AnyaNova Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 (edited) So I realize it has actually been a few weeks now, but I'm going to go ahead and post this and see if any of you can help me understand it. Help me understand what happened. because I keep going around and around in my head and I cannot make sense of it. Multiple friends and family have multiple theories, but all I am left with is questions. My ex and I met online. We messaged for quite awhile and then began seeing each other exclusively at the beginning of June. The relationship had some issues, and truth be told, there were a number of times where I did consider calling it off. But we ended up dating for two months. He broke up with me at the end of July because he hadn't felt anything when we were being intimate the night before. Now. I would not be here if I had done the intelligent thing and gone NC. But instead, I thought that the rare circumstances that allowed my previous ex and I to be friends, weren't rare. So we agree to be friends, and to take some time with limited contact, so we messaged back and forth with a little bit of phone. When we were about to get together again for the first time, I started to realize that I still had feelings, and couldn't see him. So I asked for a period of 60 days of NC. But a few days in, I started reading and discovering how difficult being friends with an ex usually is, and started to doubt. So I broke NC so that we could discuss some of the things I'd read and reach a decision. We decided not to try and be friends, and in a real fit of "brilliance" we decided to meet one last time a couple weeks later, so that our last memories of each other wasn't the breakup. This is where it starts getting really weird. Between our agreement on this, and our last meeting. So we keep messaging back and forth, talking on the phone several times for nearly two hours at a time (and no change at all in tone, or "phone rituals" or anything from when we were dating, they could have been taken from the early and better part of our relationship). And from the phone and the messaging, literally everyone I talked to about it (from the content of the messages, length of time on the phone, etc.) thought that we were about to get back together. And I mean, our messaging and talking was so incredibly positive and meaningful, I think this time period is where my feelings really started to develop, but I didn't know it. I didn't recognize it. So the night comes for "the last meeting." We drove around and he showed me some of the nicer houses in the town he lives in. We have a great time and are happy and laughing. We go swimming. Things are great. We go get ice-cream. The distance he stood from me, we were so close we barely would have had to move to kiss. People who don't want romantic relationships or who are separating themselves from you emotionally don't stand that close. There are only two reasons to stand that close, and I guarantee you that physical combat was not in the offing. So we go back to his place. More stuff and talking. And then, during the cuddling, I mentioned that this really didn't feel like an ending. But he was completely adamant. We would not be seeing each other again. Even against my own concerns that having lost a friend to death last spring, that "losing" a friend right now, in this way might really not be good for me at all. While cuddling, he kept trying to pull my closer and closer (almost fretfully) as if he couldn't get me close enough to him for his satisfaction. Anytime the subject veered anywhere near the eventual end to the evening and my leaving for good, he would literally shake with muscles tensed. He cried so much. And couldn't let me go for so long. We must have cuddled and/or standing hugs for several hours. He stood on the porch to watch me drive away. My last sight of him, he was running to the end of the sidewalk to keep up with the car. I wonder if anything would have changed if I would have stopped the car. That was the 6th. It was only on the drive home that I realized that I loved him. We have had no contact since. A couple of emails (one I sent the day after, and then two I sent on the same day, the 11th), but no response to any of them, to be fair, I did clarify that he didn't need to feel obligated to respond to the first one. The second communication I did ask him to let me know that he'd read it, so that I would know that I'd been heard. But nothing. And I am left trying to figure out why he would send me away when he so obviously had such strong feelings for me. What happened. What this mess is. If any of you can help me understand this please. Theories from friends and family range from possibly being forced by family to choose (and obviously I lose) to demonstrating the behavior of an abuse victim, who hurts himself before allowing anyone else to (I'll make you leave, before you leave me). I don't know. If any of you can offer anything to help me understand what happened. This whole thing has really screwed with my head to a great degree. I still miss him. And am trying not to love him anymore. Edited October 1, 2013 by AnyaNova Link to post Share on other sites
Polak Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 I'm replying just to let you know I read the whole thing a few times and am trying to figure out what was going on... it seems like what you see in movies, where the guy says stuff like "NO! It's time for you to go! I'm not right for you!" despite him knowing he loves the girl. I didn't know it actually happens in real life... Link to post Share on other sites
Bubberfly Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Something I've found out, "one last beautiful moments" just don't work. They confuse people. Best to rip off the relationship like an old bandaid This man is the the GReat Wall It seems to me from the get-go he just wasn't that attracted to you. I think he is a man who'll consistently keep you at arms length- emotionally, relationship wise. This guy likes you, no doubt. But he doesn't like you enough to break down his emotional barrier (and I promise you, he's had one with everyone before you and will with everyone after.). He runs after you because he's scared. But he's not scared of losing you, he's scared of himself. He's scared to death of letting anyone break down that barrier and most if all he's scared of being alone but knowing there's nothing he can do about it. I say go for him, at your own risk. This is someone who'll never fully open up to you (obvious from his being so adamant you two won't be "together") He hasn't responded to your email because he's got his brick wall up. I think any pursuing on your behalf will only lead to heartbreak. I think you need to let this one go. And find someone who'll be with you with open arms. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
ConfusedHumanBeing Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 So I realize it has actually been a few weeks now, but I'm going to go ahead and post this and see if any of you can help me understand it. Help me understand what happened. because I keep going around and around in my head and I cannot make sense of it. Multiple friends and family have multiple theories, but all I am left with is questions. My ex and I met online. We messaged for quite awhile and then began seeing each other exclusively at the beginning of June. The relationship had some issues, and truth be told, there were a number of times where I did consider calling it off. But we ended up dating for two months. He broke up with me at the end of July because he hadn't felt anything when we were being intimate the night before. Now. I would not be here if I had done the intelligent thing and gone NC. But instead, I thought that the rare circumstances that allowed my previous ex and I to be friends, weren't rare. So we agree to be friends, and to take some time with limited contact, so we messaged back and forth with a little bit of phone. When we were about to get together again for the first time, I started to realize that I still had feelings, and couldn't see him. So I asked for a period of 60 days of NC. But a few days in, I started reading and discovering how difficult being friends with an ex usually is, and started to doubt. So I broke NC so that we could discuss some of the things I'd read and reach a decision. We decided not to try and be friends, and in a real fit of "brilliance" we decided to meet one last time a couple weeks later, so that our last memories of each other wasn't the breakup. This is where it starts getting really weird. Between our agreement on this, and our last meeting. So we keep messaging back and forth, talking on the phone several times for nearly two hours at a time (and no change at all in tone, or "phone rituals" or anything from when we were dating, they could have been taken from the early and better part of our relationship). And from the phone and the messaging, literally everyone I talked to about it (from the content of the messages, length of time on the phone, etc.) thought that we were about to get back together. And I mean, our messaging and talking was so incredibly positive and meaningful, I think this time period is where my feelings really started to develop, but I didn't know it. I didn't recognize it. So the night comes for "the last meeting." We drove around and he showed me some of the nicer houses in the town he lives in. We have a great time and are happy and laughing. We go swimming. Things are great. We go get ice-cream. The distance he stood from me, we were so close we barely would have had to move to kiss. People who don't want romantic relationships or who are separating themselves from you emotionally don't stand that close. There are only two reasons to stand that close, and I guarantee you that physical combat was not in the offing. So we go back to his place. More stuff and talking. And then, during the cuddling, I mentioned that this really didn't feel like an ending. But he was completely adamant. We would not be seeing each other again. Even against my own concerns that having lost a friend to death last spring, that "losing" a friend right now, in this way might really not be good for me at all. While cuddling, he kept trying to pull my closer and closer (almost fretfully) as if he couldn't get me close enough to him for his satisfaction. Anytime the subject veered anywhere near the eventual end to the evening and my leaving for good, he would literally shake with muscles tensed. He cried so much. And couldn't let me go for so long. We must have cuddled and/or standing hugs for several hours. He stood on the porch to watch me drive away. My last sight of him, he was running to the end of the sidewalk to keep up with the car. I wonder if anything would have changed if I would have stopped the car. That was the 6th. It was only on the drive home that I realized that I loved him. We have had no contact since. A couple of emails (one I sent the day after, and then two I sent on the same day, the 11th), but no response to any of them, to be fair, I did clarify that he didn't need to feel obligated to respond to the first one. The second communication I did ask him to let me know that he'd read it, so that I would know that I'd been heard. But nothing. And I am left trying to figure out why he would send me away when he so obviously had such strong feelings for me. What happened. What this mess is. If any of you can help me understand this please. Theories from friends and family range from possibly being forced by family to choose (and obviously I lose) to demonstrating the behavior of an abuse victim, who hurts himself before allowing anyone else to (I'll make you leave, before you leave me). I don't know. If any of you can offer anything to help me understand what happened. This whole thing has really screwed with my head to a great degree. I still miss him. And am trying not to love him anymore. How old are you? This sounds very teenage-ish Link to post Share on other sites
Author AnyaNova Posted October 1, 2013 Author Share Posted October 1, 2013 I'm replying just to let you know I read the whole thing a few times and am trying to figure out what was going on... it seems like what you see in movies, where the guy says stuff like "NO! It's time for you to go! I'm not right for you!" despite him knowing he loves the girl. I didn't know it actually happens in real life... Here is how I know I am not a character in a movie. 1). It is not nice, it is hell. 2)If it were a movie, he would have given me a long, impassioned speech explaining what was going on. 3) if it were a movie, either we would have gotten back together by now, or there would have been some other meet cute with an even better dude very shortly after. No such happy ending. Just mess. Link to post Share on other sites
Author AnyaNova Posted October 1, 2013 Author Share Posted October 1, 2013 Something I've found out, "one last beautiful moments" just don't work. They confuse people. Best to rip off the relationship like an old bandaid This man is the the GReat Wall It seems to me from the get-go he just wasn't that attracted to you. I think he is a man who'll consistently keep you at arms length- emotionally, relationship wise. This guy likes you, no doubt. But he doesn't like you enough to break down his emotional barrier (and I promise you, he's had one with everyone before you and will with everyone after.). He runs after you because he's scared. But he's not scared of losing you, he's scared of himself. He's scared to death of letting anyone break down that barrier and most if all he's scared of being alone but knowing there's nothing he can do about it. I say go for him, at your own risk. This is someone who'll never fully open up to you (obvious from his being so adamant you two won't be "together") He hasn't responded to your email because he's got his brick wall up. I think any pursuing on your behalf will only lead to heartbreak. I think you need to let this one go. And find someone who'll be with you with open arms. I think you are right. It hurts, but it sounds true. Link to post Share on other sites
Author AnyaNova Posted October 1, 2013 Author Share Posted October 1, 2013 How old are you? This sounds very teenage-ish My thoughts as well. I am surprised to find myself in such. Bizarrely teenager ish thing myself. The thing is, is that I have only been in three relationships, including him. The first was an abusive relationship when I was 19. The second was a relatively stable and usually adult relationship that lasted for over ten years, with none of this odd teenagery angst about it. My third relationship was him. I am 35. He is 32. However, I will note that though he had been on a few dates, he had not had a significant relationship since high school. I was dubious, but given his extreme introversion and social anxiety, was willing to give him a chance. Yes, I freely admit, that something must have hooked some immature part of me, since relationships are a two way street, I am just not sure what part or why. I am still working on that question. Link to post Share on other sites
lindsay1990 Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 I would try to keep the "I wonder what wrong that we broke up" and the "but everything was so nice after when me met I thought we would take back the break up" separate. He pulled you closer and you guys had a great time on the last meeting because he must be attracted to you enough in the first place (as he as was Intimate) and well, you had fun because you like each other, again, enough. However, do not let yourself be confused about what happened on the hang out. Everything you need to know is what he told you before and has yet to tale back, because he insisted on the same: he doesn't want to be with you. That is what he said and it is not an easy thing to say to someone but whatever his reasons, what matters to you is the result and he has provided it. Im sorry this is getting to y ou so much but you cannot count on things changes. As you said you had a great time that last day, well, this is what you agreed to, a last meeting to make for a nicer, last memory. Stay strong. Link to post Share on other sites
Author AnyaNova Posted October 2, 2013 Author Share Posted October 2, 2013 I guess what is confusing me is why so many of his actions seemed to indicate otherwise. Though I agree that separating the breakup from the dermis probably wise, and could help speed my healing. Anyone else have any thoughts on what might have been going through his mind? Link to post Share on other sites
melell Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 This is insane. All I can think is that this guy is playing mind games. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
lindsay1990 Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 (edited) For when actions don't match words I will provide a theory, based on what I've heard and read. Obviously this is just for some guidance so take with grain of salt, but: - When guys say something and do another, listen to what they say. Example: a guy tells a girl he isn't looking a for a serious relationship, has a lot on his plate, etc. just wants to have fun and get to know each other and the girl replies "oh sure, me too. I don't want anything serious either", trying to play it cool and not freak the guy out. Right? Weeks or months pass, they maybe take a trip together, maybe meet some friends, definitely spend a lot nights in together ordering take out and watching TV, cuddling, etc until one day an argument ensues about exclusivity and the guy flirting with someone else, maybe he doesn't want to go with this girl to a cousin's wedding and BOOM! It explodes: the guy says "we're not serious like that, we talked about this!", the girl will reply "well that was three months ago, before we started spending every night together, I started walking your dog, we took trips, you picked me up everyday at work and stuff like this. The guy can only say "Well, I TOLD YOU I wasn't looking for anything serious." Also, he will probably be pissed off and blind-sided, and get defensive, because the girl... you guessed it, TOLD him the same and he relied on this. - When a girl says something and does another, listen to what she does. Example: You get my drift. ^^^ Basically, my girl opinion is that generally a guy will rely on what he TOLD you in words, regardless of what is materially going on, or rather, appearing to be materially going on. A girl on the other hand, will think "well, he *did* say he doesn't want to be serious but obviously he had to have changed his mind because look at this, we are clearly in a serious-type of situation here!". But, alas...... with a guy. Stick to what comes out his mouth. Do not let his actions confuse you. It is rare that a guy, especially the younger, will have the self awareness or maturity to match his actions to his words, unless you make him. Sorry to the guys! Just a broad generalization, for the sake of speculation as to why the actions don't match words sometimes Edited October 2, 2013 by lindsay1990 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Polak Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 For when actions don't match words I will provide a theory, based on what I've heard and read. Obviously this is just for some guidance so take with grain of salt, but: - When guys say something and do another, listen to what they say. Example: a guy tells a girl he isn't looking a for a serious relationship, has a lot on his plate, etc. just wants to have fun and get to know each other and the girl replies "oh sure, me too. I don't want anything serious either", trying to play it cool and not freak the guy out. Right? Weeks or months pass, they maybe take a trip together, maybe meet some friends, definitely spend a lot nights in together ordering take out and watching TV, cuddling, etc until one day an argument ensues about exclusivity and the guy flirting with someone else, maybe he doesn't want to go with this girl to a cousin's wedding and BOOM! It explodes: the guy says "we're not serious like that, we talked about this!", the girl will reply "well that was three months ago, before we started spending every night together, I started walking your dog, we took trips, you picked me up everyday at work and stuff like this. The guy can only say "Well, I TOLD YOU I wasn't looking for anything serious." Also, he will probably be pissed off and blind-sided, and get defensive, because the girl... you guessed it, TOLD him the same and he relied on this. - When a girl says something and does another, listen to what she does. Example: You get my drift. ^^^ Basically, my girl opinion is that generally a guy will rely on what he TOLD you in words, regardless of what is materially going on, or rather, appearing to be materially going on. A girl on the other hand, will think "well, he *did* say he doesn't want to be serious but obviously he had to have changed his mind because look at this, we are clearly in a serious-type of situation here!". But, alas...... with a guy. Stick to what comes out his mouth. Do not let his actions confuse you. It is rare that a guy, especially the younger, will have the self awareness or maturity to match his actions to his words, unless you make him. Sorry to the guys! Just a broad generalization, for the sake of speculation as to why the actions don't match words sometimes Very interesting... Never thought about something like this before. Link to post Share on other sites
Shosh Posted October 2, 2013 Share Posted October 2, 2013 - When guys say something and do another, listen to what they say. Really? I always thought it was the other way round. Listen to his actions, not his words. For example, he may tell you that he cares about you and really wants to be with you, but if he does not call you regularly and does not ask you to spend time together, than he is just not that into you. No matter what he says. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author AnyaNova Posted October 2, 2013 Author Share Posted October 2, 2013 Really? I always thought it was the other way round. Listen to his actions, not his words. For example, he may tell you that he cares about you and really wants to be with you, but if he does not call you regularly and does not ask you to spend time together, than he is just not that into you. No matter what he says. That is what I was led to believe, as well. And all his actions, his tone of voice, everything were positively screaming that he had strong feelings for me, perhaps even loved me. Link to post Share on other sites
Lizrd3000 Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Your last time seeing him is ALOOOOOOOOT like my last time seeing my ex (which was the day of the BU). She cried alot, wanted to cuddle me and not let go. Bad thing was, I cried too. Her mother was there too later on (I'm so ashamed, LOL). I don't know what I can make of this, but it seems like he's scared to love? My exgf had her guard up aswell, so I think I can relate to how your relationship might've been like. I think you should forget about him, and move on. What'll happen if you do get back together? the same damn thing that happened before your break-up. You have to realize this. Do you REALLY want to be in a relationship with someone like this? I know there are really good times with him, believe me, I do. But the mind-confusing actions he's doing is just not good for you, eventually you'll break down if you were to ever have a long term relationship with him. Trust me on this one, it might be better to move on. I'll PM you a better response later on, I've got to go to school! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
lindsay1990 Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Really? I always thought it was the other way round. Listen to his actions, not his words. For example, he may tell you that he cares about you and really wants to be with you, but if he does not call you regularly and does not ask you to spend time together, than he is just not that into you. No matter what he says. Naaah, I mean I one hundred percent know where you're coming from but I still think a guy will stick to what he said and I'm talking about practical things, like the status of the relationship. Personally, as far as feelings go and saying "he cares" about you and everything, I wouldn't take these statements at face value, I mean it's what he's feeling in the moment which is valid but I wouldn't hold him to that. "You said you loved me!" isn't the same as "You said we were moving in!" Idk, I probably make no sense, but the feelings talk, yeah, I would definitely look at his actions but when he talks about feelings he isn't really promising you anything, you know? This is the reason why they can say "I love you more than I'll ever love anybody else, but I need to find myself". Just my personal theory. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
sambo77 Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Wow Anya...this is a tough one. It reminds me a lot of my ex and I. I could never (and still can't) understand how during that last face to face meeting I genuinely "felt" that she loved me. It was stuff you just can't fake...she clearly didn't want to lose me, YET she had made her mind up on some deeper (or perhaps more superficial) level that she was going to. It's hard when things just don't add up like that. Theories are all we have though. And theories are only useful when we can test their viability...sadly you'll never be able to do that unless the ex offers an insightful explanation...probably not gonna happen. I dunno. I know that my ex had spoken before about "letting previous boyfriends go" for quite pragmatic and/or practical reasons. For example, she'd say "he was never gonna get the career she hoped he'd get", or "he wasn't gonna make something of himself". I never once heard her speak about feelings. It wouldn't surprise me if, in my case, she still loved me but had decided on some pragmatic level that I wasn't suitable (like I don't own a home or something along those lines). For me, the feelings are all that matter...I think for her, pragmatic concerns can override feelings and win out. It's quite torturous when they leave you thinking they still love you. It gives you a massive reason to want to keep trying. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author AnyaNova Posted November 5, 2013 Author Share Posted November 5, 2013 Your last time seeing him is ALOOOOOOOOT like my last time seeing my ex (which was the day of the BU). She cried alot, wanted to cuddle me and not let go. Bad thing was, I cried too. Her mother was there too later on (I'm so ashamed, LOL). I don't know what I can make of this, but it seems like he's scared to love? My exgf had her guard up aswell, so I think I can relate to how your relationship might've been like. I think you should forget about him, and move on. What'll happen if you do get back together? the same damn thing that happened before your break-up. You have to realize this. Do you REALLY want to be in a relationship with someone like this? I know there are really good times with him, believe me, I do. But the mind-confusing actions he's doing is just not good for you, eventually you'll break down if you were to ever have a long term relationship with him. Trust me on this one, it might be better to move on. I'll PM you a better response later on, I've got to go to school! That would be my guess as well. Yes. I have been flat out told by multiple people that if we would at any point try and reconnect, if he didn't have therapy, he would be likely to get scared again, and leave again in exactly the same manner. That is my assessment as well. And you are right, the mind-confusing turmoil (if that were a long term pattern) would drive me to the nuthouse pretty quickly. Heck, I'm pretty sure I'm not that far away now. :-p Link to post Share on other sites
Author AnyaNova Posted November 5, 2013 Author Share Posted November 5, 2013 Wow Anya...this is a tough one. It reminds me a lot of my ex and I. I could never (and still can't) understand how during that last face to face meeting I genuinely "felt" that she loved me. It was stuff you just can't fake...she clearly didn't want to lose me, YET she had made her mind up on some deeper (or perhaps more superficial) level that she was going to. It's hard when things just don't add up like that. Theories are all we have though. And theories are only useful when we can test their viability...sadly you'll never be able to do that unless the ex offers an insightful explanation...probably not gonna happen. I dunno. I know that my ex had spoken before about "letting previous boyfriends go" for quite pragmatic and/or practical reasons. For example, she'd say "he was never gonna get the career she hoped he'd get", or "he wasn't gonna make something of himself". I never once heard her speak about feelings. It wouldn't surprise me if, in my case, she still loved me but had decided on some pragmatic level that I wasn't suitable (like I don't own a home or something along those lines). For me, the feelings are all that matter...I think for her, pragmatic concerns can override feelings and win out. It's quite torturous when they leave you thinking they still love you. It gives you a massive reason to want to keep trying. It is an extremely tough one. Not your nice, normal "he coldly breaks it to her that it is over" and walks out the door thing. It could have been, if I had left well enough alone in July. And I am with you about how torturous it is when they leave you thinking that they still love you. Because it makes it so much harder to let go and sever the connection. And so much easier to succumb to the fantasy of them coming and swooping you back up in a romantic fit of something or other (you can just hear the cheesy orchestra squealing away in the background right?--and for those of you wondering, I quashed those quite a while ago thank you). Link to post Share on other sites
Author AnyaNova Posted November 5, 2013 Author Share Posted November 5, 2013 A few unrelated thoughts on this whole thing that didn't seem to fit in any of those responses. It is ironic. Right after and for weeks I was grieving for his poor, tortured soul. And I wanted to "be there for him" to "show him that everyone doesn't leave in the end" (I even said that in an email I sent right after). Truth is, granted, people who are emotionally healthy and all there, don't do this to other people. Not without some clear explanation for why they are so badly violating their emotional state. But the truth is, is that I am nearly or as much f-ed up as he may be. Granted, once I find people I trust, I tend not to send them away so that they don't hurt me first, but that is about it. I'm a card carrying member of the avoidant personality disorder club, I even know the handshake (there isn't one, you think we can socially organize enough among relative strangers to come up with a handshake?) :-p the irony of the whole thing is, is that part of what attracted me to him were his own traits of the same thing. They read as "safe." Someone who was going to do this to my heart, not out of any kind of normal thing, but simply out of his own fear of intimacy and the hurt it can bring, read as "safe." No angel of care and recuperation for the wounded and hurting am I. Ha. But dang, I could use one right about now, because despite thinking I was above all that and could reach down and help, I am the freaking wounded and hurting. Link to post Share on other sites
lindsay1990 Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Oh, here it is. Well, like I wrote in the other thread I think it could be a defense/coping mechanism and not a full blown disorder. If you do have these patterns you are spotting, maybe go talk to somebody about it? Link to post Share on other sites
Author AnyaNova Posted November 5, 2013 Author Share Posted November 5, 2013 Oh, here it is. Well, like I wrote in the other thread I think it could be a defense/coping mechanism and not a full blown disorder. If you do have these patterns you are spotting, maybe go talk to somebody about it? I have an appointment for tomorrow. And trust me, it has been pervasive enough for enough years, p=.05 the results of my behavior could not have been obtained by chance alone and indeed, I can say that the statistically significant likelihood is that I do, indeed, have this disorder. :-) You have no idea how much I wish this weren't the case. Link to post Share on other sites
lindsay1990 Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Well good luck, I hope you are a match with your therapist. I think I should go see one too (my ex said him and his mother realized I have BPD according to them) and I guess I did break up/get back together with him when we would fight, so there's that for being emotionally unstable. I think it was more immaturity and drama, as in I never reaaaally wanted to break up, it's just something I think I did for emphasis when it was a big fight, but I never really considered it a "break up" for real. Will do when I get paid, don't want to ask my parents for therapist money,ha. Link to post Share on other sites
Author AnyaNova Posted November 20, 2013 Author Share Posted November 20, 2013 (edited) I have been reading this book called, Taming Your Outer Child. In the chapter on relationships, and how the "outer child" (kind of sappy way of thinking of it in one sense, but in another, it does make a rather useful model) interacts and messes up relationships. The section I am about to quote that sheds massive light on this whole thread and what happened--though this time, not from his perspective, but my own--and what caused my feelings to intensify so rapidly, is entitled, "The Traumatic Bond," Let's Take a moment to appreciate the impact fear has on the mammalian brain--the part of your brain involved in forming attachments. For one thing, abandonment fear leads to the ultimate paradox of attachment: The more somebody hurts you, the harder it is to let go. Why should this be so? The answer has to do with traumatic bonding. When someone's behavior causes you emotional or physical pain, it creates fear, and this fear intensifies the bond. A perfect example is the woman who knows her husband is cheating on her, but feels all the more in love with him and can't leave. You'd think that when someone causes pain, it would weaken your bond to that person. But it does just the opposite: It strengthens the attachment. Millions of people are traumatically bonded to their partners (and children to abusive parents), yet remain unaware of the role pain has played in the force of their attachment. This pain we are talking about here is mostly emotional pain. It can range from mild anxiety--waiting for the phone to ring or feeling uncertain about the other person's love--all the way to full blown panic about being left alone. --Susan Anderson, Taming Your Inner Child, page 157 I'll leave it to the peanut gallery to analyze whether or how much mild levels of fear and traumatic bonding play into the initial "butterflies effect" at the beginning of a new relationship. My interest is in my sense that I had before I went for that last night, that "I really could take or leave either outcome (us getting together or never seeing each other again)." I decided later, that I must have been wrong, that my feelings must have been developing in the weeks before our last meeting. But I don't think that is correct. In reading about this, and thinking about how incredibly distressing that evening was for me, both because of my own emotional reactions surrounding "losing" another friend (thankfully though, in this case, unlike last spring, not to death), but also the extreme distress inherent in Tim's showing me so much pain and distress at my leaving, so much that I felt like the abandon-er, even though in the end he was the one to push me away, and not being able to do anything about it at all. The pain he chose to inflict on me, both by giving my freaking AvPD child inside (it bugs the heck out of me that I have one, but its undeniable that I do) another abandonment (yes, I know my friend did not choose to die, but still), and while suffering that, ended up (and I think anyone with half an ounce of compassion and basic human love would end up feeling like this) feeling like an abandoner of another little child (the one that made the decision on his part to do this thing), I am sure now, created a traumatic bond. I suspect, given the power of the Amygdala, the created flashbulb memory of the entire freaking evening (I don't know how the traumatic nature of the later events sealed in the earlier, but boy did they), the intense emotion and the ensuing pain created a perfect stew of traumatic bonding. And maybe it is no wonder, when my emotional system gets activated by the mood swings when my B vitamins get low (btw--thank God for b vitamin shots which I just discovered yesterday) that the force of this comes back, and all the recovery I have made seems to disappear. When my vitamins are good, I'm really o.k. with things, and know that the struggles to help him recognize his need for autonomy, and help him understand that enacting it when based on good, healthy, natural, and normal human desires--like, for example, though having a great work ethic--which he did, though he disparaged himself mightily for losing focus when he got mono, but finding work as secondary to family and relationships, instead of seeing it the other way around as his parents seemed to, anyway that work to help him see his need to care for himself and his own needs would have been so great, taxing, stressing, and time consuming for me that it would have been healthy for me. But, I digress. Thankfully, though I will never forget those moments, the emotional color of them is nearly gone, as long as I don't dwell on them. If I really wanted to, I could burrow into those memories and easily retrieve the intensity, but I know what a horrible idea that would be, and how it would damage my recovery. Perhaps someday, if I need to work through them, I can do that, years down the road, when I'm in a good relationship with someone else and have no fear that my feelings for him could resurface. Right now. Let us let traumatically bonded sleeping dogs lie. It is good, once my brain is bathed again in plenty of B's, to see the immense progress I have made. I will recover, and because I will attend to the wounds and the things that made this mess possible, I will recover better and be a better person and ultimately, I hope, a better partner to someone else. I do pity the next woman he gets in a relationship with, if he doesn't get the help he needs. She will experience the same thing, unless she manages to not invoke the same tripwires of his abandonment fears, AND is so dysfunctional as to not mind his parents walking all over his true identity and nature. And in that case, I pity him. But not too long and not too deeply, for the same reason I allow the memories of that last evening to remain emotionally colorless for now by not dwelling on them. To do so for too long would reawaken that which I have managed to put to sleep. At this point, and given his inability to be there for the people he cares about and who care about him because of his issues...I can say with complete confidence... Hopefully, for good. Edited November 20, 2013 by AnyaNova Link to post Share on other sites
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