professorTR Posted November 9, 2009 Posted November 9, 2009 Greetings Everyone, I've been actively reading through the forums since July 5th, which was the day my wife decided to leave. We've been together for 7 years, married 4. She basically just said that she wasn't happy, and that she didn't like who she became around me, as though she had no identity of her own. A few days after the separation, we went to marriage counseling, where we were advised to stay separate for a few days before a return session. When we returned to counseling, my wife read from a note that she had written. She said she knew in her heart that we could never be together and that one day I would see that it would be best for us as well. As the days and weeks went on, we talked (mainly via text messages). She would say things like "we're taking baby steps," and "we're moving in the right direction. Eventually (3 months later), we went back to counseling, only to have her again do the same thing, saying she just strung me along because she didn't want to hurt me. I was in utter disbelief. I suffer from Narcissistic Personality Disorder, and Borderline Personality Disorder. I also have depression and anxiety issues. I've been trying to work on these things, and I've begun to learn a lot about myself. I was apparently very controlling in the relationship, but she has also admitted that she had problems communicating with me. Basically, by telling me things were fine and that she wasn't leaving instead of talking to me about her feelings, she allowed me to create a delusion. We married young (we first got together when I was 19 and she was 18), and we're basically all each other ever knew. I'm now 27. I teach at both the high school and college levels. I had my master's degree at age 23. Professionally speaking, I've always been ahead of the game, and this became my blind pursuit because it was ingrained in me that it was the path to happiness. I think my personal development really suffered as a result. At times, I can sit back and rationalize that maybe we aren't right for one another, but an overwhelming attachment hunger takes over and convinces me that everything we be OK if only she would come back. I suffer from very deep self-esteem issues, and I feel I lack an identity. We very obviously had a co-dependent relationship. I am so frightened to be with out her; I feel I can't stand on my own two feet. I'm constantly depressed, and I keep thinking about how we can make things better, but she does not want to even try to work on the marriage at all---she is done...completely. About 2 weeks ago (and apparently after she said she wanted a divorce) she told me that she has been "hanging out" with another guy. She insists it's nothing serious and that I am making it more than it really is. It makes me feel more rejected, like she's using this person to forget about me. She says she loves me and wants to be part of my life, but that we just can't be together. I think she is trying to recapture many of the things she gave up when we married young. I really don't know what to do. I can't let her go. She insists that I have to, that it's over and she's never coming back, but I just can't let her go. I feel she is in control of my life, but I think what I fear most is HAVING to take control of my own life. I'm afraid to be alone. i don't feel real unless someone is there to love me. I feel so isolated and afraid of the world. I need someone to take care of me. I am afraid I will never find love again and that she is the only one. I'm open to advice anyone can give me, and I appreciate you guys taking the time to read this. I will be actively around the forum looking for responses.
FeelingLonely98 Posted November 9, 2009 Posted November 9, 2009 (edited) First of all prof - I am so sorry for what you are struggling through. I hope you are seeking professional help for your disorders. You've been reading the forums and have received some therapeutic value form that. Well, posting your story and continually posting or starting new threads will help you so much more I can't even explain it. you will get such tremendous caring great advice here friend. She basically just said that she wasn't happy, and that she didn't like who she became around me, as though she had no identity of her own. A few days after the separation, we went to marriage counseling, where we were advised to stay separate for a few days before a return session. When we returned to counseling, my wife read from a note that she had written. She said she knew in her heart that we could never be together and that one day I would see that it would be best for us as well. Unless it is a caustic relationship I don't understand the counselor suggesting separation. It seems to me that there is currently and has been for a while another man. Can you investigate (cell phone? email? ETC.) As long as that is still going on (if it is) she will never be able to consider reconciliation. "we're taking baby steps," "we're moving in the right direction. saying she just strung me along because she didn't want to hurt me. All just words because she wants to drag it on while she (probably) sees the other man. (very common) I think my personal development really suffered as a result. At times, I can sit back and rationalize that maybe we aren't right for one another, but an overwhelming attachment hunger takes over and convinces me that everything we be OK if only she would come back. I've also struggled with this as my 47 year old wife left 10 weeks ago to have an affair with an 18 yr old. (yes, 18!). She really left for stupid "reasons" that were all she could make up to try to decrease her guilt and increase her feelings of justification. Maybe if you read some of my threads you can see how I've coped. Not that I'm a blueprint - but I was an excrutiating emotional wreck. I'm better now. She said if she had not met this child Bf, she would still be home. And I am CERTAIN that we could fix the "issues" in the M and be ok. But that takes two and there was only one that wanted - me. I realized I can not control the destiny of this and I could only control me. I think it is time for you to initiate no contact (NC) and let her know (or think) you are and will be fine without her. It will be hard butit helped me and I never went more tha 9 straight days of NC!!! (still working on it) We very obviously had a co-dependent relationship. I am so frightened to be with out her; I feel I can't stand on my own two feet. I'm constantly depressed, and I keep thinking about how we can make things better, but she does not want to even try to work on the marriage at all---she is done...completely. You think you can not do these things - you are an educated caring man - you will be ok. (Doesn't help to hear that now I know but it will get better.) If possible lean on family and friends now more than ever. It helped me. About 2 weeks ago (and apparently after she said she wanted a divorce) she told me that she has been "hanging out" with another guy. There's your proof. I guran-friggin-tee she's been seeing him for a lot longer that she claims. You'll see - others on LS will agree with me ... it is too common and always follows the same pattern. She says she loves me and wants to be part of my life, but that we just can't be together. Ah! A variation of the ILYBINILWY speech. (Which 99 times out of 100 means I am seeing someone else and don't want to admit it.) I'm afraid to be alone. i don't feel real unless someone is there to love me. I feel so isolated and afraid of the world. I need someone to take care of me. I am afraid I will never find love again and that she is the only one. You fell in love with her - you will fall in love again. There are wonderful women out there that would never do to you what she did. That if there was a problem they would discuss with you and you would work it out - together. I'm open to advice anyone can give me, and I appreciate you guys taking the time to read this. I will be actively around the forum looking for responses. I think you will see coming here to LS and asking for advice is going to be so helpful to you. Keep posting! GOOD LUCK. PEACE! Edited November 9, 2009 by FeelingLonely98
imagine Posted November 9, 2009 Posted November 9, 2009 Narcissism is a problem. Face it. Fix it. Your wife's B/F is a very serious problem. Expose it to family and friends. She sounds as though she is trying to let you down slowly. Part of your condition may reflect as neglect for your wife. Neglect is the leading cause of divorce. Meet her emotional needs, though you might have to study what these truly are. Your purpose as a husband is to love your wife. Learn how!
dazedandconfused2008 Posted November 10, 2009 Posted November 10, 2009 I been reading up on personality disorders for the sake of trying to at least understand the actions of my ex. I understand about the low self esteem and low self worth issues as the root of them...and co-dependency issues, depression and anxiety resulting from them. My question is in regards to WHEN you discovered you had these disorders and if you HAVE BEEN and STILL getting help and therapy for them? Has your (ex)wife been getting help for them as well? Im asking because sometimes while we suffer and struggle inside we sometimes cant always see what suffering we cause on the ones we love. There are always reactions, be it good or bad, to the actions we give out and receive. We each play our parts and dont take all the blame either...thats not healthy either and wont help you better yourself. Maybe she does want to recapture her youth...maybe not. Truth? Thats up to her to figure out in the end. The more you want to control and want to keep the same...the more you are going to hurt and feel rejected. (God knows im going through that myself). Let her go. Let her live. Maybe...just maybe....going out into the world and finding out who YOU are doesnt have to be such a bad thing either. (Change is so scary...especially facing the unknown) Only YOU can make YOU ok and only YOU can find out who YOU are...no one else can do that. What makes you YOU? Sometimes in order to move ahead we must look back....waaaaay back. Starting as a child and working our way up. What things made you feel good about yourself? What things have you regretted not doing? What times in your life (before the wife) have made you feel strong? Every stage of your life is a part of you...embrace them...good and bad. Your experiences, your memories, your views, your feelings, your story, your life....make YOU. Take what you need from them in order to move towards the future...use them to make (different?)choices, to try new things or to bring out that strength and faith hiding within. (It is in there...i promise you that). Dig within and sometimes we just gotta declutter some of that old junk to make room for the new. I think you answered some of your own questions. There is absolutely nothing wrong with having those feelings. Feelings are what drive us...what moves us...be it good or bad. Even depression can be a good thing. Depression is our bodies way of telling us hellooooo....theres something going on here....look at meeee. Want advice? Let her go for now, look within, find you in there and deal with your demons, LIVE (even if that means having a few bathrobe days and pity parties), cry, LIVE, cry somemore, continue therapy, and what everyone keeps talking about....TIME.
tojaz Posted November 10, 2009 Posted November 10, 2009 Professor, I know your Wife. Hell, I married her LOL. Except she was the career driven college professor as well as the one wanting to regain her youth. You have a long road ahead of you, it's took me a long time to piece things together and I'm still not seeing the whole picture, but I'm a lot better then when I started. My story is here http://www.loveshack.org/forums/search.php?searchid=11458679 if your interested, may fill in a few of your blanks to skim through the threads and those of a few others on the board. Good luck to you and keep posting Prof. TOJAZ
trippi1432 Posted November 10, 2009 Posted November 10, 2009 I been reading up on personality disorders for the sake of trying to at least understand the actions of my ex. I understand about the low self esteem and low self worth issues as the root of them...and co-dependency issues, depression and anxiety resulting from them. My question is in regards to WHEN you discovered you had these disorders and if you HAVE BEEN and STILL getting help and therapy for them? Has your (ex)wife been getting help for them as well? Im asking because sometimes while we suffer and struggle inside we sometimes cant always see what suffering we cause on the ones we love. There are always reactions, be it good or bad, to the actions we give out and receive. We each play our parts and dont take all the blame either...thats not healthy either and wont help you better yourself. Maybe she does want to recapture her youth...maybe not. Truth? Thats up to her to figure out in the end. The more you want to control and want to keep the same...the more you are going to hurt and feel rejected. (God knows im going through that myself). Let her go. Let her live. Maybe...just maybe....going out into the world and finding out who YOU are doesnt have to be such a bad thing either. (Change is so scary...especially facing the unknown) Only YOU can make YOU ok and only YOU can find out who YOU are...no one else can do that. What makes you YOU? Sometimes in order to move ahead we must look back....waaaaay back. Starting as a child and working our way up. What things made you feel good about yourself? What things have you regretted not doing? What times in your life (before the wife) have made you feel strong? Every stage of your life is a part of you...embrace them...good and bad. Your experiences, your memories, your views, your feelings, your story, your life....make YOU. Take what you need from them in order to move towards the future...use them to make (different?)choices, to try new things or to bring out that strength and faith hiding within. (It is in there...i promise you that). Dig within and sometimes we just gotta declutter some of that old junk to make room for the new. I think you answered some of your own questions. There is absolutely nothing wrong with having those feelings. Feelings are what drive us...what moves us...be it good or bad. Even depression can be a good thing. Depression is our bodies way of telling us hellooooo....theres something going on here....look at meeee. Want advice? Let her go for now, look within, find you in there and deal with your demons, LIVE (even if that means having a few bathrobe days and pity parties), cry, LIVE, cry somemore, continue therapy, and what everyone keeps talking about....TIME. Dazed - great advice and I am so proud of you!! :)
Cranialrupture Posted November 10, 2009 Posted November 10, 2009 (edited) I feel she is in control of my life, but I think what I fear most is HAVING to take control of my own life. I'm afraid to be alone. i don't feel real unless someone is there to love me. I feel so isolated and afraid of the world. I need someone to take care of me. I am afraid I will never find love again and that she is the only one. You nailed your biggest problem right on the head!!!! the feeling of loss of control and the fear it brings along with it. Like loosing control of your car while driving 100 mph. The fear it brings is crippling. I have learned this and it has helped me alot. I still struggle here and there but when you can start to get control of yourself everything else will start to ease. I feel she is in control of my life, Get out a pen and paper and hand write a note to her. Only put in there that you agree with the seperation and you think it is a good idea. You can throw in some general ty's toward her, like ty for being my friend or ty for being there for me, but then leave it at that. Short, simple and to the point. DO NOT go on about your love or how much you miss her etc. Keep it only a couple sentences. Put it in the mail and zip it off to her. By doing so you have equalled the playing field. She is using your weakness to give her strength. Do not discuss it if she tries to talk to you about it. Go no contact. Focus completely on yourself. Get those old hobbies back going, put in extra energy into work. Excercise (its a natural anti depressent) eat right and get out and do stuff. Hang with friends, meet new friends. Focus on yourself. Try new things you haven't done before, eat new things listen to different types of music you listened to before. This is YOU time. If you start to get down get up and do something. Its harder than it sounds but it works I promise. Go no contact for atleast a month. If you do talk to her DO NOT talk to her about your relationship. Smile, be friendly and keep it short. You were happy before her and you can be happy after her. The only one that can truely make you happy is yourself. After time of no contact and focusing on yourself, you will be able to then look back and see exactly what went wrong in your relationship. You will then be able to use that in future relationships. She is definately NOT the only one out there for you. Plus you never know, she may see you and what you have done after awhile and say to herself, damn he looks good, is confident and is happy without me. What did I do wrong and the control will no longer be hers but yours. I am saying this because that is what I have done. Your story is so similar to mine in so many ways it is scary. My wife refused to work on anything, I begged and pleaded and it just made things worse. She was defiant towards me and the more I tried the worse it got. Its been almost a month of no contact for me (my NC is impossible because of kids, but I kept conversations short, polite and just about the kids) She has actually started sending me texts saying good night, and asking how my weekend was, and if I did anything fun. Now I know that down the road we might be able to reconcile, but I am not so sure anymore if that's what i want now. My confidence is growing, other women are interested, I am having a good time and reconciliation is out of the question until she decides to work on herself first. I am getting more in control of the situation and the future does not look so dark anymore. I will not just jump right back into a relationship with her now like I would have 5 weeks ago. Its hard as hell and goes against everything you want to do right now, but please please please fight yourself and just do it. You will scream at yourself but what you will gain is so worth it. I am slowly learning to actually love my new life. Not completely yet but I can see that there is light at the end of the tunnel no matter what happens. Hang in the man, we are all here for you. Theres some great people here. Edited November 10, 2009 by Cranialrupture
tojaz Posted November 10, 2009 Posted November 10, 2009 I feel she is in control of my life, but I think what I fear most is HAVING to take control of my own life. I'm afraid to be alone. i don't feel real unless someone is there to love me. I feel so isolated and afraid of the world. I need someone to take care of me. I am afraid I will never find love again and that she is the only one. Youare going to hear a lot on LS about working on yourself. Theses statements are the ones yo need to conquer for you. Love yourself before you can love anyone else. TOJAZ
FeelingLonely98 Posted November 10, 2009 Posted November 10, 2009 Dazed - great advice and I am so proud of you!! :) Yes - Dazed my thoughts exactly. You've come a long way. I'm proud of you as well. Professor - great post and advice from Dazed. Read it a few times... ok?
FeelingLonely98 Posted November 10, 2009 Posted November 10, 2009 I am saying this because that is what I have done. Your story is so similar to mine in so many ways it is scary. My wife refused to work on anything, I begged and pleaded and it just made things worse. She was defiant towards me and the more I tried the worse it got. Its been almost a month of no contact for me (my NC is impossible because of kids, but I kept conversations short, polite and just about the kids) She has actually started sending me texts saying good night, and asking how my weekend was, and if I did anything fun. Now I know that down the road we might be able to reconcile, but I am not so sure anymore if that's what i want now. My confidence is growing, other women are interested, I am having a good time and reconciliation is out of the question until she decides to work on herself first. I am getting more in control of the situation and the future does not look so dark anymore. I will not just jump right back into a relationship with her now like I would have 5 weeks ago. Cranial - My story as well. almost identical. Once my 47 yr old STBXW got it out (the ILYBINILWY speech) it was refusal to work on anything. Just wanted to date her new 18 yr old BF that she now "loves". (BARF!) I'm proud of you as well Cranial - you've come a long way - and it is a good thing. I've come a long way as well. I have to meet the STBXW tomorrow to sign off a few papers. I'll send her off with a "wish you well" and I will tell her I forgive her for all she's done to me. (I kind of need to do that for me!) THEN, I plan to have no more contact with her, ever! We have no kids together. I suppose I will see her in the court room on D day. But no need to talk to her. (It's an amicable D) PEACE!
soheartbroken Posted November 10, 2009 Posted November 10, 2009 I really don't know what to do. I can't let her go. She insists that I have to, that it's over and she's never coming back, but I just can't let her go. I feel she is in control of my life, but I think what I fear most is HAVING to take control of my own life. I'm afraid to be alone. i don't feel real unless someone is there to love me. I feel so isolated and afraid of the world. I need someone to take care of me. I am afraid I will never find love again and that she is the only one. I'm open to advice anyone can give me, and I appreciate you guys taking the time to read this. I will be actively around the forum looking for responses. Hi. Welcome to the forum. I see a lot of myself and my situation in yours. Do you know where your fear of taking control comes from? I'm still trying to find out where mine originated. My ex also had problems communicating her unhappiness (told me she wouldn't leave me), although I personally feel I should have recognized my behaviour and changed it... Anyway, you're not alone! By posting you are taking the first steps...
Author professorTR Posted November 19, 2009 Author Posted November 19, 2009 Thank you to everyone. It has been a struggle for me. I'm getting some intensive outpatient therapy, and I'm starting psychoanalysis next week. I think that will be most helpful for me to get at the underlying issues contributing to my personality disorder. I still talk to her every day. We send texts. I feel I can't let go. She wants us to be friends and feels we can get through this divorce together (no-fault). What's killing me is that I was starting to accept the end of the relationship, but her budding romance with another man feels like a double rejection. I'm so sick of this roller-coaster ride!
curiou Posted November 19, 2009 Posted November 19, 2009 Professor, I think people tend to overanalyze the "personality disorder" gambit, in hopes of rationalizing behavior and making excuses for this and that. In reality, it is likely a spectrum. You might be narcissistic. But what higher educational professional isn't? You're being too hard on yourself. You worked hard to achieve a high performance status in order to make a career and provide for your family. If you neglected your spouse and didn't communicate with her, of course that's a problem! We all fall into routine once in a while and forget to cherish the ones we love, and must constantly remind ourselves to do so! In high probability, she has been having this affair for a while. If you've been reading for these last few months, you'll see that after you get through the initial shock and start piecing it together, you'll find it's true. So the question is now what to do about it? My advice as a survivor is to go ABSOLUTELY NO CONTACT. Minimal contact at most. Don't offer her details of your life. If she is somehow able to get a hold of you, don't engage in more than a 15 second conversation and end it willingly. Act happy. This does two things: It allows you time to heal and grow stronger. And it removes any "pressure" and stress you're putting on her. She might start to wonder if you're now healing from the separation. If you've been pleading with her to give you another chance, she knows you're still hooked. This removes that power from her. And then, you must decide what you want. You're young. I'd kill to be 27 again at the peak of the game. You could crush the rest of your life. Not to belittle what you used to have with her, but there are legions of great women out there. I'd have sex and relationships with many of them.
WTFO Posted November 19, 2009 Posted November 19, 2009 .... I still talk to her every day. We send texts. I feel I can't let go. She wants us to be friends and feels we can get through this divorce together (no-fault). Well,there is your problem. I know its tough, but you must listen to these wonderful people on this board. Don't send texts back and forth everyday like your still married. You need to show her you will get along fine without her(even if you think you can't) Of course she wants you to be friends...I'm in the Same situation, It's her way of handling the guilt. We have kids so I have to be nice. Ill see this woman for the rest of my life. Now, I'm starting to think about using the old phrase"killing her with kindness", but don't know if I want to waste my time on someone who left me for an OM like that. Plus, there is potential of me dating someone else and she says shes happy for me,but I think this bothers her in some way. Bottom line is, Start doing things to make yourself happy. Really...I'm going to take a Jiu Jitsu class soon and never had the time before to do this. I never had time to goto the book store for hours and just enjoy books,Magazines etc. Use this time for you, and you will see things diffrently in 3 months, I promise. Good luck, we are all in the same boat.
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