I don't get why...

I don't get why the "don't give a crap" attitude works. Last week was 3 different women. Last Sunday, I met a lady that I was attracted to but I had a "don't give a crap" attitude and we ended up going to a strip club together where I groped her up and she gave me her number...I never called her. Last Tuesday, I chatted up an attractive girl at a bar I'd seen before but had a "don't give a crap" attitude and ended up taking her home and sleeping with her. She's got my number now and texts every now and then but I'm not interested. Last Thursday I go on a date I'm really interested in, she reciprocates the feelings initially so I end up giving too much attention to her over the weekend & making romantic gestures...she goes cold this week. I don't understand why you pretty much have to treat a woman like crap to get her to be more interested in you.

It's sad but that's the way it is.

Not sure why. Used to have the "IDGAF" attitude myself but cut it because I didn't like how it made me, which was bitter towards women and their ways which I still don't understand.

Replaced "IDGAF" with "school, work, gym, school, work, gym, rinse and repeat". While I may or may not be attracting women, I don't know. The "IDGAF" attitude worked better for scoring some play, but it was play from women who ended up being a disappointment in the first place. Figured I'd just remove myself from that whole equation since even though I'm getting laid, it's still ending in disappointment.

I'd rather be content and productive with no play than treating women poorer than I'd treat my mother. So it's been about 3-4 months dry for me but it's alright. Next woman I meet I know she'll probably be:

1. Emotionally healthy (won't put up with that IDGAF crap)

2. Focused (same things I'm doing with my life)

3. Attractive and worth it (since now my goal is quality, not ass lol.)

It's all hopeful thinking but ****, that's all you've got as a young male on the lookout. I'm probably one of the most impatient people on the planet but working a taxing full time job and watching my parents grow old, my immediate family grow insane...it's humbling. So I just can't shake this feeling that the next woman I meet is going to be one that's worth the effort, the caring treatment, etc.

Not sure why. Used to have the "IDGAF" attitude myself but cut it because I didn't like how it made me, which was bitter towards women and their ways which I still don't understand.

 

Replaced "IDGAF" with "school, work, gym, school, work, gym, rinse and repeat". While I may or may not be attracting women, I don't know. The "IDGAF" attitude worked better for scoring some play, but it was play from women who ended up being a disappointment in the first place. Figured I'd just remove myself from that whole equation since even though I'm getting laid, it's still ending in disappointment.

 

I'd rather be content and productive with no play than treating women poorer than I'd treat my mother. So it's been about 3-4 months dry for me but it's alright. Next woman I meet I know she'll probably be:

 

1. Emotionally healthy (won't put up with that IDGAF crap)

 

2. Focused (same things I'm doing with my life)

 

3. Attractive and worth it (since now my goal is quality, not ass lol.)

 

 

It's all hopeful thinking but ****, that's all you've got as a young male on the lookout. I'm probably one of the most impatient people on the planet but working a taxing full time job and watching my parents grow old, my immediate family grow insane...it's humbling. So I just can't shake this feeling that the next woman I meet is going to be one that's worth the effort, the caring treatment, etc.

This is refreshing to read.

It's the women your attracting. I went through a "bad boy" period where I attracted either the lost souls who wanted to reform me or the really hot bad girls. No one else. It was like they didn't even exist.

You've heard of woman, & guys, who've been married 3 or more times & they tell you that all men/women are alike? I'ts because they attract the same people.

My bad boys days ended when I joined the military & found myself in a different area, with different friends & influences & after a few months a different attitude & instantly! I was meeting different women. I'm not saying it was better, just different & instantly. I thought for awhile it was just because of the new area but as I was re-stationed I realized; it was me & the new environment I was surrounded by. I'm also NOT advising you join the military, LOL. That was simply an eye opening experiences in my life. Years later, in psyc school, I learned the technical aspects of what occurred but I don't think I would have fully appreciated it if I hadn't experienced it.

What was different about the girl you liked? How would she have reacted to being groped at a strip club?

The only kind of girls/women that you could actually get by treating like crap are insecure, validation-seeking ladies. And who wants to deal with that mess? Unfortunately - you'll find lots of these women available for poor treatment.

Of course they all say they don't want to be treated like crap - who actually thinks they want to be mistreated? but they don't understand they allow it so inadvertenly - they must be craving something about it.

The only kind of girls/women that you could actually get by treating like crap are insecure, validation-seeking ladies. And who wants to deal with that mess? Unfortunately - you'll find lots of these women available for poor treatment.

Of course they all say they don't want to be treated like crap - who actually thinks they want to be mistreated? but they don't understand they allow it so inadvertenly - they must be craving something about it.

Yes, there will always be people like that. Most likely a learned behavior. They saw mom being treated poorly by dad or women in general being treated poorly by men so that is what they expect or at the very least tolerate. Their issues probably aren't so different from the OP learned behavior & environment. What guy takes a date to a strip club? This is basic stuff. He dates women who expect & tolerate being treated poorly & he knows how to do that. What he isn't having much luck with is treating a woman well. Most likely because he really doesn't know how, he just thinks he does.

I experience the same thing and I'm a woman. When I don't like a guy and it's clear I'm not interested, he falls in love with me. When I genuinely like someone and make this clear, it seems they are no longer interested. It's so frustrating.

And then there is the false positive reinforcement he is getting by treating woman poorly & believing, or wondering, why woman respond to that favorably. Then when he meets one that he believes he is being nice to wont call him back he assumes that ALL women like to be mistreated. At what point in a mans life does he go out on a date and say; "I think I'm gonna treat this woman like a piece of crap, just to see how it goes"? COME ON! there is a core environmental issue going on here.

I don't get why the "don't give a crap" attitude works. Last week was 3 different women. Last Sunday, I met a lady that I was attracted to but I had a "don't give a crap" attitude and we ended up going to a strip club together where I groped her up and she gave me her number...I never called her. Last Tuesday, I chatted up an attractive girl at a bar I'd seen before but had a "don't give a crap" attitude and ended up taking her home and sleeping with her. She's got my number now and texts every now and then but I'm not interested. Last Thursday I go on a date I'm really interested in, she reciprocates the feelings initially so I end up giving too much attention to her over the weekend & making romantic gestures...she goes cold this week. I don't understand why you pretty much have to treat a woman like crap to get her to be more interested in you.

I think if a woman needs you to treat her like crap to find you attractive, then she's dysfunctional.

For the rest of women, let's put ourselves in their shoes.

Imagine you're out at a bar or party or school or whatever...and you see this bland or ugly woman give you the eye, constantly come up and kiss your butt, shower you with attention, latch on to you at every social engagement, etc.

Now, you have no attraction to her. You might think she's sweet and nice, but you can't fathom dating or having sex with her. Plus her insane amount of attention is keeping hotter and more desirable women from talking to you. How would you feel?

How would you feel if you try to leave subtle ideas that you're not into her, but she ignores them all and keeps trying? So you first not call her back, but she keeps calling you. You try to avoid her at social affairs, but she seemingly finds out if you're going and makes sure to find you. She buys you gifts sometimes and it makes you feel uncomfortable.

Finally you tell her pointblank you're not into her and you don't want anything more than friends. She blows up, calls you an @$$hole, and starts loads of drama.

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Here's another one...imagine you're out with your buddies watching a game, drinking pitchers, etc...and it seems like every 30 minutes some bland or ugly girl tries to flirt with you. You don't find it hot, but more annoying because you aren't into these women and thus you can't enjoy the game with your peers.

How about if you saw hotter women step up and flirt, but you know immediately they are women who will get you to spend all your money on them, then drop you for a hotter guy. Some have even gotten nice guys to take them out on the town and then drop them off at another man's apartment at the end of the night so she could sleep with that other guy.

Wouldn't you be annoyed?

How about a girl you are kind of into, but she's coming on too strong too quick, or you know her "great girl" personality is all an act and wonder what kind of b!tch she might become when the "deal is sealed"?

This is what women go through.

Women like men who don't NEED them. Men who enjoy their company, but don't see "getting them" as the be-all-end-all matter of their lives. They hate men who have nothing more in their lives other than "find a girlfriend". So the guy has no life, and spends his every waking moment on trying to find someone.

Women like men who look like they have lives, interests, etc...and thus a woman becomes an added benefit to his life, not a necessity. Yes I know they want flowers, love, respect, devotion, etc...but they want to be a PARTNER...not an object of worship.

I'll say it over and over...when I stopped prioritizing dating and lived my life...more women were into me.

I experience the same thing and I'm a woman. When I don't like a guy and it's clear I'm not interested, he falls in love with me. When I genuinely like someone and make this clear, it seems they are no longer interested. It's so frustrating.

But there are a couple of components here. One is the date who has esteem issues & is grateful he/she is being talked to. The other is the belief that all people are like this & therefore should be treated poorly if you want to be in a relationship with them. Your attracting stalkers & are trying to get away from them. He's attracting women who tolerate being treated poorly and he is wondering if that's what it takes when he finds a girl who isn't interested in him. So he is wondering if he needs to treat all girls like crap.

I'll tell you right now, if I had taken my wife to a strip club on our first date there would not have been a second date. If she even thought that I was the type of guy who didn't respect women there wouldn't have been a first date. In fact my daughter ended a date early when a guy wanted to take her to Hooter's. Not that she has anything against the place but she does have something against a guy who would take her there on a date.

So I've got to wonder, if your in an environmental where there is a mindset that says it's ok to take a date to a strip club and grope her, how much more refined can that mindset be for any-other date? I'm not ripping on the guy, I'm just wondering. It's like; Hey I usually take broads to a strip club then back to my place but i like yous so I'll buy you flowers & then maybe we can go back to my place".

But there are a couple of components here. One is the date who has esteem issues & is grateful he/she is being talked to. The other is the belief that all people are like this & therefore should be treated poorly if you want to be in a relationship with them. Your attracting stalkers & are trying to get away from them. He's attracting women who tolerate being treated poorly and he is wondering if that's what it takes when he finds a girl who isn't interested in him. So he is wondering if he needs to treat all girls like crap.

 

I'll tell you right now, if I had taken my wife to a strip club on our first date there would not have been a second date. If she even thought that I was the type of guy who didn't respect women there wouldn't have been a first date. In fact my daughter ended a date early when a guy wanted to take her to Hooter's. Not that she has anything against the place but she does have something against a guy who would take her there on a date.

 

So I've got to wonder, if your in an environmental where there is a mindset that says it's ok to take a date to a strip club and grope her, how much more refined can that mindset be for any-other date? I'm not ripping on the guy, I'm just wondering. It's like; Hey I usually take broads to a strip club then back to my place but i like yous so I'll buy you flowers & then maybe we can go back to my place".

I'm typically the way I was with the date I liked but that usually gets stomped on, it's like I pedestal them too quick. The strip club experiment was just to see what I could get away with since I didn't really care about the woman. Same thing with the chick from the bar, I'm not a ONS kind of guy, but since I saw the payoff from Sunday I said what the hell let's see what I can continue to get away with. I literally told the girl I just wanted to see her t*tties, she told me she wasn't going to sleep with me, I told her I didn't care, then we ended up going back to my place.

did it again....diff chick same bar. dont give a crap attitude, took her home. she's sending me naked pics & i still dont care. why cant i "not care" about the ones i care about?

Women are like dogs, you gotta use reverse psychology to train them. They only want attention when you don't give it to them. They only want the guy they can't have.

Basically just don't give a f*ck. That's always the best approach. You can't be burned, you do the burning, and can get what you want out of it without sacraficing any emotion or attachment.

did it again....diff chick same bar. dont give a crap attitude, took her home. she's sending me naked pics & i still dont care. why cant i "not care" about the ones i care about?

Sounds like you need to up the quality of the girls you're taking home.

seriously - you go to a bar - she goes home with you the same night and you're surprised she's low quality and just chases a guy that treats her like he doesn't care.....

Why are you even surprised? You have such an unhealthy outlook on relationships it's scary.

Women are like dogs, you gotta use reverse psychology to train them. They only want attention when you don't give it to them. They only want the guy they can't have.

 

Basically just don't give a f*ck. That's always the best approach. You can't be burned, you do the burning, and can get what you want out of it without sacraficing any emotion or attachment.

Yea - and then he's going to end up with some needy, validation chasing, nuisance of a girl. Guys that get girls from treating them like dirt only attract ones not really having in the first place.

Women are like dogs, you gotta use reverse psychology to train them. They only want attention when you don't give it to them. They only want the guy they can't have.

 

Basically just don't give a f*ck. That's always the best approach. You can't be burned, you do the burning, and can get what you want out of it without sacraficing any emotion or attachment.

I can understand this attitude in the dating/initial approach stage of things. But this can't possibly be productive in the context of a relationship can it? I mean not giving a flip about your girlfriend or wife seems rather cold to me.

Not giving a crap = demonstration of higher value.

Women are sexually repelled by men who treat them like princesses.

Of course, they will always say the opposite.

I can understand this attitude in the dating/initial approach stage of things. But this can't possibly be productive in the context of a relationship can it? I mean not giving a flip about your girlfriend or wife seems rather cold to me.

You have to adjust and be more sensitive the longer your relationship goes....but you must always be a little bit indifferent. By indifferent I mean have the mindset that if it ends tomorrow, you'll be fine. It's the men who cling and worry that their lives will come to a crashing halt if their women leave them who wind up being jettisoned, or worse, cheated on.

Not giving a crap = demonstration of higher value.

 

Women are sexually repelled by men who treat them like princesses.

 

Of course, they will always say the opposite.

Yea and me not tolerating a man that's playing games with me and not giving a crap is me demonstrating MY higher value.

Honestly - you guys approving of this are pigs.

I'm not repelled by the fact that my boyfriend treats me wonderfully and he's not repelled that I do the same.

Seriously - I doubt even you can believe half the BS you're spilling out.

I can understand this attitude in the dating/initial approach stage of things. But this can't possibly be productive in the context of a relationship can it? I mean not giving a flip about your girlfriend or wife seems rather cold to me.

It's not that you don't give a flip, you just have to act like you don't care if she stays or walks. She has to know that if she crosses the line, or isn't living up to her end of the relationship....there are many other women out there who want to be with you.

When they know they have you and that you are truly loyal, knowing that you would be heartbroken and lost without them....that's when you will lose them. Just never let yourself get that far from an emotional standpoint. You have to go into every relationship for its entirety ready to walk away at any moment or be ready to be dropped for any reason by your SO. That's the nature of the business.

To sum up what I'm saying: Don't give yourself to them emotionally all the way. If you trust them with your heart, they will crush it.

Robert DeNiro in the movie "Heat" said: "Don't let yourself get attached to anything you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you feel the heat around the corner."

I don't get why the "don't give a crap" attitude works. Last week was 3 different women. Last Sunday, I met a lady that I was attracted to but I had a "don't give a crap" attitude and we ended up going to a strip club together where I groped her up and she gave me her number...I never called her. Last Tuesday, I chatted up an attractive girl at a bar I'd seen before but had a "don't give a crap" attitude and ended up taking her home and sleeping with her. She's got my number now and texts every now and then but I'm not interested. Last Thursday I go on a date I'm really interested in, she reciprocates the feelings initially so I end up giving too much attention to her over the weekend & making romantic gestures...she goes cold this week. I don't understand why you pretty much have to treat a woman like crap to get her to be more interested in you.

When I asked a guy who slept with hundreds of women what it exactly was they did that made women go so crazy over him, the answer he gave was "I ignore them and give attention to other women in their presence. The harder I play it and the harder I disrespect them, the harder they fall. The girls will act angry, but they'll sleep with me the same night, every f*cking time."

I've noticed the effect it seems to have on girls/women too, although I don't ignore girls/women with a purpose like players do. Although I have considered using it for what I think is a more genuine goal. If I like a girl I perhaps shouldn't immediately make a move on her and give her a chance to develop a crush on me if she's inclined to do so. That way I'll know there's reciprocation and thus I can make a move on her knowing that she's into me.

Doing that will initially take some restraint on my side and I suspect the reason players can do it so easily is that they don't give a damn about the women they f*ck anyway, for them it's about the p*ssy and for them the woman around the p*ssy is only the vehicle that moves it around.

It's not that you don't give a flip, you just have to act like you don't care if she stays or walks. She has to know that if she crosses the line, or isn't living up to her end of the relationship....there are many other women out there who want to be with you.

 

When they know they have you and that you are truly loyal, knowing that you would be heartbroken and lost without them....that's when you will lose them. Just never let yourself get that far from an emotional standpoint. You have to go into every relationship for its entirety ready to walk away at any moment or be ready to be dropped for any reason by your SO. That's the nature of the business.

 

To sum up what I'm saying: Don't give yourself to them emotionally all the way. If you trust them with your heart, they will crush it.

 

Robert DeNiro in the movie "Heat" said: "Don't let yourself get attached to anything you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you feel the heat around the corner."

DeNiro quotes? seriously? What are you? 20 years old?

If this is the way you approach relationships while you're young - fine...you'll learn that head games are a waste of your own time. Have fun with that.

Fine - you don't want to jump in head first - that's reasonable but if a woman plays this game with a man that's just as screwed up. I doubt if you would appreciate a girl doing this with you.

DeNiro quotes? seriously? What are you? 20 years old?

If this is the way you approach relationships while you're young - fine...you'll learn that head games are a waste of your own time. Have fun with that.

I'm 28, thanks for your concern. The movie quote was to help him grasp my point, but clearly you missed it.

I don't play head games, I have just learned, and very recently, that you play with fire you will get burned. If you give yourself to someone, you are giving them a piece of yourself, your soul. It's fragile and it gives them the ability to inflict great emotional pain on you. It is perfectly reasonable to maintain a happy and healthy relationship without allowing yourself to get to that level of emotional attachment. It's counterproductive to keeping a woman around, and it sets you up for getting hurt.

I just won't go that far anymore. It's like when you get burned, your skin gets a little tougher, calloused. And you can't be hurt again so easily. If I can explain to some how learn from MY mistakes of giving myself completely to someone, then maybe I can help them avoid the fire.

At least one of us is brining something constructive to the discussion.

I'm 28, thanks for your concern. The movie quote was to help him grasp my point, but clearly you missed it.

 

I don't play head games, I have just learned, and very recently, that you play with fire you will get burned. If you give yourself to someone, you are giving them a piece of yourself, your soul. It's fragile and it gives them the ability to inflict great emotional pain on you. It is perfectly reasonable to maintain a happy and healthy relationship without allowing yourself to get to that level of emotional attachment. It's counterproductive to keeping a woman around, and it sets you up for getting hurt.

 

I just won't go that far anymore. It's like when you get burned, your skin gets a little tougher, calloused. And you can't be hurt again so easily. If I can explain to some how learn from MY mistakes of giving myself completely to someone, then maybe I can help them avoid the fire.

I'm 28 as well and where I can see what you're saying about not diving head first and learning from your past relationships - it doesn't sound like you've learned much:

You said that women were like dogs. Seriously? No way would I ever consider someone saying that is "healthy" in any respect when it comes to relationships. Sorry - you sunk your own ship with that comment.

I understand what getting burned is like - but I don't use that as an excuse to abandon all respect for an entire gender and say they're like dogs and they have to be treated like so. Come on.