newsguy Posted November 12, 2008 Posted November 12, 2008 Okay, here's the situation....My wife and I have been married for 25 years, but not without some bumps in the road. During the late 80's my wife was feeling very uneasy about our relationship and took some time to be on her own. She was seeing another man, but said it wasn't sexual. After about a year she came back. Since then we have had two beautiful children together. The boy is now 16 the girl 12. Jump to the present. My wife is now going through menopause and all the mood swings that go with it. But that is not all, no that is not all. She has confessed to me that she is not happy and is depressed. I have asked her to please see a marriage counsellor with me and she refuses. There were some very strange things that also started happening around this time too. What do you make of this? She told me never to answer her cellphone, something that I used to do all the time, and one of the most shocking things to me was when she covered herself up when I walked in on her topless. That was something she never did before. She has started developing friendships with the opposite sex again. In one case it's with a man (who is separated) who works with the same company she does. She has decided to team up with him to do some graphics work and has also been taking pictures of his two girls as a favour to him (she's a photographer by trade). She even went to his house on a couple Saturday nights to do this work. There was also one occasion she went to his place for one of his daughters birthday parties and came home far later than she promised. After I protested she has since scaled back her relationship with him...but they still communicate. Now there is a second man(also separated) in her life whom she communicates with on Facebook. Just by accident I found some of his e-mails to her on our computer and have been secretly monitoring them. He has been flirting with her and wanting to get together for lunch or coffee. Each morning at 8:15 they have a chat together because I'm not at home. Right now I don't think they have connected, but boy am I worried. I have gone back to the basics of trying to woo her back by letting her know that I'm thinking of her by getting her flowers, writing notes to her and those little things they tell you get to a womans heart. I'm not sure where I stand with her but I would hate to see this relationship go down the tubes. There is probably a lot more I could tell you but that's the basics for now. If anyone has any advice I'd love to hear it.
Owl Posted November 12, 2008 Posted November 12, 2008 Confront her on both of these men...because she's cheating on you. AT LEAST emotionally with the online guy...and trust me, that can and will escalate. And almost certainly she's been sleeping with the other guy. I'd snoop more about what's going on with the guy she's been "helping"...and get the details there. Go to marriagebuilders website and look at their free material...look for information on plan A and B...and all of that. Avoid the forum...trust me on that one. After you've read that info...come back here. Also...you could consider reading a book "Not Just Friends"...it might give you some more things to consider in this.
JamesM Posted November 12, 2008 Posted November 12, 2008 You have two choices: Prepare for divorce. Seduce your wife. Doing nothing is not an option. I could go into detail about each one, but assuming you still want your wife, then it is time to become her husband again. I will get blasted for giving this advice, but it comes down to this. For some reason, she lost contact with you. You are to blame either a lot or somewhat. While she may simply have gone mentally overboard with no connection to you due to her menopause, it is also possible that this dissatisfaction on her part has been building over time. People have depressions often and women go through menopause, but this does not mean they have affairs. Affairs are caused by other reason. I am not saying that you are to blame, but you do have the power to at least to compete with the possible other man. If she has not connected sexually with anyone yet, then begin by becoming her friend and by being romantic. Surprise her. Do things she loves. And to help you regain the motivation, try to remember what you love about her. What things did the two of you do together that made the two of you feel close? These men offer newness to her and excitement while she is depressed. Once she gets to know them, then the fantasy becomes reality. Your goal is to get her to realize that as her reality, you make a better fantasy. I have been married almost 19 years. I understand the ups and downs of marriage. My wife and I lost our connection about three years ago. I can still see her sitting at our kitchen table telling me, " I lost all of my feelings for you." I can still see her sitting next to me in bed saying, "I never want to have sex again." Those were the most hurtful times I can remember in our marriage. Somehow through research and changes, we were able to reconnect, and our marriage was very passionate just six months later. Truthfully, with as much humility as I can muster, none of this would have happened without ME making the decision to make it all happen. She would not h ave done it, and our marriage would have existed in name only. In fact, I joined LS when my marriage was at about its lowest. There are no guarantees in life.except one. Do nothing and you will gain nothing. It is possible that you attempt to reconnect with your wife, and it may not work. However, you have the advantage over these other men in one sense....you KNOW your wife better than they do. You won her heart over once before. And based on that, you can do it again. You will get advice here that says your marriage is over and she is cheating on you and just "kick her to the curb." I am saying different. Since it is possible that this marriage is breaking, why not try to fix it first? Many have been where you are, and many have rebuilt their marriage to be stronger than before. It is up to you.
jmargel Posted November 12, 2008 Posted November 12, 2008 Depressions, Menopause? EXCUSES! That's all they are. That doesn't cloud your judgement to the point that you don't know what you are doing. It doesn't stop you from saying 'STOP, I am doing something wrong here!' The reason why she's doing this AGAIN, is because she has not faced any consequences for her behavior. You only know what you have found out! There could have been time between then and now that affairs could have happened. Go with your gut instinct, all the red flags show that she is cheating. Doesn't matter if it's not physical, emotion cheating is just as bad, if not worse. You need to confront her on this and make her face the consequences. Trying to 'woo' her won't help. It's like trying to bribe your child into doing something they don't want to do. They won't respect you and neither is your wife. To gain this respect not only do you need to show confidence, you need to live it. You need to pull your own self-worth out from her. You need to make that decision of telling her, either A,B & C happens or this marriage is over. She needs counseling, we all know that. If she refuses to go, then let her know that she needs to walk. Nothing less will be tolerated. If you don't, you will be dragged through the mud, while playing detective for the next 6 months to a year. You will be living on eggshells, you will be worn out physically and emotionally from the roller coaster you are on. You have alot of power right now, you need to realize this. Tolerate her disrespect and that is what you will continue to get. You need resolution to this, one way or another.
LakesideDream Posted November 13, 2008 Posted November 13, 2008 I have heard this story.. and have lived it. Sadly friend there is little or nothing you can do about it. Anything you try to do will be seen as manipulation by her. She's in the "checking out" stage. Expect a lot of malarky about "needing space" and "getting herself together" until the truth that she is romanticly and sexually involved with another man comes to light. Prepare yourself as best you can, but be aware that it won't do much good. You are going to be battered and beated no matter what she decides to do. Prognosis? Saddness ahead.
TrustInYourself Posted November 14, 2008 Posted November 14, 2008 My suggestion would be to smile and be cordial. Take care of business. Get your finances in order. See a lawyer. If she won't go to counseling to settle the issues, she's checked out. You see the signs, take action to rectify her behavior. Without consequences, we do not implement change. Create consequences and look out for your own health and happiness.
mark982 Posted November 15, 2008 Posted November 15, 2008 you ever think of following her when she goes out? take a camera.
Author newsguy Posted November 16, 2008 Author Posted November 16, 2008 Thanks for the advice on my predicament. I didn't know what to expect when I first posted....but I it appears the members on this site believe in tough love. I'm hesitant to make any decisions that involve telling her it's "my way or the highway" because of my children, especially the girl. It would break her heart if we split, so for the moment I'm going to try to keep things working the best I can.
Author newsguy Posted December 6, 2008 Author Posted December 6, 2008 Well my situation continues to be much the same. I asked my wife about the second guy and she called him a "goof" and that she's old enough to be his mother. She was still reluctant to admit he existed until I pushed the point. Here's an example of the Facebook messages he sends to her...please give me some feedback as to how serious you guys think this relationship is: You are an amazing mom (wife's name)! I am more in awe of you everyday ! From your busy work schedule and home improvment and upkeep you still find the time to do project's with (daughter's name) and go to hold her hand at the health unit and you are there cheering (son's name) on for almost every show or driving adventure ! And it also sound's like you have alot of love and respect for momzie !! You are beautiful inside and out sweety! They are very lucky to have you in there lives. Just as I am very lucky to have you in mine ! <3 (O) I hope your head is feeling better I have amazing hand's and took a massage course in Calgary I wish I was there I could kneed and tweek a few muscle's in your neck that would make you feel like you were in heaven!! Tomorrow would be great to chat give me aring in the afternoon sometime of you are free K The name of her dentist escape's me but she is a nice woman who is located at (arcade name) . How about this when pulling up I told Alex this was a video arcade that I used to hang out in year's ago . She had no idea what a " Video arcade was !!LOL Now that made me feel old !! Now we know you were born at 6 pm or 7 pm what month and day Sandi because depending on the season it may have been dark at that time of evening and that would count too! If it was light I can still work on giving a taste of night life through my eye's and tales=) I am always happy getting your messages too (wife's name) thank you so much for messaging even though you were not feeling so hot ! I am thinking of you and looking forward to chatting sometime tomorrow ! Sweet Dream's Sweet (wife's name) ! (O) (O) <3 Sometimes words are hard to find but im looking for that perfect line to let you know your always on my mind =) When you want it or when you need it ...You will always get the best from me ! This is pretty typical of the messages he sends...If anyone has any comments I'd love to hear them
Ronni_W Posted December 6, 2008 Posted December 6, 2008 This is pretty typical of the messages he sends...If anyone has any comments I'd love to hear them Seems as if a big (or the only, at this point) role he has in her life is to make her feel good about herself...and words do that far better than flowers, chocolates and trinkets. You said that you write 'notes' -- but do you talk 'epic poems'? Do you look at her with admiration, respect and a healthy dose of lust in your eyes? Also, when you do give little gifty-things, it's about those representing HER passions and interests...not so much what "they" say women in general want. Example, a pretty dollar store notebook and pen with hearts (or smilies) on it, does it for me far better than flowers. Or, 3 pieces of ginger chocolates over a whole box of Godiva. How does SHE want to feel about herself, what makes HER feel like 'her'? And how can you facilitate those feelings for her? EDIT: This guy seems to have clued in that she may be feeling 'insecure/bad' about the kind of mom she is being...start paying genuine and sincere compliments on what a terrific mom she is. Also, that she may not be feeling appreciated -- she's not feeling that you guys are "lucky to have her in your lives." Good clues -- use them to your advantage, I would.
Author newsguy Posted December 6, 2008 Author Posted December 6, 2008 Seems as if a big (or the only, at this point) role he has in her life is to make her feel good about herself...and words do that far better than flowers, chocolates and trinkets. You said that you write 'notes' -- but do you talk 'epic poems'? Do you look at her with admiration, respect and a healthy dose of lust in your eyes? Also, when you do give little gifty-things, it's about those representing HER passions and interests...not so much what "they" say women in general want. Example, a pretty dollar store notebook and pen with hearts (or smilies) on it, does it for me far better than flowers. Or, 3 pieces of ginger chocolates over a whole box of Godiva. How does SHE want to feel about herself, what makes HER feel like 'her'? And how can you facilitate those feelings for her? EDIT: This guy seems to have clued in that she may be feeling 'insecure/bad' about the kind of mom she is being...start paying genuine and sincere compliments on what a terrific mom she is. Also, that she may not be feeling appreciated -- she's not feeling that you guys are "lucky to have her in your lives." Good clues -- use them to your advantage, I would. Thanks Ronni....I'm working really hard on this and I will use your advice wisely
Ronni_W Posted December 6, 2008 Posted December 6, 2008 Thanks Ronni....I'm working really hard on this and I will use your advice wisely No prob. I know it's really difficult but...see how the guy's message is all light and fun and playful? (At least, that's what came across, and 'caught' (courted?) me, when I read it.) So. If you can capture some of that, my feeling is it will deliver your messages of admiration and appreciation better than if there is an underlying note of "hard work", desperation, etc. If that makes sense? Like I said, though, I know it's tough to fill the heart with 'light & playful' when the mind is feeling 'gloom, doom & desperation.' But. I would suggest that you try, nonetheless, from an optimistic attitude and mindset that you WILL be successful at it. Have you visited marriagebuilders.com? They've got some good articles.
Author newsguy Posted December 8, 2008 Author Posted December 8, 2008 Here's more information on my wife's actions that has made me scratch my head and wonder. Recently I was on my Facebook site and decided to show my relationship status as being married to her. It required her permission and she was very upset that I did this. She says that Facebook is her own private sanctuary and was very angry, and claimed I was interfering. As well yesterday I tried to hold her hand in public because we hadn't done it for a while, she refused. I sometimes think that nothing I do will satisfy her. I'm pretty close to just giving up.
LakesideDream Posted December 8, 2008 Posted December 8, 2008 Here's more information on my wife's actions that has made me scratch my head and wonder. Recently I was on my Facebook site and decided to show my relationship status as being married to her. It required her permission and she was very upset that I did this. She says that Facebook is her own private sanctuary and was very angry, and claimed I was interfering. As well yesterday I tried to hold her hand in public because we hadn't done it for a while, she refused. I sometimes think that nothing I do will satisfy her. I'm pretty close to just giving up. Newsguy, she's gone. The only thing that remains is her physical presence. That will be gone too as soon as she has the means to make it a reality. That may take awhile, but it's coming as sure as the sun will rise tomorrow. You are in for a rocky road until she finishes making all the important decisions in your lives. And don't you love Facebook and Myspace? Such wonderful devices.
Owl Posted December 8, 2008 Posted December 8, 2008 If you don't change anything, nothing will change. She's not suffering any consequences for her poor behavior. You're in the same boat you were a month ago, because you've done nothing to change the situation. Look at this from her perspective...why SHOULD she change? While you're clearly not happy with her behaviors, you're still ACCEPTING them by doing nothing to really put a stop to them. You don't like them, but you're still TOLERATING them. And that enables her actions. And...there is NO SUCH THING as a "private sanctuary" online...where she can pretend to be single. You know better than that...why are you letting her spew that kind of nonsense at you? I told you before...set and enforce some boundaries. Take ACTION...or, file for divorce. It's up to you, but you've continued to default and let HER run the show. You're letting HER dictate the terms of your marriage. Plan on this continuing until you finally decide enough is enough and you force a change. But...if you wait too long, the change she'll make is to get rid of you, rather than try to fix the marriage. Go back and reread my first post to you...and look at those resources I mentioned.
imagine Posted December 8, 2008 Posted December 8, 2008 Please News If you are not bothered to read these articles especially those that Owl mentioned at marriagebuilders.com then it is pointless us talking to you. The book you want is "Surviving an Affair" Dr Harley. I'm done talking until you do something. Post more frequently.
jmargel Posted December 9, 2008 Posted December 9, 2008 Owl is right.. I tried giving you this advice a month ago and you didn't take it. Doing the same thing over and over, expecting different results is the definition of insanity. She's acting like a teenager so treat her like one. Both Owl and I have been in this situation and the ONLY thing that works is the advice we gave you. It's time to realize how much power you do have and start living some confidence.
Winnie B. Posted December 9, 2008 Posted December 9, 2008 Newsguy, 1- reading that typical love message to your wife-mom from some her odd Facebook , one can see very well ,how funny that 'fishy' romantic guy has to be to make such messages ,I laughed really .. but your wife has to cut him off out immediately unless she is having just an innocent fun 2-relationship status changing to "married" or "committed" once a person is really such - is very necessary,and I can`t undersatnd why actually she does not want to do that 3- sometimes people want to feel free,and will go miles to feel so,but it Mustn`t be out of control and Isn`t to be desrespectful to oneself .Now your wife is just showing disrespect to herself allowing herself to flirt so openly at 6:15 am (I remember,it was the time (?) daily with someone . *thumbs down* >>>Show her more love,Do your best<<< If it does not work,then either give in and let her do what she does or divorce. It`s up to you . TEST HER - tell her to 'play' online flirting without hurting you and disrespecting her family officially ,just finding some appropriate sites for that and giving and taking all affection and love she needs FREELY ,just under a nickname................. .................... If she just needs all these 'games',nothing more,then she agrees. If she stubbornly goes on flirting with a guy on the site and not showing respect to you and herself ,then .........its up to you what to do .
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