid about it. She should NEVER EVER hid these things from me.....

 

You have every right to be pissed off Moose. Your wife had no right to hide that information from you for 2 whole days!

 

Just shows that whatever else problems you have, it's spilled out to other places. Sorry...Had to say that.

 

As for your daughter, does she feel remorse? Instead of spanking her, listen to her. She's obviously upset or acting out for some reason. (Oh and don't mention to the principal that you're gonna spank your daughter. He'll call the cops on you. Just tell him that it will be dealt with.)

If the school doesn't mention this, you should bring your daughter to some counselling.

 

I hope she understands what she did was wrong, and that she feels remorse. But, let her talk. I'm sure she's scared of you, scared of upsetting and disappointing you. Let her know you love her, no matter what - If she feels too scared she won't open up to you.

 

You and your wife need to talk and figure out the parenting thing. She can't be hiding stuff from you and as your kids get older, teen issues, you BOTH have to know wtf goes on in your kids life, otherwise they'll divide and conquer, pit you and your wife against eachother - and that will cause MORe problems than you'd like to know about.

[magichands]

i was paddled in the second grade.... and you know it was because i told a boy i would cut his head off, actually I said HAIR, but he misunderstood, and i got whipped.

:lmao:

 

Life sooo isn't fair.

[whichwayisup]

Forget the part where I mentioned you spanking your daughter. I just got caught up reading the rest of your thread...I didn't realize the school allowed paddling.

[JackJack]

I'm coming into this a little late, and I did not read all of the replies. So if its been mentioned, I aplogize. Sounds like these "death threats" are a sign of crying out for help. Something is going on either at home or at school or possibly both.

 

Have you talked with her about if anything was going on at school?

 

I don't think it was right either Mrs. Moose didn't talk with you about it. Perhaps there is something going on with her as well, for why she felt she couldn't talk to you about it.

[Touche]

Playing devil's advocate here....what jumped out at me is the fact that you said something about the confrontation with your daughter would have taken hours until it was resolved. I have never held back anything concerning our child with H but if every time there was an issue we had to sit down for hours with him, I might be inclined to hold back as well.

 

I think this is the key here.

 

Why HOURS? Our son is 11 years old soon and we've never had an issue with him (and yes, we've had some issues) that necessisated hours worth of resolution. Normally, H and I discuss alone together how we will handle any issue and then confront our son with our decision regarding the consequences. No muss, no fuss. No long discussions. We present a united front and deliver the consequences with very little discussion with him.

 

So anyway, do you think there's something to what I'm saying? Because it sounds to me like she didn't tell you to avoid that long session with your daughter. And I must say that I don't blame her.

 

Also, just wanted to add that our son is in public school that DOES allow paddling. I think someone asked if that was still legal...it certainly is and I'm glad of it. I agree Moose...more schools should employ it.

[Moose]

As soon as I got home from work, my 17 year old helped me carry the pizza in, and I was met at the door by my daughters, (the usual, "Daddys home" hugs and kisses), and they went straight to the Friday feeding frenzy.

 

Afterwards, lil' princess came and sat on the arm of my recliner, (her favorite spot) and we talked.

 

Me: "Hey sissy, can I ask you a question about what happened at school?"

 

T: "I already talked to Mommy about it, am I still in trouble?"

 

Me: "NO, you're not in trouble, I just want to know how it happened, can you tell me?"

 

T: "Dakota, Jessica, and me were bored, so we played a joke on James"

 

Me: "Who's idea was it to write the note?"

 

T: "Dakota's"

 

Me: "Oh, I see. Didn't you know it was wrong?"

 

T: "I felt like it was wrong, but I didn't think I would get into trouble for it" (She delivered the note to the boy)

 

Me: "Well, from now on can you do me a favor?"

 

T: "I guess, it depends on what you're going to say"

 

Me: "Anytime, ANYTIME, you feel inside that you're about to do something wrong, do not do it, go to an adult, and let them know what's going on"

 

T: "Ok"

 

We talked a little longer about how serious things like this is, and she asked if she could go stay the night at a friends house. Mrs. Moose had already grounded her so I had to tell her she couldn't, that I would be dis-respecting Mom if I did.

 

So I don't think there's a deep rooted issue, she was cohersed into delivering the note, and she fell for it, and paid the price.

 

Now I feel like crap cause I don't think she should've gotten the swats. Although, it will teach her a lesson about being talked into something she knows is wrong.

 

Thanks everyone for your insight about my daughter. Now I'll need to figure out what to do about Mrs. Moose, and her not keeping me in the loop.....

 

And I'm not sure who said this, but I'm not LOOKING for reasons to be mad at my wife. I DO need to find out why our methods are being tweeked after 19 years......

[Touche]

That was a very reasonable discussion you had with your daughter. And a short one. Can you say whether it would have gone the same way had your wife told you about the incident when she found out about it? Or is it that you've had time now to digest it all and approached it differently now?

 

I guess I'm agreeing with one of the posters here (was it James?) who said that maybe your FIRST reactions aren't always the best ones. And perhaps your wife knows this and decided to hold back from telling you about this right away.

[alphamale]

Now I feel like crap cause I don't think she should've gotten the swats. Although, it will teach her a lesson about being talked into something she knows is wrong..

ha ha you should watch some old re-runs of Leave It To BEaver. Mr. Cleaver was always dealing with that shyt. That Larry Mondello was a real devil always gettin' the Beav into trouble.

[JackJack]

The conversation you just explained you had with her, is the conversation that probably should have taken place before the swatting began. Always listen to your kids explain themselves and get the whole, story before anythign else needs to take place.

[Ariadne]

Boy...

 

~ I'd be getting an email this morning asking if I want her to get ISS or swats.

 

~ ISS: "In School Suspension" Swats: Paddling

 

~ Now I feel like crap cause I don't think she should've gotten the swats.

 

~ As far as being a team about discipline, why do you think we, WE insisted on a School with corporal punishment???

 

~ The principal made it very clear that she not only could kick her out of School, BUT, she could call the police and have charges brought up on her.

 

~ my older sister is bi-polar and you can never tell what mood she's in, and it's usually a pretty negative one......

 

---------------

 

(I wouldn't be one bit surprised if your little princess actually kills somebody, or never talks to you for the rest of her life)

 

Ariadne

[whichwayisup]

Me: "Hey sissy, can I ask you a question about what happened at school?"

 

T: "I already talked to Mommy about it, am I still in trouble?"

 

See, already (even if her tone didn't show it) her even asking am I still in trouble and saying she already talked to 'mommy' about it - means, she KNOWS your wife protected her from you.

Which, leads me to my next point....

 

We talked a little longer about how serious things like this is, and she asked if she could go stay the night at a friends house. Mrs. Moose had already grounded her so I had to tell her she couldn't, that I would be dis-respecting Mom if I did.

 

Fact that she knows she's grounded and asked you if she could still spend the night at a friends house, (normal kid stuff, to sneak in trying to get away with asking and pin you and your wife against eachother) THing is, would she have tried that if the TWO of you both spoke to your daughter at the same time? Just seems your daughter now will see her mom as the displinary officer and go around you. Hope that makes sense...

 

Me: "Oh, I see. Didn't you know it was wrong?"

 

T: "I felt like it was wrong, but I didn't think I would get into trouble for it" (She delivered the note to the boy)

 

Atleast she knew it was wrong. IS she showing remorse, regret of her actions and involvement? Just seems she's very aloof, unless it's the way you're telling the story............Like the whole thing wasn't a big deal.

 

So I don't think there's a deep rooted issue, she was cohersed into delivering the note, and she fell for it, and paid the price.

 

Let's hope that she learned her lesson. And, hopefully next time she won't follow the crowd or get sucked into something.

 

Question. Have you and your wife thought about talking to the other kids with their parents around? Just so the stories are straight. I mean, what if the kid she said came up with the idea, denies it? Blames your daughter?

 

All the kids involved should talk to James and appologize to him. That would be good for them. Just a suggestion.

[whichwayisup]

Now I'll need to figure out what to do about Mrs. Moose, and her not keeping me in the loop.....

 

And I'm not sure who said this, but I'm not LOOKING for reasons to be mad at my wife. I DO need to find out why our methods are being tweeked after 19 years......

 

Yup, you two need to talk this out and find out the real reason why she felt the need to keep it from you for 2 days.

 

Good luck Moose.

[Touche]

I just wanted to chime and say that Witch, you gave great advice except for one thing: My H and I are ALWAYS, (really always) on the same page regarding presenting a united front when it comes to discipline issues. But irrespective of that fact, the little rascal STILL tries to go around one of us. So, in my experience, that's a perfectly normal thing kids do whether the parents are on the same page or not.