the definitive age and (online) dating thread

[aj22one]

In my life outside of LS I do demographic data analysis and ethnography for various organizations, businesses and government agencies. I’m off this whole week, and it’s a bit dreary outside today so I decided to use my wonderful skills to tackle that pesky issue known as age and dating. In this case particularly online dating.

 

Now for those new to this subject the gist of it is this: men prefer younger women for (*insert negative reason here*) and women prefer older men for (*insert reason here*), or at least that’s how the stereotype goes. My own stance on online dating is that for men, and particularly young men, it’s a complete waste of time and effort. I tried it (to see it what it’s about) and failed miserably. I found myself a lovely girlfriend though by other means, so no hard feelings.

 

But I’ve done a cursory survey of young men and young women (aged 20-25, I’ll do other age ranges later…maybe) on the site OkCupid. I looked at 53 profiles of each (I was going to do 100, then 75 but I gave up) living within 25 miles of me, at random (no repeat profiles). Here’s what I found:

 

For women:

21 out of 53 profiles (or 39.6%) were not open to dating men younger than them. 11 out of 53 (20.7%) had upper age ranges of 10 or more years, with the highest being 16 years, while 25 out of 53 (47%) had upper age ranges of 7 or more years.

 

Out of those women who were open to dating younger men, 62% were only open to men who were 1-2 years younger (37.7% of the total number of profiles). The average was 1.2 years younger and 6.9 years older. Two women preferred men who were older than them (both by at least a year) and none preferred younger men only.

 

For men:

Of the 53 male profiles, all were open to dating younger women (no surprise there). Two men preferred women their own age or younger, and one man preferred only younger women (so 50 of the 53 were ok with dating older women). There were two significant outliers however, men who were open to women 17 and 20 years older than they were. Before adjusting the numbers for these outliers the male averages were 3.85 years younger and 4.02 years older, after an adjustment the numbers went to 3.82 years younger and 3.45 years older.

 

14 of the 53 men preferred women who were no more than 2 years older than them, while 22 of the 53 (42%) were ok with dating a woman 4 or more years older, 44% of those who were open to dating older women.

 

So what does this mean? Well, on first glance it does mean that women are more open to older men than men are to older women, apparently women are somewhat less ageist. But, women are also more critical of youth. Preferring on average that a man be no more than one year younger than she is. Men, in contrast have much more balanced ranges (almost 4 years younger and about 3.5 years older). Seemingly, young men want a woman more or less their own age. It also lends credence to the idea that women prefer older men, the guys on here who are 30 or 35 and date slightly younger women are seemingly catering to women’s preferences for slightly older men.

 

Again, this isn’t a scientific study, 53 profiles is somewhat of a small sample size and online dating sites may or may not be indicative of wider trends off the net and in the real world. I’d invite people to do their own research and post their findings or maybe just merely post on this thread and criticize what I’m saying. Your choice of course. And yes, I was bored today.

[dasein]

Have posted it before, women set the tone of the future in HS when they seek out and overvalue upperclass men. Upperclass women are already after college aged men. How many upperclass women did you see with underclass men at the prom? At college datey functions? This continues throughout college, and then on into early working. Women have near complete control during this age range IME. Many women seeking and sharing few men during this time leaves many average men without a chair in the musical chair dating game. Those left out men age, focus on career and other things, and then when they actually start to have some power in dating, naturally gravitate towards the attention of prime younger women they never were "good enough" to attain in the past.

 

Of course there are many exceptions, I'm making a generalization about the mass. Personally, having dated all ages, prefer women in early 30s, but acknowledge I'm an exception to what I see around.

 

IMO, women maintain their preference against younger men well up into their 30s and beyond. One of my ex GFs first hesitated to date me in our 30s because I was 2 years younger, and she claimed that "younger men" hadn't fully developed yet, LOL.

[aj22one]

Have posted it before, women set the tone of the future in HS when they seek out and overvalue upperclass men. Upperclass women are already after college aged men. How many upperclass women did you see with underclass men at the prom? At college datey functions? This continues throughout college, and then on into early working. Women have near complete control during this age range IME. Many women seeking and sharing few men during this time leaves many average men without a chair in the musical chair dating game. Those left out men age, focus on career and other things, and then when they actually start to have some power in dating, naturally gravitate towards the attention of prime younger women they never were "good enough" to attain in the past.

 

Of course there are many exceptions, I'm making a generalization about the mass. Personally, having dated all ages, prefer women in early 30s, but acknowledge I'm an exception to what I see around.

 

IMO, women maintain their preference against younger men well up into their 30s and beyond. One of my ex GFs first hesitated to date me in our 30s because I was 2 years younger, and she claimed that "younger men" hadn't fully developed yet, LOL.

 

Definitely. I only really remember one girl who dated a guy younger than her when I was in high school. She was a junior and he was a freshman.

 

But this is in large part why women shouldn't be so judgmental about men who date women slightly younger (~5 years). It's just how the system works (and seemingly what women prefer). That being said however, I'm 24 and my gf is 23 (almost 24) and I prefer women more or less my own age.

 

I also find it telling that no one is disputing this so far. Perhaps people don't like facts getting in the way of their "truths".

Edited November 22, 2011 by aj22one

[dasein]

But this is in large part why women shouldn't be so judgmental about men who date women slightly younger (~5 years).

 

Well no sh-t. 40 years of them being told by thousands of messages a day that they can have it all and are perfect has something to do with that particular double standard they harbor.

[PlumPrincess]

In my life outside of LS I do demographic data analysis and ethnography for various organizations, businesses and government agencies. I’m off this whole week, and it’s a bit dreary outside today so I decided to use my wonderful skills to tackle that pesky issue known as age and dating. In this case particularly online dating.

 

Now for those new to this subject the gist of it is this: men prefer younger women for (*insert negative reason here*) and women prefer older men for (*insert reason here*), or at least that’s how the stereotype goes. My own stance on online dating is that for men, and particularly young men, it’s a complete waste of time and effort. I tried it (to see it what it’s about) and failed miserably. I found myself a lovely girlfriend though by other means, so no hard feelings.

 

But I’ve done a cursory survey of young men and young women (aged 20-25, I’ll do other age ranges later…maybe) on the site OkCupid. I looked at 53 profiles of each (I was going to do 100, then 75 but I gave up) living within 25 miles of me, at random (no repeat profiles). Here’s what I found:

 

For women:

21 out of 53 profiles (or 39.6%) were not open to dating men younger than them. 11 out of 53 (20.7%) had upper age ranges of 10 or more years, with the highest being 16 years, while 25 out of 53 (47%) had upper age ranges of 7 or more years.

 

Out of those women who were open to dating younger men, 62% were only open to men who were 1-2 years younger (37.7% of the total number of profiles). The average was 1.2 years younger and 6.9 years older. Two women preferred men who were older than them (both by at least a year) and none preferred younger men only.

 

For men:

Of the 53 male profiles, all were open to dating younger women (no surprise there). Two men preferred women their own age or younger, and one man preferred only younger women (so 50 of the 53 were ok with dating older women). There were two significant outliers however, men who were open to women 17 and 20 years older than they were. Before adjusting the numbers for these outliers the male averages were 3.85 years younger and 4.02 years older, after an adjustment the numbers went to 3.82 years younger and 3.45 years older.

 

14 of the 53 men preferred women who were no more than 2 years older than them, while 22 of the 53 (42%) were ok with dating a woman 4 or more years older, 44% of those who were open to dating older women.

 

So what does this mean? Well, on first glance it does mean that women are more open to older men than men are to older women, apparently women are somewhat less ageist. But, women are also more critical of youth. Preferring on average that a man be no more than one year younger than she is. Men, in contrast have much more balanced ranges (almost 4 years younger and about 3.5 years older). Seemingly, young men want a woman more or less their own age. It also lends credence to the idea that women prefer older men, the guys on here who are 30 or 35 and date slightly younger women are seemingly catering to women’s preferences for slightly older men.

 

Again, this isn’t a scientific study, 53 profiles is somewhat of a small sample size and online dating sites may or may not be indicative of wider trends off the net and in the real world. I’d invite people to do their own research and post their findings or maybe just merely post on this thread and criticize what I’m saying. Your choice of course. And yes, I was bored today.

The age difference for men between 20-25 is not that great, because, well, if the woman is more than four years younger, she is going to be below the legal age soon!

 

Do a check on men over 30 and you will something completely different. Men prefer women to be in their 20s or 30s, no matter how old they themselves are. I've seen guys in their 40s who think they can get a 20-something, while the upper age limit is maybe +1.

[aj22one]

The age difference for men between 20-25 is not that great, because, well, if the woman is more than four years younger, she is going to be below the legal age soon!

 

Do a check on men over 30 and you will something completely different. Men prefer women to be in their 20s or 30s, no matter how old they themselves are. I've seen guys in their 40s who think they can get a 20-something, while the upper age limit is maybe +1.

 

Oh I fully plan on doing more analysis. But you could say the same thing about women aged 20-25. All things being equal, if your theory were to be correct about legal age of consent, then women's age ranges should also be 4 older and 4 younger. But, they aren't.

[dasein]

Older men can actually get much younger women, I have 20ish girls hitting on me constantly and I'm no Lothario. If women have a problem with older men dating younger women, a portion of it is older men's preference for younger women, but an even greater portion is younger women's preference for older men. My senior citizen Dad gets flirty attention from young girls constantly, and I'm not talking "be sweet to the old codger" type attention either.

[aj22one]

The age difference for men between 20-25 is not that great, because, well, if the woman is more than four years younger, she is going to be below the legal age soon!

 

Do a check on men over 30 and you will something completely different. Men prefer women to be in their 20s or 30s, no matter how old they themselves are. I've seen guys in their 40s who think they can get a 20-something, while the upper age limit is maybe +1.

 

Well, I analyzed 50 profiles of men aged 30-40.

 

10 out of 50 (20%) were not open at all to dating women older than them. But only 4 required that the women be younger than them. In other words 80% of men aged 30-40 were open to dating older women, 34 out of the 50 were open to dating women 3 or more years older than they were.

 

36 out of 50 or 72% were open to dating women 9 or more years younger. While 4 out of 50 were open to women 9 or more years older. The original averages 9.58 younger, 5.12 older; but there was an outlier (a man who was interested in women up to age 99) so I had to find another profile to substitute in and the numbers changed to 9.54 years younger, 3.86 years older.

 

When compared to the younger women, the 20% of men who were not open to dating older women is a little more than half the percentage of women who weren’t open to dating younger men (as stated in my OP).

 

Up next, women aged 30-40. And, as always spreadsheets available upon request.

[Mme. Chaucer]

There are plenty of exceptions, but I believe that there is much evidence to prove that generally speaking, girls mature physically faster than boys. On average, girls start puberty as early as 9 and stop at 16 or 17, while boys start puberty at least at 11 and stop at 18 or 19.

 

This probably has something to do with teenage girls' interest in older boys.

 

This is sheerly anecdotal, but I clearly recall many of the freshman and sophomore girls in my high school who were going out with the upperclassmen. They were … the more "developed" ones. They looked WAY older than many of their age peers. They looked like women.

 

I wasn't one of them!

 

Some individuals maintain patterns set in high school days for a lifetime. Some don't.

[PlumPrincess]

When compared to the younger women, the 20% of men who were not open to dating older women is a little more than half the percentage of women who weren’t open to dating younger men (as stated in my OP).

Are you comparing women aged 20-25 with guys 30-40 or your whole sample of men? Whatever you did, why would you do this??? I'm not a genius in statistics, but the methods you use to draw your conclusions seem a little bit flawed.

[ThsAmericanLife]

The age difference for men between 20-25 is not that great, because, well, if the woman is more than four years younger, she is going to be below the legal age soon!

 

Do a check on men over 30 and you will something completely different. Men prefer women to be in their 20s or 30s, no matter how old they themselves are. I've seen guys in their 40s who think they can get a 20-something, while the upper age limit is maybe +1.

 

 

 

That's my observation as well. I tried online dating after my divorce (I was in my 30's), and again after my fiancee's death (in my 40's).

 

The preferred age range for men becomes more and more skewed the older they get...

 

... I haven't observed many men willing to go up as high as four years. Plum Princess says +1... mine is MAYBE +2... and for those +2...they are diving well into the -10 to -15 range (think 40 - 15 = 25).

 

If the numbers really are starting to swing more towards -10 to +4, then perhaps some of these guys are starting to get a clue. (I don't know... I haven't been doing online dating in quite awhile... 6 months at least)

 

I won't date a man with overly skewed age ranges... or much older men either. I want someone close to my own age...

Edited November 22, 2011 by ThsAmericanLife

[ThsAmericanLife]

Lots of women have daddy issues. The ones I know who make a habit of dating older men aren't particularly well-balanced emotionally.

 

Some women date older men for the same reasons young men date older women. They want to get their learn on sexually...

 

For people who aren't looking for a committed relationship, I suppose real compatibility in the long run isn't as much of a concern.

 

Keep in mind too, that plenty of people doing online dating (especially the free ones like OkC) aren't looking for serious relationships. It is too bad you can't factor that in. I wonder how that would change the results.

[aj22one]

That's my observation as well. I tried online dating after my divorce (I was in my 30's), and again after my fiancee's death (in my 40's).

 

The preferred age range for men becomes more and more skewed the older they get...

 

... I haven't observed many men willing to go up as high as four years. Plum Princess says +1... mine is MAYBE +2... and for those +2...they are diving well into the -10 to -15 range (think 40 - 15 = 25).

 

If the numbers really are starting to swing more towards -10 to +4, then perhaps some of these guys are starting to get a clue. (I don't know... I haven't been doing online dating in quite awhile... 6 months at least)

 

I won't date a man with overly skewed age ranges... or much older men either. I want someone close to my own age...

 

While I respect your opinion and I don't doubt what you say, the numbers that I've found do not correspond. As you see in what I wrote, men between the ages of 30 and 40 tend to prefer women be no more than 9.5 years younger and no more than 4 years older. That's a far cry from +1 and minus 20 as Plum Princess was insinuating.

[aj22one]

Are you comparing women aged 20-25 with guys 30-40 or your whole sample of men? Whatever you did, why would you do this??? I'm not a genius in statistics, but the methods you use to draw your conclusions seem a little bit flawed.

 

I'm saying that (young) women discriminate against younger men far more than older men discriminate against older women. At least that's what my sample size tells me. Again, not a scientific study but still fairly revealing.

[aj22one]

Lots of women have daddy issues. The ones I know who make a habit of dating older men aren't particularly well-balanced emotionally.

 

Some women date older men for the same reasons young men date older women. They want to get their learn on sexually...

 

For people who aren't looking for a committed relationship, I suppose real compatibility in the long run isn't as much of a concern.

 

Keep in mind too, that plenty of people doing online dating (especially the free ones like OkC) aren't looking for serious relationships. It is too bad you can't factor that in. I wonder how that would change the results.

 

For the record, I tossed out anyone who listed "casual sex" or who didn't list "long term dating" in their looking for section to minimize the risk of people looking for something other than relationships skewing the numbers.

[ThsAmericanLife]

While I respect your opinion and I don't doubt what you say, the numbers that I've found do not correspond. As you see in what I wrote, men between the ages of 30 and 40 tend to prefer women be no more than 9.5 years younger and no more than 4 years older. That's a far cry from +1 and minus 20 as Plum Princess was insinuating.

 

I honestly wish to believe what you say... Not trying to be argumentative.

 

You have a small sample size... I'm not sure how you are making your selection, for one..

 

I'm also not sure what role geography plays either (but you mentioned that already).

 

I'll admit that the age ranges were MUCH more balanced in regions of the country where the male/female ratio was higher. In other words, fewer women.

 

this is why I'm moving Boston, Austin, Seattle... top picks.

 

NYC and Washington DC have a much higher female/male ratio... at least it was the last time I checked. NOT moving there.

[aj22one]

So now for women aged 30 to 40. Again, 50 profiles.

 

On average they preferred men at a range of 3.44 years younger and 8.66 years older. In addition, 19 of 50 (38%) were open to men who were 9 or more years older (the highest was 23 years). 8% (4 out of 50) were not interested at all in younger men, while an additional 8% percent were interested in men no more than 4 years older. 12 out of 50 (24%) wanted a man to be no more than 2 years younger than them.

 

In other words what the numbers say is that yes men do prefer younger women when they are in their 30s (although to a much lesser extent than is popularly believed) but, women themselves actually want these older men (many even prefer them over younger men). So it seems like there's a bit of "chicken and egg" going on. But, if you expect older men to be open to dating women their own age or older (rather than younger skewed age ranges) then women themselves are going to have to be open to younger men as well, which according to the numbers they are not.

[aj22one]

I honestly wish to believe what you say... Not trying to be argumentative.

 

You have a small sample size... I'm not sure how you are making your selection, for one..

 

I'm also not sure what role geography plays either (but you mentioned that already).

 

I'll admit that the age ranges were MUCH more balanced in regions of the country where the male/female ratio was higher. In other words, fewer women.

 

this is why I'm moving Boston, Austin, Seattle... top picks.

 

NYC and Washington DC have a much higher female/male ratio... at least it was the last time I checked. NOT moving there.

 

If OkCupid or some other dating site or agency wanted to pay me (as much or more than what I currently make) I'd be more than happy to go for a much larger sample size, as it is though I'll have to go with less than perfect.

 

I live in Arlington, Virginia right outside of D.C. so it kind of contradicts your theory I guess.

[PlumPrincess]

Ok, I will be nice and tell you that OkCupid has a blog where they post statistics about their users. Here's the link to the data they collected about the age preferences of women and men.

 

Their sample is much bigger than yours and I don't think it looks that great for men...

[ThsAmericanLife]

If OkCupid or some other dating site or agency wanted to pay me (as much or more than what I currently make) I'd be more than happy to go for a much larger sample size, as it is though I'll have to go with less than perfect.

 

I live in Arlington, Virginia right outside of D.C. so it kind of contradicts your theory I guess.

 

I'll admit that I only checked age ranges in Match.com and OkC for Boston, Austin, Seattle... a little in NYC (since it is a short train ride away), and in the DC metro.

 

I don't know about Arlington. That is where alot of the more well-off and higher educated folks tend to reside.

 

I checked DC metro (I'm starting to become a city girl). So maybe a more diverse set?

[aj22one]

Ok, I will be nice and tell you that OkCupid has a blog where they post statistics about their users. Here's the link to the data they collected about the age preferences of women and men.

 

Their sample is much bigger than yours and I don't think it looks that great for men...

 

Yes, I've read that, that's kinda what inspired this thread (along with everyone else's threads on the subject here on LS).

 

But, as every good statistician knows, results are only as good as their ability to be repeated. So, I figured I would localize the numbers to where I live (the DC, NOVA, Maryland region) and see if I could find my own results.

 

Again, I implore people to read the link you posted, but also to do a check of their own to see the results. I will gladly send my own spreadsheets to anyone who wants them and I implore people to challenge my numbers. Seriously, I want a good discussion here with people's own studies as well.

[aj22one]

I'll admit that I only checked age ranges in Match.com and OkC for Boston, Austin, Seattle... a little in NYC (since it is a short train ride away), and in the DC metro.

 

I don't know about Arlington. That is where alot of the more well-off and higher educated folks tend to reside.

 

I checked DC metro (I'm starting to become a city girl). So maybe a more diverse set?

 

I did a 25 mile radius which included places like Gaithersburg, Bethesda MD; Herndon, Fairfax, Chantilly, Centreville, Alexandria and Sterling, VA (outer suburbs of D.C.)

[ThsAmericanLife]

Ok, I will be nice and tell you that OkCupid has a blog where they post statistics about their users. Here's the link to the data they collected about the age preferences of women and men.

 

Their sample is much bigger than yours and I don't think it looks that great for men...

 

Yep, I've read that one too. I don't think they are eliminating anyone based on relationship goals though.

 

I'm wondering if those who are looking for or open to 'casual sex' are modifying their usual standards. Men going for younger just for sex or to make themselves feel better after a breakup... not for a real relationship.

 

Women going older just to get wined and dined... and to make themselves feel better after a breakup.

 

Seems possible.

[ThsAmericanLife]

Yes, I've read that, that's kinda what inspired this thread (along with everyone else's threads on the subject here on LS).

 

But, as every good statistician knows, results are only as good as their ability to be repeated. So, I figured I would localize the numbers to where I live (the DC, NOVA, Maryland region) and see if I could find my own results.

 

Again, I implore people to read the link you posted, but also to do a check of their own to see the results. I will gladly send my own spreadsheets to anyone who wants them and I implore people to challenge my numbers. Seriously, I want a good discussion here with people's own studies as well.

 

Sounds like a really interesting study you did. I know it sounds flaky, but right now I just don't have the time to crunch the numbers. I definately will before I settle on a new place to live though

 

As it is, the City where I live is trying to get me to do their carbon footprint for free (AGAIN!! I keep telling them it is time to pay me... it hasn't proven to be a marketing triumph). Plus, I'm doing the structural calcs for 'free' for a local non-profit that is building a pavilion with a green roof. I've got enough 'free' work on my plate for now

 

If/when I crunch my numbers, I'll let you know... and do my best to do it in the highest tradition of statistical accuracy too.

[dasein]

Lots of women have daddy issues. The ones I know who make a habit of dating older men aren't particularly well-balanced emotionally.

 

Hmm that's interesting because few of the younger ones I meet seem to have much baggage at all or be on SSRIs or antianxiety meds, etc. They seem much happier generally than older women.