stuck33 Posted August 26, 2008 Posted August 26, 2008 hi all! i wanted to thank you all for your replies to my previous posts, they have really helped me out a lot. so i have started writing a letter to my husband, to try to explain to him how i feel and explain the need for MC...right now i'm on the 4th draft... i'm a terrible communicator, i will never deny that so i thought that this letter might be my best option. he is probably worse at communicating than i am. so now i'm left with a few my questions to throw at you guys : we work opposite shifts and often go 2-3 days without seeing eachother. i'm having real difficulty with how to bring this all up to him. should i just leave the letter for him to read while i'm at work one night? i know this seems like the "easier" way, but it would also give him time to think about everything i'm saying. or should i just give him the whole "we need to talk" speech and hand him the letter? i guess i'm just trying to figure out the best time to do this. i don't want to actually read the letter to him, because i know i will never be able to finish it. when it comes to talking about how i feel, i often just panic and end up crying without saying anything. any suggestions would be greatly appreciated and thank you all for being here, i don't have a whole lot of people i can talk to about all this!
LoyalGirl Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 hi all! i'm a terrible communicator, i will never deny that so i thought that this letter might be my best option. he is probably worse at communicating than i am. i don't want to actually read the letter to him, because i know i will never be able to finish it. when it comes to talking about how i feel, i often just panic and end up crying without saying anything. I, personally, would read him the letter, so I'm not much help with that I guess... But- I wonder if you would consider seeing an individual counselor as well to help you express your feelings without shutting down. Just a thought...
Ronni_W Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 i'm a terrible communicator, i will never deny that so i thought that this letter might be my best option. he is probably worse at communicating than i am. Work with what you know and what you've got right now -- leave the letter for him to read. I agree, though, with LoyalGirl's suggestion -- you owe it to yourself and your loved ones to improve how you communicate, especially your feelings (both "positive" and "negative" feelings, that is.) You could add in the letter that you wish you didn't have to resort to putting your feelings down on paper, and you do intend to do something about that regardless of anything else (if you commit to doing that.) And could also mention that you wanted to give him time to process the contents without feeling 'put on the spot', and you are expecting a response, whether written or verbal...you might even want to put a time on that...one week should be plenty, really. Good luck -- I do hope your efforts bring desired results, and prove to be the beginning of a whole lot of happiness and success for you both. PS - you've read up about using "I statements" and such, right? Or, do that first (google 'assertive communication' or 'healthy communication styles' or somesuch), and then start the 5th draft
Author stuck33 Posted August 27, 2008 Author Posted August 27, 2008 thanks so much for your replies, i am now on the 5th draft and still going. i'm posting it for review (although i must admit i'm a little embarrased to have it out in the public like this) here goes: "Dear___, I am writing this to you because I have a lot to say and I know I'm not a great communicator. I'm afraid I won't be able to say everything I want to. Let me start off by saying I'm sorry I have waited so long to say anything. I feel like I shouldn't feel the way I do and I have been trying to change it myself for a while now. I'm sorry that I'm also saying it through this letter, but we are not great at communicating and I thought this might be the best way. I also wanted to leave it for you to read while I wasn't around so that you wouldn't feel put on the spot or overwhelmed. I want you to read this and then think about it and respond in a way you feel most comfortable. I'm sure you have noticed that I have been a little grumpy and distant. The truth to it all is that I'm not happy. I am having a lot of issues having to do with our marriage and I'm not sure how to fix it. I have been feeling like this for a while now and I have tried to deal with it on my own but it isn't working and I don't know where to go from here. I have mostly been feeling like we are little more than roomates. I think this might not be a bad thing if we had been married for a while and had children, but at this point in our marriage I don't want to feel this way. I started having doubts when we were engaged, but I thought it was just cold feet and nerves. When those doubts continued, I thought maybe it was just nursing school and being stressed. Now, I don't know what it is and I don't know how to fix it. I don't think we are as close as a married couple should be. Sometimes I'm afraid that we got married because we were comfortable. I mean, we get along great, we hardly fight, we like most of the same things, but shouldn't there be more? I can't help but think that you probably feel the same way. Sometimes I'm even more scared that maybe we got married too young, too fast, that maybe we (or I) was more in love with the idea of marriage. We had this argument a lot before we got married - about how I wanted you to make me feel special, how I wanted to make you feel that excitement that you should feel when you are in love. Those things never happened and I have given up trying to fight for it - a lot of times it seems like you would sooner just agree with what I'm saying than risk making me upset or angry and I don't think that is healthy either. At the same time though, I don't want to force you to do these things, because they should come naturally and without trying. I want you to think about why you can't give me that. I just feel like a lot is changing for me and that I am changing a lot. I feel like a much different person than I was 4 years ago, I guess growing up. And I am not feeling like we are connecting how we used to. I feel like we don't have a whole lot to talk about anymore and I don't have that "in love" feeling. I know it dwindles over time and comes and goes, but I can't remember the last time I did feel it, with the exception of our wedding day and that scares me. I think that maybe we should see a counselor because I don't know what else to do and I don't know how to talk to you properly to fix this. I'm sorry if a lot of this doesn't make sense, I'm having a hard time finding words for how I feel - I feel like I'm being selfish because you really do treat me well and I'm hoping that some counseling will get me past this. I don't know how to change these feelings and I'm grumpy all the time because I feel this way and even more, I feel guilty for feeling this way. " So far this is what I've got. Input appreciated!
SingleDad Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Stuck - I think the letter is fine as written... but I guess I'd like to understand more... What things have you tried to try to re-kindle the marriage ? 180's... shake thing up a little bit... fireplace and wine... surprise teddy... night out for fun, Friday night "date night", and of course no arguing or complaining during them, etc. Have you done things out of your normal mundane routine (we all run into that daily grind) ? If you have done those things for a while and still have no response, then maybe it would be time for the letter. If you haven't then I would try some of them first for a couple of weeks - see if there is any change in H - if not then give him the letter. Sometimes the "sugar" may have lead to a better reaction than the "hammer"
TrustInYourself Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Get rid of the statements of self-doubt. There is no need to tell him how you do not communicate well. You also don't want him to doubt what you are trying to convey. You want to be clear and concise about the way you feel. I see some indicators of why you might feel the way you do about your relationship from this letter. We can talk about those if you'd like. Altogether, I think it's a pretty good letter. It should be with 5 drafts! Take care and I hope the letter works out for the both of you.
Author stuck33 Posted August 27, 2008 Author Posted August 27, 2008 Stuck - I think the letter is fine as written... but I guess I'd like to understand more... What things have you tried to try to re-kindle the marriage ? 180's... shake thing up a little bit... fireplace and wine... surprise teddy... night out for fun, Friday night "date night", and of course no arguing or complaining during them, etc. Have you done things out of your normal mundane routine (we all run into that daily grind) ? If you have done those things for a while and still have no response, then maybe it would be time for the letter. If you haven't then I would try some of them first for a couple of weeks - see if there is any change in H - if not then give him the letter. Sometimes the "sugar" may have lead to a better reaction than the "hammer" To be honest, I have tried - I take him out to dinner and we barely have anything to speak about. I bought a sexy outfit for our weekend at the casino, and he was too tired. I put it on when we got home and he barely noticed. I will also admit that I am not trying as much as I could. I think that might be for a couple of reasons 1) he puts in NO effort and 2) the first year and a half of our relationship was very bad (he cheated x2) and I put a lot of emotional effort into our relationship early on and I am beginning to feel like I don't have a whole lot more to give.
TrustInYourself Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 To be honest, I have tried - I take him out to dinner and we barely have anything to speak about. I bought a sexy outfit for our weekend at the casino, and he was too tired. I put it on when we got home and he barely noticed. I will also admit that I am not trying as much as I could. I think that might be for a couple of reasons 1) he puts in NO effort and 2) the first year and a half of our relationship was very bad (he cheated x2) and I put a lot of emotional effort into our relationship early on and I am beginning to feel like I don't have a whole lot more to give. You probably don't have any more to give, so don't. Stop giving. The issue with us men, we don't understand women. We don't understand marriage. For us to understand, we have to lose everything we care about. We desire and need "wake up calls". Not all the time, but when things are bad...we need to know. Are you prepared for his reaction?
Author stuck33 Posted August 27, 2008 Author Posted August 27, 2008 Are you prepared for his reaction? Not even a little. I hate hurting people (I'm a nurse, haha!) and I hate confrontation. I'm pretty petrified, but I'm young and don't want to realize all these things 10 years from now so I better start now I guess.
Ronni_W Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Stuck, It is an excellent journaling of your fears, frustrations and complaints. But when I put myself in position of recipient...it doesn't feel so good to 'me'...makes 'me' feel sad and like there's not much hope for 'us'. Like 'I' am somewhat of a failure/loser husband/partner. (Is there ANYTHING 'I've' done to make you happy?) Like you settled for 'me' in the first place. Like most everything about our "marriage" is mostly a sham and a farce. Maybe you can do a bit of reflection on it -- for each statement, ask yourself, "What is my own contribution to this? How would I respond to it? How do I want, hope and expect him to respond to it? Is it even something that HE has any influence over? What am I willing to do about this? What do I want him to do about this? Am I being reasonable/realistic to expect that from him?" Have you taken the 'emotional needs' and 'lovebusters' questionnaires available at marriagebuilders.com? Those may help you get more clear and specific about what you are missing and what you want...as it stands, the generalities don't really offer him any insight into what he can do to facilitate your better feelings...and there's nothing that you have offered that you will be doing for yourself. As the author, I'd try to tighten it up; make it shorter. I'd not go back to BEFORE we were married; I'd try to put it in a more positive way...make it more hopeful and project that I'm anticipating wonderful things to come. I'd not suggest that this would be okay for 'us' if we had kids and were married longer; or apologize for how I feel -- you are feeling what you're feeling and you have the right and authority to do that. I dunno. Maybe that is (MUCH) more critiquing than you want. In the end, of course, follow what your own heart is saying will be the best way to approach things. Of course, I'd also be happy to offer further input if any of above is the type you are looking for.
TrustInYourself Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 Not even a little. I hate hurting people (I'm a nurse, haha!) and I hate confrontation. I'm pretty petrified, but I'm young and don't want to realize all these things 10 years from now so I better start now I guess. Haha, my wife is also a nurse. She gave me the same speech you are about to give to your husband. If he's as caring and understanding as you stated, he will eventually respect your decision. His initial reaction is going to be filled with emotion and pain. I'd ask on his behalf for some patience and understanding. These things hurt. It's scary I'm sure, but you're making the best decision you can with the knowledge you have. Maybe in the future, you'll feel differently. Anything can happen! I just hope you limit the rollercoaster ride to a minimum. Keep hope and take care.
SingleDad Posted August 27, 2008 Posted August 27, 2008 I think many men, especially myself, tend to be on "auto-pilot" and do not really understand what a woman wants or needs. You need to get him on Manual control. How much it takes to get that shift will likely depend on his stubbornness. He needs to know what you need and be whipped into shape... the difficulty is being able to do that without being nagging or controlling - if he sees it as nagging it will have the opposite effect. Obviously, my W had the opposite effect on me and went for the D - I did not wake up until then. The precise way to do this I do not know - but do it in a loving or even fun way - so he can appreciate what you are trying to do and gain from it together.
Author stuck33 Posted August 28, 2008 Author Posted August 28, 2008 Get rid of the statements of self-doubt. There is no need to tell him how you do not communicate well. You also don't want him to doubt what you are trying to convey. You want to be clear and concise about the way you feel. I see some indicators of why you might feel the way you do about your relationship from this letter. We can talk about those if you'd like. Altogether, I think it's a pretty good letter. It should be with 5 drafts! Take care and I hope the letter works out for the both of you. First, I want to thank you all for your replies. They are helping me to muster up the courage to actually give him this letter. Secondly, TIY- I'm interested with what you mean by some indicators of why I feel how I do. Sometimes I think I'm just being selfish and crazy and have no reason to be so unhappy in my marriage. Care to elaborate?
Author stuck33 Posted August 28, 2008 Author Posted August 28, 2008 I think many men, especially myself, tend to be on "auto-pilot" and do not really understand what a woman wants or needs. You need to get him on Manual control. How much it takes to get that shift will likely depend on his stubbornness. He needs to know what you need and be whipped into shape... the difficulty is being able to do that without being nagging or controlling - if he sees it as nagging it will have the opposite effect. Obviously, my W had the opposite effect on me and went for the D - I did not wake up until then. The precise way to do this I do not know - but do it in a loving or even fun way - so he can appreciate what you are trying to do and gain from it together. I agree with you, Single Dad, in that he is definatly on auto-pilot. And maybe this is awful of me, I'm not sure, or maybe I've just waited too long to convey my feelings - but I don't want to whip him into shape. And I'm most definatly not the nagging or controlling type, I just have this terrible feeling that if this doesn't elicit the type of response I'm looking for that we will be heading for the big D sooner rather than later. UGH!
Ronni_W Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 , I just have this terrible feeling that if this doesn't elicit the type of response I'm looking for that we will be heading for the big D sooner rather than later. Ah, see. It might not be wise to hook your entire marriage onto one letter, especially if that letter doesn't offer him real ways of understanding what's going on for you, or how he can help you gain what you need. YOU need to be clear on, and able to express, what you want and need, first. Otherwise your husband will basically be 'fumbling in the dark without a playbook' when trying to understand you and meet your needs. It's not fair to you, or to him, or to your marriage. (It's the mistake that I made...not having "sufficient and proper" words for my own discontent and unhappiness. I just dumped it on (ex)hubby in similar way you intend to do, and he had no clue what to do with it.) You're not being "selfish" or "crazy", though. You're just feeling what you're feeling, whether or not you have all the words for it yet. Hopefully TrustInYourself will offer you some insight and you'll be able to create a game plan that gives your marriage a real, excellent chance for success.
Author stuck33 Posted August 28, 2008 Author Posted August 28, 2008 Ah, see. It might not be wise to hook your entire marriage onto one letter, especially if that letter doesn't offer him real ways of understanding what's going on for you, or how he can help you gain what you need. YOU need to be clear on, and able to express, what you want and need, first. Otherwise your husband will basically be 'fumbling in the dark without a playbook' when trying to understand you and meet your needs. It's not fair to you, or to him, or to your marriage. (It's the mistake that I made...not having "sufficient and proper" words for my own discontent and unhappiness. I just dumped it on (ex)hubby in similar way you intend to do, and he had no clue what to do with it.) You're not being "selfish" or "crazy", though. You're just feeling what you're feeling, whether or not you have all the words for it yet. Hopefully TrustInYourself will offer you some insight and you'll be able to create a game plan that gives your marriage a real, excellent chance for success. Oh no no! Haha, I think what I meant came out wrong (see how bad I am with words!) What I meant was that - if he doesn't want to go to counseling or work with me on this or if he does agree to go but doesn't participate (he was not a fan of counseling for himself when we was going through a depression), I'm not going to sit around nagging and begging for what I need. Hope that comes out a little better
Ronni_W Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 Hope that comes out a little better Yeah...NOW I get it...thanks for clearing it up for me. I do understand about not sitting around "nagging and begging." I felt the same way. But then I'd also be stronger in expressing that -- sort of, "this has become a SERIOUS problem for me, to the point of it threatening our marriage." That is, help him fully comprehend that it's not something that is just going to go away after a couple of perfunctory counseling sessions and not much else. Keeping in mind that if he isn't too in touch with his own feelings, and doesn't have ability to express his own desires and dislikes in positive, healthy ways...it still may be difficult for him do what's necessary. Unfortunately. Have you considered individual therapy? Given that we're each 100% responsible for our individual contributions to relationship dynamics, it may prove useful.
Author stuck33 Posted August 28, 2008 Author Posted August 28, 2008 Keeping in mind that if he isn't too in touch with his own feelings, and doesn't have ability to express his own desires and dislikes in positive, healthy ways...it still may be difficult for him do what's necessary. Unfortunately. Have you considered individual therapy? Given that we're each 100% responsible for our individual contributions to relationship dynamics, it may prove useful. No he isn't unfortunatly. When he was a teenager and his parents got seperated (it was nasty) they tried to get all their kids to counseling. he went but refused to speak to the counselor. a few years ago after he cheated, he tried to kill himself...he refused to go to counseling. he say a therapist in order to get a presecription for antidepressants and that was the end of it. (he has been off of them for over 2 years and doing much better with his depression) so i'm not holding out a lot of hope for MC, i am however going to be looking into IC. i think it could be very useful to me in a number of ways. thank you for everything, ronni
TrustInYourself Posted August 28, 2008 Posted August 28, 2008 First, I want to thank you all for your replies. They are helping me to muster up the courage to actually give him this letter. Secondly, TIY- I'm interested with what you mean by some indicators of why I feel how I do. Sometimes I think I'm just being selfish and crazy and have no reason to be so unhappy in my marriage. Care to elaborate? Well you have expectations that you don't really understand. How is he going to understand? I don't like reflections because they are just snapshots into your current mood. I want you to figure out what it will take for you to feel more connected to your husband.
Recommended Posts