Consequences without D Day

[jj33]

Im sure there have been threads on this before but it seems to me that if the A ends without a Dday, the MP has no "consequences". If the AP wanted more and went NC or walked out of disappointment then there are consequences but for the MP? Seems not so much.

 

I kind of resent that. There have been 0 consequences for him and loads of consequences for me. Well not 0 for him but almost 0. The people who impact his life whom I told (not his W shes uninterested) but the others torture him a little bit to this day and I know that because he called me recently to ask if I had mentioned it again because hes still being grilled about it. But other than that. Nothing.

[2sunny]

he may be baiting you to get some emotional response from you - maybe see if you might be willing to step back into your "old behavior"...

if it were me - i would spend NO TIME/ENERGY/EFFORT even responding to anything he may have to say.

 

look at it this way - he's only in contact to waste your time and energy to feed HIS ego... so DON'T bother giving him that satisfaction/power.

 

i'd be telling him to buzz off.

[jj33]

he may be baiting you to get some emotional response from you - maybe see if you might be willing to step back into your "old behavior"...

if it were me - i would spend NO TIME/ENERGY/EFFORT even responding to anything he may have to say.

 

look at it this way - he's only in contact to waste your time and energy to feed HIS ego... so DON'T bother giving him that satisfaction/power.

 

i'd be telling him to buzz off.

 

Thanks Sunny. No he would never ask me to go there again. Too messy after everything. He would go after someone new.

[Spark1111]

Im sure there have been threads on this before but it seems to me that if the A ends without a Dday, the MP has no "consequences". If the AP wanted more and went NC or walked out of disappointment then there are consequences but for the MP? Seems not so much.

 

I kind of resent that. There have been 0 consequences for him and loads of consequences for me. Well not 0 for him but almost 0. The people who impact his life whom I told (not his W shes uninterested) but the others torture him a little bit to this day and I know that because he called me recently to ask if I had mentioned it again because hes still being grilled about it. But other than that. Nothing.

 

jj...there is another thread somewhere today about karma...how a person will not or cannot be forced to change without a dday.

 

But here is what I think: wherever you go, well, there you are. And that may be enough karma for one lifetime.

 

Unhappy, blaming others, making the same mistakes over and over, nothing changes, stuck in a miasma of nothing new or exciting or authentic. Waiting for external events to give you some self-worth or some validation: more money, more status, more praise, more, more, more.

 

But it is never enough.

 

That's karma enough, dontcha think? Being on the hamster wheel you never get off of because you lack the courage to change it up and make it real?

 

And this does not need to apply to only MAP without DDays. This can apply equally to OW who, years later, are stuck in anger and bitterness and he lied to me, and they never introspected or changed or owned their part in their own unhappiness and willing engagement with a damaged man.

 

Hey, we are either living, and learning and growing stronger and happier, or we are stuck in a state of dying by degrees.

 

It's a personal choice, with or without a DDay. There is always consequences in life. Some just don't realize what they are, if ever, unless it is too late.

[Spark1111]

Thanks Sunny. No he would never ask me to go there again. Too messy after everything. He would go after someone new.

 

And how SAD AND PATHETIC is that? That in and of itself is a consequence.

[jj33]

And how SAD AND PATHETIC is that? That in and of itself is a consequence.

 

LOL thanks Spark. That is the best smile I have gotten all day. I was going through some things today and I found Ws card (so I can call her and be her bff... )

 

Yeah I guess that is karma. They have each other and they continue to play out their little drama together. I hear she has some man in her life (not xMM) so I figure he must be on the lookout for somone new too. Not that they will divorce mind you, heaven forbid what would the neighbors say!

[whichwayisup]

The thing is, you don't know what type of consquences he's truly suffered and the affect it's had on him. He more than likely wouldn't want you to know either.

 

jj, his will come one day. Maybe unrelated to this situation, but something is coming his way.. Karma.

[TigerCub]

Hey JJ,

 

I get what you're saying.

 

There were times in the beginning of NC where I thought I wanted him to suffer some consequences, but that thought passed.

 

There is obviously something very wrong with his relationship with his gf/mother of his children - he's cheated on her constantly. He really is someone with daddy / abandonment issues - I actually felt more sorry for him than out for vengeance when I think of it that way.

 

He's missing something, it could be in his "M", its definitely in himself, and it could be both - I think living that way without dealing with it is consequence enough.

 

I dunno, when I think of his life and his choices, the (can't be very fulfilling) "M", the kids, the constant living a lie, the abandonment issues - all that, I honestly would hate to have a life like his - so when I think of that, the idea of consequence or revenge or whatever doesn't seem important to me.

 

Meanwhile I've moved on to an incomparably better man and I'm happy and I'm the one IGNORING xmm when he tries to email me once in a while

 

But I totally understand what you're saying

[lynne76]

I've had these questions too. I guess unfortunately (or fortunately) the consequences for my xMM are that he DID get introspective and change things in his life. So now he's in a really good place with himself and his marriage, and I'm on the sidelines. It's like I pushed him to see truths about himself and he took positive action on those things and now my loss is his wife's gain. He will never cheat on her again and they are trying for another baby (they lost the last one). I did a lot of "therapy" with him and he is so appreciative of my role in his life....but me, I just got so heartbroken. Zero consequences for him, at least in a negative sense....and she just benefits from everything I taught him, be it sexual openness, spiritual connection, communication....all those things. I've "taught" men how to be better men before....they go to someone else and apply the lessons after they've torn through my life. It's tiring.

[woinlove]

I've had these questions too. I guess unfortunately (or fortunately) the consequences for my xMM are that he DID get introspective and change things in his life. So now he's in a really good place with himself and his marriage, and I'm on the sidelines. It's like I pushed him to see truths about himself and he took positive action on those things and now my loss is his wife's gain. He will never cheat on her again and they are trying for another baby (they lost the last one). I did a lot of "therapy" with him and he is so appreciative of my role in his life....but me, I just got so heartbroken. Zero consequences for him, at least in a negative sense....and she just benefits from everything I taught him, be it sexual openness, spiritual connection, communication....all those things. I've "taught" men how to be better men before....they go to someone else and apply the lessons after they've torn through my life. It's tiring.

 

I'm a firm believer in the fact that people can change (although, sadly, many do not change). If someone changes for the better, to lead a more honest and authentic life, that is good. However, it's awful that you have essentially been used in this learning experience - from the sounds of it, more than once. I hope that you connect with someone who is not so broken that they need you in this way, so you can enjoy and benefit from the fact that they are already a better person.

[East7]

IMO the "consequences" to the WS without D-day are more or less the same as if the A was still going on:

 

- Marriage goes on with the same flaws, no re-commitment, no MC/IC, no efforts to change the bad dynamics within the M or WS himself.

 

- Loss of sexual interest for the BS, enforcement of the sense of "entitlement" and taking BS for granted which may lead to new affairs.

 

- Heavy hidden guilt which leads into swinging between excessive attentions for the BS and moments of depression and avoidance.

 

- Pining after AP, breaking NC and attempting to resume the A each-time there is a low point in the M, OR nostalgia for the AP and resentment towards BS after a big fight.

 

- Disconnection and desire to spend time apart from the BS (hobbies, friends etc).

 

 

I strongly believe that in most cases the lie comes up one day in a form or another. Either the guilt is to heavy to bear and the WS confesses or the BS learns it from a friend, an old message, etc etc.

[reboot]

Once the affair has ended, why would you care if he/she had any consequences? It's over. New chapter.

 

Is it that "I didn't get any revenge" ?

[Spark1111]

IMO the "consequences" to the WS without D-day are more or less the same as if the A was still going on:

 

- Marriage goes on with the same flaws, no re-commitment, no MC/IC, no efforts to change the bad dynamics within the M or WS himself.

 

- Loss of sexual interest for the BS, enforcement of the sense of "entitlement" and taking BS for granted which may lead to new affairs.

 

- Heavy hidden guilt which leads into swinging between excessive attentions for the BS and moments of depression and avoidance.

 

- Pining after AP, breaking NC and attempting to resume the A each-time there is a low point in the M, OR nostalgia for the AP and resentment towards BS after a big fight.

 

- Disconnection and desire to spend time apart from the BS (hobbies, friends etc).

 

 

I strongly believe that in most cases the lie comes up one day in a form or another. Either the guilt is to heavy to bear and the WS confesses or the BS learns it from a friend, an old message, etc etc.

 

Which proves my point, East: Wherever you go, well there you still are. Karma enough IMO.

[Owl]

Which proves my point, East: Wherever you go, well there you still are. Karma enough IMO.

 

Shades of Buckaroo Banzai!!!

 

Wonder if there's anyone who's read this that remembers 'ole Buckaroo?

[goodthingscome]

I don't understand why you feel there has to be negative impact for your MM/MW? What happened to all the love? Whining about it now just makes you look and feel bad.

 

Accept that the affair has run it's course, hold on to the memories and move on.

Hopefully your next relationship will be an honest and open one that you can be proud of.

[reboot]

Shades of Buckaroo Banzai!!!

 

Wonder if there's anyone who's read this that remembers 'ole Buckaroo?

 

Unfortunately, I do.

[xxoo]

If he had ended up with you, would you believe he deserved some consequences for the affair?

 

I'm curious whey his involvement in the affair was justifiable when it was going on, but deserves consequences now that it ended badly for you.

 

Is it in the nature of the ending?

 

I do understand pain, and the desire for justice. He'll reap what he sows, as we all do eventually. Even if the affair is never discovered, is he truly living a life you'd want for yourself?

[IfWishesWereHorses]

Im sure there have been threads on this before but it seems to me that if the A ends without a Dday, the MP has no "consequences". If the AP wanted more and went NC or walked out of disappointment then there are consequences but for the MP? Seems not so much.

 

I kind of resent that. There have been 0 consequences for him and loads of consequences for me. Well not 0 for him but almost 0. The people who impact his life whom I told (not his W shes uninterested) but the others torture him a little bit to this day and I know that because he called me recently to ask if I had mentioned it again because hes still being grilled about it. But other than that. Nothing.

 

What consequences does an AP expect or desire for the MP? I think much of this is that the person who cares least wins. Even when a normal relationship dies, one person is usually hurt more by it.

 

A WS doesn't respect his marriage enough to not have an affair, nor do they respect the AP enough to leave the M. What consequences would hurt a person who doesn't care?

 

If two mature adults agree to the affair and their rolls as AP and MP, why the need to wish ill will on the person they supposedly loved once the R comes to and end? Who is it that deserves consequences? The person who put more stock into the R and it's future will always be the one who is most hurt by it's ending.

 

JJ, men like him never lose, because losing is a mental thing. It's a mental game and all of the consequences in the world won't change who he is.

[jj33]

 

JJ, men like him never lose, because losing is a mental thing. It's a mental game and all of the consequences in the world won't change who he is.

 

Truer words were never said men like him dont lose. Its kind of annoying sometimes. I dont wish him unhappiness or anything it just feels unfair that I have consequences (not emotional anymore but in dealing with certain people) and he does not because hes a man and he is who he is and there is a huge double standard.

 

Thanks for the hug BB

[bentnotbroken]

Unfortunately, I do.

Me too.

[Circular]

I've contemplated this thread for a bit and I haven't come up with a clear way to articulate what I'm thinking, but here's a rough shot at it.

 

I suppose it can be distilled into there are direct repercussions and indirect ones. I think most of the people here are suffering/living the direct reprecussions, it's the nature of if you're an introspective person or not in many cases. Are you willing to ask the questions and seek out the answers? Even if those answers can be hard to hear and accept. Ultimately find your path out of darkness. All introspection results in some form of change, change, especially emotionally rooted is hard, at times painful. I'm a true believer that happiness comes from within, it's the way you perceive life and what's around you. I think that's why you're here and that's why many of us are, including me; At times I'm feeling the pain in the here and now, I'm trying to make changes, and I'm trying to understand myself better and do the right things, make the right decisions; sometimes given the emotional charge that's not easy.

 

My experience in life is that those people that are not introspective, are care-free in their actions, ignore any sense of accountability, responsibility pay a different price through at times a lonely and shallow existence, its more indirect. Like your xAP he'll most likely live out his days searching for something he'll never find, always have this sense of emptiness, a part of his soul unfulfilled. Constantly in denial, rejecting the need to change or ask hard questions of himself. Most likely his life will be filled with 'acquaintances', people who see that person for who they are and keep them at an arms distance, never truly connecting and never understanding the discomfort that's within themselves. Their pain is different, it comes out in different ways; drugs, alcohol, addictions, etc... Their pain is a more life-long emptiness.

 

I don't believe anyone truly comes out of an attached experienced unscathed. Dang, even three decades later I still sometimes remember my college girlfriend that I abruptly and rightfully broke up with. When I think about it I think I could have been more compassionate than I was, but I live with it and try to remember not to treat people that way.

[NoIDidn't]

Once the affair has ended, why would you care if he/she had any consequences? It's over. New chapter.

 

Is it that "I didn't get any revenge" ?

 

I think this is exactly it. It is wanting your presence in their lives to be validated and acknowledged. Its wanting them to actually feel your loss, that's the "consequence" most of us want.

 

I've only seen one of the guys that lied to me about their status (having a GF or Fiance) have some consequences because of our relationship. She dumped him. But he had already dumped me, so I didn't experience a d-day on my end - they did on theirs when she put two-and-two together.

 

The others, they just went on their merry little way and made me feel inconsequential to them. Like I was used.

 

But you always reap what you sow. They sowed bad Ju-ju in being cheaters, and they reaped poor relationships. Seeing me in a solid marriage and happy in it (most of the time), made them wish they'd treated me better, and made some wish they'd treated most of the women they dealt with better.

 

But, yeah, I do think its wanting to know they experienced a loss as the "consequence".

[MissBee]

Im sure there have been threads on this before but it seems to me that if the A ends without a Dday, the MP has no "consequences". If the AP wanted more and went NC or walked out of disappointment then there are consequences but for the MP? Seems not so much.

 

I kind of resent that. There have been 0 consequences for him and loads of consequences for me. Well not 0 for him but almost 0. The people who impact his life whom I told (not his W shes uninterested) but the others torture him a little bit to this day and I know that because he called me recently to ask if I had mentioned it again because hes still being grilled about it. But other than that. Nothing.

 

What consequences would you say you've had as the non-married person?

 

I do believe there can be consequences even if there is no dday; however, I think the true issue is that we often want to be the ones to dictate this other person's consequences as a form of punishment that suits our standard, based on how we feel it has affected us, and we want to make them feel just as bad as we do or worst. In that case, it can be tricky, as sometimes there is just no way to know the true effect of things on this person and sometimes consequences are not immediate or they are not apparent to outsiders. I have therefore learned that I cannot be hung up on another's lesson/consequence, as it can drive me crazy and my idea of how much they are/are not "paying the price" may be way off the mark and frankly counterproductive to me living my life. I'd rather believe everything has a consequence and no one escapes that and it is not for me to decide a person's consequence. As my grandma says: "Today for me, tomorrow for you"....so I'd rather leave people to their own fate instead of constantly worrying about if they're paying the price or not and policing their life in that way. I've done it before with my ex for over a year, and it was such a waste of time and made me so miserable and half of what I thought was actually false and him paying or not paying didn't change my life...so I learned my lesson in that regard.

Edited August 30, 2011 by MissBee

[MissBee]

If he had ended up with you, would you believe he deserved some consequences for the affair?

 

I'm curious whey his involvement in the affair was justifiable when it was going on, but deserves consequences now that it ended badly for you.

 

Is it in the nature of the ending?

 

I do understand pain, and the desire for justice. He'll reap what he sows, as we all do eventually. Even if the affair is never discovered, is he truly living a life you'd want for yourself?

 

Great questions!

[jj33]

Great questions!

 

The day that I started the thread I had read something about his life. It was just a passing reference in an article, but it made me feel so foolish. I know the truth about how ugly his marriage is. Even after all this time it gets to me that he values the lifestyle over anything else. I wish I could just erase all traces of him from my life.

 

I would love the financial freedom he has but I wouldnt want his marriage. He wouldnt have the same lifestyle if he divorced but I would like to think if I was in his shoes I would adjust to having a less lavish lifestyle hed still be really well off and not be in a terrible marriage. But its his life, his choice.

 

And for those of you who dont know my story I have been in her company and she is horrible. I know everyone says that but I have seen her in action on several occassions. Obviously he prefers being treated like dirt to changing his life.