No papers yet

[kenmore]

I have a question maybe somebody here can answer. My wife filed for divorce and a separation on Nov 20. She told me to expect to be served via the mail soon, and here it is over a month later, and I have not seen them yet. She has asked me several times if I got them and she contacted her lawyer who said they are in the mail. That was over a week ago.

 

So, my question is this: Since I know how easy it is to mail something, and taking the assumption that her lawyer is not inept, could s/he be playing a game by purposely delaying serving me? Might there be a legal issue where even though I have not been served, I could run out of time to respond and lose my rights?

 

The divorce is not until early May, and I have read that here in Ca, I have thirty days to respond after being served. But I know it isn't that hard to mail papers certified and should only take a couple of days to get here; so my suspicious mind is wondering WTF?

[tojaz]

To the best of my knowledge, papers are sent certified mail requiring a signature or served by the Sheriff (like I was). That way there is no question when they hit your hands and no funny business on the other end. There's nothing wrong with calling her attorney yourself and letting them know you haven't received them, and that puts that fact on record in case your worried about it.

 

Tojaz

[stillafool]

Ask her for her lawyers phone number and call him to find out when they were mailed.

[carhill]

Here's a great place to start:

 

FLF Self Help Center

 

If the documents have been filed, which they'd have to be to be legally served on you, there will be a record with your and your spouses name referencing a case summary and you, the clerk of the court, or the FLF staff can access.

 

It is possible, though highly unlikely, that the documents got lost in the mail. Generally, when an attorney is involved (I got many legal documents from mine over the years), they send legal documents certified or registered mail with return receipt, even though there's a separate document you'll sign and return to the server (her attorney) acknowledging receipt of the FL100 and supporting documents.

 

Our version of the FLF (it was called 'self-help' at our Cali court) was excellent. Saved me a ton of money on lawyer fees.

 

The 30 day clock starts running once you've acknowledged receipt of the documents, formally, in writing by signing the FL-117 and returning to her lawyer.

 

Things have changed since my exW and I divorced back in 2009, as back then the FL-100 could only be served by the sheriff (our choice) or process server. Now, service by mail for that initial filing is allowed, though it can be problematical if the spouses aren't cooperating because the respondent can, well, not respond and acknowledge receipt, forcing the petitioner to serve them in person to get things moving.

 

While you're at it, ask the FLF if they have any referrals to free or inexpensive mediation. That can help with your MSA presuming this is an amicable divorce. Saves more money.

[DivorcedDad123]

No way! They havent been filed. The onus is on her and he attorney to insure that you are properly served. Dont sweat it. I say she's bluffing.

[kenmore]

Thanks all!!

 

Carhill, I am confused because the papers (I went to the courthouse and viewed them myself last Monday) have a date (5/12/15.) I assumed this to be the date of disillusionment, but you are now the second entity (I saw it on a website) to say the 6 mo clock starts when I am served.

 

Since I do not want this divorce and she is the one who wants it to proceed ASAP, I am content to sit and wait. I am mostly worried about tricks against me, though that seems to not be the case, since me not getting served only delays the issue, but does not harm me specifically.

 

DivorcedDad, your post was not there when I started replying, but I have seen the documents at the courthouse. Thanks!

Edited December 24, 2014 by kenmore
to add emoticon

[DivorcedDad123]

Somethings still holding her back then. Being served is an easy process her lawyer can take care of. I dont see how you can have a court date without you even being served?

[carhill]

The 5/12/15 date would appear to align with the cooling-off period but that period is supposed to also begin with service to the respondent, just as the response period begins, as you note.

 

The FLF staff or clerk of the court can explain further regarding the specifics of that date.

 

If you actually reviewed the papers in person, and you had been legally served, there would have been a copy of the proof of service or acknowledgement of service. If there isn't, the court will not act on the filing and/or kick back any future filings that are made out of order. Ha, ask me how I know this!

 

Since you appear to not want the divorce, your spouse erred in not having you personally served, presuming she wants to move forward. I mean, it's expensive to have a lawyer file the lawsuit, plus the nearly 400.00 filing fee, so it makes sense to move things along.

 

As far as benefiting from delay, that's a legal matter and you'd need an attorney to advise. It can be beneficial for some and a disaster for others. It all depends on the specifics of the case. All I can share is that, IME, the longer things drag out, the more of a drag it is, both financially and emotionally.

[kenmore]

Thanks again!!

 

It does not make sense to me either, but the fact she keeps asking if I have been served implies that she wants it and is waiting (impatiently) for it, which implies it's the attorney's doing. That said, it makes no sense since I'm sure she said to her attorney on more than one occasion that she wants this to move along. The reason she filed for separation in addition to divorce is to get some immediate relief from my financial situation (credit card debt.)

 

I totally appreciate your inputs. It's her baby, and she can worry it. I have enough to worry about.

 

Take care!

[kenmore]

New info and thoughts:

 

I met my wife Christmas eve day and we spoke. I told her I have not been served yet and she said (which I can't believe BTW) that her attorney mailed them and she thinks my family took them and are hiding them.

 

I told her the attorney would have sent them certified and will be able to know where they are and she said (get this) I didn't want to pay for certified mail.

 

I told her it's like $5. Previously she said this filing cost her $1000. She wouldn't spend $5 for certified mail?

 

She said she will now spend $100 to have the sheriff serve me.

 

So, she'll spend $100 to have the sheriff serve me but not $5 for certified mail...

 

Mind you, she's not a stupid person. Something here seems fishy.

[angel.eyes]

It's the holiday season, and the US postal service tends to be very slow this time of year. It can take 2-3 weeks as you get closer to the holidays. I mailed a notarized document to someone in mid-November, and they called me in early December to let me know it hadn't yet arrived. It arrived the next day. A lot of mail is also delivered to the wrong address this time of year.

 

If she wants the divorce and you don't, it's unlikely she's delaying things. But it's important that it not appear that you are holding things up. If you don't receive service soon, write a letter to her attorney informing him that you expected to be served and have yet to receive any documents.

[kenmore]

Thank you Angel eyes.

 

I just really feel it's a game she's playing. Even during the holidays, it shouldn't take over a month to mail me something, and any attorney worth their salt will send the papers in some traceable way regardless of what the client says. Also, what she says makes no sense.

 

Don't get me wrong, I don't think (any more) that there is some trick being perpetrated on me. What I have been told here and what I have read tells me that nothing will continue without proof that I have been served, and obviously if I haven't been there can be no proof. I am mostly wondering what the motivation here is. I'm wondering if she's either not sure she wants to do this or is giving me time. It seems odd since she paid to file the divorce, but people do odd things all the time. Maybe it's a $1000 "scare tactic".

 

But, like I said, it's not in my best interest to push it. I'm in no hurry to divorce and am not planning on dating anyone anytime soon. I have a new career to focus on. She can worry about serving me, I'm not calling her lawyer and asking for it.

[2.50 a gallon]

You might want to check with the clerk of the court.

I did not find out about my divorce until almost a decade after the fact. It was my mom who worked in the court system here, that was smart enough to contact my state and found the divorce decree.

My Ex claimed that she did not know where I lived and had the divorce complaint published in the local newspaper.

[kenmore]

wow, 2.5

 

What a horrible shock that must have been to you! I have heard of that.

 

My sympathies.

 

I don't think that would fly here. She undoubtedly knows where I am and I am even willing to go pick them up (while I understand that to be served, one must employ the services of an adult over 18 and not themselves, I imagine that if I signed an affidavit, I could pick them up from her.)

 

I never tried to make anything difficult and she knows it. While I don't in any way want this divorce, I won't fight it. It's Ca, and she can get out of the contract she swore to (marriage vows) just because she wants to, unlike any other contract I know of in the friggin world!! I still think this is so wrong! There is nothing to do but bend over.

 

So, while I'm a guy and don't like to bend over, I will because it's just the way. It's how it must be, and like I said, I am not resisting in any way, she simply hasn't served me yet, and that's awesome!! IMO.

[2.50 a gallon]

Same State! And she knew where I lived. In fact she tried to reconcile for 3-4 years, and even called me after the divorce decree was final, about a week before she remarried, and asked a last time whether we had a chance.

 

No shock. I did not care. I had caught her kissing the OM, turned by back on her and walked out of her life. Told her I was never going to marry again, so did not plan on filing, and it she wanted a divorce she had to pay

[JJLA]

Ca attorney here (but up north in LA). Go to the San Diego county court website and do a search on your names. Here is the link:

 

Party Name Search

 

I'm in Los Angeles and don't operate in SD, so I'm not familiar with the court website down there, but from there you should be able to find what documents have been filed.

 

You want to (1) confirm that they have filed a petition, and (2) see if they have filed a "proof of service of summons". If they have, then they are lying about serving you personally. This is unlikely because if she is represented, the attorney would know that defaults are VERY easy to overturn (if caught quickly, sorry 2.5) and courts don't take kindly to gamesmanship. We mostly see this with unrepresented people. But still, cover all your bases.

 

If they are serving you by mail, you should be getting a FL-117, which is a Notice and Acknowledgement of Receipt. You need to sign this and send it back within 20 days. If you do not, then they will send a process server to give it to you personally and you will have to pay for the server. From the day you sign the FL-117, you then have the 30 days to respond, 60 days to do initial disclosures, and 6 months before you can finalize.

 

You want to start shopping around for an attorney now, not later. When one side is represented and the other is not, the unrepresented party usually gets hosed. At very least, find an attorney who will act "limited scope" to ensure (1) your paperwork is correct, and (2) to look over any potential settlement.

Edited January 2, 2015 by JJLA

[outthewindow]

Any news ken?

 

Hugs

[kenmore]

Thank you JJLA for your help and wisdom, it's greatly appreciated!

 

Here's the status: my wife is representing herself, though I'm sure she consulted with an attorney. She hired a company to do paperwork processing and I'm not impressed.

 

Supposedly the original petition was mailed to me Dec 9th (they sent a copy of the original cover letter), but they sent it to the street address which the post office here does not deliver to. How they got that address I have no idea. My wife asked for my street address on Dec 16th and I gave it to her. The only address my wife had for me before the 16th was the PO box, so that doesn't explain what happened on the 9th.

 

On Wed. new year's eve day I finally received the papers, sent regular mail. I'm just some dude, but even I would have sent anything so important certified mail. But that's neither here nor there. While I'm amicable to being served this way, I am not going to rush sending the acknowledgement back. As you said JJLA, I have 20 days, so I'm going to sit tight for awhile. I'm in no hurry.

 

Since our divorce should be pretty simple, my wife is representing herself and since she has much more to lose than I do, I will also represent myself but I will definitely be consulting with an attorney to make sure the response form is exactly the way I want it. Besides, since I have 16 more days to file the acknowledgement and 30 days after that to return the response, I can take my time and think it through carefully.

 

Thank you both for responding. Hugs back OTW

 

Ken

[carhill]

Don't forget to check with the FLF to see if they have some low-cost or free mediation available. If things are simple and amicable, their participation can be no more than properly preparing the MSA for filing, and the FLF can likely request judgment by mail when filing the settlement docs and you won't have to even go to court. In our case, the court rubber-stamped the MSA (which actually was pretty complex!) and done and done.

 

Some folks, our self-help desk mentioned, even prep the MSA during the response period and let the response go to default and file default with MSA to save on the response fee, which at our court is the same as the filing fee.

 

If you want to do it all in one trip, you can file the FL117 at the same time you talk to FLF and get a plan of action established for what to do during your 30 day response period. Look at your options and make the best choice for yourself and your situation.

[kenmore]

Carhill, once again your advice is hugely useful, thank you!

 

I will contact the FLF ASAP, LOL.

 

That tidbit about avoiding the responding fee is a real gem! After thinking about it, there's nothing I want from her other than her heart, and obviously that's off limits. I had thought about consulting with an attorney and asking the court to have her pay the fees, but maybe it's not worth it. Even though she has good employment and I have been unemployed for a year, I wouldn't ask for spousal support because she worked hard to get what she has and deserves it all. Our prenupt precludes me tapping into her pension, and for the same reason, I wouldn't do that anyway, I had already decided that weeks ago.

 

So, default should work for me, especially if it saves me $400.

 

Thank you so much, you have opened my eyes.

 

Ken

[kenmore]

Well, I filed my response with the court and sent her a copy. Very procedural and necessary. It was a day of getting personal stuff dealt with. I got my haircut (was a little late for my appointment because of traffic), got my car detailed (had to waste an hour waiting), had lunch (wanted to talk to the owner of the deli about insurance but he was in a meeting) and went to the courthouse to file, (appropriately just as they were closing for lunch, so had to kill another hour.) While I got a few things done, I feel it was a waste of a day.

 

I really don't feel well now. I am wondering if I'm coming down with the flu or if the court stuff is just giving me an unsettled feeling. I shouldn't care anymore, but I guess logic has no place here at the moment.

 

I guess there's only one more thing to deal with before the court date, and that's send my disclosures. Thank God! I can't wait until all of this is behind me.

 

So many days I don't even think about her anymore, and if she pops into my head, I can quickly find something else to drive it out, but today with so much time on my hands, I couldn't. I guess that's not a good solution, though it did seem like one for awhile. I have now tried spending time thinking about it and trying to work it through, spent time distracting myself hoping I could just forget; discussed my feelings here, talked with her and spent time alone with my thoughts all trying to get rid of the pain, and nothing works.

 

At least I have now scientifically shown myself that that's true. Nothing works.

 

I guess my best hope now is to finish it ASAP and never see her again. Also, to spend as much time not seeing her, talking to her nor thinking about her as possible.

 

It's just so difficult. Just six months ago she was my beautiful loving wife.