sarme Posted August 9, 2006 Posted August 9, 2006 So I posted here a 3 months ago about a married man I met through a function I attended with my folks, he turned out to be in the same industry as myself and we had plans to work together. Our project to work together quickly turned into a more than work attraction, unbeknownst to me, he became very attracted to me and I in turn also felt a strong pull. It did not begin with that intent at all, at least not on my part. We do have great things in common and we are very attracted to one another, physically, and intellectually/personalitywise we are like twins....we are both culturally the same (born in same country and now living in Canada) and have the same goals in life. We saw each other a few more times after we established there was a strong attraction between us and then I tried breaking it off many times. Our emotional affair continued off and on, via email and phone calls but it was a constant battle for me. Never wanted to be the OW never will be (no offence to women who are in this position, it does happen to the best of us so I am not pointing fingers, I understand but I refused to let it get to that point with me at least physically) . He kept insisting agressively when I would cut all ties, emails, phone calls, show up at my house after work etc. you name it and would not take the hint that I wanted nothing to do with him if he was with someone, but he kept assuring me he was going to move out. I kept insisting "then call me when you are free and we can talk then" We saw each other one last time (he had shown up at my place) and talked for a long time and ended up kissing passionately. It was out of this world of course, but I ended all our contact after that. This time it was for good and he respected it somewhat(well he still emailed and called but I would respond every 5 days or so) . I felt horribly bad and just sick to my stomach that I let it get that far so he still insisited we needed to see each other and has been telling me he was leaving his wife and that the problems were there for many years now. no kids, three year marriage and eight years together. According to him the passion was never there, they met as roomates, fell in love but he says he was never wowed by her and drifted into marriage, eseentially the way he diecribes their personalities is that they are day and night. Though he had not really thought of leaving her prior to meeting me, he knew he was just coasting and was not satsified in his rel. in fact he says he has wanted children for a long time but just did not see her as the mother of his children. Weird thing to say huh? did he not see her as that when he married her? Well the day is finally here he moves into his new place next week. Of course he is renting an apt. and still has the house with his wife etc. My thing is I will see him but I am very cautious of getting involved with him physically before he is 100% done with his ex. Anyone out there in a similar sitatuation? All I keep thinking is he told her "I want to try being on my own for a month" meanwhile trying to get his way with me and then crawling back to his wife after he has a taste of the free life. Who's to say he is not just having a "grass is greener"moment? He assures me it is much deeper than that, has told me he fell head over heels in love with me and his body laguage does not lie. When I am with him he shows me with his every being that he is in love with me. HE also assures me that this was something he should have done a long time ago, but I can't seem to trust him fully. Are we doomed from the get-go? He said he would be out begining of Aug and he stuck to his word so a side of me really wants to believe him. He also tells me it is hard to leave her because he does not want to hurt her, but that he must. She is fighting to keep him. I am more confused now than when I knew I was not going to get involved with him.... Sam
Sami_D Posted August 10, 2006 Posted August 10, 2006 I think you're very wise to be cautious at this stage. Perhaps keep it 'dates only' and no stop-overs for 6 months or so, and see how things progress with him finding his feet and setting himself up alone. The more 'unavailable' you are, and telling him it will be that way until he has shown you he's serious about separation and filing, and going through with it (in terms of his actions) the more likely I think it will be to actually happen. Don't fall for words, when the actions don't match. How many times have we seen THAT go wrong..? Have a read of the reviews for this book, and see if you think it might help you: How to Survive Your Boyfriend's Divorce, by Robyn Todd.
Author sarme Posted August 10, 2006 Author Posted August 10, 2006 Sami D thank you very much for your kind words and wise advise. I think you are absolutely right and I have said to him many times, speak to me in actions not words. I too am a firm believer that actions speak louder. I have been looking around for literature that deals with this type of topic but I have been to embarassed to go in to a bookstore to pick something up....the book you recommended looks terrific, thanks again!
inarut Posted August 10, 2006 Posted August 10, 2006 You are much stronger than I have ever been. Good for you! Don't give me. Believe me, you will regret it.
Author sarme Posted August 10, 2006 Author Posted August 10, 2006 Well Inarut, it has not been easy. It has taken a LOT. But I know that putting all the moral issues aside, if I had gotten involved with this man physically I would have let myself become emotionally vulnerable, and I am not willing to do that with a man who is not available. Stumbling upon this site has helped me out immmensely, a lot of what the women here speak about in their experiences was already clear to me that it could happen to me if I let myself get involved with this man. Inadvertently by staying strong and standing my ground with this man I managed to: a) discover his true intentions/emotions b) let his actions speak for or with his words c) let his true colours shine through d) help me gain some trust in him It's hard enough getting to know a regular single man let alone one who lies to his wife to be with you. I read some of the posts on here and all I can say is that we have to stay strong for ourselves and we have to protect ourselves because these men are only looking out for their well being, they ALL want their cake and to eat it too. I am not sure how things would have turned out if I had just given in and followed my heart blindly. They will say WHAT IT TAKES to have us and we need to learn to read past those pretty words and make them put their actions to the test. This is not to say I don't still have my doubts, I do, beleive me I do. but little by little that trust that is so hard to gain from being the OW is growing with this man, and all because I refrained from going with knee jerk reactions. My advice to all the women out ther wanting to buy into the pretty words with often little truth, DON'T see him. Especially if you know you are vulnerabe. Don't pur yourself in the lion's den if you don't want to be mulled by the lion. I know that sounds harsh but you need to be strong and you need to think the worst. If he trully loves you he will prove it to you. If you let yourself be used he WILL use you.
inarut Posted August 10, 2006 Posted August 10, 2006 Those are some powerful words. I am going to remember them everytime I am tempted to contact my MM. Thanks!!!
Author sarme Posted August 10, 2006 Author Posted August 10, 2006 Sure thing Inarut. You must look out for yourself because no one else will. Men (or women) in these situations are selfish they are just there for the take, and they will say whatever they can to convince OW/OM that they are not. I saw that my guy could have done this if I allowed it, the tendency was definitely and is there. I am not going to say the proverbial "you deserve better" because only you know what you deserve, but I can say that we ALL deserve to be given a fair chance to enter into a relationship on even ground. We all deserve to give 100% into a new relationship, whether we or the other person does or not, is always the risk that we take when we enter a normal relationship. But guaranteed that when we allow ourselves a chance to form a tie with someone who is not available we enter this relationship with a handicap. As I said to him the last time we broke off contact, "talk to me when you are free, I would rather know you worked out things with your wife and made a concsious choice to stay than to know you came to me for a temporary escape. My life will go on, it's not like I am losing you if you stay because I never had you. The only thing I will lose is the hopes of what we could have had if you left"
Author sarme Posted August 20, 2006 Author Posted August 20, 2006 Feeling a little lost and confused but ultimately good that I stuck to my guns and played the game my way: I met MM a week ago friday and we discussed how things would be when he moved out and the fact that I could not give him my 100% until he filed for divorce, basically separation was not enough for me to go into it 100%. He got very uspet with me and called me a coward, told me I was not willing to give it my 100% was not willing to take risks, etc. It was a hellish week because we faught and then broke contact and he left me feeling like it was my faul we had ended things and that I did not want to continue with him. I was confused. Needless to say he did not move out, GEES that's a surprise!!! He called me today crying and telling me that he had tried twice to pack his things this week and go but he could not do it that he was extremely confused and that he did not want to lose me that he was so devestated and utterly confused but that he could not go through the seperation and was emotionally very confused. Funny thing is I totally understand him, afterall we only met 6 moths ago and we had an emotional rel, but have not even slept together or shared real intimacy. I told him I knew that all along. I was hurt and dissapointed since he had been so convincing all along but a part of me always saw what was really going on therefore I was not surprised. Well he called me this weekend and have been talking back and forth and have decide to go back to our plan a) we are going to work together afterall, he landed a deal that he started this weekend and he would like me to join him in his venture as of next week and I accepted it. I accepted because it is a great opportunity for me and a great career move, but I am unsure of how things will play out for us as far as how we will handle our emotions. I had to take the opportunity, (after much consideration) it is what i wanted ever since day one when I met him, but I am unsure I will be able to work with him so closely and not let emotions get in the way. He asked me to please join him since the project was created the whole time with me in mind and he does need me to have it work best, and I can see that. I am firm on my decision to NOT get involved with him physically or even emotionally anymore. So I have no worries there, I have proven to myself I can do it. My question is has anyone out there tried to work with their MM man AFTER the breakup? I am sure he will still try things but I am extremely set on putting all stops on it, and I know I can because I can be a cold b**ch when I want to be. We will soon find out if this will end in a recipe for disaster but I figure I can only gain professionally. Feedback?
whichwayisup Posted August 20, 2006 Posted August 20, 2006 Needless to say he did not move out, GEES that's a surprise!!! He called me today crying and telling me that he had tried twice to pack his things this week and go but he could not do it that he was extremely confused and that he did not want to lose me that he was so devestated and utterly confused but that he could not go through the seperation and was emotionally very confused. Hmm, and he had the nerve to call YOU a coward...Nice eh? I think you know what you need to do and stick to it. Even if he leaves her, moves out etc., the chances are he'll move back home. Emotionally he's not ready to deal with the fallout and I'm sure he's terrified of losing all that he knows and is comfortable with. Say in a year or so if he does actually leave, and enough time goes by that he's healed, then re-evaluate the situation. Until then, live your life for you, and to be honest I think you working with him is a huge mistake. Neither of you know exactly how you'll feel or handle working together so closely. It's too soon and it's only going to mess you up.
Author sarme Posted August 21, 2006 Author Posted August 21, 2006 Whichway great words!!! thank you for that. I agree 100% even with the uncertainty of working together, I have to agree. BUT I agreed to it because it is only once a week for a total of 4 hours, we are doing a radio show together on weekends so it will be in and out and that's it. Other than that my life will be lived day to day totally independant of his. I know it's a tough call but I am willing to try. I know, the nerve of him to call ME a coward. It was so blantly obvious he just did not have the cojones to go through with things.... LOL loved your steven wright comment, I love that guy!!!
whichwayisup Posted August 21, 2006 Posted August 21, 2006 Yeah, I stumbled across that quote and it made me laugh so hard! Great voice too! Well, try it and see how it goes. And, don't do 'personal' talk with him. Completely ignore his advances, conversations or anything referring to you and him. Keep it on the straight and narrow...If you start feeling too much, just remember how much he's capable of hurting you and making you feel bad. Bring up the anger inside you - That oughtta stop you from letting him in.
Sami_D Posted August 21, 2006 Posted August 21, 2006 Looks like your gut instinct was right on with him. I'd be careful with working with him (if that's what you really have to do). He WILL try more emotional blackmail and pushiness and not taking no for an answer and being 'confused'. Don't let your guard down. Ever. Don't get sucked into this. It's what he wants. Do you really need to get into this work situation... it's going to be tough rebuffing him every week. Even the strongest of us can be worn down by the drip, drip, drip approach. Take care of yourself. And he has SUCH a cheek to call you a coward. I have no idea how you can still talk to him.
Author sarme Posted August 21, 2006 Author Posted August 21, 2006 Yes I know this sounds like a bad idea all around, but suprisingly enough now that I know that he just couldn't do it I feel at ease. I know this sounds strange and that I should be devestated that he did not move out, but I had a feeling he was thinking of moving out just because he met me, and to me that was all the wrong reasons I did NOT want him like that. He managed to convince me otherwise in his words but his actions spelled soemthing different. I feel relieved because if he did go through with the move we would have probably slipped into physical mode once he was on his own eventually, and THEN I would have been really hurt when he said he was confused and had to move back home. This way it hurt to let go of the hopes I had for all the plans we had together but nowhere near as much as I would have hurt, so in that sense I feel at ease. I really do feel releived, notice my original point which was "HE IS MOVING OUT NOW WHAT?" I really felt uneasy. The other thing is that when he told me it was me who ended it because of my cowardice he actually left me believing he was a liar and had reeled me in only for sex, in other words he did not mean the words of loving me and that devestated me. But know knowing that he was just not ready for the move I understand that his feelings were 100% honest and that he really did develop feelings for me but that he cannot make the move he is still unsure. So the way I figure it is that it is going to be a LOT harder for him, than it is for me. I will be a reminder of what he cannot have. As for what he represents for me I'm not sure yet but we will see. I want to give this work thing a go. It's a great opportunity for me and I have to be pragmatic about it. If i did not get love out of this union (which was not what I wanted to begin with) I want to walk away with the professional gain, which WAS my main goal to begin with. We'll see I will keep you posted how it goes after our first show ;-) I have a feeling he won't make it easy. Already today he has sent me emails stating how much he misses me and how confused he is and how the main character of a movie he watched on the weekend reminded him of me etc. So I know this is not easy for him. I just needed to know that. I know that sounds bad but it does make the pain a little better for me.
officespace Posted August 23, 2006 Posted August 23, 2006 OMG, my ex said the same exact things. Moved out quickly but didn't make a clean brake. i don't want to be negative, but I see red flags going up everywhere. My ex even said the same words about his W.....she never really 'blew him away'. Of course, after 9 months of waiting and agony, I broke it off and he was back with her within a few weeks. My guy also 'kept to his word' for the first two months. After, it was one broken promise after another.....be careful!!!
Sami_D Posted August 23, 2006 Posted August 23, 2006 I have a feeling he won't make it easy. Already today he has sent me emails stating how much he misses me and how confused he is and how the main character of a movie he watched on the weekend reminded him of me etc. So I know this is not easy for him. I just needed to know that. I know that sounds bad but it does make the pain a little better for me. The thing is that at the moment you're feeling up and strong and even finding it funny that you're the one in control. But things can have a habit of biting us on the bum. He's going to be relentless and attentive and eventually you might come to rely on his ego-boosting. And then BAM... all he has to do is take it away. If you're feeling pain now, he's already affected you too much. Anyway... just be careful.
Author sarme Posted August 23, 2006 Author Posted August 23, 2006 Officespace: is there a way to contact you directly on here? I would love to exchange stories it sounds like we were involved with the same man ;-) So did your man move out? and were you involved while he moved out? Sami: please explain this about relying on the ego boost and being cut off suddenly, I think I know what you mean...but I would like you to elaborate on that. right now I am just thinking "work" I am not really weighing out the emotional repercutions, though I should....so perhaps I need a good kick in the butt in that sense. But I honestly feel like I need to be one track mind right now. We met last night for a coffee to go over work things and we talked about us since there were a lot of questions since our "break-up" He basically told me he was in love with me but that he could not move out now, that it was difficult and that he is very confused especially since I won't open up to him sexually/physically (as he put it it "throws him off" and makes him think I am not attracted to him) It amazes me the things guys will sayd to get what they want!!! He said that he knows that what he has done is wrong but that his heart is with me and that he can't help how confused he is and feels, he told me the old I think about you day and night and dream about you and cannot get you out of my head....blaaah blaaah blaaaah. He tried to kiss me several times, and I am aware it is NOT going to be easy to work with him but I have made it clear we are not going to progress anymore. I am so dead set on this because it angers me that he still wants his cake and THAt is what is going to give me strength to say no. I am dead set agianst being his toy. SO we'll see how our work rel. pans out. We do work very well together. Oh the best part is that he told me that he does not want me to get involved with anyone yet. LOL I honestly laughed in his face!
Author sarme Posted August 23, 2006 Author Posted August 23, 2006 Officespace: is there a way to contact you directly on here? I would love to exchange stories it sounds like we were involved with the same man ;-) So did your man move out? and were you involved while he moved out? Sami: please explain this about relying on the ego boost and being cut off suddenly, I think I know what you mean...but I would like you to elaborate on that. right now I am just thinking "work" I am not really weighing out the emotional repercutions, though I should....so perhaps I need a good kick in the butt in that sense. But I honestly feel like I need to be one track mind right now. We met last night for a coffee to go over work things and we talked about us since there were a lot of questions since our "break-up" He basically told me he was in love with me but that he could not move out now, that it was difficult and that he is very confused especially since I won't open up to him sexually/physically (as he put it it "throws him off" and makes him think I am not attracted to him) It amazes me the things guys will sayd to get what they want!!! He said that he knows that what he has done is wrong but that his heart is with me and that he can't help how confused he is and feels, he told me the old I think about you day and night and dream about you and cannot get you out of my head....blaaah blaaah blaaaah. He tried to kiss me several times, and I am aware it is NOT going to be easy to work with him but I have made it clear we are not going to progress anymore. I am so dead set on this because it angers me that he still wants his cake and THAt is what is going to give me strength to say no. I am dead set agianst being his toy. SO we'll see how our work rel. pans out. We do work very well together. Oh the best part is that he told me that he does not want me to get involved with anyone yet. LOL I honestly laughed in his face!
Sami_D Posted August 23, 2006 Posted August 23, 2006 Sami: please explain this about relying on the ego boost and being cut off suddenly, I think I know what you mean...but I would like you to elaborate on that. right now I am just thinking "work" I am not really weighing out the emotional repercutions, though I should....so perhaps I need a good kick in the butt in that sense. But I honestly feel like I need to be one track mind right now. Well, we all go through phases of feeling up and good an in control of our lives.. .and then other patches come around when we're not feeling so good about things... and we're apt to fall back on those who provide us with something more. We can come to rely on other people in ways we never really understood untill they pull the rug when we really need it. I mean, I don't know you, or him. And maybe he's not into game playing. But you do seem a little into being on top, or power play as a way to avoid hurt. I can't say exactly how it would work. I've just been around long enough to see that thinking you're on top in something can end up in feeling very much the opposite. I can't really elaborate on how it might work in your/his case... just warn you to perhaps look out for your own feelings.
Author sarme Posted August 23, 2006 Author Posted August 23, 2006 Well Sami I hear what you are saying and I agree that I do need to stay on top of my feelings. Just to help you understand where I am coming from, I am not looking to be in control of him I just want to be in control of myself, in order to avoid getting hurt. This work opportunity is important for me and it's a break that I would have gotten so easily had I not met him so I want to stay on top of that for my own well being. The fact that I ended up devloping feelings for this man has very much complicated things, but the reason I refuse to get more involved with him is not because I want to power trip over him, it's to protect my own heart. And yes he is very much into playing games but I see it. I think that is important that I see it. A good friend of mine who is a very attractive woman and very successful in her career told me these great words "if you are an attractive woman men are always going to want to sleep with you, professionally speaking they will test the waters in promise of giving you career advances. They can want to sleep with you all they want, and they can think they will but if they are willing to further your career on the notion that one day they will have you well, why not use it to your advantage?" And you know what? She is absolutely right! I cannot control what he is now going to play out in his head, I have to look out for myself. The only thing I can control is not getting invovled phsyically to avoid further emotional depth. Everything else is in the hands of time.
Sami_D Posted August 23, 2006 Posted August 23, 2006 As long as you can stay on top of things, you are fine. Hey I know there are many flirtings at the work place, and it can definitely get you places. As long as you're aware of what's going on and don't start to fall for his words or need them, then good luck to you. Take care!
Author sarme Posted August 23, 2006 Author Posted August 23, 2006 I know what you mean Sami he already is putting on the words full force. Last night even he was back to his own antics, but the difference is that I see through his words now. now I know what he is really thinking and wanting to do. Before he reeled me in with all these promises to so much but now I know what he is capable of and the only way I will allow him in is if he shows me in actions. But I do understand that is it going to be hard not to let his pretty words take me away at times, you are ABSOLUTELY spot on about that one! Well the funny thing is that he has asked me not to start seeing anyone yet because it will kill him...I mean to what lengths this guy will go to try to have his every way. I told him my life started up again the minute he told me was not moving out. He told me last night to please let him know so that he can move on when I tell him I am seeing someone else...he said he can handle me saying to him "no to get involved because of moral reasons and because he is unavailable" but it will distroy him to know I have fallen for someone else. What the hell is that!?!? seriously not to generalize, and believe me this whole world is SO new to me, but c'mon these guys really do have rocks in their heads. AH HELLO YOU'RE MARRIED! does that even mean anything to you?
movinon05 Posted August 23, 2006 Posted August 23, 2006 What he fails to grasp is - you are entitled to have a life without worrying about how it affects him. He hasn't figured out that it works both ways. My exMM used to tell me that if I ever date anyone, please don't bring him around in our area and places where he might see us or people we know might see us and tell him. It would just kill him! But that didn't stop him from being around town with his W. I was supposed to just suck it up. Which I did til I wised up. They really know how to play these head games.
Author sarme Posted August 24, 2006 Author Posted August 24, 2006 I'm curious to know what would happen if I did start dating someone. In fact I WILL date someone if they come along, I am not going to stop to avoid hurting him...that's just nuts. The thing is that I won't tell him because I don't want it to affect our working relationship,though he says it won't. I already told him I am going to date if the opportunity comes along and he told he wants to know as soon as I meet someone that I am serious about and then he said because then I will close all doors on us. To which I said "what us?" there is no "us"...you may think I am hanging around for you but I am not. Deep down he thinks I will stick around for him to decide what he wants and it does not work that way. They really do try it all!
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