We broke up AGAIN, 20 days ago...today I initiated "closure"..how should I proceed?

I wrote here http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t264254/ originally, but I don't think I can classify this as a "second chance" anymore. I strongly believe I've pulled the last straw from the hat and there's nothing left but friendship. My main question is - do I salvage our friendship and gain a friend from this experience (we were good friends before dating) or do I throw away a friend forever, potentially throwing away any chance of reconciliation (even if it's 0.001%)?

 

Short History

Me (24) and my coworker (28), friends for ~6 months beforehand, dated for 1 year and got into a somewhat serious relationship. We had one minor breakup before and the first major breakup in August 2010. We got back together in September 2010 after I initiated NC for 10 days. She gave me a list of things she wanted me to fix and I promised I would. 20 days ago, in the afternoon of January 26, 2011, on MSN nonetheless, she asked for an indefinite break; I was baffled, dumbfounded and suggested that we break up instead out of pure anger. I had no reason to break our relationship - I only wanted to test her and see her response. Well, not the response I'd hoped as she agreed to the break. Easy way out for her I suppose since she was gonna dump my ass anyways, right?

 

20 Days in Between

The 20 days after our breakup, from Jan. 26 to today, were tough but somewhat bearable. It was a mixture of NC, full contact, accidental contact, avoid/ignore at all costs, to friendship. Some days at work seemed normal - we'd talk, chat, joke, laugh in person and on MSN. Other days, we would ignore each other like the plague. Some days, there were 'heys' and 'goodbyes', some days there weren't. The other day, I was feeling generous and voluntarily helped her do some heavy lifting (I'm in IT, she's not) and saved her a lot of trouble. We connected for a bit and ended up going to a work party together, arriving fashionably late, and sitting together (I know, stirring the rumour pot even more..). It was fun to pretend, we talked, acted, laughed like a couple but deep inside we were nothing! In the 20 days between, we barely talked about our relationship/breakup in person...I initiated one lunch but things did not turn out well. There were tears, anger, and fingers pointed...that was until today....

Today, Valentine's Day Eve...closure and the final gift

(yes I'm stupid, weak, dumb)

I messaged her yesterday and we agreed to eat brunch at her place then catch a movie just to pass some time. I, of course had other plans. There was a special project I was working on before our breakup, specifically for her, for us, for V-Day, and nothing but death was going to stop me from completing the project and putting it in her hands. It was a scrapbook that she made me for V-Day 2010 for the first ~3 months of our relationship. It was the sweetest thing anyone's ever done for me...I kept it for awhile but decided to either destroy/return it to her after our first major breakup in Fall 2010. She kept it, we got back together eventually, and I promised her I would add my portion of the scrapbook one day.

 

And that's exactly what I did last night. I finished our book, met up with her today for closure, and gave her our book. We never really talked after the breakup but today we talked our hearts out for ~4 hours. Lots of mourning, crying (mostly by me, since girls apparently have no emotions), no blaming or finger pointing which is the good thing. I listed my faults, apologized for my mistakes as they were mostly mine, and proposed changes that would improve our relationship...but of course it was too late. I wasn't terribly surprised with the outcome, but I had to come for closure and I had to give it my all for one last shot or suffer with regret the rest of my life. Of course I cried, wept, begged, pleaded..simply because I had no other option. She sat, watched, and comforted me. Here were some of her responses:

 

"This would have worked 4 months ago..."

"If only you showed you cared this much while we were in a relationship..."

"But I already told you a million times I don't like _______..."

"I care about you and love you as a friend..."

"What if you can find someone better and I can find someone better?"

"You are not ready for a relationship right now..."

"We both need to heal..."

"I felt less and less love for you ~3 months ago..." (yet we slow danced together and came out of the closet for the Work Christmas Function...AND SHE GAVE ME A ****IN RING for Christmas?!? A RING?!?!?!?!)

I do not disagree with any of her words. She's made up her mind, it's her choice, and I know I can't change her heart, so I accept her decision.

 

"One day you're going to find another girl, love that girl with all your heart, give her your 100%, and I will be jealous..."

The only thing I cannot accept, at least not right now, is how I messed up the relationship (twice). This quote is like a dagger to my heart and will stay with me for the rest of my life. I loved this girl, never cheated on her, never thought about other girls, dedicated a lot to her, but did not give her my 100% constantly while she did more than I did. I gave her 70%, 80%, 90%, 100%, but never the full 100% that she deserved all the time. I know and realize that a relationship is a two-way street and both parties have to commit 100% always to make it work. I did not and now I am single .

 

The way today ended was sad. I returned to her the Christmas present she gave me...a ring of our "love". She insisted that I keep it as a memory of our "love" since she'd keep our scrapbook (she always keeps everything from her ex'es). I insisted that she keep it, and give it to the next person she loves because our "love" does not exist anymore. I, for the most part, failed our relationship and I wasn't going to wake up and remind myself of my shortcomings every morning. That's when she started to really bawl (she didn't cry much when I was apologizing before) and let me out...

 

SOOO, the question I have right now is, how do I proceed? Do I salvage our friendship and gain a friend from this experience (we were good friends before dating) or do I throw away a friend forever, potentially throwing away any chance of reconciliation (even if it's 0.001%)? What are my odds of getting her back if we do becomes good friends again? I am going to go on a journey of self-improvement, do I want to do that with her by my side, as a friend, or without her? WHAT SHOULD I DO?

 

 

Where there is hope - Dumb as I am, I promised I'd court her again one day and even asked if there was a possibility we could get back together in 6-12 months...she neither said yes or no, only that I am not ready to be in a relationship right now.

Where there is no hope - I took a look at her notebook, hoping to see something that signified us..instead, I was utterly shocked to see her favourite picture of her ex-bf (first lover, SEVEN years ago) hidden in between the pages. If anyone cares, this ex was a problem for me twice in our relationship - once he came out of NOWHERE when we were happy and a second time when we were JUST getting back together (http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t245401/). I am not angry at her, but I want to know WTF his picture is doing there when she clearly promised me NC with him, no pictures, phone numbers, NOTHING to remind her of him...I WANT ANSWERS

Edited February 14, 2011 by dextm

I’m not going to read all your pervious posts and just go with what you’ve documented here in the essence of time.

 

It seems you have come to realize what went wrong or better said what you did wrong in this relationship. Sometimes coming to your senses and making corrections puts the relationship on track, but often when one of the partners has been living with the issues for much time when they finally talk about it either through an argument, a break up or some other altercation, the damage from the issues has taken seed and things are never the same. It sounds like this is the case of your relationship.

 

You did what you thought was right and it probably was, although one day when you find the next really great girl you will wish so much you had never begged or pleaded with this one. Mark my words on that point even if it’s hard to imagine that day will come in your current emotional pain.

 

Your question is around keeping her as a friend and perhaps leaving the door ajar for reconciliation. There are thousands of posts on this subject in this forum. All of the long-term experienced posters will tell you it cannot be done and the best course is NO CONTACT, the reason being to distance yourself and start the healing process. You will find some “new” posters who are clinging to hope such as yours and are having trouble moving on; they have recently broken up and tend to lean towards being friends with their EX with the thought of keeping their chances alive.

 

Despite the different points of view there are very, very few posts in these forums about successful friendships with EX’s and hardly any with reconciliations with long-term EX’s that amount to a new rekindled relationship of any significance. Oh yes they do happen, but rarely since so much changes when you are no longer together and the healing process starts to open the world to new possibilities.

 

I know in your pain today all you want is her back in your arms. Right? We’ve read in your post she is not ready for this and perhaps is sugar coating the real truth that she will never be ready to return. I’m afraid all a friendship with her will do is make your pain intensify and your wishes more profound. Don’t do that to yourself.

 

Work on healing now.

 

Since you both are employed in the same location you’re bound to run into each other. Be polite, smile but don’t engage in conversation with her. Simply say your hellos and keep moving…if she is as good as you say she is she will understand how you are coping and give you both the space you need. The sooner you are in good mind and spirit the sooner you’re likely to find the next really great catch to test the ALL NEW YOU upon and there won’t be a list of things for you to FIX!

 

Best Wishes,

 

Am4Real

It seems you have come to realize what went wrong or better said what you did wrong in this relationship. Sometimes coming to your senses and making corrections puts the relationship on track, but often when one of the partners has been living with the issues for much time when they finally talk about it either through an argument, a break up or some other altercation, the damage from the issues has taken seed and things are never the same. It sounds like this is the case of your relationship.

 

+1

 

You will find some “new” posters who are clinging to hope such as yours and are having trouble moving on; they have recently broken up and tend to lean towards being friends with their EX with the thought of keeping their chances alive.

 

If she cheated on me or was a terrible gf to me when we were together, I would not hesitate to NC, delete all pics, etc. She was good to me, breakup was mainly my fault, and we were very good friends before, so she doesn't deserve to be shut down...according to her.

 

Since you both are employed in the same location you’re bound to run into each other. Be polite, smile but don’t engage in conversation with her. Simply say your hellos and keep moving…

 

We do that a lot. I do some systems support so I'm bound to get questions from her. This morning I had to fix something for her and she started talking about her brother....how am I supposed to respond?

 

 

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I don't feel so bad today. I just want to know why she has a picture of her ex and if it was there before we broke up. I'd much rather have a reason to hate her then to break up so "cleanly". I really need to know.

She messaged me "Happy Valentine's Day" on work messenger...

Poor you Dex, I hope you were strong and didn't reply. What did you do though?

 

Right this:

 

She was good to me, breakup was mainly my fault, and we were very good friends before, so she doesn't deserve to be shut down...according to her.

 

But she is the one who doesn't want to be with you now right? Therefore she has waivered all her rights and what she 'deserves'. She is being all precious and princess like with that and it is not fair for you, but you know this cos we see it all the time on here. At least give NC a fair trial of 2 weeks before you make a judgement, you may well find yourself feeling strong and glad to be free of the relationship after that time.

Poor you Dex, I hope you were strong and didn't reply. What did you do though?

 

I didn't respond to her V-day wishes. What's the point? Of course she's having a happy V-day...she already admitted that she "feels like a weight has been lifted off her shoulder." Whatever. Good for her. I'm not happy.

 

She was good to me, breakup was mainly my fault, and we were very good friends before, so she doesn't deserve to be shut down...according to her.

 

But she is the one who doesn't want to be with you now right? Therefore she has waivered all her rights and what she 'deserves'. She is being all precious and princess like with that and it is not fair for you, but you know this cos we see it all the time on here. At least give NC a fair trial of 2 weeks before you make a judgement, you may well find yourself feeling strong and glad to be free of the relationship after that time.

 

I'm trying to NC as best as possible but I can't completely ignore her because of work...damn work, our relationship would be so much better if we didn't work in the same office and have to see each other almost 24/7... I'll have to deal with it now, but I just had to try without regrets right? :o

 

Moments ago she needed help lifting some 40lb boxes and storing them in the shelves. I wanted to be an ******* to her and pretend to be busy but that would just make my work performance look bad. I ended up helping her. The last thing I need is my personal life ruining the work life....ughhh

 

 

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Guys, what would you do here? I want to know why she has a picture of her ex in her notebook and if it was there before we broke up. Curiousity kills and I really need to know . I find that I need a reason to "hate" her even though she's done practically nothing wrong other than breaking up with me. Ughhh, do I confront her now about it, 2 weeks down the road, or 3 months down the road? I need to know . I don't want her to get back with that scumbag ex (he really screwed her over 7 years ago).

Look, ask her about the picture now but don't expect a honest answer now or ever. But once you've asked her, that is it, go NC (apart from work - can you look for a new job maybe?) and start your recovery.

Look, ask her about the picture now but don't expect a honest answer now or ever. But once you've asked her, that is it, go NC (apart from work - can you look for a new job maybe?) and start your recovery.

 

I don't plan to work here for much longer and it's not just about her. The current job sucks and it's hard to move up...I'm actually planning to go back to school part time.

 

Moments ago, she came over to my desk, gave me a hug and said "Happy V-Day", then walked off...go figure, we both changed our work hours to accommodate the relationship. NC won't work if she keeps forcing the issue. Should I just tell her straight up, in her face, to GTFO of my life?

I would politely tell her for sure that you don't want her contact, sympathy and you certainly don't want hugs!! FFS, you poor thing - you had to keep face in public but that is why she did it, so she doesn't look the bad girl. Defo put her straight.

Look, ask her about the picture now but don't expect a honest answer now or ever. But once you've asked her, that is it, go NC (apart from work - can you look for a new job maybe?) and start your recovery.

 

Not sure whether this was good or bad advice but I asked her right after work before going our separate ways. I just had to, otherwise I'd continue to torment my soul forever. Her response was this:

 

"What picture? What notebook? What are you talking about? *puzzled look* *20 seconds later* Oh that picture? I must have left it there months ago. Why did you go snooping around my stuff?"

 

Like you said, I can't expect a honest answer. It could be the truth or it could not. She's always been honest with me whilst in our relationship and even after we first broke up (even if it meant hurting me, she was honest when I asked about the new guy, etc. [stupid move I know]) so I think I'm gonna have to give her the benefit of the doubt and just move on. Sigh.

 

I would politely tell her for sure that you don't want her contact, sympathy and you certainly don't want hugs!! FFS, you poor thing - you had to keep face in public but that is why she did it, so she doesn't look the bad girl. Defo put her straight.

 

She didn't do it in public, she waited till the end of the day when everyone was gone and came over to my cube. The last thing we need on our plates is to give our coworkers some false illusion and morning coffee chit chat.

Your giving us a “day in the life of you and your EX” and scribble it all you want and make excuses for you not being able to let go of her for sometime…however you ask for advice, what we think, and what to do and do the exact opposite.

 

Go back to the top of your post and re-read the advice and tell us how you are going to man-up and move on starting tomorrow.

 

She's over you buddy...try and get that understanding in your head and move on.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showpost.php?p=3246806&postcount=2

Your giving us a “day in the life of you and your EX” and scribble it all you want and make excuses for you not being able to let go of her for sometime…however you ask for advice, what we think, and what to do and do the exact opposite.

 

Go back to the top of your post and re-read the advice and tell us how you are going to man-up and move on starting tomorrow.

 

She's over you buddy...try and get that understanding in your head and move on.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showpost.php?p=3246806&postcount=2

 

Okay. I haven't gone out of my way to contact her since yesterday evening. I had to do one thing, which turned to two - give her the damn scrapbook, in which I found out about the pic of her ex-scumbag, two - find out what the F the pic was doing there...

 

I'm moving on as best as I can. But to put on a show and act happy, fun, polite in front of her? That's tough. She's been with me for a year. We can usually tell if there's something wrong. What difference would it make if this girl can see thru my "act"? I think I'm just going to have to fight through this until the day I am truly, freely happy (Without her).

Hi Dex,

 

Well you asked her. The pause either meant she really had no idea, or she had been caught and quickly thought of a cover up. Either way you'll never know the truth but somewhere she has lied to you and you deserve way better.

 

As for acting ok around her - you CAN do it. Just pretend and keep pretending. Who is your fav actor? Imagine him playing you in a film and act like you'd be played; we would all like to be portrayed as strong, friendly etc (universally appealing traits). Eventually it won't be acting anymore and you will get into the habit of feeling better. Train your mind, it is possible.

My no. 1 rule in dating is:

 

Never ever get involved with someone you work with. I don't care how beautiful, attractive, or compatible you are. I just don't go there. I've heard way to many horror stories.

 

And even if you wanted to try NC to see if there was a chance at getting her back, it's impossible.

Hi Dex,

 

Well you asked her. The pause either meant she really had no idea, or she had been caught and quickly thought of a cover up. Either way you'll never know the truth but somewhere she has lied to you and you deserve way better.

 

As for acting ok around her - you CAN do it. Just pretend and keep pretending. Who is your fav actor? Imagine him playing you in a film and act like you'd be played; we would all like to be portrayed as strong, friendly etc (universally appealing traits). Eventually it won't be acting anymore and you will get into the habit of feeling better. Train your mind, it is possible.

 

Few times today I didn't look at her and one time she said 'hi' but I was too busy doing whatever I had to do to respond. Tomorrow I'll act nicer. I don't want her to suddenly think we're friends now because I've decided to act "nice".

 

My no. 1 rule in dating is:

 

Never ever get involved with someone you work with. I don't care how beautiful, attractive, or compatible you are. I just don't go there. I've heard way to many horror stories.

 

And even if you wanted to try NC to see if there was a chance at getting her back, it's impossible.

 

Then your suggestion is to be friends? Or enemies?

The advice given you in earlier posts to “ask about the picture” is just plain dumb/bad.

 

What on earth would you expecting to happen – did you think she would tell you all about it? Of course not! Nor is she going to tell you about what has been going on in her life sexually with you out of the picture. She doesn’t owe you anything and certainly not an explanation. Do you get that now? She is over you and otherwise just playing you along for her sake, not yours!

 

The more you play detective and worry about what it all meant, when things changed in her mind or heart, or worse yet what she is doing when she is not with you, will drive you nuts and you certainly will not be treated kindly by her for asking or prying into her mind or actions.

 

Join a gym – take all the frustration out on the weights or the treadmill. You’ll be looking good and full of endorphins in no time making you ready for whatever else comes along.

Secondly, stop playing games about how you feel or how you should act as one poster suggested. That is just plain dumb/crazy.

 

If you feel like crap it’s okay to be crappy.

 

I said be polite to her whenever you cross paths but there is absolutely no need to pretend you are joyfully happy when you’re not – after all the games she has been playing with you the last thing you need is "YOU" playing games with "YOURSELF".

Oi am4real, Dex had pretty much made his mind up; he was going to ask about the picture at some point and he wanted to know whether to do it now, in weeks or months. Now, knowing his best call was to move on with his life it was I who figured it would have to be now, as it would seem even crazier in the future with this advice:

 

Look, ask her about the picture now but don't expect a honest answer now or ever. But once you've asked her, that is it, go NC (apart from work - can you look for a new job maybe?) and start your recovery.

 

Note the bolded bit!! I don't appreciate being called dumb by someone who has clearly not read/comprehended the thread in full.

 

As humans we are not robots and sometimes we have questions, or things to say ourselves before we can accept closure and go into no contact.

What on earth would you expecting to happen – did you think she would tell you all about it? Of course not! Nor is she going to tell you about what has been going on in her life sexually with you out of the picture. She doesn’t owe you anything and certainly not an explanation. Do you get that now? She is over you and otherwise just playing you along for her sake, not yours!

 

We stayed in contact after our first break up (friends I guess?) and did everything together minus the romantic stuff. We constantly asked each other "What are you doin' tonight? Who are you going out with? etc.). She replied honestly, I kinda replied honestly. She told me things that she knew would hurt me because I wanted to know, and I wanted to confirm my own thoughts/beliefs. She told me she wanted to be friends with the ex, even told me they kissed out of nowhere.... She told me because I asked, not because she wanted to feel superior/happy over me and make me feel bad.

 

Do I care about that stuff now? She's probably f'ing someone right now but do I care? Am I going to ask her about it? No...

 

The more you play detective and worry about what it all meant, when things changed in her mind or heart, or worse yet what she is doing when she is not with you, will drive you nuts and you certainly will not be treated kindly by her for asking or prying into her mind or actions.

 

Agreed. If I found out months later, I wouldn't care. It's just that I found out about it on closure day.

I said be polite to her whenever you cross paths but there is absolutely no need to pretend you are joyfully happy when you’re not – after all the games she has been playing with you the last thing you need is "YOU" playing games with "YOURSELF".

 

I'll do the bare minimum. Hi, bye, nothing else. Maybe I'll even ignore her sometimes. I don't want her to mistaken my "politeness" as a means of mending our "friendship" right?

 

It sucks that I do systems support/administration...if she needs "work-related" help, I have no choice but to go and see her face to face. I really hope she doesn't use that to "open me up".

It's so boring at work. I just want to talk to her. God damn it!!!!!