Is monogamy in animals a myth?

[4fin]

I was watching a documentary on geese and it was talking about how their life cycle: migratory, monogamous, social/not solitary and it got me to thinking. Is this a load of bs. Here we have an animal that flies 1000's of miles a year, is hunted extensively and they are monogamous. I find that hard to believe on face value.

 

As they fly south in flocks their partners for life are getting shot left and right. How in the hell can some one affirmatively say one of these now single geese hasn't mated with another goose? To make that statement you would have to follow millions of geese (can't be done) and make sure they didn't mate with another goose which by the way looks just like the last goose it was mating with. Are we saddling our moral values on animals we have no way of proving are monogamous in an effort to make monogamy a natural state for some members of the animal kingdom?

 

I am in a monogamous relationship with my wife but we both had partners before. In humans it may be something to aspire to but it seems to be the exception and not the norm. Maybe I'm cynical but I find it hard to believe there are not geese that have had multiple partners. I think no 2 snow flakes are the same is a crock to. Does anyone know how we can state what species of wild animals are monogamous or am I being too cynical?

Edited May 1, 2017 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Paragraphs and move to GRD

[elaine567]

monogamy

məˈnɒɡəmi/

noun

noun: monogamy

 

1. the practice of marrying or state of being married to one person at a time.
   "Judaism has journeyed from polygamy to strict monogamy"
    
    
   
   • the practice or state of having a sexual relationship with only one partner.
     "AIDS can be contained by monogamy as well as by early sex education"
      
      
     
   • Zoology
     the habit of having only one mate at a time.
     "monogamy is rare in most animal groups, but is common among birds"
      
      
     

 

 

 

 

 

 

The bit in bold that many people forget when trying to pick apart monogamy

 

"at a time"

[aileD]

Yeah. You're thinking of the wrong definition of monogamy.

 

In the human world, it's not cheating if you have a girlfriend after your wife dies.

[Ronni_W]

Monogamy is the practice or state of being married to - or having sexual relations with - one person/mate at a time.

 

If that person/mate dies - or you break-up for whatever reason - and you move on to having sex with the next one, then that does not mean that you are no longer monogamous. (Taking all other factors, like religion or personal philosophies, out of the equation. That's just the 'dictionary definition', as they say.)

[aileD]

Some animals and people do "mate for life" which is what you might mean, but again "for life" means if one dies, the other might find someone else to mate with

[carhill]

Since very few animals are socially monogamous, try checking out beavers. They're hard wired to do some pretty amazing things, including relationship maintenance.

 

Humans, with their big brain, rely to only a minor degree on their primitive brain but it does play a role in reproduction and reproductive drive and may be one of the reasons we act much like our animal relatives when it comes to mating for life.

 

Very few humans, cradle to grave, are sexually and socially monogamous, and that includes humans who end up dying in a monogamous relationship.

 

Some good evidence of that is how big brain maturation in the 20's is discussed as a demarcation for 'youthful indiscretion' and 'adult behavior'. It's (non-monogamy) often dismissed/rationalized/forgiven when 'young'. It's 'hormones'. Heh. Yup.

[somanymistakes]

It's a valid question, as there have been situations where scientists sometimes failed to notice animal behavior, or intentionally didn't report animal behavior, because it didn't conform to what they WANTED the behavior to be like.

 

Same-sex interactions between animals, for example, were intentionally left out of records sometimes because the people studying them thought they were gross and wrong and probably just aberrations so it wasn't worth mentioning.

 

The first hit I get on a search for 'are birds monogamous' is:

 

About 90 percent of bird species are monogamous, which means a male and a female form a pair bond. But monogamy isn’t the same as mating for life. A pair bond may last for just one nesting, such as with house wrens; one breeding season, common with most songbird species; several seasons, or life.

 

Social monogamy seems to be more common than sexual monogamy. Social monogamy refers to the male bird’s role in parenting. In most songbird species, the male defends a nest and territory, feeds his incubating mate, brings food to nestlings and feeds young fledglings. In some species, especially when the male and female look alike, the male will even incubate eggs. Social monogamy is when a male bird is actively involved in nesting and rearing the young.

 

But genetic testing of songbird nestlings, even in socially monogamous species, shows that the father who sired them isn’t necessarily the one who is helping to rear them. In other words, a socially monogamous female songbird sometimes “cheats” on the male with whom she has a bond. And her socially monogamous mate may have fathered eggs in other nests.

 

Which suggests that in many cases when people talk about "monogamy" in animals, they mean "do they form a family unit with one male and one female and offspring". NOT "do they only ever mate that way"

 

Because lots of animals don't form that kind of family unit at all. Some species, the male and female only interact in passing and then the female is left to raise any offspring on her own... or even just to dump them out and let them fend for themselves. Some species form much larger groups rather than a single pair.

[Birdies]

I'm a wildlife biologist actually, and yes, monogamy in animals (birds, for example) is completely exaggerated. The species that we used to think were monogamous (songbirds or hawks that pair up for a mating season and raise chicks together, for instance)... well, new techniques of genetic testing of eggs / chicks has turned that all on its head. It turns out that the females often sneak over to the next door territory and mate with the male, so that the chicks in the nest have multiple fathers. Likewise, males sneak over to the nest next door and mate with the female. There is evidence of extra-pair copulation (a bird mating with an individual other than its mate during the breeding season) in something like 95%+ of bird species.

[wmacbride]

There are many species of birds, such as albatrosses, many of the more "evolved" parrots, crows, ravens, etc. that will have only one mate for most of their lives.

 

They dedicate a lot of care and time to raising their chicks, and have tight family bonds,especially crows and other corvidae and species like macaws, black palm cockatoos etc.

 

Mind you, the female electus parrot is quite the "swinger" and will often have ore than one male caring for her and her chicks, which are often genetically linked to the different males looking after her.

[preraph]

Many animals are monogamous. Many are not.

[elaine567]

Many animals are monogamous. Many are not.

 

Many people are monogamous. Many are not.

[4fin]

The bit in bold that many people forget when trying to pick apart monogamy

 

"at a time"

 

You are correct I did not understand the true meaning of monogamy but I stand by my assertion that I do not think you can say x animal is monogamous. Even if the mate lives how can you say a migratory species is monogamous when many could be cheating.

[elaine567]

Humans evolved monogamous relationships to stop men killing rivals' babies, says study | The Independent -

Monogamy is rare in primates but in those species where it has evolved it was always preceded by a non-monogamous breeding system where there was a high risk of incoming males killing the infants of rival males in order to take over their rival’s females.

In those species where monogamy became established, there was a corresponding decrease in infanticide as males guarded and protected their females and their offspring, said Kit Opie, an anthropologist at University College London and lead author of the study published in the journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

 

Humans also became monogamous because it works well in a civilised society.

...Western European, American, and East Asian societies live in relative peace and prosperity because they honour and enforce monogamous marriage, as did the earliest human societies. Meanwhile, the reason other societies remain relatively poor and plagued by internal violence is because they have reverted to polygamy and continue to practice it.

Henrich, Boyd, and Richerson go on to summarize the civilizing benefits of monogamy:

1. The pool of unattached men is reduced

so

that they do not form a potentially disruptive residue in society.

2. Crime is reduced since most crimes are committed by unmarried males. (In addition, longitudinal studies show that fewer crimes are committed by the same men when they marry.)

3. Political coups and factional fighting become less common because there are fewer single men willing to enlist in rebel armies.

4. Society becomes more productive because men work more when they are married.

5. Children do better because men invest in them instead of using their resources to obtain more wives.

6. Spousal relations improve because men and women are more dedicated to each other instead of merely entering an economic/ reproductive relationship.

7. Child marriages disappear and the age gap between husbands and wives narrows. There is reduced inequality between men and women and spousal abuse declines.

8. Young women are no longer hoarded and sequestered by their families in order to protect the value of the brideprice. Marriages become elective and more stable.

What Are the Advantages of Monogamy?

 

I guess some animals haven't quite worked that out yet.

[todreaminblue]

penguins are monogamous......they will search a beach covered in pebbles to find the right one.......for their intended....animals are amazing.....the tragedy and beauty fo the animal kingdom.....i dont care if they are monogamous or not.....what matters more to me is that animals exist and reproduce......for future gernerations without us making them extinct....we should work at preserving all animals...respecting all animals and their habitat and ultimately their place on earth the importance they have for us and all our descendants.......we need to understand that more than their monogamy.... ..deb

[Birdies]

Humans evolved monogamous relationships to stop men killing rivals' babies, says study | The Independent -

 

 

Humans also became monogamous because it works well in a civilised society.

 

 

I guess some animals haven't quite worked that out yet.

 

Actually the way animals do it works pretty well - acting socially monogamous but not maintaining sexual monogamy.

 

Acting monogamous is a good way to provide for and protect offspring.

In pairs of bird species, females generally hatch the eggs and protect the chicks from the elements/nest predation, while males generally forage and feed chicks and protect the larger territory from predators. But not maintaining sexual monogamy (extra-pair copulations) is a way to maximize genetic diversity in your offspring and help increase the odds that some of the young survive, thus increasing your genetic fitness. It's kind of a win-win if they can be sneaky about it, lol.

 

(Birds are generally the easiest to study because their mating behavior, e.g. singing and displaying, is very obvious; their territories are small so you can have a large sample size; and their nests/eggs/chicks are relatively easy to find and genetically test. So that's why biologists often use them as a common study taxa for these kind of questions.)

[Simple Logic]

There are several insect species where the female eats the male after mating. So the males seem monogamous enough.

[somanymistakes]

I think there's a fish species where the tiny males physically merge into the larger female's body and become part of her...

[Popsicle]

And male seahorses give birth!

 

[wmacbride]

Humans evolved monogamous relationships to stop men killing rivals' babies, says study | The Independent -

 

 

Humans also became monogamous because it works well in a civilised society.

 

 

I guess some animals haven't quite worked that out yet.

 

Another advantage to monogamy is it prevents the spread of disease. that may be pragmatic and boring, but it's true.

[wmacbride]

I think there's a fish species where the tiny males physically merge into the larger female's body and become part of her...

 

I know the angler fish is one species that does this...the ultimate form of codependency...

[elaine567]

There are several insect species where the female eats the male after mating. So the males seem monogamous enough.

 

Sex then death for all the men..

That would solve a lot of problems on LS.

NO men sneaking off with mistresses and making BWs and OW unhappy.

NO men here upset about their relationships, breakups or cheating wives.

NO men worried about sexless marriages either.

The parenting section may be busy but I guess a lot of the male virgins would be thanking their lucky stars...