hi....
my name is dan, i guess im hear because ive been up all night thinking about something that just happened last night. i guess i just want to reach out and see if anyone else has experienced something like what i have just experienced....
basically, im 24, and been in an off and on relationship with my now ex-girlfriend of 2 years...in a way, the relationship had been abusive, but comming from her. shes punched me in the face before, as well as hit me with a chair. she has a history of not only a bad childhood but being mentally unstable. i love and care about her, and we've always had a good sex life, but i guess ive never been IN LOVE with her....basically, i guess we just arnt right for each other....i would describe her as fire, and me as water....i put out her fire, and she boils my water. also, i think past issues she has with her life come out in anger directed towards me. i had broken up with her a few times before because of our relationship obviously not working, but she wouldnt see it and beg me to come back to her. i guess even tho i wasnt in love with her, i still loved her and cared for her like anyone close to me, and when i broke up with her i was hurt because i was hurting her.....and so i would eventually cave in and take her back.
But this time, it was different. i broke up with her after another one of her crazy fits for good (she hit and run another car on the highway from getting cut off and getting roadrage...shes also beat up her car with her fist, as well as me, and broken numerous plates)....i made it clear, this was it, and we wernt getting back together two nights ago.
She came by last night begging me to take her back, and sadly i had to tell her it was over. she then said i cant live without you, i NEED you, i want you to come back to my house with me and ****, i want to marry you, etc. i hate to see her sad, but i knew for the better we didnt work in a relationship, so i stuck to my decision. she bolts out the door, and i went back to sleep.....
I awake two hours later to her writing a SUICIDE note in my room (i dont know how she got in)....she had planned to down a bunch of sleeping pills (2 bottles worth) and fall asleep forever beside me while i slept.....luckilly, i woke up and asked her what she was doing. she told me she had already taken 70 sleeping pills, that she didnt want to live without me, and that life wasnt worth living.
i called her best friend franticly and she called an ambulance...i guess i called her friend before anyone else because she has helped me deal with this girl before in her many destructive fits. a bunch of firemen and police came into my house and took her to the hospital. supposedly they are going to force her into a 3 day therapy session or something, i cant remember the specifics.
basically, i feel horrible, as if i need to be in a relationship with this girl in order to keep her from hurting herself. im scared and depressed. i care about her so much, but at the same time i CANNOT be in this abusive relationship.
i dont know what else to say or do.....i guess im hoping to find some other people out there who have gone thru this, maybe with a happy ending....
all i can say now, is people please, love yourself before trying to love others.....
2) You stayed longer and did more than you should've.
3) You came to the right place.
Dan, if you think you need live, in-person support in breaking away from this relationship and dealing with the obvious baggage it will leave, by all means, seek it.
You gf is where she needs to be right now.
Let the professionals work on her, -you don't have the expertise to help her.
You never did.
Surround YOURSELF with a fortress of caring and supportive people.
I agree with RioBikini. Hang in there. . . Your ex is probably getting the support she needs from the professionals.
But Question: What do you think would be the best thing for HER now and in the scheme of her life? Would you contacting her be best thing for her now and in the scheme of her life? Would you staying away from her be the best thing for her? Would you making a gesture of friendship and support be the best thing for her now?
I want YOU to be okay and strong yourself. But since this girl has progressed to a suicide attempt, I think that thinking about what SHE needs now, and in the scheme of her entire life, is also in order. If you know you cannot give yourself to her, then perhaps staying away but still being her friend would be best for her. If you know you just cannot be a good friend to her, then think about if there's something she needs to hear right now that you can say to her. If not, then I guess just stay away completely....
What I'm trying to say here-- in a convoluted way-- is that while you must and should take care of yourself, please also really think of this girl's life with true and meaningful consideration. A precious life is at stake. Act as truly and helpfully as you can to her, without being untrue to yourself.
From one abused person to another, she has BORDERLINE PERSONALITY DISORDER
She's abusive and controlling because she can't STAND the thought of being alone, and ends up pushing people away. How many of these symptoms ring a bell?:
A pervasive pattern of instability of interpersonal relationships, self-image, and affects (mood swings), and marked Impulsivity beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:
1.Frantic efforts to avoid real or imagined abandonment. Note: Do not include suicidal or self-mutilating behavior covered in (5). (Desperation / rage if they think they are being abandoned, intense feelings of sadness, loss and fear when their partner is away, a need to have access to the partner at all times, inability to allow their partner their own life and friends, a belief that healthy independence in their partner is a threat to them.)
2.A pattern of unstable and intense interpersonal relationships characterized by alternating between extremes of idealization and devaluation. (The partner of the person with BPD, friends, coworkers or the person with BPD themself is seen as wonderful or perfect, or as evil and rotten. People and things are seen as rigidly black and white by people with BPD - there is no normal middle ground.) People with BPD are highly intolerant of / unable to deal with the gray areas in life. This is called "splitting."
3.Identity disturbance: markedly and persistently unstable self-image or sense of self. (Confusion about goals, career, life choices, sexuality or sexual orientation. Persistent questions and discomfort with their perceived role in life. Pervasive issues related to "who am I" and "what is my role in the world". Many people with BPD change careers frequently or enter careers that give them a clearly defined framework and sense of identity, like large corporations or the military. Others fall prey to cults or fundamentalist religions that control all aspects of their life. Fundamentalism can be comforting for people with BPD since the "black and white" nature of these religions give them a framework that fits their world view.) See *Author's Note
4.Impulsivity in at least two areas that are potentially self-damaging
e.g., uncontrolled spending, reckless driving, substance abuse, dangerous sexual acts or unsafe sex, binge eating, thrill seeking or risk taking behaviors. Note: Do not include suicidal or self-mutilating behavior covered in (5).
5.Recurrent suicidal behavior, gestures, or threats, or self-mutilating behavior. This can be manifested as overt suicide attempts, drug or alcohol abuse, unsafe sexual behavior, or as a pattern of "living dangerously"; this also includes cutting, burning, piercing, and sexual self mutilation.
6.Affective instability due to a marked reactivity of mood e.g., intense episodic dysphoria, irritability, or anxiety usually lasting a few hours and only rarely more than a few days. (People with BPD are intensely moody and volatile emotionally - mood swings and huge shifts occur seemingly "out of nowhere". This is why people with BPD are often misdiagnosed as having Bipolar disorder, and therefore improperly medicated.)
7.Chronic feelings of emptiness. (Generally manifested as sadness, loneliness, isolation, aimlessness, feeling empty without a project or relationship to distract them. People with BPD's low self esteem is often masked by public displays of ego, feelings of superiority or an intense need to control themselves, other people, places and events.)
8.Inappropriate, intense anger or difficulty controlling anger
e.g., frequent displays of temper, uncontrolled anger, violent rages, recurrent physical fights, threats, sexualized expression of anger through violent or abusive sex.
9.Transient, stress-related paranoid ideation or severe dissociative symptoms.
(BPD may manifest as a belief that those who love them wish to hurt, control or destroy them. This is especially common in times of stress. Ongoing belief that they are being followed, threatened, observed or are always at risk. BPD's see the world as a dangerous and frightening place and remain constantly on guard, even in safe environments and with safe people.)
I suggest you visit this site: I dealt with crazy behavior and abuse from an undiagnosed BPD...
thank you, i really appreciate it the hug, even it be in emoticon form
Quote:
Originally Posted by riobikini
Dan,
Simply, for now, this is all you need:
1) It's not your fault.
2) You stayed longer and did more than you should've.
3) You came to the right place.
Dan, if you think you need live, in-person support in breaking away from this relationship and dealing with the obvious baggage it will leave, by all means, seek it.
You gf is where she needs to be right now.
Let the professionals work on her, -you don't have the expertise to help her.
You never did.
Surround YOURSELF with a fortress of caring and supportive people.
wow....
she basically has expressed all of those symptons at one time or another.
Quote:
Originally Posted by beentheredonethat2
From one abused person to another, she has BORDERLINE PERSONALITY DISORDER
She's abusive and controlling because she can't STAND the thought of being alone, and ends up pushing people away. How many of these symptoms ring a bell?:
A pervasive pattern of instability of interpersonal relationships, self-image, and affects (mood swings), and marked Impulsivity beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:
1.Frantic efforts to avoid real or imagined abandonment. Note: Do not include suicidal or self-mutilating behavior covered in (5). (Desperation / rage if they think they are being abandoned, intense feelings of sadness, loss and fear when their partner is away, a need to have access to the partner at all times, inability to allow their partner their own life and friends, a belief that healthy independence in their partner is a threat to them.)
2.A pattern of unstable and intense interpersonal relationships characterized by alternating between extremes of idealization and devaluation. (The partner of the person with BPD, friends, coworkers or the person with BPD themself is seen as wonderful or perfect, or as evil and rotten. People and things are seen as rigidly black and white by people with BPD - there is no normal middle ground.) People with BPD are highly intolerant of / unable to deal with the gray areas in life. This is called "splitting."
3.Identity disturbance: markedly and persistently unstable self-image or sense of self. (Confusion about goals, career, life choices, sexuality or sexual orientation. Persistent questions and discomfort with their perceived role in life. Pervasive issues related to "who am I" and "what is my role in the world". Many people with BPD change careers frequently or enter careers that give them a clearly defined framework and sense of identity, like large corporations or the military. Others fall prey to cults or fundamentalist religions that control all aspects of their life. Fundamentalism can be comforting for people with BPD since the "black and white" nature of these religions give them a framework that fits their world view.) See *Author's Note
4.Impulsivity in at least two areas that are potentially self-damaging
e.g., uncontrolled spending, reckless driving, substance abuse, dangerous sexual acts or unsafe sex, binge eating, thrill seeking or risk taking behaviors. Note: Do not include suicidal or self-mutilating behavior covered in (5).
5.Recurrent suicidal behavior, gestures, or threats, or self-mutilating behavior. This can be manifested as overt suicide attempts, drug or alcohol abuse, unsafe sexual behavior, or as a pattern of "living dangerously"; this also includes cutting, burning, piercing, and sexual self mutilation.
6.Affective instability due to a marked reactivity of mood e.g., intense episodic dysphoria, irritability, or anxiety usually lasting a few hours and only rarely more than a few days. (People with BPD are intensely moody and volatile emotionally - mood swings and huge shifts occur seemingly "out of nowhere". This is why people with BPD are often misdiagnosed as having Bipolar disorder, and therefore improperly medicated.)
7.Chronic feelings of emptiness. (Generally manifested as sadness, loneliness, isolation, aimlessness, feeling empty without a project or relationship to distract them. People with BPD's low self esteem is often masked by public displays of ego, feelings of superiority or an intense need to control themselves, other people, places and events.)
8.Inappropriate, intense anger or difficulty controlling anger
e.g., frequent displays of temper, uncontrolled anger, violent rages, recurrent physical fights, threats, sexualized expression of anger through violent or abusive sex.
9.Transient, stress-related paranoid ideation or severe dissociative symptoms.
(BPD may manifest as a belief that those who love them wish to hurt, control or destroy them. This is especially common in times of stress. Ongoing belief that they are being followed, threatened, observed or are always at risk. BPD's see the world as a dangerous and frightening place and remain constantly on guard, even in safe environments and with safe people.)
I suggest you visit this site: I dealt with crazy behavior and abuse from an undiagnosed BPD...
I always do this, but I thought of one other thing to add...
If you want to hear about a similarly gory relationship read my post "Ricky Lake in real life". I failed to mention the 80 mile an hour suicide drive in his monty carlo or sitting in the garage to commit suicide with carbon monoxide poisoning. (He, of course only wanted the response from me, didn't actually want to do it)
Borderlines have the highest suicide rate of ANY mental disorder, and are the least treated because BPD's refuse there is anything wrong with them, until someone actually leaves them.
So I suggest you LEAVE and in a week of no contact (she will of course, try to contact you) send her a note with this information about BPD printed on it, saying "I think we could have worked if you could have treated this problem with therapy and medication. But you seem unwilling to get help."
Because if you give it to her right away, she won't take it seriously, even discard it. But if she truly thinks you're leaving, she'll read it.
Also, don't be fooled if she suddenly seems okay and happy, content. My ex threatened suicide last week and this week is hanging out with family pretending like nothing's wrong.
trust me, i want to do everything i can for her, but her best friend and i talked all last night and agreed i should avoid all contact with her. even the policeman i talked to outside my house said the same thing....even a restraining order was suggested by her best friend...she admitted this girl had planned to stab me with a knife during our 2nd (of 4) breakups....wow....
and before, honestly, i tried being a good friend and not avoiding contact after other breakups, and everytime we ended up getting back together....its easy to slip back into a relationship when you are lonely, and another person already feels comfortable....plus she could be persuasive and extremely apologetic...so basically i wasnt strong enough to say no to getting back together.
what i think she really needs is to realize she has a whole lot to live for....she just got a great job she finally likes, with bosses and co-workers she likes, shes an incredibly talented jewelry designer and artist...she sells jewelry at galleries, and all talent at drawing and painting is unbelievable...i tried to tell her that she needs to find her happiness in herself and what she is doing before she should be in a relationship with someone and focus all your love on that person...
i want to contact her and say something to let her know i still want to know her and be friends sometime in the future, but ive been told by her bestfriend and an officer to avoid all contact.
i dont know what to do....
Quote:
Originally Posted by beangirl46
I agree with RioBikini. Hang in there. . . Your ex is probably getting the support she needs from the professionals.
But Question: What do you think would be the best thing for HER now and in the scheme of her life? Would you contacting her be best thing for her now and in the scheme of her life? Would you staying away from her be the best thing for her? Would you making a gesture of friendship and support be the best thing for her now?
I want YOU to be okay and strong yourself. But since this girl has progressed to a suicide attempt, I think that thinking about what SHE needs now, and in the scheme of her entire life, is also in order. If you know you cannot give yourself to her, then perhaps staying away but still being her friend would be best for her. If you know you just cannot be a good friend to her, then think about if there's something she needs to hear right now that you can say to her. If not, then I guess just stay away completely....
What I'm trying to say here-- in a convoluted way-- is that while you must and should take care of yourself, please also really think of this girl's life with true and meaningful consideration. A precious life is at stake. Act as truly and helpfully as you can to her, without being untrue to yourself.
Dan, you probably feel guilty about what's happened, but it was her decision to do this. You did what you needed to do to take care of you. She is where she needs to be.
Check out the abuse section for a thread on men being abused. It happens more than you'd think. Your local domestic violence shelter may have resources to help you deal with what's happened to you. This girl has really messed with your head.
For your own safety, I'd change the locks (Did she have a key? You say you don't know how she got in.) You may have to take out a restraining order against her after telling her in no uncertain terms that you can no longer see her. Call her friends and family to let them know what's happened so that you care for her--but from a distance--by getting others to care for her during this time of transition.
She's manipulative and will hook you back in if you're not careful, which is why I think you're going to have to go completely no contact with her. In this, I disagree with beangirl to a great extent. She seems hellbent on destruction and will take everyone else down with her. I applaud your decision to choose life.
It's not your job to take care of her; it's hers. It's your job to take care of you, and you're a mess from being in a mess of a relationship. Please, contact a counselor at a domestic violence center--not the hotline, but a real counselor--who can help you deal with the trauma you've suffered at the hands of this woman and probably don't even realize it at this point.
i guess ill try to avoid her for a week and then send info on BPD...im not a doctor, but its obvious she has this mental disorder.
Quote:
Originally Posted by beentheredonethat2
I always do this, but I thought of one other thing to add...
If you want to hear about a similarly gory relationship read my post "Ricky Lake in real life". I failed to mention the 80 mile an hour suicide drive in his monty carlo or sitting in the garage to commit suicide with carbon monoxide poisoning. (He, of course only wanted the response from me, didn't actually want to do it)
Borderlines have the highest suicide rate of ANY mental disorder, and are the least treated because BPD's refuse there is anything wrong with them, until someone actually leaves them.
So I suggest you LEAVE and in a week of no contact (she will of course, try to contact you) send her a note with this information about BPD printed on it, saying "I think we could have worked if you could have treated this problem with therapy and medication. But you seem unwilling to get help."
Because if you give it to her right away, she won't take it seriously, even discard it. But if she truly thinks you're leaving, she'll read it.
Also, don't be fooled if she suddenly seems okay and happy, content. My ex threatened suicide last week and this week is hanging out with family pretending like nothing's wrong.
on one hand i would happen to disagree with beangirl (although her points are totally valid), but on the other hand...im not a small guy, and i feel wierd about locking myself in from her or getting a restraining order...and im not sure i want counseling (honestly just hearing other people's opinions and perspectives and experience and kind words are helping emmensely)
but i do agree, i think i need to avoid her....i can only hope the counseling shes getting right now will open her eyes....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Becoming
Dan, you probably feel guilty about what's happened, but it was her decision to do this. You did what you needed to do to take care of you. She is where she needs to be.
Check out the abuse section for a thread on men being abused. It happens more than you'd think. Your local domestic violence shelter may have resources to help you deal with what's happened to you. This girl has really messed with your head.
For your own safety, I'd change the locks (Did she have a key? You say you don't know how she got in.) You may have to take out a restraining order against her after telling her in no uncertain terms that you can no longer see her. Call her friends and family to let them know what's happened so that you care for her--but from a distance--by getting others to care for her during this time of transition.
She's manipulative and will hook you back in if you're not careful, which is why I think you're going to have to go completely no contact with her. In this, I disagree with beangirl to a great extent. She seems hellbent on destruction and will take everyone else down with her. I applaud your decision to choose life.
It's not your job to take care of her; it's hers. It's your job to take care of you, and you're a mess from being in a mess of a relationship. Please, contact a counselor at a domestic violence center--not the hotline, but a real counselor--who can help you deal with the trauma you've suffered at the hands of this woman and probably don't even realize it at this point.
I interned in a mental hospital for a summer where I saw a 90# petite woman send a 6'2" ~230# man to the hospital when she went off and it took 5 big people to finally restrain her. They were all trying to restrain her when the big guy got hurt. I don't care how big you are, mentally ill people can do a lot of damage--not just physically, but mentally. How ready are you to be stalked by her day in and night out? Don't you deserve some peace?
1) Wow, I didn't know she threatened to stab you with a knife. I think you definitely need to protect yourself. Even though you may be strong, what if she sneaks in somehow and takes you by surprise, like she did last time? I agree with Becoming on this -- mentally ill people can do a lot of damage.
2) I am reminded of what the character of Carrie said on one episode of Sex and the City. In response to a guy who said that girls get "all psycho-bitch" if you break up with them, Carrie says "Most girls are not crazy psychos-- they just want to know that what they had was meaningful." Similarly, in her song "How Come You Don't Call Me Anymore?" Alicia Keyes sings post-break up: "What I want to know, baby," she sings, "is if what we had was good." I confirm both Alicia's and Carrie's sentiments from my own experience. So, maybe, what you can do is just let this girl know somehow that even though it's over for good, what you had was meaningful. Hearing that it was meaningful may go a long way in helping her. After you convey that somehow-- through a letter, a note, or whatever you know will convey that to her-- you can just zip off completely, for your own protection, and let other people take care of her. (It seems like she has a support structure.)
You gotta protect yourself and take care of yourself. But at the same time, if you could do a little something to help this suicidal girl, why not?
You won't be able to completely recover her-- that she'll have to do herself. But maybe a little something like that note (kind words, but words that also treat it like it's over) could help. I know you said her best friend and the policeman said NC. But perhaps you could discuss the idea of your note with them, and your reasons for wanting to write it, and see what they say.
3) If nothing else, I think you must A) protect yourself and B) not get back with her or make any contact with her (beyond the note/meanginful act of closure I described above if you want to.)
That's all I got. Lots of luck to you in this difficult time.
thank you for your advice...i think i will do that...
Quote:
Originally Posted by beangirl46
This is a tough situation, to state the obvious.
1) Wow, I didn't know she threatened to stab you with a knife. I think you definitely need to protect yourself. Even though you may be strong, what if she sneaks in somehow and takes you by surprise, like she did last time? I agree with Becoming on this -- mentally ill people can do a lot of damage.
2) I am reminded of what the character of Carrie said on one episode of Sex and the City. In response to a guy who said that girls get "all psycho-bitch" if you break up with them, Carrie says "Most girls are not crazy psychos-- they just want to know that what they had was meaningful." Similarly, in her song "How Come You Don't Call Me Anymore?" Alicia Keyes sings post-break up: "What I want to know, baby," she sings, "is if what we had was good." I confirm both Alicia's and Carrie's sentiments from my own experience. So, maybe, what you can do is just let this girl know somehow that even though it's over for good, what you had was meaningful. Hearing that it was meaningful may go a long way in helping her. After you convey that somehow-- through a letter, a note, or whatever you know will convey that to her-- you can just zip off completely, for your own protection, and let other people take care of her. (It seems like she has a support structure.)
You gotta protect yourself and take care of yourself. But at the same time, if you could do a little something to help this suicidal girl, why not?
You won't be able to completely recover her-- that she'll have to do herself. But maybe a little something like that note (kind words, but words that also treat it like it's over) could help. I know you said her best friend and the policeman said NC. But perhaps you could discuss the idea of your note with them, and your reasons for wanting to write it, and see what they say.
3) If nothing else, I think you must A) protect yourself and B) not get back with her or make any contact with her (beyond the note/meanginful act of closure I described above if you want to.)
That's all I got. Lots of luck to you in this difficult time.
A couple years ago I was miserable for a long time and took some pills again, cops and EMS came, blah blah blah...I'd been dealing w/ suicide and self-harm since I was very young. I dont really want to get into it, and its unimportant to your thread, other than to say that from a person who was similar to her in a couple ways, you should stay away from her and allow NO CONTACT.
She will be upset about it, and will probably act out in some way, but its sooo important to be invisible to her so that she can get her head straight again. She cannot do that with you around right now. I agree that a letter saying good things about her, and that the relationship meant a lot to you, would be good.
I know this is difficult for you. You seem like a wonderful, caring person. I wish you peace, especially during the next few days/weeks. Peace that its nothing you've caused, and peace that you are doing the right thing by being absent.
Please note: The suggestions and advice offered on this web site are opinions only and are not to be used in the place of professional psychological counseling or medical advice. If you or someone close to you is currently in crisis or in an emergency situation, contact your local law enforcement agency or emergency number.
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