I understand now.

[Confusion_Reigns]

Long story short I was the BS a couple of times over…and now I find myself in the WS role for the first time ever. I’m sure I’ll get flak for this post form some and I’ll get kudos from others, depending on their current situation. But I need some help, I seriously need some help with my crazy-making mind…and this intense situation I find myself in…

 

So, my H and I met a long time ago. I’m 42 now and he’s 51. We have two kids one’s over 18 and one’s 16 yrs old. My H and I have had a very rocky relationship forever, from the beginning it’s been full of emotion…some might call it drama...I don’t want to get into all of that because some will think I’m just trying to use the past to justify what’s happening now. Let’s just say that there are degrees of abuse that I’m ashamed to say have happened and I’m more ashamed to say I’ve stayed. I could get into all the over-analyzing of why I’ve allowed this and why my H has done these things, but what’s the point? He is who he is and I am who I am because of what we’ve experienced in our past’s. Whatever the reason’s it doesn’t make it ok, not by a long shot. For either one of us. We’ve had good years, great years, horribly years, and years that have nearly killed me (us).

 

He says he loves me, but his actions show me it’s not really love. It’s something like love but it is not love. Its more like need, control,and possession. We’ve been going thru a really rough patch right now, he hasn’t hit me or anything but…well, he’s insisting on sex, like every night….and will not take no for an answer. This is something that I don’t want to live with anymore. I want to be able to say no and him not have a tantrum. This is the main issue right now, but there’s other issues that reflect the control/possession thing. Another major issue I have is that he’s always angry,upset, or sick. I mean like very day. I ask him to go to the dr, nope he won’t go. I ask him to go to marriage counseling, nope he won’t go (he actually laughed at me when I asked and said “that’s your bull**** not mine”), I’ve asked him to go to individual counseling, nope he won’t go, I’ve told him something needs to change. He says that I’m the one who needs to change…not him…

 

I know all of this is bad. I know it, and it’s bad for our kids. I’ve been foolish to pretend otherwise. We are good parents except for this fact of arguing/abuse, dysfunction that we’ve displayed to them. I hate myself for this…well, ok hate is maybe too strong of a word…I really do not respect myself for letting all this happen like this for my children to witness. I feel foolish for thinking that things would get better, that things were good enough…for rug sweeping. Now, it’s like there’s a window that’s been opened into my mind…letting light in…and I can see how truly messed up I am and my marriage is…I don’t want to be this unhealthy anymore. I want to show my kids what healthy is supposed to be. Other than that our kids are very well adjusted (as much as any teen can be). Good grades, well-behaved, happy (I think), they’ve got good friends, and are on-track with everything I can think of. Yes, they’ve heard us argue, they’ve seen more than they should…the last time was a few weeks ago, he was yelling at me on the side of the hwy…cursing me out…and when my 16 yo son has his hands balled up into fists and trying to console me…well, I just know it’s well past time for me to get out of this situation.

 

Honestly, for a very long time I just didn’t know…I really-really just didn’t know that things shouldn’t be the way they are for me and my H…and that makes me feel like a fool, too. I’ve done my level best to keep my family together, to keep my kids happy, to meet my H’s needs, and to meet my own needs. I’m a professional woman, I work full time (always have) and I earn good money (ok-money lol). I’m in the process of starting on my master’s degree and am looking forward to this…my husband didn’t even want me to get my bachelor’s degree, but I wanted it so I did it with our without his support (because he’s flaky like that at times). So, I feel even more foolish for not knowing, not understanding how messed up things really are. I’ve held on for so long for my kids…but mostly because of my ideas of ‘family’ and that it’s highly important to me to provide my kids with a two parent home. But now I think…why? What good has this done for them? For me? For their dad? Well, it is what it is and it simply can’t be anything different at this point.

 

So now to the other part…I’ve meet someone who has blown me away. I am simply amazed with this man. He is the polar opposite of my H. He is someone I want to know better. He is intelligent, he’s spiritual, he’s nice (I mean really nice, respectful), he’s funny, and handsome, and he smells so good.I know it’s infatuation, not love…maybe just lust…there’s been no physical infidelity (I don’t believe I have it in me to go there – but where I’m at now is bad enough)…I’ve meet with him privately many times over the last few months…we’ve gotten to know each other and are comfortable with each other…We talk every day either in person, texting, or online. He knows things that I want to know. We’ve hugged (but I hug lots of people as that’s part of our culture). I’ve helped himout with some of his business things and he’s helped me out mainly by talking to me. I’ve opened up to him in a way that I have never opened up to anyone. He seems to understand and it seems he knows exactly what to say. He is divorced and has just recently moved back to the area…our families know each other, I’ve heard of him before this but never met him (we live in a very small, rural community where everyone knows of just about everyone else)....we’ve shared things that are just between us and will always remain just between us.

 

My own morals and beliefs are taking a blow here. I know it’s wrong and I’ve told him this…he says it’s not wrong, that we’re friends…and we are friends, I know this to be true…but my intentions are not of just a friendly nature, you know? He’s interested in me, I can feel it…but he’s not making any of those types of moves (which is good as that would diminish him in my eyes)…for right now we really are just friends and it might always stay like that, I’m ok with this idea too. This friendship doesn’t feel wrong to me in my heart and in my mind…it feels like just about the only right in my life right now (except for my kids of course they’ll always be right for me)…I’ve told him that I wanted to step back from this friendship and he plead his case, but ultimately said it was up to me. I tried to walk away from him but can’t seem to do so…maybe it's not that I can’t but that I don’t want to…I’ve tried to avoid him and we endup running into each other…

 

I know what I want and that’s to end my marriage and start a relationship with him. I don’t know if this is the right thing or not….I’ve told him that I’m kinda messed up right now…I’ve never thought this or felt this way before, not even when my H was courting me…not even when H was trying to win me back after his affair(s)…I don’t want to end my marriage for him but because my marriage is over…and it is over…my H refuses to work on anything. I’ve asked him many times but he just won’t do anything. He wants things to magically just be ok. I’ve told him it doesn’t work like that, that we need help…that I don’t know what to do anymore…that things won’t change unless we make a change…and there is nothing from him. So, I do believe that my only choice here is to end the marriage.

 

I’m not sure exactly what I’m looking for here, except support– in any/all forms (kindness, tough love, sharing experiences, etc.) I am afraid of what will happen when I tell my H it’s really over. I highly doubt he will just say “ok” and leave me alone. Past experience has shown me that he will not leave me alone, that he will stalk and harass me….and he will escalate his behavior until I respond in some fashion. He’s told me he’s moving out several times over the last few weeks but he’s not actually done anything to move out…past experience has shown me that he uses this threat as a way to get me to do what he wants…and now that I’m not playing that game with him anymore he’s getting really angry inside. I could pack up and move…but then I leave my son with him and that’s just not good for my son. I was planning on waiting to leave him when my son was 18 yrs old, then there wouldn’t be any co-parenting issues…but I don’t think I can wait that long anymore as the situation has changed.

 

And with all of this my mind is racing all the time. I’m not eating right, not sleeping right, and just trying to maintain. I’m going to start this story here, on the infidelity board, as a starting point…I may end up on another board before too long.

 

Thank you in advance for your thoughts.

[Spark1111]

Well......I say tell your H you want to no longer be married to him. he can move out and you stay with your son, or you move out and take your son with you.

 

Talk to a lawyer and find out what your rights are and what, if any money you will be entitled to. can you afford your independence when all is said and done?

 

As for your friend, he must remain EXACTLY that for a few years.....unless you want your sons to resent him for life.

 

So, break free, get good legal advice, grow stronger and more independent, concentrate on you and your sons transitioning through divorce and into adulthood and then think of your friend and a possible future with him.

 

In fact, start to cultivate many friends as you will need a support system to weather your divorce.

[veryhappy]

I'd suggest you get a divorce if you can even if the knight in shinig armour wasn't on the side.

 

You are lucky - unbelievable lucky that your boys haven't turned against you and copiehis behavior. Even so, they may end up repeating it with their partners even they detest it. If anything, leave your M so your boys whom I sure you'd die for don't end up like their dad.

 

No, you don't have to stay married and you shouldn't. However, it's difficult to leave an abusive marriage, more than otherwise. Your h seems the type to potentially go nuts and threaten you. Do your homework, get some mental and legal help first.

[Quiet Storm]

You are unhappy in your marriage and have been for a long time.

 

This other man has come along and now you finally see a way out. You are caring less & less about your husband, which makes leaving him so much easier. You are seeing now that you have an alternative to staying in an unhappy marriage.

 

The problem is, your marriage with your husband and the "friendship" with this other guy are two separate entities. You need to end your marriage in a legitimate way. Even though you no longer respect your husband, he is the father of your children. You owe it to your children to end your marriage in a respectful way, IMO. You do not want your children to view you as a cheater. This means leaving the marriage because it is done & overwith- regardless of other options.

 

If you had not met this OM, would you be considering divorce right now? You say you are family minded and you always wanted your kids to have a two parent family. Are you changing your values & standards because of OM? You do not have a healthy marriage, but what if a separation prompts your husband to get counseling? What if you leaving is the shock he needs to examine & change his behavior? It seems the values you have held for a lifetime should cause you to welcome his desire to get help, and to keep your family together.

 

I know what I want and that’s to end my marriage and start a relationship with him.

 

First, this man may not want another full time relationship. Some divorced men just want to be single. He may see you as "safe", because he can have his emotional needs met by you, without having to commit. Don't be so sure that OM would jump at the chance to be with you legitimately. It's easy for him to "future fake" with words & dreams while you are safely married to another. Leaving your H will change the dynamics dramatically. OM may not want to feel responsible for the end of your marriage. What has been an easy friendship & emotional connection, could morph into a relationship that makes him feel pressured and accountable.

 

The fact that you didn't actually seriously consider ending your marriage until OM got in the picture tells me that his friendship has made you feel stronger. It is a huge mistake to see the OM as your safe place to land. If OM bolts after you leave, are you OK with being alone? Does your strength stand alone? Or is your strength dependent on OMs emotional support?

 

You need to seek counseling for yourself and get strong on your own. You need to learn to be OK without a man. You need to come to terms with the end of your marriage and the reasons you accepted poor treatment. A new guy can't waive a magic wand and make your issues disappear. You have to do that on your own.

 

Also, if your husband is controlling and possessive, it is not very smart to allow another man to get close to you. Your husband may feel threatened in a way he's never felt before. You are playing with fire here. If you truly care about OM, why put him in the position to have to face the wrath of your possessive & controlling husband? Who knows what he'll do. This tells me that you may not care about OM as much as you think. You love what OM represents, you love how OM makes you feel....but if you genuinely care about OM, why suck him into your drama?

Edited June 7, 2013 by Quiet Storm

[Confusion_Reigns]

I hear you, all of you, and thank you so much for your thoughts….much of these thoughts have crossed my mind, and some have kind of just got stuck in my mind.

 

Like OM’s safety…that’s a big one and one of the reasons I’ve told him I wanted to back off the friendship. He said he’s not afraid of him,of my H…but I am afraid for him and his safety…he just doesn’t know my H like I know him. Also, the soft place to land, aspect of this…it makes me feel…well,bad…like weak or something.

 

Yes, I knew I was going to leave my H but I was going to wait until youngest was 18 then my son won’t have to be forced into spending time with his dad…not that his dad would hurt him but I just don’t think it’s a good idea for my boy to be forced to spend time with a bully. I doubt I’d have any real legal say in any of that but when he’s 18 then he has the final say on where he wants to be.

 

Yes, I think that OM has given me strength…is that such a bad thing? I don’t think so. I needed some strength, desperately…so now I have more strength than previously. I don’t see how this is a bad thing. I know Ineed to get myself healthy, that’s all there is to it. I need this for me…not the affair or a new relationship….but I need my life to change.

 

I don’t kid myself into thinking that OM’s forever for me. No, I’ve had forever offered and I don’t want that anymore. I don’t think I really want any fulltime man in my life ever again, really, I think I’d like to just be alone for a while…like a long while…and just be me.

 

I’m highly doubt I’d accept H’s idea of ‘working’ on the marriage.He’s already said so many times that he’s not going to do anything…I doubt he’d really do anything anyway…maybe just enough to get me comfortable, relaxed…and then everything would just eventually get back to here…and I don’t want to be here anymore. I know he’s got issues that he needs to work on, I do love him and want the best for him…but I can’t do anything for him anymore…no more…I do not trust him, not really. This is something he has to do for him and I cannot force him to get himself healthy.

Edited June 7, 2013 by Confusion_Reigns

[Mycatsnuggles]

You sound a lot like me. With a strong man who overwhelms your decision making processs. You begin making choices " they don't approve of" (going to school) and they feel threatened. They try to pull you back in by domineering you ( the sex) you resist by meeting another man and complete your education regardless. You begin to develop some balls ( sorry but you know what I mean by this). OM gives you the self confidence H has taken away.. If I'm off track stop reading....

 

H needs a wake up call. Divorce "sounds" so easy in theory and I am always surprised how many throw it out as a logical alternative. What if you did a negotiated separation? It's a moment to take a pause and consider what you have? Seek a counselors advice,on your own if H won't go, and separate. You set the parameters of what you want. Separate residences for xx period, dating others, contact between you two.. Your still married put it puts it all on pause.

 

I am in the midst of this. Something I have never revealed here. H has made some valiant attempts at change. We make work in the long run. I got involved w OM and it complicated things. Just my FYI.

[Try]

Before everyone jumps on the bandwagon of calling the OP's husband an emotional abuser, please consider that the OP is clearly heavily in an emotional affair with another man (OM), and is now viewing her husband through the eyes of someone deep in an affair fog. This always includes revisionist marital history that often has the cheater calling the spouse controlling and saying that the spouse is emotionally abusive. For instance, if they had a long history of frequent sex that they both mutually wanted, but that she no longer wants now that she has met this OM who she views as her soul mate, the revisionist history becomes that she has always had to give the spouse sex because if she did not the spouse would emotionally abuse her by throwing a tantrum.

 

She and her affair partner are not just friends, but that is not what she tells her husband. She is seeing and talking to this OM behind her spouses back which would require secrecy and lies. The infidelity section of most marriage sites are filled with false claims of emotinal abuse against the spouse being cheated on. This is called blame shifting. The scary part of the affair fog is that the person in the EA starts to actually believes their own revisionist history. They have to believe, because if they did not, they would have to accept that they have become the bad person cheater that they have longed despised.

 

@OP: You cannot make a rational decsion on something so important while in an emotinal affair fog. Maybe I am wrong and maybe your husband is as bad as you say, but you will never know until you end the EA with your affair partner by completely cutting off all contact with him, and giving yourself time to think clearly again. If after 6 months of zero contact or communications with the other man, you are still unhappy in your marraige, sit your husband down and tell him that you either want changes in the marraige or you will end the marraige. If he does not comply, file for divorce. After the marraige is over, if you then want to try to reconnect with your former affair partner, do so.

[Confusion_Reigns]

Thank you all again for your thoughts, I really do appreciate them.

 

First, I don’t believe, never have and never will believe in the idea of ‘soul mates’ because it implies that one cannot be whole without another to complete them. It is my belief that people should complement each other not complete each other. So, no my friend is not my soul mate, he’s a man that I’m very interested in knowing better.

 

I know I’m not thinking as clearly as I could be right now and that’s one reason why I’m here. I feel like I’m all alone inside my head spinning my wheels with only my own thoughts…I figured that I could come here to hear some other peoples thoughts on this so I can start thinking new things,or at least start seeing different possibilities than the ones in my head. So,thank you again.

 

I’ve also been thinking about the fact that my friend *might* not be all that I imagine him to be. He could be just lying to me about everything…he could be misrepresenting himself to me…he could be just another guy like my husband…and….well, is every man like that? Is every man going to be like my husband? Are they ALL f’ed up like that? No..no…no…they can’t all be bad. Not every man, right? There’s got to be good men out there….and maybe he’s one? How am I ever going to know unless I try to find out? I can’t know with out more information, right?

 

I don’t kid myself into thinking that my friend has no baggage. Everyone has baggage, everyone. Is his too heavy for me to handle? No, because it’s his not mine. I have my own to carry, right? I’m sure he’s made mistakes and f’ed things up from time to time, as we all have…I’m sure his actions (or lack thereof) had contributed to the end of his marriage…and I’m just as positive that he will make mistakes in the future, too…with or without me…and I’m sure I’ll make more mistakes in the future, I’ll try very hard not to, but, well, such is life.

 

And I’m sure I’ve contributed to the state of my marriage. I wonder if there was anything I could have done differently to prevent any of that abuse from happening? I wonder if I’ve caused this in my life? In my husband? Maybe if I could be just a little bit better then things wouldn’t be like they are now…maybe my husband wouldn’t be like he is now…and some place way deep down inside of me I think that maybe…somehow…if I did get together with my friend…if I’d cause him to become like my husband? …and I’m learning that this is codependent thinking, right? I’m not a saint, never claimed to be. I’m a screwed up individual who is trying to do the best I can with what I have…and I’m feeling a bit empty at the moment so am looking for help.

[Confused48]

the idea of ‘soul mates’ because it implies that one cannot be whole without another to complete them. It is my belief that people should complement each other not complete each other.

 

You say that you see yourself as a F*cked up, co-dependant in need of help mess of a person. I see you a wise and eloquent person. The above statement by you is both. You came here for help but while here are giving help too. Thank you.

[Confusion_Reigns]

Thank you. Like I said I really have been trying to get myself healthy and it takes time to even begin to begin understanding things that are new ideas. I used to believe in soul mates, but then I grew up. lol

[Confusion_Reigns]

"The need for change bulldozed a road down the center of my mind"......Maya Angelou

 

I have to say that I absolutely love this quote.

 

I have been trying to figure this out for years and years....why do I stay with him? There's lots of reasons but they all seem kinda fake, somehow. I stay for the kids...I stay because I love him...I stay because I don't think there really is anything better...I stay because the devil you know is better than the devil you don't...because I *want* to be like my grama and gramps who were married for ever...because I *want* to believe that love is real and it can last....and sometimes I think this is as good as I'm ever going to get... and all that just seems like excuses to me.

 

My friend, OM, is recently divorced. Maybe I'm just naïve (yes, that's probably it) but when we first started talking he didn't at all seem like he was interested in me like that, not at all. I'm the one who has crossed lines here, not him.