MM's close friend divorcing after an affair and possibly moving in for now...yikes!

March 15, 2011

MM told me today that his friend just experienced DDay...the first I've heard about from a non-LS connection. Short story is that his friend (former co-worker) moved here from the UK years ago because he was twenty-something and the job prospects in the US were interesting. He wasn't so keen on the U.S., or the idea of staying with this company. But he met a woman at work and fell in love, and pursued the R, and decided to stay for her. Since he hated his job, they agreed to marry because she didn't want him to leave, but he couldn't deal with working for the company that was sponsoring his work visa.

A year later, they're married but nobody knows. I'm not supposed to know. His/her families don't know for various reasons. But he proposed to her after the legal marriage took place, and they've been planning a real wedding, and debating where they will live..and even where they will marry "officially."

She tried to break up with him recently, and told him she cheated (his only deal-breaker) and he wondered if it was true or she really did cheat. After spending a few days apart, he asked her, and she said she really did cheat...but minimized the details, and decided to try with him again. This morning, he discovered her chats with her coworker and former boyfriend...and she disclosed the truth, entirely. He decided to leave. He called MM and talked for an hour or so, and wanted to stay with him while deciding whether to leave the country entirely.

All of this makes for an interesting (and heartbreaking) story, and my intuition says she wanted to get caught, or flat-out admit it, without truly being able to handle admitting to sex with someone else. Maybe she does love him, but can't fathom moving to the UK with him, which they had discussed without planning anything solid. Maybe she's scared. Or maybe she decided a while ago that she doesn't want to marry this guy (he is very negative and morose, the way MM describes him and I've seen in our few interactions)..but decided to stay married long enough for his citizenship to be valid. Who knows?

I wonder what the impact of his presence in their home will have on MM's wife. We are at a point where everyone must suspect something, and he has decided that he cannot stay in his marriage, for a million reasons that have nothing to do with me. Now infidelity and divorce (if the friend stays instead of high-tailing it home) are going to become regular conversation points.

I think that if I was in MM's wife's position and had blinders on, this would rip them off to some degree. For instance, the friend caught his wife when he tried to shut off the alarm clock on her phone and she had left open a chat conversation with her OM. Even if I had no doubts in my H, I might find myself paranoid (and possibly checking his phone/email) when living with one of his friends whose divorce is imminent for this very reason. Thoughts?

March 15, 2011

Do you want your mm's wife to catch him?

March 16, 2011

MM told me today that his friend just experienced DDay...the first I've heard about from a non-LS connection. Short story is that his friend (former co-worker) moved here from the UK years ago because he was twenty-something and the job prospects in the US were interesting. He wasn't so keen on the U.S., or the idea of staying with this company. But he met a woman at work and fell in love, and pursued the R, and decided to stay for her. Since he hated his job, they agreed to marry because she didn't want him to leave, but he couldn't deal with working for the company that was sponsoring his work visa.

A year later, they're married but nobody knows. I'm not supposed to know. His/her families don't know for various reasons. But he proposed to her after the legal marriage took place, and they've been planning a real wedding, and debating where they will live..and even where they will marry "officially."

She tried to break up with him recently, and told him she cheated (his only deal-breaker) and he wondered if it was true or she really did cheat. After spending a few days apart, he asked her, and she said she really did cheat...but minimized the details, and decided to try with him again. This morning, he discovered her chats with her coworker and former boyfriend...and she disclosed the truth, entirely. He decided to leave. He called MM and talked for an hour or so, and wanted to stay with him while deciding whether to leave the country entirely.

All of this makes for an interesting (and heartbreaking) story, and my intuition says she wanted to get caught, or flat-out admit it, without truly being able to handle admitting to sex with someone else. Maybe she does love him, but can't fathom moving to the UK with him, which they had discussed without planning anything solid. Maybe she's scared. Or maybe she decided a while ago that she doesn't want to marry this guy (he is very negative and morose, the way MM describes him and I've seen in our few interactions)..but decided to stay married long enough for his citizenship to be valid. Who knows?

I wonder what the impact of his presence in their home will have on MM's wife. We are at a point where everyone must suspect something, and he has decided that he cannot stay in his marriage, for a million reasons that have nothing to do with me. Now infidelity and divorce (if the friend stays instead of high-tailing it home) are going to become regular conversation points.

I think that if I was in MM's wife's position and had blinders on, this would rip them off to some degree. For instance, the friend caught his wife when he tried to shut off the alarm clock on her phone and she had left open a chat conversation with her OM. Even if I had no doubts in my H, I might find myself paranoid (and possibly checking his phone/email) when living with one of his friends whose divorce is imminent for this very reason. Thoughts?

Are you sure you aren't just wishful thinking in regards to "we are at a point where everyone must suspect something". I know you firmly believe in him and you, yet neither of you have bothered separating or divorcing your spouses. Now you think that this friend staying with MM and his wife will "rip the blinder off" to some degree. Why? Just because he/she knows someone who has been cheated on doesn't mean she doesn't trust and believe in her husband. Just because he has a friend who is married to a cheater doesn't mean she is going to automatically start to think her husband is a cheater. I think this is just wishful thinking of you.

Why don't you two just leave your spouses? Why all the waiting and waiting? Are you both waiting for your partners to decide they are done with you? I don't understand.

March 16, 2011

Do you want your mm's wife to catch him?

No, I don't. If the affair is going to be revealed, I want him to tell her directly. I know very well that the longer this goes on, the more likely it is that we'll get caught. So far we have successfully pulled off the "friendship" front without suspicion. They both have prepaid cell phones, so there are no records on that end. My phone is password protected and nobody knows the password, which I change frequently anyway. He deletes texts as soon as he sends and receives them, and she'd never guess his email or other passwords for anything online. We're both extremely vigilant.

My only concern is that this will pique her interest and maybe make her wonder. She would be extremely hard-pressed to actually catch him doing anything wrong, and I really can't imagine how that would happen if we remain careful. Contact just might become that much harder in the short-term.

His friend actually texted him (after their long talk) that he was hanging out with another friend and wouldn't be arriving last night. Since then, he's heard nothing. It's very likely he found a single friend who is also willing to put him up, which would be much less uncomfortable than staying with a married couple in his situation.

March 16, 2011

It's just as likely that witnessing his friend's devastation will make MM think about what he's doing to his own wife and stop him--and this affair--dead in it's tracks.

I still don't understand why the two of you are being so vigilant when you have this amazing love and connection. I think you're both getting off on the deception and the drama of this affair. If what you felt was real, you'd be making an exit strategy, not figuring out way to continue lying to people who've made the mistake of loving you.

March 17, 2011

i don't understand wht's the connection between his friend and your affair...it must have been illuminating discussion between a cheater (MM) and his friend.....and people like you never seize to amaze me...you are flaunting your affair like a qualification..while using your spouse like a tissue paper.... moreover you think it is funny(probably you need a doctor there)....i mean letting them waste their time/money on ungrateful people like you must have been really funny....this is the reason i rather spend my money on my dog rather than a girl ,enjoy it while you can.....

I'm glad you'd prefer spending your money on a dog, not a girl. You know absolutely nothing about me, and assume I find this situation funny (ummm...no), I'm ungrateful (for what, exactly?), and that I'm letting someone waste money (what money???) on me. If you're going to attack me, get your facts straight...I can't take this seriously. And please, have someone edit your posts. Minor grammatical errors are expected on a message board, but "seize to amaze"? Really?

March 17, 2011

It's just as likely that witnessing his friend's devastation will make MM think about what he's doing to his own wife and stop him--and this affair--dead in it's tracks.

I still don't understand why the two of you are being so vigilant when you have this amazing love and connection. I think you're both getting off on the deception and the drama of this affair. If what you felt was real, you'd be making an exit strategy, not figuring out way to continue lying to people who've made the mistake of loving you.

You're right, Carrot. I'm not worried about him thinking twice about what he's doing. If witnessing his friend go through this makes him rethink this, that is a good thing. If he's not sure about what he is doing, I'd rather that he figures out what he really wants. If he chooses her because he feels guilty, so be it. If he chooses to end both relationships because I highlighted what was missing from his and he needs to do some soul-searching, so be it. If he ultimately decides to be with me, I want him to know that it's right for him.

And for that reason, while we are in the stages of making exit strategies, I'll give him whatever time he needs to make the decision to be with me because that's what he really wants before we plan a future together.

March 17, 2011

And for that reason, while we are in the stages of making exit strategies, I'll give him whatever time he needs to make the decision to be with me because that's what he really wants before we plan a future together.

Regardless of what MM decides to do, have you ended things with your fiance or are you still planning a future with him?

March 17, 2011

I wudnt worry...I apreciate that the dude might see the fallout of his friend and doesnt want that crap and stops ur affair, but then again I think if he knows his own mind hes gona just stick with u the same way he did before. Mind u, r u engaged? This is a whole lotta drama - a wedding AND an affair, wow girl, this is like the Hills.

March 17, 2011

A year later, they're married but nobody knows. I'm not supposed to know. His/her families don't know for various reasons. But he proposed to her after the legal marriage took place, and they've been planning a real wedding, and debating where they will live..and even where they will marry "officially."

This is not your typical tale of infidelity. I dont think your MMs wife is going to compare this friend to her husband OR their marriage to that.

March 18, 2011

Regardless of what MM decides to do, have you ended things with your fiance or are you still planning a future with him?

My fiance and I were originally supposed to be married this summer. We postponed the wedding indefinitely a long time ago for various reasons. For starters, he's graduating and taking his boards this summer, and it's too much stress on him, and he was showing little interest in the wedding plans all along.

I'm not sure if his indifference has been anxiety about the wedding (it started a year before the A) or just his preoccupation with school and his career. The fact that it's not going to work is very clear to us both, but he's also made it clear that he isn't ready to deal with breaking up or major life changes until he survives his grad program. So I haven't left yet, and we're like roommates who swap stories but are very distanced from one another.

I'm respecting his expressed but not explicitly expressed wishes and waiting.

March 19, 2011

TBH Carrie, had my H had a friend to stay who was going through this, the talk would have been about the A. We would, in the privacy of our bedroom had before going to sleep conversations about If you did this ... then, or I don't get how anyone could do this, type conversations. This would have, in some ways, brought the whole consequences of H's affair into his mind, and also, TBH, he would/might/probably not be able to compartmentalise as easily as the A word would have invaded our conversation and our life.

I am not saying this is the situation in your, situation, but many WS are able to continue with the A simply because they are able to put their marriages and their affairs into two separate boxes and never the twain to meet. It would have been like lighting a fire under a pile of sticks. I asked H and he said he would have taken his head from up hi a*** and taken a long, hard look at what he was doing and why.

I am not too sure what your situation is or what the MM's situation is, if he is gaslighting his wife, then the chances are she will be unaware there is a problem and will probably have a ... If you had an A then .... and he will probably say, Of course I wouldn't do that, I love you etc etc.

However, if he is planning to leave, it might just prompt him to do so.

Edited March 19, 2011 by seren
spelling

March 22, 2011

TBH Carrie, had my H had a friend to stay who was going through this, the talk would have been about the A. We would, in the privacy of our bedroom had before going to sleep conversations about If you did this ... then, or I don't get how anyone could do this, type conversations. This would have, in some ways, brought the whole consequences of H's affair into his mind, and also, TBH, he would/might/probably not be able to compartmentalise as easily as the A word would have invaded our conversation and our life.

I am not saying this is the situation in your, situation, but many WS are able to continue with the A simply because they are able to put their marriages and their affairs into two separate boxes and never the twain to meet. It would have been like lighting a fire under a pile of sticks. I asked H and he said he would have taken his head from up hi a*** and taken a long, hard look at what he was doing and why.

I am not too sure what your situation is or what the MM's situation is, if he is gaslighting his wife, then the chances are she will be unaware there is a problem and will probably have a ... If you had an A then .... and he will probably say, Of course I wouldn't do that, I love you etc etc.
However, if he is planning to leave, it might just prompt him to do so.

Thank you for your feedback, Seren. I really appreciate your insight and your even-keeled approach to dealing with affairs. A week after his friend first contacted him, he has heard nothing from him, so either he decided to work things out with his wife, or he's staying elsewhere and not telling MM the details because he is (clearly) a generally private man who chooses to only discuss his personal life when absolutely necessary.

In any case, your assessment is excellent. Neither of us is sure about what she would do if the subject of affairs became regular household conversation. We both suspect that even if she suspected something, she might just keep her blinders on to keep him in her life. Obviously, that's an awful situation, and we both need to make our own decisions about our current relationships sooner rather than later.

In my case, there is an exit strategy in place. I'm fairly certain my fiance already knows it and will deliver an ultimatum once he finishes school and is making decisions about which job to take, and where. In his field, the options are limitless. He's depending on me at the moment to pay the bills and to be there to support him through the last few months, but I've gathered that he knows it's probably ending, and he's considering his own exit strategy...which he cannot fully develop right now, with so much on his plate. Our conversations have basically led to this point..."let's just wait it out until I'm ready to deal with this."

In MM's case, it's infinitely more complicated, given a longer history and assets and everything else involved. I'm 99% sure that they will divorce even if I disappear from the picture, for reasons far more complex than I'll get into in this thread, but the question is how and when. If the affair discussion comes into play at this point, it's more likely to distance or break up me & MM because then the A (as opposed to their complicated marital issues that extend back to before they were engaged) will become the focal point of the divisive force. If we lay low and see eachother less and let things happen in the manner that they were already happening, we are more likely to actually end up together in the future.

March 22, 2011

Thank you for your feedback, Seren. I really appreciate your insight and your even-keeled approach to dealing with affairs. A week after his friend first contacted him, he has heard nothing from him, so either he decided to work things out with his wife, or he's staying elsewhere and not telling MM the details because he is (clearly) a generally private man who chooses to only discuss his personal life when absolutely necessary.

In any case, your assessment is excellent. Neither of us is sure about what she would do if the subject of affairs became regular household conversation. We both suspect that even if she suspected something, she might just keep her blinders on to keep him in her life. Obviously, that's an awful situation, and we both need to make our own decisions about our current relationships sooner rather than later.

In my case, there is an exit strategy in place. I'm fairly certain my fiance already knows it and will deliver an ultimatum once he finishes school and is making decisions about which job to take, and where. In his field, the options are limitless. He's depending on me at the moment to pay the bills and to be there to support him through the last few months, but I've gathered that he knows it's probably ending, and he's considering his own exit strategy...which he cannot fully develop right now, with so much on his plate. Our conversations have basically led to this point..."let's just wait it out until I'm ready to deal with this."

In MM's case, it's infinitely more complicated, given a longer history and assets and everything else involved. I'm 99% sure that they will divorce even if I disappear from the picture, for reasons far more complex than I'll get into in this thread, but the question is how and when. If the affair discussion comes into play at this point, it's more likely to distance or break up me & MM because then the A (as opposed to their complicated marital issues that extend back to before they were engaged) will become the focal point of the divisive force. If we lay low and see eachother less and let things happen in the manner that they were already happening, we are more likely to actually end up together in the future.

Wow. I think you should decide what you want to do and do it, regardless of what your fiance, your MM, or MM's wife decides to do. It's like you're waiting around for everyone else to make decisions about your own life. Why?

March 22, 2011

My MM's wife's brother was caught in an affair. My MM became even more careful and the wife still is not suspicious and that was her own brother. He would tell me about bits and pieces of the conversation with his W about her brother and it didn't seem to make her more inclined to check on her husbands doings. Although we are much like you with being so careful it would be a huge effort to find something. The brother didn't move in or anything, but the talks between the two about her brother's cheating did happen pretty frequently at two different points and still may be getting discussed. I haven't asked.

So in my case it did not lead to more suspicion as far as he can tell. And it also has not made him want to stop being with me. And even since then, we have begun to say I love you among other pretty significant things.

March 23, 2011

My MM's wife's brother was caught in an affair. My MM became even more careful and the wife still is not suspicious and that was her own brother. He would tell me about bits and pieces of the conversation with his W about her brother and it didn't seem to make her more inclined to check on her husbands doings. Although we are much like you with being so careful it would be a huge effort to find something. The brother didn't move in or anything, but the talks between the two about her brother's cheating did happen pretty frequently at two different points and still may be getting discussed. I haven't asked.

So in my case it did not lead to more suspicion as far as he can tell. And it also has not made him want to stop being with me. And even since then, we have begun to say I love you among other pretty significant things.

Interesting. Thanks for that feedback!

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MM's close friend divorcing after an affair and possibly moving in for now...yikes!

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